Batman: The Killing Joke (2016)

[millennium]

3 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

That may be how Harleeb became Harley-since she was a character created for B:TAS, and comics for her were born from that, but Barbara didn't become Batgirl to get Batman's attention. And that

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certainly wasn't the case in this movie

and Batgirl came to be because she was trying to save her father who had been framed for taking bribes and kickbacks.  She asked Barman for help by attending a rally for Gordon to show that he believed in Gordon's innocence, but he said no-he was investigating to prove it.  So Babs pretended to be Bats and from there became Batgirl. Who was involved with Dick. She decided to stay and be on Bats' team with another Robin. This is all in the DCAU. I'm not sure where in the timeline this stiry takes place-definitely after Joker killed Jason Todd. I have this book about Batman from his creation to the 80s and nowhere did I see that Barbara became Batgirl because she had a crush on Bats and wanted his attention.  

I blame Timm and James Tucker for even putting this shit in the universe-of them being involved romantically. Just gross.

So, no. Not even comparable.

Did I like or agree with some of the direction? No. But it wasn't as bad as I feared it was going to be. And I'll leave it at that.

I haven't seen Killing Joke.   I made my observation based on starri's comment:

On 7/26/2016 at 0:53 PM, starri said:

 It's the way Barbara is depicted in general, starting with her deciding to become Batgirl because she wants to get Batman's attention, not as a crimefighter, but as a boyfriend.  It reduces her to being a spurned woman, whose only role in the story is to be A) a sexual object, B) a victim, C) a driver for Batman's revenge against the Joker.  She's basically completely robbed of any agency.  

Which is why I wrote, "It sounds like they made her Batman's Harley Quinn."

[Demented Daisy]

Watched today and I did not get the impression that Barbara became Batgirl to get Bruce/Batman's attention.  More that she was in a place in her life where she wanted more -- not from him, not from a relationship, but from her own life.  She wanted to do something with it.  She even cringed when her guy friend asked if their relationship was sexual.  Seems an odd reaction from someone "looking for attention" from a man.  

Secondly, I thought that the Joker shot Babs because she was between him and Gordon, who he really wanted.  She was in the wrong place at the wrong time.  I thought it was a reasonable adjustment from the original story.

All in all, I enjoyed the performances.  The animation -- particularly Batman's cowl -- was a little off-kilter for me, but I've seen worse.  Much, much worse.  I'd say it was worth the money I spent to purchase the digital download.

[Kromm]

GQ review: The New R-Rated Batman Movie Was Probably A Mistake

io9 Review: The Killing Joke Movie Is Stuck in the Worst Parts of the Past

Less specifically about the movie and more about TKJ as a whole... Gail Simone, one of the writers most responsible for Barbara Gordon's success after TKJ, tweeted this last week--specifically about the idea that Babs fans should be grateful that TKJ existed, or the character wouldn't be what she is today.

[Brn2bwild]

Could someone whose seen the movie tell me exactly how the carnival owner died? He shakes hands with the Joker, then Joker takes his hand away pulls a band off of his wrist, and the carnival owner is still.  The next time we see the carnival owner's face, it's white, with blood running down his chin, and he's dead.

Now if we assume the Joker had an electrical buzzer on his wrist that killed the carnival owner, that wouldn't explain why the carnival owner also suddenly got white paint on his face.  Could it be a continuity error?  

[BatmanBeatles]

Toxic chemicals?

[GHScorpiosRule]

11 hours ago, Brn2bwild said:

Could someone whose seen the movie tell me exactly how the carnival owner died? He shakes hands with the Joker, then Joker takes his hand away pulls a band off of his wrist, and the carnival owner is still.  The next time we see the carnival owner's face, it's white, with blood running down his chin, and he's dead.

Now if we assume the Joker had an electrical buzzer on his wrist that killed the carnival owner, that wouldn't explain why the carnival owner also suddenly got white paint on his face.  Could it be a continuity error?  

What @BatmanBeatles said. Joker never just has the "standard" prank stuff. His flowers shoot out acid, his tear gas are always poisoned to make any and all exposed to it get the same richter "Joker" smile, and his electric buzzer is also poisoned. It's why Bats knew not to take it in this movie as well as in all other movies and episodes with the Joker in the animated series.

[Spartan Girl]

Finally watched it tonight. I agree that the Batgirl stuff at the beginning was dumb, but Kevin Conroy and Mark Hamill knocked it out of the park.

I'm confused though: in the graphic novel, he kills the Joker after the titular joke, but he doesn't in the movie version? 

[Brn2bwild]

12 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

What @BatmanBeatles said. Joker never just has the "standard" prank stuff. His flowers shoot out acid, his tear gas are always poisoned to make any and all exposed to it get the same richter "Joker" smile, and his electric buzzer is also poisoned. It's why Bats knew not to take it in this movie as well as in all other movies and episodes with the Joker in the animated series.

Thanks (both of you) for the explanation.  Personally, I think the first episode of Telltale's Batman is better than this was.

[Jon121]

i watched it and i wasn't upto the expectations.  However I liked the climax of the movie. 

[cambridgeguy]

10 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

I'm confused though: in the graphic novel, he kills the Joker after the titular joke, but he doesn't in the movie version?

Whether or not he kills in the Joker is left ambiguous in the comic.  You can interpret the movie ending the same way - Batman is the only one laughing at the end so theoretically he could have killed the Joker when the shot pans away.

[Spartan Girl]

Oh ok, thanks for clearing that up.

[HeySandyStrange]

Watched it, and thought the actual Killing Joke part, brief though it was, was really good. I agree about the Batgirl intro being stupid, and not just because of the shoe-horned Batman/Batgirl "romance" (they need to stop trying to make that happen). It didn't flow at all with the Killing joke second act, what with it's focus on Barb chasing some 4th rate criminal. Talking it out with my husband afterwards, I thought the better story for Batgirl would've been one where she was pursuing the Joker, right as he had been discovered to have escaped Arkham, most likely to prove something to disapproving "dad" Batman. Have her confront the Joker and in the ensuing fight, one or the other of them saves and/or shows some mercy to the other. Joker and Batgirl have some kind of human moment between them and the Joker gets away, shortly to commit the violence against Barb and Jim. Or any other number of scenarios that included the Joker earlier in the movie, since the Killing Joke is a Joker story, through and through.

[benteen]

Once you get passed the first 30 minutes of Barbara's embarrassing obsession with Batman, it's actually a really good adaptation of The Killing Joke.

[darkestboy]

I don't feel it was that much of an obsession but seeing the whole movie just a couple of hours ago, I still hated the hookup scene with Batgirl and Batman. It just added nothing to the movie at all.

I did like that the movie attempted to give her more character than the comic did though and the mid credit scene was a pleasant surprise.

The rest of it was a solid, engaging enough adaptation with the Batman/Joker dynamics still being interesting and the flashbacks quite nice too. The musical moment fell a little flat though.

Other than that, engaging enough for me.

[Lantern7]

Haven't gotten this from the library yet. Wouldn't say that out loud, but I had to share this:

I'll still watch it, but man, that's a bit deflating.

ETA: Are you guys getting a link window? It's not formatting on my iPad. I'll fix it when I get to my laptop.

ETA2: Fixed it. And I was a little put off by the mere idea of Bruce and Babs dating in Mystery of the Batwomen. Seeing them reenact the end of Catwoman #1 that fans bitched about? Yikes.

[starri]