S03.E06: The Pot

[OnceSane]

Quote

Frankie refuses to go home, and all the kids are dragged into Grace and Frankie's fight. Grace, Brianna and Mallory smoke Frankie's pot together.

[Bastet]

I love the silly episodes, and how they blend that with the ongoing relationship issues.  I love that virtually every time there is a disagreement between two characters, I see both sides.

Grace’s gun is named Louise, hee.

I liked going back and forth between the two versions of the shooting.  And the double fuck-you of smoking all of Frankie’s pot without her.

“We can hang out more, just like tonight.  We can smoke the pot, and have the talks.  Maybe we can start a book club.”

Damn; this is all the time I have to watch until tomorrow night or Sunday.  I’m loving this season so far.

[EarlGreyTea]

Damn, do I love it when Grace and Frankie interact with their kids. The dynamic is just so, so good. Frankie clearly has a warm relationship with her boys, but Grace's girls can't fully....I don't know the word. Grace has put up more a wall with them over the years, and now that she's divorced, can't fully let their relationship thaw.

And now that Bud finally has a life, he doesn't have as much time for his family's shenanigans, which I applaud. Last season he was running around putting out fires left and right. Good for him for finally putting his foot down. And major respect to how well he is able to call Frankie out. Always being the responsible one can grate on a person.

I was disappointed that Robert and Sol moved out of that gorgeous house, but wow am I over that disappointment. Their new house is stunning, and since they live in California, probably a cool $3 million at least. Love that there is finally less interaction between the two sets of couples. If it was any of the previous seasons, Robert and Sol would have been part of the fight.

Edited March 25, 2017 by EarlGreyTea

[zxy556575]

6 hours ago, EarlGreyTea said:

Frankie clearly has a warm relationship with her boys, but Grace's girls can't fully....I don't know the word. Grace has put up more a wall with them over the years, and now that she's divorced, can't fully let their relationship thaw.

I really like that Grace isn't the stereotypical grandmother fawning over/living for the grandkids, either. It's consistent with her character and is also a point of view we don't see much in entertainment.

[Empress1]

On 3/25/2017 at 0:27 PM, EarlGreyTea said:

And now that Bud finally has a life, he doesn't have as much time for his family's shenanigans, which I applaud. Last season he was running around putting out fires left and right. Good for him for finally putting his foot down. And major respect to how well he is able to call Frankie out. Always being the responsible one can grate on a person.

I agree. 18 months is plenty of time to get your shit together, Coyote. (I still don't like Bud's creepy girlfriend though.)

[EarlGreyTea]

22 hours ago, Lord Donia said:

I really like that Grace isn't the stereotypical grandmother fawning over/living for the grandkids, either. It's consistent with her character and is also a point of view we don't see much in entertainment.

Agreed. And kids tend to bring down a show (IMO) unless they're good actors, which is hard to find. Not every show can strike gold with its child actors like Stranger Things did. So I'm glad they've only gotten one or two episodes. If the grandkids were older, even teenagers or young adults, then I'd want to see them interact with Grace.

Have you all noticed we're seeing Grace eat a lot more this season? Maybe they're dropping all the anorexia jokes from seasons past. She still seems like a textbook alcoholic, though.

Edited March 26, 2017 by EarlGreyTea

[Clanstarling]

6 minutes ago, EarlGreyTea said:

Agreed. And kids tend to bring down a show (IMO) unless they're good actors, which is hard to find. Not every show can strike gold with its child actors like Stranger Things did. So I'm glad they've only gotten one or two episodes. If the grandkids were older, even teenagers or young adults, then I'd want to see them interact with Grace.

Have you all noticed we're seeing Grace eat a lot more this season? Maybe they're dropping all the anorexia jokes from seasons past. She still seems like a textbook alcoholic, though.

To be fair, Stranger Things is constructed around the kids, exceptionally great kids, so they're kind of a high standard and the showrunners clearly made a strong effort to cast the best of the best (even the toddler sister is pretty great, imo).

But I agree that in general, I don't care for kids in an adult show. It is rare that it works, and usually only in shows about families with young children (Parenthood, et al) and even then...

Edited March 26, 2017 by Clanstarling

[Bastet]

1 hour ago, EarlGreyTea said:

Have you all noticed we're seeing Grace eat a lot more this season? Maybe they're dropping all the anorexia jokes from seasons past. She still seems like a textbook alcoholic, though.

Yes, I noticed she's eating more.  I don't think she's an alcoholic, though; I think she's just a heavy drinker (and not even as heavy as in previous seasons).  She has definitely abused alcohol, but I don't see her as addicted to it.

[zxy556575]

Frankie has made a few jokes about Grace being bony. The two of them poking fun at each other's idiosyncrasies and foibles makes me laugh, though, because they're always spot on.

(Although honestly, Frankie is very thin herself.)

Edited March 27, 2017 by Lord Donia

[OtterMommy]

I have to say that I like stoned Grace.

That being said, I felt this episode was a little too easy. Yeah, Grace and Frankie made up and they shared that they both felt lonely in their marriages (was that supposed to be a surprise?), but I didn't feel like anything fundamentally changed between them.

Also, someone mentioned--I think on another episode thread--that Robert and Sol have no chemistry.  Honestly, I never noticed--probably because I consider them peripheral characters and I'm not that interested in either of them.  But, yeah, I noticed how inert that relationship is in this episode.  And I don't even mean romantically.  Jane Fonda and Lily Tomlin have great chemistry together whenever they are on screen.  But watching Robert and Sol sitting on the couch was just....flatlining.  And these two guys are fabulous actors, so I'm not sure why this isn't working at all for me.

[Wings]

27 minutes ago, OtterMommy said:

Also, someone mentioned--I think on another episode thread--that Robert and Sol have no chemistry.  Honestly, I never noticed--probably because I consider them peripheral characters and I'm not that interested in either of them.  But, yeah, I noticed how inert that relationship is in this episode.  And I don't even mean romantically.  Jane Fonda and Lily Tomlin have great chemistry together whenever they are on screen.  But watching Robert and Sol sitting on the couch was just....flatlining.  And these two guys are fabulous actors, so I'm not sure why this isn't working at all for me.

I have said this from season one.  They are not a believable couple.  They have known, worked together and loved each other for over 20 years and there is no evidence of that.   No shared jokes, memories, rituals or traditions, nothing.  

The writers have not taken note of this feedback, it is everywhere. Fortunately we don't see a lot of them alone. 

[Blakeston]

On 3/27/2017 at 3:27 PM, wings707 said:

I have said this from season one.  They are not a believable couple.  They have known, worked together and loved each other for over 20 years and there is no evidence of that.   No shared jokes, memories, rituals or traditions, nothing.  

Well, there was that business with the Ryan Gosling chair, so I guess they had an inside joke about sitting on his face. In retrospect, it's kind of difficult to picture them talking that way.

I wasn't crazy about how Grace and Frankie resolved their argument in this one. They've both blatantly lied to one another about extremely important issues, and the resolution is...that Grace is willing to give up her gun, because she has someone living with her? What about their shattered trust? And why is Frankie so satisfied with Grace looking her in the eye and kissing her forehead, when the last time she did that it was a complete lie?

[Clanstarling]

4 hours ago, Blakeston said:

Well, there was that business with the Ryan Gosling chair, so I guess they had an inside joke about sitting on his face. In retrospect, it's kind of difficult to picture them talking that way.

I wasn't crazy about how Grace and Frankie resolved their argument in this one. They've both blatantly lied to one another about extremely important issues, and the resolution is...that Grace is willing to give up her gun, because she has someone living with her? What about their shattered trust? And why is Frankie so satisfied with Grace looking her in the eye and kissing her forehead, when the last time she did that it was a complete lie?

On Frankie's part, I see it pretty easily. She seems like a "forgive and forget" kind of person. Whereas I'm a forgive, maybe, forget never, kind of person. Grace I'm not so sure about - maybe she was willing to give up the gun because she realized she wasn't alone anymore.

As for Robert and Sol being a believable couple - the only experience I have with that was my former husband's college mentor. He and his partner were together for about that long, and I got pretty much the same vibe from them that I get from Robert and Sol. The professor was about as stodgy as Robert and his partner was the dramatic one. Interestingly enough, my ex never accepted that they were gay, despite rather glaring evidence and having grown up in SF and having gay friends. He had quite the blinders on when it came to his mentor.

Edited March 30, 2017 by Clanstarling

[stillshimpy]

On 3/26/2017 at 3:39 PM, Bastet said:

Yes, I noticed she's eating more.  I don't think she's an alcoholic, though; I think she's just a heavy drinker (and not even as heavy as in previous seasons).  She has definitely abused alcohol, but I don't see her as addicted to it.

Grace and Frankie are both in my mom's age range and one of the things that I enjoy about the show is that Grace drinks like she is from a different generation.  Frequently and without much self-criticism about it.   Last season when she had vodka hidden everywhere, I thought for a horrible moment that they were going to have her declare she was an alcoholic and we'd have to go on some kind of sober journey with her.  Not that there's a thing wrong with people recognizing when they have a problem, it's just that Grace is a habitual drinker vs. an alcoholic.  I'm glad they kept it at that level.  

She's openly boozy and people know to give her a martini if they wish to curry favor.  But it isn't the thing that has defined her life or her relationships.  It hasn't done the damage to her life that alcoholism does to people and those around them, with one very notable exception.   She drinks, she drinks far more than anyone should by medical standards and for the most part she's not manifesting any signs of it being a true problem.  It's a character note and I'm glad the show hasn't decided to take a lecturing tone, or turn this into a morality play.  

She drinks far more than I personally think is a good idea for anyone but she also drinks about as much as a lot of my mother's friends did and still do in a lot of instances.  

I like that the show doesn't spend a great deal of time trying to fix the characters because Frankie's fondness for pot is her character note along the same lines.  It's like a billboard from the show "If you're looking for a staircase with 12 steps, keep looking, these people are working with who they are and doing the best they can with that."  

It wouldn't work for me in a real person but I'm oddly charmed by it on the show. 

 

On 3/27/2017 at 11:55 AM, OtterMommy said:

That being said, I felt this episode was a little too easy. Yeah, Grace and Frankie made up and they shared that they both felt lonely in their marriages (was that supposed to be a surprise?), but I didn't feel like anything fundamentally changed between them.

Also, someone mentioned--I think on another episode thread--that Robert and Sol have no chemistry.  Honestly, I never noticed--probably because I consider them peripheral characters and I'm not that interested in either of them.  But, yeah, I noticed how inert that relationship is in this episode.  And I don't even mean romantically.  Jane Fonda and Lily Tomlin have great chemistry together whenever they are on screen.  But watching Robert and Sol sitting on the couch was just....flatlining.  And these two guys are fabulous actors, so I'm not sure why this isn't working at all for me.

I think a lot of that is a function of comedy first, some dramatic development second.  I was waiting for Frankie to be able to make her point but this show is lecture-light and clearly, they are keeping it that way.  Besides, it leaves tensions on the table for more stories later.    Bud called Frankie on some of her more manipulative behaviors that she cloaks in hemp-woven garments and tries to put forth as enlightenment cloaked in the mantle of an all-loving hippie.   Grace did also.   Plugging your ears and refusing to listen to anyone as you sing loudly is childish, not evolved or a problem-solving technique.   However, they also illustrated the good parts of Frankie's nature.  She's always poised on the edge of forgiveness and happy to leap when she gets a chance.   That's what makes her winning instead of unbearable. 

Clanstarling upthread referred to the kids from Stranger Things and how the producers there cast carefully for the roles.  That's entirely true.   I think the issue with Robert and Sol is that they didn't cast carefully for the roles, they were just giddy to get Martin Sheen and Sam Waterson and who can blame them?  Not me.   I'm very aware that I'm watching two giant talents playing roles vs. relating to the characters because they don't have a particularly convincing relationship.  Their chemistry is sort of negligible but that's okay by me. 

I love watching Grace interact with her kids and I also loved watching Bud finally start setting some boundaries.   I also like how little anger was involved in any of that.  Bud was right, Frankie has long felt too free to make herself her sons' responsibility.  She doesn't seem to understand that her relationship with her grown sons is meant to be mostly autonomous and whereas I don't like Bud's overly neurotic and peculiar girlfriend, I loved that he finally just called foul.  

Edited September 19, 2017 by stillshimpy

[Sesquipedalia]

On 3/27/2017 at 1:55 PM, OtterMommy said:

Also, someone mentioned--I think on another episode thread--that Robert and Sol have no chemistry.  Honestly, I never noticed--probably because I consider them peripheral characters and I'm not that interested in either of them.  But, yeah, I noticed how inert that relationship is in this episode.  And I don't even mean romantically.  Jane Fonda and Lily Tomlin have great chemistry together whenever they are on screen.  But watching Robert and Sol sitting on the couch was just....flatlining.  And these two guys are fabulous actors, so I'm not sure why this isn't working at all for me.

Flatlining describes it well, unfortunately. This show would be so much better if I could enjoy and root for the Robert/Sol relationship, but the extreme lack of chemistry makes it impossible. Conversely, the chemistry between Grace and Frankie is so strong I find myself kind of wishing they were a couple.