Season 8: Speculation and Spoilers Discussion

[nikma]

2 minutes ago, bubble sparkly said:

I won't even complain if they just retcon his s7 robot persona and pretend he's been the same old Bran all along.

I don't think  they will do that. Maybe they will tone it down, like it was in his last scene with Sam, but he won't be normal again. He died in that cave, that's the point they want to make, he is lost.

[OhOkayWhat]

12 minutes ago, bubble sparkly said:

Yeah, turning Bran into a robot was very weird.  As you said, the old 3ER had been isolated in a tree for 1000 years and he seemed able to have normal interactions with people and was able to feel empathy

Maybe the previous 3ER had a guide to help him survive the transformation with fewer changes. 

And he was not isolated, the Children of the Forest were with him.

In other words, the show gave us the reason of the change, gave us the special circunstances of such change and the change happened. Therefore, the show was consistent.

Edited September 28, 2018 by OhOkayWhat

[Colorful Mess]

The 3 eyed raven told Bran he wasn't ready. His training was cut short. He didn't get lesson on how to manage all of that power. That could explain his personality change. Still, it sucks for the poor kid. I bet GRRM would do something terrible to him anyway because magic doesn't come without a cost.

[nikma]

While they were writing previous 3ER I just don't think they were thinking about effect it could have on person if you can see everything at the same time. It makes sense that it will fuck you up. 

 

I mean, I'm sure you can find some explanation within the story, but I think this is the reason. And you don't cast Max von Sydow to play emotionless character. That's the reason he didn't have beard or wig. He is just too big name for that. 

2 minutes ago, Colorful Mess said:

The 3 eyed raven told Bran he wasn't ready. His training was cut short. He didn't get lesson on how to manage all of that power. That could explain his personality change.

Yeah. I agree. There are a lot of reasons you can find within the story. He downloaded history of the entire world in his head. It makes sense that he will be lost. 

Edited September 28, 2018 by nikma

[anamika]

7 hours ago, Eyes High said:

A propos of the excerpt, Alysanne seems pretty cool. She reminds me of Dany or Margaery.

 

It's funny that this got released now considering our very recent discussion here on how all Targaryens were mad and despised and white supremacists/nazis who should be killed off. And GRRM releases a chapter which covers good governance under the Targaryens and their relationship with the North! It's almost like GRRM was reading our discussion and decided to provide some new material :)

Jaehaerys and Alysanne make me think of a future Jon and Dany if they survive and end up as leaders. Jon has proven to be quite the administrator in ADwD and Dany looks like the person to get on her dragon, go places and charm (or coerce) people into following her.

The people in white harbor coming in their thousands to cheer Alysanne and her dragon! And the Manderlys seem to be pro Targ with relatives among them from all the alliances Alysanne made - could explain Manderlys comments in ADwD where he says that Rhaegar Frey is unworthy of the name.  We will be seeing Jon and Dany at white harbor at the start of next season. It will be interesting to see reactions there to Dany and her dragons. I am curious to see if the show starts aligning with the book Northerners or if they are going to continue with the 'Northerners are whiny idiots who will hate Dany even though she has come to help'.

Silverwing not going beyond the wall, makes me think that if dragons and WW do battle in the books, it will be after they cross the wall. They meet either in the North or the trident. The connection between dragons and WW is interesting considering how they are like the polar opposites.

Reading that excerpt made me wish that GRRM was still writing asoiaf. 

Edited September 28, 2018 by anamika

[Colorful Mess]

2 minutes ago, nikma said:

Yeah. I agree. There are a lot of reasons you can find within the story. 

Oh another one I forgot - warging Hodor too much. When you warg a person/animal too frequently you lose your own identity and start to think like them.

[OhOkayWhat]

1 minute ago, Colorful Mess said:

The 3 eyed raven told Bran he wasn't ready. His training was cut short. He didn't get lesson on how to manage all of that power. That could explain his personality change

Exactly. 

1 minute ago, Colorful Mess said:

Still, it sucks for the poor kid

Yes, it does.

 

We should not confuse "I don't like what happened with that character" with "bad written narrative".

[GraceK]

3 minutes ago, bubble sparkly said:

Yeah, turning Bran into a robot was very weird.  As you said, the old 3ER had been isolated in a tree for 1000 years and he seemed able to have normal interactions with people and was able to feel empathy (i.e. "you won't end up an old man in a tree").  It seems like the only reason they turned Bran into a robot was as an excuse to have Sansa be Lady of Winterfell instead of Bran resuming the title of Lord of Winterfell.

Exactly. It came out of nowhere . we’ve spent six years with Bran in his head, being shown and told how important he is. Hodor died for him, the NK personally hunted him down, we lost Summer, this kid was dreaming since the beginning of it all...he’s been set up as significant to this story and it’s endgame and all he did season 7 was hide in Winterfell and wait for Jon to get back while his sisters tried to murder each other. Sorry not sorry that was contrived bullshit.

[nikma]

I agree that there are some differences between Bran in S6E10 and S7E1, but not that much to be honest. He doesn't show any emotion when Benjen leaves them. The only line that he said like a normal person is "I have to be ready now". 

[bubble sparkly]

If they are going to have Bran continue to be a robot, then they at least better use it for maximum drama by having him drop Jon's parentage bomb in the most awkward, painful and public way possible lol.  Like:

[Jon, Dany and their arrive at Winterfell and a crowd gather to greet them]

Jon: I would like to introduce Dan...

Bran (interrupts): That is Daenerys Targaryen, your aunt and lover

Everyone: ...???...

 

Or:

 

[Jon, Dany and the Starks are gathered in the great hall for a meeting with the idiot Northern Lords]

Glover: Daenerys Targaryen is an evil foreign whore who can't be trusted.  Her brother kidnapped and raped Lyanna Stark and we can't abide rape, unless Ramsey is raping Sansa Stark.  When a Northern Bastard Lord is raping a Stark daughter we totally let that slide.

Bran: Lyanna wasn't raped, she and Rhaegar were in love and ran away together.  Jon is their secret baby and heir to the throne, bow to your new king.

Everyone:...???...

Edited September 28, 2018 by bubble sparkly

[nikma]

3 minutes ago, GraceK said:

he’s been set up as significant to this story and it’s endgame

I'm sure he will play significant role in the endgame. He didn't do much in S7, but it is still a lot more than he did in S5. 

[GraceK]

Just now, bubble sparkly said:

If they are going to have Bran continue to be a robot, then they at least better use it for maximum drama by having him drop Jon's parentage bomb in the most awkward, painful and public way possible lol.  Like:

[Jon, Dany and their arrive at Winterfell and a crowd gather to greet them]

Jon: I would like to introduce Dan...

Bran (interrupts): That is Daenerys Targaryen, you aunt and lover

Everyone: ...???...

 

Or:

 

[Jon, Dany and the Starks are gathered in the great hall for a meeting with the idiot Northern Lords]

Glover: Daenerys Targaryen is an evil foreign whore who can't be trusted.  Her brother kidnapped and raped Lyanna Stark and we can't abide rape, unless Ramsey is raping Sansa Stark.  When a Northern Bastard Lord is raping a Stark daughter we totally let that slide.

Bran: Lyanna wasn't raped, she and Rhaegar were in love and ran away together.  Jon is their secret baby and heir to the throne, bow to your new king.

Everyone:...???...

????

also::

Bran:: Jon your butt looked so beautiful on the boat that night 

[nikma]

1 minute ago, bubble sparkly said:

If they are going to have Bran continue to be a robot, then they at least better use it for maximum drama by having him drop Jon's parentage bomb in the most awkward, painful and public way possible lol.

I don't know about that, but I really liked how his new personality worked with Sam. I hope we see more of that in the last season. 

[bubble sparkly]

2 minutes ago, GraceK said:

Bran:: Jon your butt looked so beautiful on the boat that night 

Bran: Your sperm also looked beautiful as it fertilised the egg of your aunt Daenerys, ensuring Targaryen restoration.

[nikma]

Out of all main characters, Bran was the most difficult to adapt, after ACOK/S2 his character is isolated from the rest, everything becomes internal, there is not a lot of plot development in his chapters after ACOK. There is a lot about history and lore and his internal life, but if  you break down what actually happens in his storyline in the last 3 books it's not much at all. It is not strange that they've kept Rickon and Osha longer with him in the show, that they gave him Craster's Keep arc and that they've cut him from S5. 

[Eyes High]

11 minutes ago, anamika said:

It's funny that this got released now considering our very recent discussion here on how all Targaryens were mad and despised and white supremacists/nazis who should be killed off. And GRRM releases a chapter which covers good governance under the Targaryens and their relationship with the North! It's almost like GRRM was reading our discussion and decided to provide some new material :)

Jaehaerys and Alysanne make me think of a future Jon and Dany if they survive and end up as leaders. Jon has proven to be quite the administrator in ADwD and Dany looks like the person to get on her dragon, go places and charm (or coerce) people into following her.

To be fair to the Targ haters, Jaehaerys and Alysanne are the best the Targ monarchs have to offer and are not representative of the typical Targ rulers, since historically they’ve hovered between mediocre and disastrous. Even Aegon V, who was sane, intelligent and well-intentioned (which already distinguishes him from several Targ rulers), racked up several failures and had his reign end in disaster.

With all that said, I agree that Jon and Dany have the potential to be the next Jaehaerys and Alysanne.

[nikma]

Jon and Dany will bring balance to the force and make Westeros great again.

[GrailKing]

5 hours ago, anamika said:

How does she know what stupid decisions Ned made that got him killed? Here's the thing - Ned was surrounded by enemies on enemy territory and he had to depend on people like LF - and considering that even folks like Tywin trusted LF, does that make him stupid? Hindsight is 20/20 and I am sure he would not have expected his own daughter to stupidly and selfishly betray him to Cersei. And considering that Sansa was still entertaining, listening to and taking advice from LF at this point, her calling Ned's decisions stupid is the pot calling the kettle black.

And  I agree she was correct on her assessment of the Northern Lords on the show. Which is what I mentioned before - the entire North is very different on the show and the books.  Their motivations are different, their actions are different. In the books we have big bucket Wull:

Probably from her years stuck in KL and LF, QOT, Sansa understood it was Ned's honor that got him killed, just like Arya did, and Ned had options besides LF, but that went against his honor and what he perceived rightful law.

 Sansa  taking and listening to LF kept her alive, like it or not she out lasted him thanks to his lessons and she still maintains her humanity, got her family and home back.

Sansa, Arya, Bran, Jon are all poised to be a power force if they survive and it's all from their many lessons they learned from good and bad people

You love the word betray, but no.

As I said Sansa doesn't call Ned stupid, he made foolish mistakes, but plenty of others have called Ned stupid.

6 hours ago, anamika said:

Arya is currently 11. Considering how much trouble GRRM has aging up his characters, I doubt their adventures are going to continue for another two years. Especially since he mentioned we are going to be see more of the Others in the next two books. The Wall is most likely about to fall as well considering everything's that happened there. The story is supposed to move faster now that we are in the last act and all the characters have finished their learning arcs and now have to do.

Yes, but she's very close to 12, when Sansa is in the Eyrie, so to me if a 12 Yo has to save the world, I think it be Bran.

Time line sucks, lets throw rotten tomatoes at George.

[cambridgeguy]

On 9/27/2018 at 9:36 PM, Eyes High said:

To be fair to the Targ haters, Jaehaerys and Alysanne are the best the Targ monarchs have to offer and are not representative of the typical Targ rulers, since historically they’ve hovered between mediocre and disastrous. Even Aegon V, who was sane, intelligent and well-intentioned (which already distinguishes him from several Targ rulers), racked up several failures and had his reign end in disaster.

With all that said, I agree that Jon and Dany have the potential to be the next Jaehaerys and Alysanne.

It seems like the main benefit of having a ruler for on the Iron Throne is that it prevents the various kingdoms from fighting each other all of the time.  Aside from that each kingdom seems to do it's own thing and the Great Houses were pretty good at keeping their people content.  I doubt that Ned, Tywin, Doran, etc. were constantly getting ravens from King's Landing telling them what to do (yeah, Robert didn't care but Jon Arryn would have sent those if it was necessary).  Having Dany/Jon on the throne at the end will help settle the current instability since the Martells, Baratheons, Tyrells, and (probably) the Lannisters will all be officially gone by the end of the series.

[areca]

Oh, Sansa will rule alright.  She will take Casterly Rock and claim it for the Starks in a final act of revenge.  Arya will become the Lady of the North.   Bran will become the Hermit King at the Vale.  Jon or Dany will die (probably Dany) and the remainder will be the sole remaining ruler stationed at King's Landing.  And the Starks will hold it all.

Edited September 29, 2018 by areca

[anamika]

I was hoping that Sophie Turner would give more interviews while doing promotion for her movie. She's more leaky than Friki and we would have got some stuff to discuss. But with Dark Phoenix getting pushed to a summer 2019 release, I guess that's it with her interviews for now.

Friki is currently theorizing that after the trial, Tyrion could get send to the wall. Like wat? Was he not very sure that Tryion is executed and dies? I am confused.

[Happy Harpy]

5 hours ago, anamika said:

Friki is currently theorizing that after the trial, Tyrion could get send to the wall. Like wat? Was he not very sure that Tryion is executed and dies? I am confused.

According to him, in this latest video he only discusses his subscribers' theories that he likes, Tyrion sent to the Wall was one of them; there was no new spoiler or info.

It was only part of the GoT milk? 2018-2019 campaign.

Edited September 30, 2018 by Happy Harpy

[SimoneS]

7 hours ago, anamika said:

Friki is currently theorizing that after the trial, Tyrion could get send to the wall. Like wat? Was he not very sure that Tryion is executed and dies? I am confused.

I like this theory. If he does betray Jon and/or Dany, better Tyrion get sent to the crumbled wall than be executed.

[anamika]

Finally some good news!

https://www.huffingtonpost.in/entry/game-of-thrones-ghost-season-8_us_5b7eb066e4b0348585fe242b

Quote

“Oh, you’ll see him (Ghost) again. He has a fair amount of screen time in Season 8,” VFX supervisor Joe Bauer told me in an interview in August. “He does show up.” 

“Ghost does show up, and he does some ... he’s very present and does some pretty cool things in Season 8,” he said.

Edited September 30, 2018 by anamika

[SimoneS]

1 hour ago, anamika said:

Finally some good news!

https://www.huffingtonpost.in/entry/game-of-thrones-ghost-season-8_us_5b7eb066e4b0348585fe242b

 

I think we see Ghost and Nymeria and her pack saving lives in the battles. I can't wait for Daenerys to meet Ghost. It will be love at first sight! I wonder what Drogo and Rhaegal and Ghost will think about the other when they meet.

Edited September 30, 2018 by SimoneS

[nikma]

I expected this. 

After almost 2 years of work on S8 I'm sure they will give us a lot of dragons, direwolves, elephants, giants and so on.

[anamika]

26 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

I think we see Ghost and Nymeria and her pack saving lives in the battles. I can't wait for Daenerys to meet Ghost. It will be love at first sight! I wonder what the Drogo and Rhaegal and Ghost will think about the other when they meet.

Yeah, I want to see Arya/Nymeria and Jon/Ghost fight together. We have seen quite a bit of Dany and her dragons do some amazing stuff. It's time to showcase what the Starks and their direwolves can do together.

Just hearing that Ghost has a fair amount of screentime has got me excited. I hope he's huge and in his final size. And yes, it will be fun to see Dany's reaction to him.

[GraceK]

4 minutes ago, anamika said:

ust hearing that Ghost has a fair amount of screentime has got me excited. I hope he's huge and in his final size.

I’m both excited and scared. I hope my baby makes it out alive. ?if anything happens to Ghost I think my heart will finally break for good.

[GrailKing]

5 hours ago, SimoneS said:

I like this theory. If he does betray Jon and/or Dany, better Tyrion get sent to the crumbled wall than be executed.

I like Tyrion, but I want Tywin's line  to end. I be happy seeing Jon swing the sword; but purposely  miss. With Jon and Sansa both having  some doubts and they do what Tyrion did to Jorah in front of Dany. Save him but banish him.

[GrailKing]

About Effin time, I like to see Ghost pounce on Tyrion, knowing he's not being 100% truthful.

ETA: And shows Danny love maybe nuzzle's the bun in the little oven and all the Starks take notice.

Edited September 30, 2018 by GrailKing

[SimoneS]

35 minutes ago, GrailKing said:

I like Tyrion, but I want Tywin's line  to end. I be happy seeing Jon swing the sword; but purposely  miss. With Jon and Sansa both having  some doubts and they do what Tyrion did to Jorah in front of Dany. Save him but banish him.

I think that the only way for Tywin's line to end is for Tyrion to die. The wall is already destroyed which means that the Night Watch is done and there is nothing to stop Tyrion from procreating if he is banished. After Peter Dinklage's comments, I have to admit that I now think that Tyrion's betrayal and death are a possibility. 

[bubble sparkly]

Perhaps Ghost and Nymeria will give us direwolf restoration lol.

[Happy Harpy]

3 hours ago, GrailKing said:

I like Tyrion, but I want Tywin's line  to end.

Jaime isn't sterile -as the show just reminded everyone with Cersei's last bun in the oven. Why do people keep forgetting about it? (Not only you.)

It isn't as if Jaime x Brienne needed a pomegranate or shit was a crackship. It might not happen but it's likely enough to not dismissed from the start and for Tyrion not to be considered as the only male Lannister able to procreate and further the line.

[bubble sparkly]

4 minutes ago, Happy Harpy said:

Jaime isn't sterile -as the show just reminded everyone with Cersei's last bun in the oven. Why do people keep forgetting about it? (Not only you.)

The spoilers about Jaimie dying seem pretty solid, so I think most people are assuming he bites it and thus won't have anymore kids.  I guess Brienne could get pregnant if she and Jaime hook up prior to his death, although I wouldn't be shocked if we only get a dying-in-the -arms kiss between them.

[Happy Harpy]

14 minutes ago, bubble sparkly said:

The spoilers about Jaimie dying seem pretty solid, so I think most people are assuming he bites it and thus won't have anymore kids.  I guess Brienne could get pregnant if she and Jaime hook up prior to his death, although I wouldn't be shocked if we only get a dying-in-the -arms kiss between them.

If this is true, Jaime dies in episode 3 or 4, so at the half-mark or two-third (?)-mark for S8 -a lot of things can happen. For example, in 7x01, Daenerys' forces were overwhelming and she seemed unstoppable, yet two episodes later she had lost her three allies and she was losing the war.

Jaime was showed sleeping with Cersei in 7x03 (imo, just to leave no doubt as to who the father was) and she was pregnant in 7x05. After six seasons of build-up, Jaime/Brienne could even hop in bed in 8x02 and it wouldn't be out of the blue.

It's imo more than enough not to dismiss the possibility of Jaime fathering a child, least entirely.

[anamika]

7 hours ago, GraceK said:

I’m both excited and scared. I hope my baby makes it out alive. ?if anything happens to Ghost I think my heart will finally break for good.

Ghost is a creature of the North. And I don't think Jon's story ends in the North anymore. Jon is either dying or ending south. I am preparing for Ghost either dying in battle or Jon and Ghost telling goodbye and Ghost heading off to the lands beyond the wall.

Of course, Jon himself leaving everything behind and heading to the lands of always winter is also one of the speculated endings. So Ghost may accompany him there if that's the case.

[GrailKing]

6 hours ago, Happy Harpy said:

Jaime isn't sterile -as the show just reminded everyone with Cersei's last bun in the oven. Why do people keep forgetting about it? (Not only you.)

It isn't as if Jaime x Brienne needed a pomegranate or shit was a crackship. It might not happen but it's likely enough to not dismissed from the start and for Tyrion not to be considered as the only male Lannister able to procreate and further the line.

What makes you think I or others forgot about Jaime?

Jaime didn't know about Lancel or moon boy ( Euron )for all we know.

If Brienne does have Jaime's child, I'm convinced she bring him up as a Tarth.

Edited October 1, 2018 by GrailKing

[SimoneS]

5 hours ago, Happy Harpy said:

 After six seasons of build-up, Jaime/Brienne could even hop in bed in 8x02 and it wouldn't be out of the blue.

It's imo more than enough not to dismiss the possibility of Jaime fathering a child, least entirely.

Yes, it is possible, but it feels like Jaime's story is at its end. He gets redemption and that is it. We'll see though.

[Happy Harpy]

1 hour ago, GrailKing said:

If Brienne does have Jaime's child, I'm convinced she bring him up as a Tarth.

 

He'll (or she'll) still have Tywin's blood.

Edited October 1, 2018 by Happy Harpy

[GrailKing]

19 minutes ago, Happy Harpy said:

He'll (or she'll) still have Tywin's blood.

Won't matter if she names him a Tarth. She rather keep the child alive under her name rather risk the child killed as a Lannister.

[Happy Harpy]

3 minutes ago, GrailKing said:

Won't matter if she names him a Tarth. She rather keep the child alive under her name rather risk the child killed as a Lannister.

The subject is ending Tywin's line. If (again, it's an if) Jaime fathers a child, Tywin's line doesn't end. Tywin didn't kill infant Tyrion because he had his blood, so yes it mattered to him.

And why would the hypothetical child be killed as a Lannister?

57 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

Yes, it is possible, but it feels like Jaime's story is at its end. He gets redemption and that is it. We'll see though.

Yes. I don't know if it will happen, and I don't mean that people can't think otherwise. It isn't fact, that's all.

[GrailKing]

1 hour ago, Happy Harpy said:

The subject is ending Tywin's line. If (again, it's an if) Jaime fathers a child, Tywin's line doesn't end. Tywin didn't kill infant Tyrion because he had his blood, so yes it mattered to him.

And why would the hypothetical child be killed as a Lannister?

Why did Ned Stark lie for all those years about Jon?

Brienne would give the child her ser name, not Lannister, to keep the child safe from people who could want to kill it.

[whateverdgaf]

I think if Brienne were to have Jaime's child, she would acknowledge it as Jaime's so she can honour him, otherwise this would be the fourth child that grows up without Jaime's name.

[WindyNights]

10 hours ago, Happy Harpy said:

Jaime isn't sterile -as the show just reminded everyone with Cersei's last bun in the oven. Why do people keep forgetting about it? (Not only you.)

It isn't as if Jaime x Brienne needed a pomegranate or shit was a crackship. It might not happen but it's likely enough to not dismissed from the start and for Tyrion not to be considered as the only male Lannister able to procreate and further the line.

It's not going to happen. People just want Jaime and Brienne to hook up and for Jaime to leave a child behind because he's popular but that's not the way that Jaime and Brienne's story is set up.

Brienne's endgame isn't to become Jaime's baby factory to ensure his blood lives on. 

But anyways, it seems that there won't be any epilogue according to another leak which goes with what Liam said about the ending.

[whateverdgaf]

20 minutes ago, WindyNights said:

It's not going to happen. People just want Jaime and Brienne to hook up and for Jaime to leave a child behind because he's popular but that's not the way that Jaime and Brienne's story is set up.

Brienne's endgame isn't to become Jaime's baby factory to ensure his blood lives on. 

But anyways, it seems that there won't be any epilogue according to another leak which goes with what Liam said about the ending.

As a Brienne fan I would like Brienne to have Jaime's child if Jaime dies because otherwise she would be practically alone in the world. Pod's actor wasn't seen much and it's likely for him to be killed off early next season, so if Jaime dies as well Brienne will have no one. 

[anamika]

37 minutes ago, WindyNights said:

Brienne's endgame isn't to become Jaime's baby factory to ensure his blood lives on.

lol! Poor Brienne. Either destined to be stuck in servitude under someone like Sansa or survive to ensure that Jaime has a baby. Gwendoline herself sees Brienne as going off on adventures and starting a school for young ladies at the end of it all. I don't think that can happen, but Brienne's story has been closely linked to Jaime's - especially in the books - and hence maybe the resolution of her story is linked to his.

37 minutes ago, WindyNights said:

But anyways, it seems that there won't be any epilogue according to another leak which goes with what Liam said about the ending.

There not being a proper resolution was a given considering how much has changed from books to show. Even GRRM is unable to complete the books with all his many plots and characters. So how will the show be able to do it? There is no known character left in Dorne and Highgarden on the show. All the Martells and Tyrells are dead. I think Edmure and his child will be back in the Riverlands in the books - on the show, that's doubtful. I am very certain Rickon will survive in the books. I don't think they are even going to discuss how the Stark name will be carried forward and that will be left up in the air if there is no epilogue on the show. If Tyrion is indeed dying on the show, and with Jaime and Cersei most probably dead as well,  all the Lannisters are gone on the show. What happens to Casterly Rock then? House Baratheon and Greyjoy may get a resolution because of Gendry and Yara - two known characters. I do think a lot will be left vague or unresolved towards the end.

Edited October 1, 2018 by anamika

[Happy Harpy]

2 hours ago, GrailKing said:

Why did Ned Stark lie for all those years about Jon?

Because Robert wanted to kill all the Targaryens. Only Robert, who happened to be king.

Out of the people who are likely to survive and have some power, who holds innocent children responsible for the crimes of their fathers (or family)?

Not Jon. Not Daenerys. Not Davos. Bran doesn't seem able to feel hatred or want revenge and if he did, Jaime would be dead the moment he reaches WF. Arya, so-called soulless vengeful psycho *snorts*, didn't kill Jaime just because he has the Lannister name, whereas she had the opportunity. Even when Varys obeyed Robert, he arranged for the attempts on the Targ kids to fail.

The other houses? People who were blinded by their Lannister hatred, the old Karstark and Ellaria/the Sand Snakes are all dead*, so are the Tyrells. I don't think that any other House has enough personal hatred for House Lannister, or enough power to go against the rulers' will -less when said rulers famously don't take the murder of innocent children kindly. Moreover, several potential house heads have reasons not to go after a child, like Theon who's still haunted by the two farm boys he killed, or Gendry who was hunted and molested because of his blood.

The common folks don't seem to hate Cersei or the Lannisters more than they do any other House; so far they only rallied around the winner no matter what, I'd say they're a McGuffin rather than a political actor. If Jaime dies, it will be fighting for the people against the AOTD. If Brienne survives, she will be a hero of the war. They'll certainly find better targets if they need somone to hate.

There's Sansa, of course, who showed her generous soul dealing with Ned Umber and Alys Karstark, but again since both parents fought on the good side, her argumentation has no basis.

The only person who could truly threaten Jaime's child with another woman is Cersei, and not because of his family name.

*All died because they killed an innocent Lannister child, so maybe there's something the writers are saying here.

1 hour ago, WindyNights said:

Brienne's endgame isn't to become Jaime's baby factory to ensure his blood lives on.

Nobody is saying that Brienne has to or will have a child in order to pass the Lannister blood on.

I'm saying the opposite. Because Brienne and Jaime's relationship has been developed for six seasons and the sexual attraction between them was explicitely stated on the show, it's possible that they have sex in S8, therefore it's possible that Brienne gets pregnant with his child. Furthering Tywin's line would be a side consequence, not the cause or goal. It doesn't mean either that having a child will be the alpha and omega of Brienne's character.

[Meredith Quill]

I think it extremely unlikely that Brienne & Jaime hook up sexually. For me, their arc has been more symbolic of 'courtly love' vs getting it on. Additionally, given that their whole dynamic has been about 'honour' and what it means to be honorable, the idea that Jaime would 'dishonour' Brienne by sleeping with her/getting her with child outside the bonds of marriage seems counter-intuitive to that.

I have a hunch that Brienne's destiny is to become the first female Lord Commander of the King/Queensguard and as such, the responsibility for The White Book becomes hers; she'll be the one who records Jaime's heroic deeds within its pages. How the act he's reviled for - killing The Mad King - saved the lives of the people of Kings Landing, how he learned to be a better person; saving her from being gang raped and losing a hand for it, rescuing her from being mauled to death, keeping his oath to Catelyn Stark by sending her to find and get Sansa to safety and giving her a sword forged from the Stark family sword, Ice, to do so, not to mention the heroic stuff he's gonna do, plus imo he's definitely gonna be killed *whilst performing a heroic act, in S8.

And that feels like a poignant ending for both their stories. #bittersweet

*"You fucking idiot" - It wouldn't surprise me one bit if that line returned when whatever brave-but-suicidal thing he does causes his death for real next time.

[SimoneS]

Brienne is one character who I hope survives and has a happy ending. Yes, she can be sad over Jaime's death, but his choices doomed him, she has made better ones. I hope she is able to be independent and have the honorable life that she wants. She can go home and become Lady of Tarth.

[YaddaYadda]

Brienne doesn't need to have Jaime's baby, although I can see D&D indulging themselves in the same way they did with Missandei and Grey Worm. Brienne is her father's heir. She can go home, or do whatever she wants with her life now that her vows have been fulfilled.