Young Justice - General Discussion

[Lantern7]

6 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

The summary for the fourth episode makes it sound like we're still there. I'm stunned they'd spend so much time on this. FOUR episodes? Seriously?

Budget issues? Not animating lip movements must save a few bucks.

[GHScorpiosRule]

11 hours ago, ruby24 said:

The summary for the fourth episode makes it sound like we're still there. I'm stunned they'd spend so much time on this. FOUR episodes? Seriously?

And this is why I'm waiting until all episodes are out. Jeebus Cripes.

I want to know about Wally.

Yeah, I'm dying on this hill.

[Primal Slayer]

Hopefully this was our last episode on Mars and we can move on. Im so tired of these sets of characters that even though the end was good and tense, im ready to move on.

Between this a s3...even though the writing is still better than 99% of other DC content, they aren't focusing on characters that interest me so wanting a 5th season is hard. 

[ruby24]

Yeah, I don't know what they're thinking in structuring things this way. Do they really think this is interesting, this is the way to do things? I don't get it.

If they're not going to focus on characters people want to see...look, Season 1 was the best and looking back on still today, it's pretty easy to pinpoint why. We liked all the characters and we liked them interacting with EACH OTHER. These separate arcs with random people mixed in is just...why? Why do it like this? 

[The Crazed Spruce]

For any Canadians in this thread, Teletoon will finally start airing Season 4 on November 7th.

[Lantern7]

Finally caught the latest episode. Geez, great that the heavy-handed overtones stopped . . . stopped long enough for a heavier hand to smack us in the face. I wanted to get away from M’arzz . . . but not like this. NOT LIKE THIS!!!! I didn’t want to hear Winnie Cooper dramatically cry!

Okay, I think I wrote enough to fill a content space. I’m wondering . . . is it possible the Legion faked Conner’s death for their own means? I’m thinking that if you need to snag a superhero, leaving behind a fake body in lava is pretty convincing. Martians can’t stand the flame, Superman can’t get close because of the Kryptonite. And since Gar has Martian blood, he can’t retrieve the body.

And is it possible that maybe the Legionaires went Freejack and nabbed Wally in the S2 finale? I swear, I’m not trying to bait @GHScorpiosRule or give false hope. Maybe the Legion needed Wally and Conner. Or maybe I’m way off, and I’m as delusional as Gar was in the prior episode. At least he had the excuse of not dealing with grief messing with his little green head.

Edited November 2, 2021 by Lantern7

[Primal Slayer]

This episode got good about halfway through but boy the first half was very rough to watch. Like Stargirl, YJ is working on a budget and it is showing. So many still shots, so many "stock" footage shots, any way to have them talking w/out showing their mouths.... they took it. 

This had a lot of flashbacks that i didn't think were needed as Artemis and Chesire are pretty fleshed out. Id rather that time be used to flesh out Arrowette, Spoiler, or Orphan. 

[Lantern7]

Back on Earth! Yeah, the story is a bit by-the-numbers, but there's no politics or massive sadness. Yeah, Artemis found herself broken, but it probably wasn't as bad as when Wally died.

Okay . . . Roy is Arsenal because he's got the weaponized replacement arm. Does Will have a code name? I post in a Facebook group based on Death Battle. Here's what I'd like to do:

Me: Okay . . . on one side? Will. His opponent? Batman.

Responses: Conditions?

Me: Will's feats are strictly from Young Justice. Batman has all feats and he's at peak performance.

Responses: Why are you wasting our ti-

Me: The battle takes place inside of a Staples.

Responses: Damn. Just . . . DAMN.

Onyx and Orphan are new to the series, right? I remember Cassandra from S3. Being a fan of the original Young Justice comic, of course I recognized Arrowette last season.

15 hours ago, Primal Slayer said:

This episode got good about halfway through but boy the first half was very rough to watch. Like Stargirl, YJ is working on a budget and it is showing. So many still shots, so many "stock" footage shots, any way to have them talking w/out showing their mouths.... they took it. 

This had a lot of flashbacks that i didn't think were needed as Artemis and Chesire are pretty fleshed out. Id rather that time be used to flesh out Arrowette, Spoiler, or Orphan. 

Maybe that was for new viewers? But the series has all seasons available on HBO Max. Perhaps this is a cost-cutting measure. If this Orphan is close to the canon version, she would need some background dropped about her ASAP.

Thinking of Stargirl . . . now I appreciate that show's Sportsmasters. That guy's a dick like the Crusher Crock we see, but he's an entertaining dick.

[Primal Slayer]

13 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Back on Earth! Yeah, the story is a bit by-the-numbers, but there's no politics or massive sadness. Yeah, Artemis found herself broken, but it probably wasn't as bad as when Wally died.

Okay . . . Roy is Arsenal because he's got the weaponized replacement arm. Does Will have a code name? I post in a Facebook group based on Death Battle. Here's what I'd like to do:

Me: Okay . . . on one side? Will. His opponent? Batman.

Responses: Conditions?

Me: Will's feats are strictly from Young Justice. Batman has all feats and he's at peak performance.

Responses: Why are you wasting our ti-

Me: The battle takes place inside of a Staples.

Responses: Damn. Just . . . DAMN.

Onyx and Orphan are new to the series, right? I remember Cassandra from S3. Being a fan of the original Young Justice comic, of course I recognized Arrowette last season.

Maybe that was for new viewers? But the series has all seasons available on HBO Max. Perhaps this is a cost-cutting measure. If this Orphan is close to the canon version, she would need some background dropped about her ASAP.

Thinking of Stargirl . . . now I appreciate that show's Sportsmasters. That guy's a dick like the Crusher Crock we see, but he's an entertaining dick.

Cassie/Orphan was in last season w/Stephanie/Spoiler but of course they just used her to fill the body count for the Batfam and never gave her anything of value. 

[Noneofyourbusiness]

On 11/4/2021 at 10:43 PM, Lantern7 said:

Does Will have a code name?

Red Arrow, though he's not active as a superhero at the moment.

[cambridgeguy]

See Bat-team, this is why you should wear armor that's resistant to swords, knives, etc.  But I do think their way of showing how Barbara was paralyzed works better than the Killing Joke.  At least she actually made a choice here rather than being a pawn in Joker's scheme to break Gordon.

And M'gann really has changed - the season 2 version would have turned her brother into a vegetable.

[Primal Slayer]

It was a great episode and i questions why they felt that M'gann needed 4 fully dedicated episodes just to her but Artemis gets 2 and one that has 3 storylines. This is how the season should've started w/at least 2 storylines split between the characters.

It was great that Cassandra gets her "origin" story and gets tied into Barbara. Hope we get that for some Wonders.....

Barbaras reasoning for jumping in front of a sword when she has batarangs was a choice. They wanted to do something new that didn't involve Killing Joke but had the same outcome, i just wish it made a tiny bit more sense but i like how it connects Barbara/Cassandra more.

The CS reveal was good, kind of wish they swapped it but still enjoyed it. The big reveal was great.

These last 2 episodes remind me why I love YJ as much as i do.

9 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

See Bat-team, this is why you should wear armor that's resistant to swords, knives, etc.  But I do think their way of showing how Barbara was paralyzed works better than the Killing Joke.  At least she actually made a choice here rather than being a pawn in Joker's scheme to break Gordon.

And M'gann really has changed - the season 2 version would have turned her brother into a vegetable.

To be fair, when something horrific happens to someone it usually isnt their choice. Being the daughter of a Commissioner in Gotham puts her in danger and it was a surprise attack. Those things dont always need to be "agency" given. 

[Lantern7]

We close on the Tigress/Cheshire/Cassandra arc . . . but shit, watching Clark explaining to his son why "Uncle Conner" won't be coming back was brutal. And beautiful.

[GHScorpiosRule]

I had nothing else to do so I watched the first eight episodes.

No WAY do I believe Connor is dead. He’ll be back.

While the conversation with Clark and Johnny was heartbreaking, it didn’t bring me to tears like the one with Supes and his dream son, Van in JLU’s “ For the Man Who Has Everything” when he says goodbye and realized Van and his life wasn’t real.

But the first four episodes were soooo boring to watch. Didn’t like the animation for all the martians. They looked like a mashup of lizards and skeletons with those teeth and mouths that didn’t move.

How many episodes are we getting this season?

[Primal Slayer]

11 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

How many episodes are we getting this season?

26. Im pretty sure the show will go on hiatus after the Zatanna arc.

[UnoAgain]

Man... When are we getting to Kaldur... I mean if were gonna do this focused arc thing and not have everyone pop in from time to time... Let's get going

[ruby24]

This arc was better (I think because it was Artemis in the lead and set on Earth), but I'm not exactly looking forward to the Zatanna/Rocket one. Gulp.

It sucks not getting appearances from everyone at the same time.

[cambridgeguy]

I suppose it's fitting that the Phantom Stranger shows up in a season titled Phantoms.

[Primal Slayer]

It was a pretty good episode. Definitely fitting the new model with some type of story followed by a bunch of awkward still images.

Zatanna taking on some students was expected along with Traci13 being part of the crowd. Mary Marvel....was a welcomed surprise. Of course something happened off screen that seems immensely interesting (on par with the show) with the Marvel fam. Interesting that she still invokes the gods powers but wont transform.

Not sure how much I care to get even more backstory to Vandals storyline. He's been the shows main villain since S1 and has gotten a lot of development but I guess we know why he's such a formidable villain when he's encountered it all.

[Lantern7]

Is it weird to want Zatanna to get captioned? When you read comics, it's easy to know what she's doing: Words forward, letters backward. It's irritating when that happens anywhere else.

On 12/2/2021 at 6:46 PM, Primal Slayer said:

Not sure how much I care to get even more backstory to Vandals storyline. He's been the shows main villain since S1 and has gotten a lot of development but I guess we know why he's such a formidable villain when he's encountered it all.

This worked for me. Interesting that Vandal and Klarion met that long ago, and their relationship began with the witch boy killing the caveman for 300 straight days. In other news, I forgot how delightfully obnoxious Klarion can be.

On 12/2/2021 at 6:46 PM, Primal Slayer said:

Zatanna taking on some students was expected along with Traci13 being part of the crowd. Mary Marvel....was a welcomed surprise. Of course something happened off screen that seems immensely interesting (on par with the show) with the Marvel fam. Interesting that she still invokes the gods powers but wont transform.

"Young Justice. Every episode: two dozen new characters firmly entrenched in DC Comics canon!" I don't mind, really . . . Mary Marvel (Sgt. Marvel?) going plainclothes supernatural with what appears to be the traditional Shazam power set used in new way is pretty cool. It's just that the character drops can get exhausting. "Wait . . . the girl scanning Cassandra and Onyx was Looker? But she's not in the weird-ass classic costume! On the other hand, she's neither vampire nor a racist with poorly-explained powers. I'll allow it."

Aside from Swamp Thing, has Blue Devil ever been on screen? I think for five seconds in Justice League Unlimited, but I can't remember for sure..

Heh . . . Saturn Girl and Chamelon Boy randomly streaming Space Trek and watching Gar perform. I'm a big fan of the seemingly random scenes in the end credits.

[Noneofyourbusiness]

On 12/5/2021 at 12:52 AM, Lantern7 said:

Mary Marvel (Sgt. Marvel?)

In Young Justice, according to Ask Greg, instead of going by Mary Marvel and Captain Marvel Jr., she and Freddie were Sergeant Marvel and Lieutenant Marvel when they were on the Team.

https://www.s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/latest.php

[cambridgeguy]

For those of you who are Gargolyes fans, the objects Blood told Mary not to touch were the Phoenix Gate, Grimorum Arcanorum, and Eye of Odin. 

And it sure sounds like they're setting things up for a new Dr. Fate. 

[Primal Slayer]

This was....a mess of an episode. It just felt very flat and the constant jumping between storylines didn't gel very well. Jumping between a glorified picture book to a telepath to the actual action is not a way to do things. I know they clearly are trying to save money but I dont know if it is worth it just to have slightly stronger animation?

[steelyis]

10 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

For those of you who are Gargolyes fans, the objects Blood told Mary not to touch were the Phoenix Gate, Grimorum Arcanorum, and Eye of Odin. 

And it sure sounds like they're setting things up for a new Dr. Fate. 

Holy Easter eggs, Batman!

[Lantern7]

On 12/10/2021 at 6:03 AM, cambridgeguy said:

For those of you who are Gargolyes fans, the objects Blood told Mary not to touch were the Phoenix Gate, Grimorum Arcanorum, and Eye of Odin. 

And it sure sounds like they're setting things up for a new Dr. Fate. 

In my defense, it’s been a figurative eternity since I’ve had to think about those. Also: has Nabu burnt out Zatara inside of ten years?

Wait . . . so Arion is Nabu? Eh, I should just focus on Klarion being a little bitch boy.

[cambridgeguy]

5 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Also: has Nabu burnt out Zatara inside of ten years?

Wait . . . so Arion is Nabu? Eh, I should just focus on Klarion being a little bitch boy.

Arion is Vandal's grandson and was (presumably) killed when Atlantis sank, while Nabu is Vandal's son. 

We saw Zatara without the helmet in S3 and he had definitely aged faster than he should have.  In this episode you can see the white beard, eyebrows, and shadows under his eyes.

[The Crazed Spruce]

4 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

We saw Zatara without the helmet in S3 and he had definitely aged faster than he should have.  In this episode you can see the white beard, eyebrows, and shadows under his eyes.

I'm betting that Dr. Fate's gonna find a new host by the end of this arc.

Spoiler

And if the comics are any indication, it'll probably be Khalid.

 

[cambridgeguy]

Well, Khalid is definitely going to be the next Dr. Fate.  All that talk about wanting to be a doctor and being Inza's nephew?  The only question is whether or not Zatara dies before he passes on the helmet.

[Primal Slayer]

It was nice to see Mary Marvel or Sargent Marvel as she is called in this verse. 

A lot of flashbacks and pictures yet again.

Dont really understand why we need to see these storylines with Gar/M'Gann in these arcs just to remind us that they are in mourning over Conner. We could easily return to their stories later in the season and show us  that they are mourning all these months later. 

Zatanna is sadly very much a means to an end in her "arc". She isn't really central like M'Gann/Conner/Artemis were. She is mostly be used to build up Vandal. 

[UnoAgain]

17 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

Well, Khalid is definitely going to be the next Dr. Fate.  All that talk about wanting to be a doctor and being Inza's nephew?  The only question is whether or not Zatara dies before he passes on the helmet.

Who's inza.. I heard them say ot but didn't understand the reference

[Primal Slayer]

14 hours ago, UnoAgain said:

Who's inza.. I heard them say ot but didn't understand the reference

Kent Nelson/Former Doctor Fates wife.

[Lantern7]

My memory stinks . . . what’s the deal with the school bus?

[Primal Slayer]

34 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

My memory stinks . . . what’s the deal with the school bus?

That's the question on everyones minds. It's the same bus and set of characters that have appeared throughout the show since S1 with no one aging. 

[Lantern7]

2 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

That's the question on everyones minds. It's the same bus and set of characters that have appeared throughout the show since S1 with no one aging. 

Shows how much I’ve paid attention. So, basically, it’s the Magic School Bus . . . FROM HELL.

You can’t go wrong with puppets, can you? Cute yet creepy!

[Primal Slayer]

4 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

Shows how much I’ve paid attention. So, basically, it’s the Magic School Bus . . . FROM HELL.

Basically lol. They've spent a lot of time just appearing in the background so easy to forget them with everything that happens in the show.

[Primal Slayer]

This episode is the kind of episode where...I don't need more of Gar taking up valuable screen & animation time. We arent moving his story anymore further with seeing that he cant perform at work. We've already seen that he can't get his Superhero on and that is enough for the time being. Put his story on pause until we are ready for a resolution.

Apart from that and the usual that we've become accustomed to...it was a very good episode. We saw a very brief shot of all 3 Wonders in 1 place at the same time which has never happened.

The Bus mystery is coming to a fun end and if we have to save budget with a minutes worth of flashbacks then this is how I'd do it.

I do wonder what makes Child THAT MUCH stronger that a Lord of Order is able to do zero harm. Her being able to crack the Helmet of Fate was....not good for the heroes and I'm interested to see how they wrap it up.

Zataras backstory was nice to get... though out of all the changes YJ makes to a characters history, Sindella seemingly being a regular person is not the best one. She is a descendant from Arion, is a homo magi and a reason why Zatanna is as gifted as she is.

[cambridgeguy]

18 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

I do wonder what makes Child THAT MUCH stronger that a Lord of Order is able to do zero harm. Her being able to crack the Helmet of Fate was....not good for the heroes and I'm interested to see how they wrap it up.

Isn't she still channeling power from all of the Lords of Chaos?  She briefly offered to surrender it when she was fighting Klarion, but I don't think she followed through.

[Primal Slayer]

50 minutes ago, cambridgeguy said:

Isn't she still channeling power from all of the Lords of Chaos?  She briefly offered to surrender it when she was fighting Klarion, but I don't think she followed through.

Oh is that why? Makes sense. 

[Primal Slayer]

Overall it was a decent conclusion. Not exactly how I was envisioning it but it had some great cliffhangers.

Having TLO just sitting there allowing TLC to bring hell on Earth didn't make sense, that isn't any kind of balance. The fact that Vandal and Stranger had to plead with them was...what? 

Mary's arc about being a bit reckless with her abilities was a good one, it would've been more impactful if we saw her during her Sgt Marvel days, at least her last day. But i wasn't sure if the voice at the end was Sgt Marvel or Granny manipulating her. But im going to assume next time we see her she'll be in black.

Zatanna manipulating her students into taking on the helmet of Fate is some dark stuff. All of that just to get her father back part time and willing to sacrifice other young lives even if it is part time for everyone. I expect others in the League to call her out on this. 

With Fate....i was expecting him to die and take on a new host but i guess this is just a best of both worlds for now.

Gar...well at least his story went forward some. Still think they could've left him out of past episodes though since like Mary, like Cassie/Tim, like everyone...we don't need every single storybeat and just a summary.

Conner wasn't saved by LOSH? And is in some inbetween? Interesting. Hopefully this next arc doesn't face the same issues this one has.

[jmonique]

Goodness, this season is terminally boring.

This Garfield storyline is torture.

[cambridgeguy]

2 hours ago, Primal Slayer said:

But i wasn't sure if the voice at the end was Sgt Marvel or Granny manipulating her. But im going to assume next time we see her she'll be in black.

Granny's VA is in the credits so that must have been her.  Mary will probably be one of the Furies the next time she shows up.

Zatanna must have spent a lot of time reading up on the Batman rule book if she manipulated her students into that deal.  Hopefully she also read the part about not letting the extremely pissed powerhouse just storm off without checking up on her.

[ruby24]

I just have not responded to the way they're doing any of this. It's chopped up, uneven storytelling. My guess is we don't even see Mary Marvel again this season. 

I don't understand having what, 4 or 5 episodes in a row of the same damn thing regarding Beast Boy. It is SO boring and it's not going anywhere! Is there going to be payoff for this? And what the hell happened to M'Gann? Why hasn't she checked on him?

[Lantern7]

I’m going to get a sketch of Child & Flaw. I just like the hulking golem with the smiley face. I got a Klarion back in ‘06, from the guy who did the art on his 7 Soldiers book.

Ugh, Mary is gonna get done bad, isn’t she? I get Zatanna’s criticisms were valid, but now Mary is being manipulated into going full-on into Shazam stuff. Doesn’t her power set come with the Wisdom of Solomon? Wouldn’t she know that she would get played? I’m guessing that I should look past that.

I’m hoping Gar’s friends skip the traditional intervention and just try to “fix” him. Uggggh.

9 hours ago, Primal Slayer said:

Mary's arc about being a bit reckless with her abilities was a good one, it would've been more impactful if we saw her during her Sgt Marvel days, at least her last day.

Anytime I think “Sgt. Marvel,” I imagine some weird fusion between Mary and Sgt. Rock, one of DC’s most popular WWII-based characters. Please don’t let me be the only one.

Are we at the break? Or do we get Rocket’s arc next?

[steelyis]

8 hours ago, jmonique said:

Goodness, this season is terminally boring.

This Garfield storyline is torture.

 

2 hours ago, ruby24 said:

I just have not responded to the way they're doing any of this. It's chopped up, uneven storytelling. My guess is we don't even see Mary Marvel again this season. 

I don't understand having what, 4 or 5 episodes in a row of the same damn thing regarding Beast Boy. It is SO boring and it's not going anywhere! Is there going to be payoff for this? And what the hell happened to M'Gann? Why hasn't she checked on him?

 

Gar is frustrating, and if I'm being honest, and hypocritical, it is a pain watching him right now. But I like how YJ shows how messy handling someone in the depths of depression can be. And from personal experience, I can say they're putting a painfully accurate representation of it on screen. It's a little triggering.

Edited December 31, 2021 by steelyis

[jmonique]

1 hour ago, steelyis said:

 

 

Gar is frustrating, and if I'm being honest, and hypocritical, it is a pain watching him right now. But I like how YJ shows how messy handling someone in the depths of depression can be. And from personal experience, I can say they're putting a painfully accurate representation of it on screen. It's a little triggering.

I don't get why we need 6 episodes or whatever it's been of showing Garfield in depression, but we've only seen M'gann once since Connor died, though. Was Greg Cipes cheaper than Danica? Was she too busy filming Hallmark movies?

I get that they're trying something new this season, but my goodness, this season is a big ball of MEH.

[steelyis]

9 minutes ago, jmonique said:

I don't get why we need 6 episodes or whatever it's been of showing Garfield in depression, but we've only seen M'gann once since Connor died, though. Was Greg Cipes cheaper than Danica? Was she too busy filming Hallmark movies?

I get that they're trying something new this season, but my goodness, this season is a big ball of MEH.

 

 

They've shown M'gann a few times since Conner died. And it was easier to watch her pain because she had other characters to play off of. Gar is harder to watch because he's more isolated.

Six episodes of Gar depressed is a lot, and I think it was a mistake from a pacing standpoint for there to be that many. Most entertainment (I hate to say this, but...) know to skip over the rougher parts of showing clinical depression. It's boring and irritating, and it isn't engaging to watch at all.

While I appreciate the care and detail put into Gar's ordeal, it sure ain't fun to watch.

[Primal Slayer]

2 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Are we at the break? Or do we get Rocket’s arc next?

We're on like a 4-5 month hiatus. 

5 hours ago, ruby24 said:

I just have not responded to the way they're doing any of this. It's chopped up, uneven storytelling. My guess is we don't even see Mary Marvel again this season. 

I wouldnt put it past them but I will be pissed if we dont.

5 hours ago, ruby24 said:

I don't understand having what, 4 or 5 episodes in a row of the same damn thing regarding Beast Boy. It is SO boring and it's not going anywhere! Is there going to be payoff for this? And what the hell happened to M'Gann? Why hasn't she checked on him?

This is of course the most annoying thing about the show...who they choose to give actual development to. Half of Gars depression arc couldve been off screen. We have skipped SO MANY essential storylines for SO MANY CHARACTERS but for some reason we need to see every step of his? We didnt need any of him in the last episode. He summed it up in this episode perfectly. 

I'm salty that the Wonder-fam has been totally ignored and 99% of their storyline happens off screen. All of Cassies growth has happened off screen. We didnt see her introduction, we dont know anything about her origins on screen, her relationship/breakup with Tim happened off screen, her being mature and good enough to be 2nd in command happened off screen. And I dont even want to get started on Troia. 

Honestly...Zatanna was barely the focus of her "arc" and it could've been condensed to 3 episodes, same with the Mars arc. 4-5 episode arcs just for half of it to be a slideshow is not enjoyable. 

I believe Greg/Brandon are TOP NOTCH and I love their work for the most part but they want to do toooo much with YJ and it makes the overall show suffer. They need some spin offs, DTVs to explore all these side stories that we need to get filled in on and I dont mean a video game or comic or some infograph.

[ruby24]

Another thing- what's going on with this slideshow shit? It makes me think the show is suffering from budget constraints but how is that possible?

[Primal Slayer]

6 hours ago, ruby24 said:

Another thing- what's going on with this slideshow shit? It makes me think the show is suffering from budget constraints but how is that possible?

They changed to a better animation studio and HBO didn't bother to give them the proper budget for it. 

[Apathy]

On 12/31/2021 at 10:38 AM, Primal Slayer said:

They changed to a better animation studio and HBO didn't bother to give them the proper budget for it. 

Which raises another question...have Grandon or HBO Max execs even considered just making this season shorter to save money?? It's not like they haven't done it before--Young Justice: Invasion is only 20 episodes (which was probably to that season's detriment, but anyway) I think 4 episodes would have been plenty for Zatanna's arc without things getting repetitive, and the Mars arc definitely should have been condensed to 3 episodes, like Primal Slayer said. All you would really have to do was cut out the scenes of everyone talking about/preparing for a wedding ceremony that didn't even happen and at least half your audience doesn't care about, including the Supermartian clip show...even if that storyline's ending wasn't already semi-spoiled for me, that scene would've tipped me off anyway, I mean really??

I wouldn't be surprised if Greg and Brandon wanted all 26 episodes, killing their darlings has always been a problem for them, but if it's what HBO Max ordered then they should've given them more of a budget to work with, obviously. You don't have to be any kind of expert on fandom to know we'd rather have a great shorter season than a long mediocre one. Not that it's all been like that--I like Artemis's arc the best so far.

PLEASE let Kaldur's be next, TPTB. I'm begging you.