S34: Cirie Fields

[peachmangosteen]

6 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

I find it hard to blame Cirie for not reading the small print because that is literally the only time in Survivor history that I know about where something was non-transferable.

And if we're to believe Troyzan not even Probst himself knew that it was non-transferable. LOL.

Although apparently Stephen's steal-a-vote was also non-transferrable, so really Probst should have know. And also it makes the whole thing slightly less strange. I still find it weird that this one advantage is non-transferrable.

As for Cirie, this ep was pretty gratifying for me as someone who thinks Cirie is overrated and is annoyed by the fact that she bought into her own hype. Voting out Andrea was the biggest mistake she made in an ep full of mistakes though.

Edited May 18, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[fishcakes]

8 hours ago, Nalan said:

10 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

I find it hard to blame Cirie for not reading the small print because that is literally the only time in Survivor history that I know about where something was non-transferable.  Sarah formally gave it to her, just like an idol or the immunity necklace.  Just bizarre not to make it transferable.  A baffling decision by the producers.

Stephen's steal-a-vote advantage wasn't transferable, either, in Cambodia, so this was actually the second time.

It's at least the third time. The Tyler Perry idol in Cagayan wasn't transferable and couldn't be played for anyone else.

[simplyme]

I think the big thing is that everyone is human and makes mental mistakes in such a tense, draining environment. Cirie's plan could have been brilliant. Sarah just couldn't give her the advantage, which I expect didn't register because, well, it's day 30-something and Sarah freaking handed it to her. I'm not going to swear that I would catch that in a similar situation, even though I clearly should.

As for how overrated Cirie is or isn't, she was great her first time. In Micronesia, which I just rewatched, she's actually also great. A number of things that the show gives Parvati sole credit for were either Cirie or both Cirie and Parv. The huge thing Parv did was make the alliance with Alexis and Natalie, but to be fair that option wasn't available to Amanda or Cirie as they weren't on the same tribe with them at the time. Cirie often comes up with the idea (blindside Ozzy, get Erik to give Natalie his necklace) and coaches the others on how to achieve it. So I think she's actually underrated in that season because Parvati gets the glory. (I'm great with Parvati winning too. Really, it came down to who won the final IC. Parv went out first, then Amanda and Cirie battled it out. Amanda won and took Parvati.)

[ByaNose]

Cirie supposedly got the advantage last minute and never thought or had time to read the fine print. In theory, it was a slick move and it didn't pan out. Now, I'm curious how it plays out. Does Sarah cut of Cirie? Does Cirie try to use Tai again? Does Cirie throw Aubry in the fire? So many decisions. LOL!!!

[Lantern7]

I think this is the note Cirie should go out on. She wound up bowing out in the finale episodes of three seasons (she lost the cliffhanger tiebreaker in Exile Island), and she was booted in perhaps the most bizarre/dumbass way a person can go without being Bobby Jon. I think she can contend with Ozzy as the best four-timer in series history, even though she never made it to the end. I know she rubbed some people the wrong way, and Probst tends to back people we can't stand, but I think she's a class act. Period.

I would be open to her dropping by in a future season. Perhaps upon a floating couch.

[LadyChatts]

Cirie is a class act, and she handled her ouster wonderfully.  I don't think Cirie is ever going to win this game, because no one in their right mind would go to the end with her.  I kind of hope she doesn't come back, because I don't want her to ruin her legacy.  She already had one early ouster during HvsV.  I'd rather see her go out like this, even if it totally sucked how she went out.  She's definitely one of the better players to ever play this game, and though I fell briefly out of love with her after Micronesia, she will go down as one of my all time favorite players.  

[Daisy]

3 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

I think this is the note Cirie should go out on. She wound up bowing out in the finale episodes of three seasons (she lost the cliffhanger tiebreaker in Exile Island), and she was booted in perhaps the most bizarre/dumbass way a person can go without being Bobby Jon. I think she can contend with Ozzy as the best four-timer in series history, even though she never made it to the end. I know she rubbed some people the wrong way, and Probst tends to back people we can't stand, but I think she's a class act. Period.

I would be open to her dropping by in a future season. Perhaps upon a floating couch.

like Cleopatra :D

I will respect those who think that Cirie is over-rated. I think even really great survivor players make blunders. I think even with something as massive as what happened last week, Cirie still ended up with zero votes against her shows some what how she can smooth talk her way out of things. 

I think though she shot herself in the foot by booting out Andrea. I'm not sure really why she felt that Sarah was the way to go.(but maybe she thought she could talk up her game more vs. Andrea who had both social + physical game to her credit. I'm not sure). I don't think Cirie will ever get to a final (and I will always think that 16 was her best chance). She was never going to win Exile Island (though she could) and I think she was perfect set up for Micronesia. HvV - wrong tribe, hands down. 

I don't know if she could have won here. And again - I just feel robbed that we never even got a chance of a final speech from her. I'm glad she came back and I think this is a (shitty) good note for her Survivor career to end. I simply don't know what type of season of returning players she could possibly be on for her to go far (and win). She can't (obviously) be on any Winner season. MAYBE Blood vs. Water but i doubt it. 

 

[NvrMissedASeason]

I am a huge fan and that is why I am writing this.

Cirie is a wonderful and powerful player.  Jeff still uses the term when Cerie was "voted out".   So who voted her off of game changers?    No one did! ...  and yet she was out of the game.  

Here is my point ... the show needs to be careful with the non-human advantages because they introduce luck into the game and thus may dilute the influence of the actual skills of the game players.

Let's say the show had decided to limit these advantages to the simple Immunity Idol and not water down the voting further with more advantages.   That would have returned more of Cirie's skills and relationships back into the tribal council vote and Cirie would not have lost that night.

I would much rather watch the talents of the players determine the outcome and not a lucky advantage.    With these new advantages, a non skilled player can have an unwarranted and undeserved influence on tribal council votes that their own skills and talent would never have afforded them.    Thus we all lost out on getting to watch Cirie playing longer which I think she deserved, and I would have preferred to view instead of the results of a less interesting overload of simple advantages.

There was another Game Changer this season ... and it was the overuse of advantages in the game.   It changed the game so much that a great player like Cirie was thrown off the season on a night she did not receive one vote against her by the actual people playing the game.

It reminds me of when they bring on goofy or strange non contenders on the Bachelorette to create more drama.   I always want to say to the producers, Stop ... please don't water down the excellent, pure, and natural drama of people falling in love and deciding between lovers.   There is plenty of good drama there.   No cheap easy drama needed.

No cheap easy gameplay tweaks needed ... let the players pure skills determine the outcome.

Finally, can we please make it a 2 hour show so we can see more of what goes on in the camp dynamics?

Looking forward to next season!

Signed,   a fan who takes the time to give thoughtful and constructive feedback.

[cooksdelight]

6 hours ago, NvrMissedASeason said:

let the players pure skills determine the outcome

Apparently, getting off the couch and searching for an idol wasn't one of Cirie's strong suits. I guess if Jeff had not used the term "vote" this wouldn't have had such a strong reaction. Everyone has the same chance to find idols and advantages, but this season was a first where they didn't get used until very late in the game. They could start specifying that if you find an idol, you have XX number of tribal councils where it is viable. Then it expires. Not having a re-vote this season didn't scare anyone into using theirs early.

I also would like a longer show IF there are more than one TC. There is so much going on that we don't see, it would really piss viewers off if they knew how much. Jeff's blabbering and yelling nonsense has stopped challenges before, and they had to stop filming, reset and start over from the point where the missteps occurred. 

[LadyChatts]

I don't think TPTB ever anticipated that every idol and the last advantage would come into play at once.  Even with the rumor floating around that that was going to happen this season, I still couldn't believe it, especially with Troy and Tai being on the bottom at various stages.  I agree that while it might be fair based on the rules, it sucks.  I think it sucks on various levels, mainly because this season, one idol was hidden at a challenge, the rest at camp, and Tai found 3 idols total this season.  That's not his fault, but come on, make it a little more complicated.  Everyone knows where to look for them.  I think they need to have one idol per camp, and once it's played, it doesn't get re-buried.  Have one merge idol, and that's it.  No advantages or super idols.  I'm dreaming, I know.

@cooksdelight someday, one day, I hope you can spill everything you know.  It'd be fascinating to know the little behind the scenes.  In terms of extra long episodes-only if they focus on camp life and the social dynamics of the game, less on big moves, idols, and resume building.  I worry a longer episode will just mean more of that.  I know they can't do live feeds like Big Brother, but it'd be nice if they could at least upload more extra footage (like what was left out of the episode) online, rather than those little clips.  If CBS wanted to get people to subscribe to All Access, that might be a way to do it.

[kikaha]

On 5/25/2017 at 1:19 AM, Daisy said:

I think though she shot herself in the foot by booting out Andrea. I'm not sure really why she felt that Sarah was the way to go.
 

Cirie thought Sarah had too much blood on her hands.  She said that, almost with those precise words IIRC.  (Which puts Brad's seemingly-crazy decision to boot Tai in a somewhat different light.) 

Cirie also thought Andrea would be real, real hard to beat in finals.  Everyone thought that, which is why they booted her when they did.

In any case Cirie had an almost impossible path to victory.  Suppose Sarah has no legacy advantage, and gets booted at 6 in place of Cirie.  Brad still wins all the ICs.  So maybe Cirie, Aubry and Tai vote together to boot Troyzan at 5.  I can't imagine anyone wanting to sit next to Cirie in front of the jury.  IMO she gets booted next, and there's nothing she can do about that.

After Micronesia, Cirie will always face that problem.  Odds of her winning the FIC are almost zero.  So for her to argue her case at FTC, the remaining players have to agree to take her.  Who in their right minds will do so? 

Cirie's best bet may be a F2, where the FIC winner knows he/she can't win the game, and would rather Cirie win than whoever else is left.  (Similar to Lil, Sandra and Johnny Fairplay.) 

[Porkchop]

I wonder if Cirie would ever play The Amazing Race? I just love watching her, so I'm hoping she does it. Cirie and Michaela! Or Cirie and Sandra! Or Cirie and that handsome son of hers!

[LadyChatts]

I'd love to see Cirie and Michaela on Big Brother.  That might have been more up Cirie's alley, in terms of strategy.  Michaela would just be hilarious to watch,

[Nalan]

6 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

I think it sucks on various levels, mainly because this season, one idol was hidden at a challenge, the rest at camp, and Tai found 3 idols total this season.

I remember reading that they were even going to have one hidden at Tribal Council.  But that never materialized, either because no one ever found the clue to it, or they scrapped the idea.

[ByaNose]

3 hours ago, Nalan said:

I remember reading that they were even going to have one hidden at Tribal Council.  But that never materialized, either because no one ever found the clue to it, or they scrapped the idea.

With all the standing up & whispering they did at Tribal Council it would be easy to do now. Before, the only place I thought they could place an HII would be at the voting booth. Now, they could put it anywhere. That said, I don't like all the standing up & whispering. If we the viewer can't hear it then I don't think production should allow it. They are all miked but even that can't pick up what they're saying. I'm glad Cirie & Michaela at least spoke up loud when they were standing. 

[KimberStormer]

10 hours ago, kikaha said:

Cirie thought Sarah had too much blood on her hands.  She said that, almost with those precise words IIRC.  (Which puts Brad's seemingly-crazy decision to boot Tai in a somewhat different light.) 

Cirie also thought Andrea would be real, real hard to beat in finals.  Everyone thought that, which is why they booted her when they did.

In any case Cirie had an almost impossible path to victory.  Suppose Sarah has no legacy advantage, and gets booted at 6 in place of Cirie.  Brad still wins all the ICs.  So maybe Cirie, Aubry and Tai vote together to boot Troyzan at 5.  I can't imagine anyone wanting to sit next to Cirie in front of the jury.  IMO she gets booted next, and there's nothing she can do about that.

After Micronesia, Cirie will always face that problem.  Odds of her winning the FIC are almost zero.  So for her to argue her case at FTC, the remaining players have to agree to take her.  Who in their right minds will do so? 

Cirie's best bet may be a F2, where the FIC winner knows he/she can't win the game, and would rather Cirie win than whoever else is left.  (Similar to Lil, Sandra and Johnny Fairplay.) 

Well, that's exactly why she should stick with Andrea, someone very hard to beat.  Cirie pioneered the idea of "if anyone's going to get dragged to the end it's going to be me" when she arranged for Courtney's boot in Panama.  Cirie, like Kim Spradlin, doesn't need to take a goat.  Unfortunately it's probably true that taking Cirie would be too risky for Andrea, but I think Andrea would have been willing to stick with her longer than most because she could feel confident that she'd have a shot against her.

Cirie's path to the million might be something like: boot Tai (blindside with both idols in pocket), Sarah, Andrea, Troy (flush his idol at one of the previous), Aubry (if Brad still wins all the immunities).  Cirie/Brad/Michaela F3 is a win for Cirie.  Michaela and Aubry wouldn't go against her at F5, I don't think, as she'd be taking them to the end if she can and they don't like Brad.  Might come down to another fire challenge if Aubry can convince Brad to care and force the tie at 4 -- but Brad might be so stubborn that he'd insist on voting Michaela because of personal dislike.

Just an idea!  Obviously Cirie was there and I wasn't and if there's anyone whose judgment I trust in Survivor it's her, but with the benefit of hindsight and knowing where all the idols and advantages were this seems like a reasonable plan to me.

[enlightenedbum]

The problem was booting Andrea before Brad, because she was the one with the best chance to beat him in immunities, having done so twice already.  The danger for Cirie is that Andrea would want to make sure of the sure thing by booting Cirie at 4 or 5.  So you need to thread a really difficult needle, plus dodge idols.  Brad was the obvious boot at 8, that was the major flaw in Cirie's game.  From there everything spiraled out of control because now she only had two strong allies (plus Sarah) in a 7 person game.  Whoops.

Cirie's path to a victory necessarily boots Brad at 8.  Then you have to dodge various advantages and if you want to be sure, get rid of Andrea.

[KimberStormer]

Totally forgot Brad was vulnerable at 8.  Yeah, for sure he was the vote there.  (But I still think she easily beats Brad even if he immunity-wins his way to the end.)

I think Cirie could convince Michaela and Aubry that Andrea is unbeatable at F5.  But thinking of the various immunity challenges I can remember, I feel like Andrea might well have won them all...

Edited May 28, 2017 by KimberStormer

[enlightenedbum]

Yeah, but his presence makes it much harder for her to get there.  For one, he simply takes up a spot, kinda like Terry did the first time she played.  For two, he's utterly against you.

The theoretically correct boot order for Cirie to win ignoring idols was Brad, Troy, Tai, Sarah, Andrea and then Cirie easily crushes Aubry and Michaela at FTC.  And I'm not sure any other order works for Cirie, because if Andrea goes earlier then Cirie is the obvious target at 4.

[SVNBob]

I'm sure that Cirie was having Parvati flashbacks with Andrea.  Which is why Cirie jumped the gun on booting her.  The two of them were going to have to turn on each other at some point, and Cirie struck first in order to ensure Micronesia didn't happen again.  (Think about it though; Cirie, Andrea, Aubry, and Michaela could have been Black Widow Brigade 2.0.)

 

But agreed that it was too soon.  Brad was the bigger threat, as both a physical threat and the leader of the opposing alliance.  Both of those targets take priority over someone currently allied with you.  It's like Cirie caught BMF from Zeke.

[peachmangosteen]

5 hours ago, SVNBob said:

(Think about it though; Cirie, Andrea, Aubry, and Michaela could have been Black Widow Brigade 2.0.)

I have thought about it and I cry every time thinking about what might have been!

[kikaha]

9 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

Cirie's path to the million might be something like: boot Tai (blindside with both idols in pocket), Sarah, Andrea, Troy (flush his idol at one of the previous), Aubry (if Brad still wins all the immunities).  Cirie/Brad/Michaela F3 is a win for Cirie.  Michaela and Aubry wouldn't go against her at F5, I don't think, as she'd be taking them to the end if she can and they don't like Brad.  Might come down to another fire challenge if Aubry can convince Brad to care and force the tie at 4 -- but Brad might be so stubborn that he'd insist on voting Michaela because of personal dislike.

If Cirie could engineer the boot order you bring up, sure, she's in the final and wins.  The question is, how could she do that?  No one there other than Michaela wants her to reach the end and several players -- e.g. Sarah, Aubry and Andrea -- are outstanding strategists/manipulators.

7 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

Totally forgot Brad was vulnerable at 8.  Yeah, for sure he was the vote there.  (But I still think she easily beats Brad even if he immunity-wins his way to the end.)

Andrea said in an interview that she would take out Cirie well before finals.  i.e. both saw the other the same way: mortal threats to win.  Brad, meanwhile, was not a mortal threat to win, even if he made finals.  So it made sense from Cirie's standpoint to boot Andrea before Brad.  (Andrea is another challenge monster who, without Brad in the game, could easily go on an IC run.) 

 

6 hours ago, SVNBob said:

 (Think about it though; Cirie, Andrea, Aubry, and Michaela could have been Black Widow Brigade 2.0.)

  Andrea didn't want Cirie anywhere near F3.  I don't know for sure, but I believe Aubry felt the same way.  Meanwhile they all knew Michaela was in Cirie's pocket.  That is why Sarah booted Michaela at that hectic TC (at 7?).

Hard for me to see this one ever panning out.  As I said in an earlier post, hard for me to see any alliance panning out for Cirie now: she is too feared to take to the end.   

Edited May 28, 2017 by kikaha

[simplyme]

11 hours ago, SVNBob said:

I'm sure that Cirie was having Parvati flashbacks with Andrea.  Which is why Cirie jumped the gun on booting her.  The two of them were going to have to turn on each other at some point, and Cirie struck first in order to ensure Micronesia didn't happen again.

I'm not sure why Parvati gets the blame for "turning" on Cirie in Micronesia. Amanda, Cirie, and Parvati thought it was an F3 and went to F3 together. They were devastated to learn it was an F2. At that point Cirie knew she had to win the IC because either Parv or Amanda would take the other one. Amanda won the IC over Cirie. (Parv went out first). Amanda chose Parvati over Cirie, probably because she felt closer to Parv who had never voted for her and always been aligned with her and because she thought she had a better shot against Parv.

You can blame the format, or Amanda, or Cirie for not winning the IC, but I don't really see how Parvati can take the blame.

[Nalan]

15 hours ago, SVNBob said:

But agreed that it was too soon.  Brad was the bigger threat, as both a physical threat and the leader of the opposing alliance.  Both of those targets take priority over someone currently allied with you.  It's like Cirie caught BMF from Zeke.

 

9 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I have thought about it and I cry every time thinking about what might have been!

These are why I ultimately thought that Cirie, while I love her so much, got what she deserved in the end.  We could've had another awesome, amazing women's alliance run things to the end, or near it, but her choice to blindside Andrea ultimately led to the implosion of that alliance, and it turned a female-heavy post-merge into a male-heavy endgame.  Damn you, Cirie!

Edited May 29, 2017 by Nalan

[SVNBob]

9 hours ago, simplyme said:

I'm not sure why Parvati gets the blame for "turning" on Cirie in Micronesia. Amanda, Cirie, and Parvati thought it was an F3 and went to F3 together. They were devastated to learn it was an F2. At that point Cirie knew she had to win the IC because either Parv or Amanda would take the other one. Amanda won the IC over Cirie. (Parv went out first). Amanda chose Parvati over Cirie, probably because she felt closer to Parv who had never voted for her and always been aligned with her and because she thought she had a better shot against Parv.

You can blame the format, or Amanda, or Cirie for not winning the IC, but I don't really see how Parvati can take the blame.

Fair point.  I forgot the exact chain of events in that season.

So perhaps Cirie was having Amanda flashbacks instead of Parvati flashbacks.  But no matter which Widow was going through her mind, I'm sure Cirie was thinking back to that Micronesia F3 turned F2 and made a move that was meant to prevent the same result from happening when she turned on Andrea.  It's the added case of BMF that made her do it too soon.

[simplyme]

10 hours ago, SVNBob said:

Fair point.  I forgot the exact chain of events in that season.

Heh. To be fair, I just rewatched that season not too long ago. Until then, I'd forgotten that chain of events too. I'd forgotten Amanda did anything other than make out with Ozzy and cry in that season.

I understand your argument. It makes sense from an "I've been done this way before" standpoint.

Viewing from my couch, I can see from differences in the situation. Cirie herself said during Micronesia that she always felt like the bottom person in every alliance she was in (fairly accurately IMO). I don't think that was the case this time. She and Andrea felt like co-leaders and partners, so I guess I felt like taking out the other base of support (and bigger target) in her alliance before the big threat in the other alliance was gone was a mistake.

Of course, I have the benefit of watching from the comfort of my couch rather than having to, you know, play. :)

[LadyChatts]

I don't know if Cirie would have had a choice in getting rid of Andrea when she did.  If Sarah was dead set on getting her out, and Cirie worried she'd flip back to Brad/Troy/Tai, that could either lead to a 4-4 tie at TC and rock draw; but more than likely Sarah would have played her vote steal, giving the other side an advantage in numbers, and Andrea still would have gone.  Cirie wouldn't have had any blood on her hands, but she still would have lost an ally.  I can see where they might have been afraid that Andrea would have gone on an immunity run, because she seemed to be the best person to challenge Brad, and get to the end.  Between her and Cirie, the vote might have been very close, and I don't know how it would have gone, but I think it's possible Cirie could have squeaked it out.  Her biggest obstacle was getting there, and with the other side having all the idols and advantages, plus Andrea likely not wanting to go to the end with Cirie, it would have been difficult anyway.  I don't really think there was any way Cirie was making it to the end.

[enoughcats]

Cirie, I wish I knew you.  

While so many people are giving well reasoned analyses of what you did and didn't do, and why, I think Cirie played more of a stealth game with only a few insights into what makes her tick.  Her comments on Michaela this season, and on their relationship, made me want to know more about her.  

Getting off the sofa?  That I can understand.  But now, years later, going back and playing again....I really want to know more of what inspired her yet again.

[Daisy]

On 5/28/2017 at 4:37 AM, SVNBob said:

I'm sure that Cirie was having Parvati flashbacks with Andrea.  Which is why Cirie jumped the gun on booting her.  The two of them were going to have to turn on each other at some point, and Cirie struck first in order to ensure Micronesia didn't happen again.  (Think about it though; Cirie, Andrea, Aubry, and Michaela could have been Black Widow Brigade 2.0.)

 

But agreed that it was too soon.  Brad was the bigger threat, as both a physical threat and the leader of the opposing alliance.  Both of those targets take priority over someone currently allied with you.  It's like Cirie caught BMF from Zeke.

that's 100 percent probably it. 
Man black widow brigade 2.0 would have been beautiful though. (sigh). 

I keep seeing a lot of comments of "well, Cirie could have looked for an idol so they have no issues how she got booted out." That kind of irks me because we know people look for idols, the show only shows the successful attempts. also. What idol was she supposed to look for when 2 people had the 3 available in the game? Like i get the concept and i'd agree with it.... if there was only one idol. but when there is three, no rules on how much you can have, and Tai makes the logical assumption of, well if this clue works for this camp, that will work for the other clue. 

I'll put the result on the whole "Survivor, it can screw you, " shelf, but it really does bother me how she got screwed up twice. the Final 2 in Micronesia, and literally idol'ed out (sigh)

[Nalan]

2 hours ago, Daisy said:

I'll put the result on the whole "Survivor, it can screw you, " shelf, but it really does bother me how she got screwed up twice. the Final 2 in Micronesia, and literally idol'ed out (sigh)

Thrice.  She was idoled out here in Game Changers and back in Heroes vs. Villains, plus the F3-to-F2 switch in Micronesia.

[KimberStormer]

Getting idoled out in regular fashion doesn't really count as getting screwed by the show IMO.  She just got plain outplayed by JT that time.

Spoiler

here come the arguments

[Daisy]

10 hours ago, Nalan said:

Thrice.  She was idoled out here in Game Changers and back in Heroes vs. Villains, plus the F3-to-F2 switch in Micronesia.

nah. I didn't have a problem with her being booted out in HvV. like she was doing her thing, and if I were JT I would have booted her out then too. She was totally doing her shepherd thing and I remember that scene vividly. like they were committed to one thing and Cirie heard it and she's like whaaa? Nooooo. and Amanda and James were like. "oh yaaaah, thanks, Ma!" (like they literally had that face on), and JT was seeing it all down and he was like nope. cut Cirie. 

Now  - while that was smart, I also think that ultimately hurt the Heroes, because I think Cirie would have been the one to be like. "What, you want to what?" when they wanted to give Russel the idol, or let's say that she wasn't privy to that, I do think the 1001 attempts Sandra made to try to make the Heroes toss Russell, would have worked because Cirie would have totally have worked with Sandra (my dream).

I'd argue what screwed her over more was being in the Heroes tribe, and she said as much. like either way she was screwed though I think had she been in Villans, people would have feared the Parv/Cirie could align again. But I think she would have flown further because everyone had bigger Villains to kill (and the Heroes were stupid)