Television Vs. Book: Why'd They Make [Spoiler] Such A [Spoiler]?

[fantique]

She's hardly "in the hands of the Boltons" and urgently in need of rescue, if she's commanding the North and has wrapped all of the leaders of the North around her little finger, so to speak. You can't have it both ways--you can't make her completely invulnerable and Bolton-proof, and at the same time have people ride out to save her. And unless she's actually married to him, frankly, she can save herself. She can walk right out that door, and I can't imagine Baelish would stop her. I can't imagine why he'd bring her to the Boltons to begin with, unless, of course, he owes them in some sort of enormous way. Which he most likely does.

Oh, I'd much rather she save herself. I was just thinking, is it really necessary to have her under threat of torture and rape (again) to have a Stark siblings reunion? I'm not that invested in Jon doing the harebrained thing again. I think that since the result is the same and most of his struggle is internal dialogue, he can be stabbed just because of the siding with Stannis and the wildlings thing. My point would be more that if Jon heard "your sister is at Winterfell", regardless of whether she needs saving or not, he would freak out. Especially if at some point Theon escapes like in the books. Ramsey would totally send a letter threatening Jon with her death/harming her. Some posters seem to really want that reunion (or at least see his desperate attempt to save her) so I was saying it could happen without the Ramsay creep factor. I don't want to have it both ways, I only want her in the situation where she has control and is actively keeping herself safe through alliances. Show Sansa has the one thing Book Sansa still lacks: she knows how to read people. She can figure out what they want and what their motivations are. That's much more compelling.

So I don't even want her plot to resemble anything like Jeyne Poole's, especially the needing to be rescued part. I want Sansa to be the Manderly substitute as in being the one to cause trouble and jump start the implosion of the Frey-Bolton alliance. None of that Frey pie shit though, that's gross and I really don't want Sansa to be actively engaging in cannibalism. Just...no.

[Winnief]

I think that since the result is the same and most of his struggle is internal dialogue, he can be stabbed just because of the siding with Stannis and the wildlings thing. My point would be more that if Jon heard "your sister is at Winterfell", regardless of whether she needs saving or not, he would freak out. Especially if at some point Theon escapes like in the books. Ramsey would totally send a letter threatening Jon with her death/harming her. Some posters seem to really want that reunion (or at least see his desperate attempt to save her) so I was saying it could happen without the Ramsay creep factor.

 

 

Precisely!  Jon might well *believe* Sansa to be in jeopardy, whether that was actually the case or not.  I could see Ramsay sending a letter claiming he had Sansa in his clutches, or for that matter Jon could fear the worst, hearing his sister was at Winterfell amongst the Boltons and automatically assume she needed rescue/protection even if he heard she was there on a vengeance scheme-he would just assume she was in over her head. 

 

Bear in mind that last time Jon saw Sansa, she was a very naïve, sheltered, little girl and unlike Arya she never had any natural aggression, interest in sword play, or the like but was instead traditionally feminine which in Westeros is  identified as meaning helpless.  (I'm not saying that's true-merely that's its what people like Jon are raised to think.)  This steely, adult, Goth version of Sansa will be a surprise to him, and I have to say it will be interesting to see his reaction. 

 

And no I don't see Sansa being behind Frey pie but I do think we still might get it since Manderly, or some other Northern lord may just decide to do that on their own initiative-especially if Walder Frey himself comes to Winterfell this season, (yes it would be a change from the books but I can totally see D&D deciding to combine the vengeance against Boltons and Walder.) 

Edited March 25, 2015 by Winnief

[Advance35]

I thought I saw it posted somewhere that the actor that played Walder Frey wasn't in Season 5.  I thought it was reported from a pretty reliable source too.

 

As for Sansa, I have absolutely NO problem with her being in peril with the Boltons.   Part of my problem with the storylines of Dany, Arya and a few others is because I don't feel there are any real stakes.   I don't feel like anything could happen to them.   I never feel like they are in over their heads or if they are, their either with Allies or the like.  

 

The closest thing Sansa has to a friend is Littlefinger.   When she's with the Boltons, I'm going to be on the edge of my seat wondering if/how she'll get out of whatever situation she finds herself in, ESPECIALLY this season since she's reached the end of her book material and there is no guarantee that Sansa lives to see the end of all this.   Agency is one thing but if she comes parading into Winterfell and running things like she's Tywin Lannister, my interest in the character will take a real nose dive.

Edited March 25, 2015 by Advance35

[fantique]

I thought I saw it posted somewhere that the actor that played Walder Frey wasn't in Season 5.  I thought it was reported from a pretty reliable source too.

 

As for Sansa, I have absolutely NO problem with her being in peril with the Boltons.   Part of my problem with the storylines of Dany, Arya and a few others is because I don't feel there are any real stakes.   I don't feel like anything could happen to them.   I never feel like they are in over their heads or if they are, their either with Allies or the like.  

 

The closest thing Sansa has to a friend is Littlefinger.   When she's with the Boltons, I'm going to be on the edge of my seat wondering if/how she'll get out of whatever situation she finds herself in, ESPECIALLY this season since she's reached the end of her book material and there is no guarantee that Sansa lives to see the end of all this.   Agency is one thing but if she comes parading into Winterfell and running things like she's Tywin Lannister, my interest in the character will take a real nose dive.

Really? Because Arya being at the twins while Northerners were being massacred left and right pretty much meant I was terrified for her even though I knew she would survive it. But YMMV. I got nothing for Dany on that front although her story is clearly about regaining her throne so the stakes hinging on us being scared she might be killed or raped by a volatile lord is not really the point of her arc. Also, what would be the point of having all these characters if they're facing the exact same type of peril?

Also, my problem wouldn't be that she's in danger. It would be that she's in danger of the same thing she was threatened with for 3 seasons and finally escaped. There is only so much I can take of a character shoved in the corner and being put in the same situation again and again. Boring. There are degrees between being Ramsay's plaything and being Lady of Winterfell in all but name. There's a whole season to see her plans hatch or fail to do so. Get one step ahead but being forced to take 2 steps back and that's what I want to see. First, she can subtly poke around and see who wants what, goes where, when. Gather info. She's not just going to ride in there and say "Tadah!!!! I'm back bitches".

Edited March 25, 2015 by fantique

[WearyTraveler]

I think in the books Sansa is learning the game from Littlefinger, and the story seems to point to her learning it so well that she will eventually take down some of House Stark's enemies much like Littlefinger takes down his: through intrigue and manipulation.

 

On the show, I don't think they have the time to show us the character's journey step by step; so, I feel the last image we had of her in Season 4 coming down the stairs all in black with a disturbing grin on her face is the show accelerating the character's book journey.

 

Because of this, I don't think Sansa going North will be about her being victimized in any way again.  My guess is that we will see her playing the game, manipulating events behind the scenes and taking the Boltons down enough so that Stannis can finish them.

Edited March 25, 2015 by WearyTraveler

[ElizaD]

IMO, Sansa's story is like the opposite of Dany's. If Dany has had it too easy for her story to have any tension, Sansa has been endlessly victimized by the leading villains. Her story has had enough violence, rape threats and helplessness, and the show possibly marrying her to the most sadistic character in the series would be more of the same, this time with no guarantee that she will escape actual rape. In general, I think Tyrion's POVs are a pretty good example of a well-structured plot in ASOIAF. Unlike Dany and Sansa, he has both highs and lows: he's never truly safe but he gets victories over his opponents that keep his plot from becoming a horrible grind of one atrocity after another. This also made me think of Spartacus. While it doesn't have the highbrow reputation of HBO's GOT, it had incredible tension. It was far more merciless in its treatment of the characters (the season 2 finale killed half the main cast, and of course the series finale had to be a downer ending with the defeat of the slave rebellion) but it made that exciting rather than tiresome by also being more generous in granting its leads exhilarating triumphs. It balanced the grimness of Roman slavery with genuine friendships and love affairs, while ASOIAF is heavy on POV isolation and self-destructive or violent sex. That's the kind of mix of tension and excitement that I'd like to see more of in ASOIAF: I admit that I sometimes find it a slog to go through all the sidetrips and descriptions of how life in Westeros sucks, enduring them due to my investment in the characters and the hope that the likes of Walder/Roose will eventually pay for what they've done.

 

While I'm dreading the extra horrors of Sansa reduced to a Bolton bride and mourning the loss of Stoneheart/Manderly, I at least have the satisfaction of knowing the TV show will get to the point, whatever it is, faster than GRRM. That's what I thought they were doing with the season 4 shot of Darth Sansa: after she was treated like an ignorant child in season 3, I agree that it felt like fastforwarding her to TWOW Sansa (perhaps as a result of their latest talks with GRRM?) who should be more active and mature following her apprenticeship. So the reports of Ramsay getting a new plaything and three weddings in season 5 really surprised me because it seemed like after one step forward Sansa was suddenly taking five steps back as part of a plot she had nothing to do with in AFFC/ADWD.

[Winnief]

I think in the books Sansa is learning the game from Littlefinger, and the story seems to point to her learning it so well that she will eventually take down some of House Stark's enemies much like Littlefinger takes down his: through intrigue and manipulation.

 

On the show, I don't think they have the time to show us the character's journey step by step; so, I feel the last image we had of her in Season 4 coming down the stairs all in black with a disturbing grin on her face is the show accelerating the character's book journey.

 

Because of this, I don't think Sansa going North will be about her being victimized in any way again.  My guess is that we will see her playing the game, manipulating events behind the scenes and taking the Boltons down enough so that Stannis can finish them.

 

I could not agree more with all that.

 

Some great interviews and round-ups linked to below, and certainly Sophie seems to be hinting that this is going to be year of Boss Sansa...

 

http://watchersonthewall.com/game-of-thrones-season-5-post-premiere-interview-round-up/

 

I have to say I found Natalie's piece especially intriguing.  Poor Margaery-it's gonna be a rough season for her!  I  do look forward to her "vile, scheming, bitch" scene with Lena though.  Those two have been killing it on screen together from day one.

 

As for the three weddings....this is gonna sound nuts but could it be the third wedding is Trystane/Myrcella? 

Edited March 25, 2015 by Winnief

[Hecate7]

Oh, I'd much rather she save herself. I was just thinking, is it really necessary to have her under threat of torture and rape (again) to have a Stark siblings reunion?

No, not at all, but what makes you think there's going to BE a Stark siblings reunion? It's not as if they are all suddenly converging on Winterfell. They're not. Bran and Rickon are North of the Wall with no reason ever to come home. Jon Snow is at the Wall dealing with Wildlings, and there is absolutely no reason whatsoever for him to return to Winterfell. Neither of the younger brothers is even in this season, and Arya's in Braavos.

 

My point would be more that if Jon heard "your sister is at Winterfell", regardless of whether she needs saving or not, he would freak out.

 

 

Why? What's at Winterfell that makes it a problem for her to be there? I think he'd more likely to, "oh, good. That's ONE sibling not dead or missing. Cool. Never liked her, she never liked me, but I'm glad she's home safe and sound." It's NOT worth raising an army over.

 

He didn't raise an army when he heard she was missing. Or when she married Tyrion. Whatever Sansa's arc is, it's going to involve Winterfell under the Boltons. And btw, without the Ramsey/Arya wedding, there is no Frey pie. Ramsey does have to marry SOMEONE to secure his claim to Winterfell. Sansa might agree to the marriage because having Winterfell under false pretenses, married to a monster, is better than not having it at all. And of course, if she were able to marry Ramsey and arrange the deaths of Ramsey and all his male relatives, she could get it and keep it. This is not where I thought Baelish was taking her, but it's not far from where I thought he'd end up leaving her. It beats abandoning her at the whorehouse while he marries Margaery Tyrell, which is honestly where I thought he was going.

 

The only reason to mount a rescue, would be if he got a good look at Theon Greyjoy, and if Sansa were MARRIED to Ramsey or his prisoner or both, and Theon were to describe what happened to Tansy, and/or point out that Ramsey loves Sansa the same way he loved Theon. THAT might get Jon Snow onto a horse. Or not. Robb fighting the Lannisters didn't actually do it in the end, so Jon Snow might not head anywhere near Winterfell at all.

Edited March 25, 2015 by Hecate7

[Winnief]

No, not at all, but what makes you think there's going to BE a Stark siblings reunion? It's not as if they are all suddenly converging on Winterfell. They're not. Bran and Rickon are North of the Wall with no reason ever to come home. Jon Snow is at the Wall dealing with Wildlings, and there is absolutely no reason whatsoever for him to return to Winterfell. Neither of the younger brothers is even in this season, and Arya's in Braavos.

 

 

Actually, Bran's north of the Wall and guaranteed not to appear this season, but last we heard Rickon was headed to the Umber's with Osha, and there's been no word whether he's appearing this season or not.  I for one think that if he doesn't show up this season, he will at the beginning of Season 6, to be the next Lord of Winterfell.  Also while Jon has no reason at present to go to Winterfell, that might well change post-Resurrection since having served 'for life' he'll be free of his NW vows AND there will suddenly be a LOT of questions about his family history that he'll want answers for-answers that are probably hidden in the crypts of Winterfell.  So essentially we've got three Starks; Sansa, Jon, Rickon, all of whose paths are going to go through Winterfell. 

 

 For that matter, come Season 6, Bran might be communicating with his siblings via Weirwood.  So while I agree a Stark reunion is unlikely in Season Five, I do think they're putting things in motion to have one in Season 6. 

[fantique]

No, not at all, but what makes you think there's going to BE a Stark siblings reunion? It's not as if they are all suddenly converging on Winterfell. They're not. Bran and Rickon are North of the Wall with no reason ever to come home. Jon Snow is at the Wall dealing with Wildlings, and there is absolutely no reason whatsoever for him to return to Winterfell. Neither of the younger brothers is even in this season, and Arya's in Braavos.

 

 

Why? What's at Winterfell that makes it a problem for her to be there? I think he'd more likely to, "oh, good. That's ONE sibling not dead or missing. Cool. Never liked her, she never liked me, but I'm glad she's home safe and sound." It's NOT worth raising an army over.

 

He didn't raise an army when he heard she was missing. Or when she married Tyrion. Whatever Sansa's arc is, it's going to involve Winterfell under the Boltons. And btw, without the Ramsey/Arya wedding, there is no Frey pie. Ramsey does have to marry SOMEONE to secure his claim to Winterfell. Sansa might agree to the marriage because having Winterfell under false pretenses, married to a monster, is better than not having it at all. And of course, if she were able to marry Ramsey and arrange the deaths of Ramsey and all his male relatives, she could get it and keep it. This is not where I thought Baelish was taking her, but it's not far from where I thought he'd end up leaving her. It beats abandoning her at the whorehouse while he marries Margaery Tyrell, which is honestly where I thought he was going.

 

The only reason to mount a rescue, would be if he got a good look at Theon Greyjoy, and if Sansa were MARRIED to Ramsey or his prisoner or both, and Theon were to describe what happened to Tansy, and/or point out that Ramsey loves Sansa the same way he loved Theon. THAT might get Jon Snow onto a horse. Or not. Robb fighting the Lannisters didn't actually do it in the end, so Jon Snow might not head anywhere near Winterfell at all.

Ok. My posts on the subject of Sansa in Winterfel wrt how it affects Jon arc was a response to someone who I thought was basically saying that they want her to have the FArya storyline in order to have Jon try to save her. My point was that, if that was their only requirement, there are ways for the story to go without the Ramsay creep factor and still get their desired outcome. I was expressing my disbelief over the idea that Sansa = FArya is a good idea just to get the attempt and eventual reunion since I didn't see the necessity for it.

 

My opinion on the matter:

What I want to see is Sansa infiltrating the ranks in Winterfell and slowly start to dismantle the Bolton influence. That is what I want her season storyline to be, and I've already explained, in a post after the one you quoted, how I find it not only believable but way more compelling than the alternative. I also said that I would rather Jon was stabbed just because of "siding with" Stannis and the Wildlings because it is a more interesting reason for the people who will stab him. "We killed him because he wanted to rescue his little sister" is a lot harder for me to buy as a "for the watch" reason whereas if they are seriously doubting his vision and think what he is doing will ruin them and then something happens at Hardhome (or elsewhere) and they snap, that will be a compelling case for me to still get where the stabbers are coming from. In the books, I was like "Really? That's what pushed you over the edge? Come on" and I also thought "just let him go to WF, he might die on the way there and you can run the watch as you see fit in either case." So I really want the show to make me feel torn. In Dance, I understood the rationalisation because he was being stupid and not communicating but not because I felt Marsh had actual good points (it felt more like the old school bureaucrat in him was freaking out over all these conventions broken and how they were alienating the IT). I want to feel like it's split down the middle who is more justified in their actions. Jon, who is focusing on the big picture or Marsh who genuinely thinks Jon is leading them to their deaths?

 

Re: Ramsay marrying someone, I've been hearing they cast someone for the FArya part, which I also talked about in a previous post of mine, BTW. Another reason why I don't think Sansa will marry Ramsay. 

Re: Frey pie, I also said I didn't want that to happen so... I feel like you didn't read my post all the way because I clearly stated that there as well.

Re: Reunion. That was also in answer of the poster I was responding to. I don't think there will be a reunion this year because I don't think they will move closer together. I was just saying that in context of a reunion ever happening, there really was no need for Sansa=FArya to happen for that purpose. 

Edited March 25, 2015 by fantique

[Winnief]

http://watchersonthewall.com/rattleshirt-recast/

 

So Mance probably will die in the first episode.

 

Definitely sounds like they're going to continue to move things forward with the White Walker storyline and

 

it does give credence to the rumors of an upcoming battle at Hard Home where Tormund dies.

[Hecate7]

Sorry, fantique, I think I was responding to a number of posts all at once, not just yours. There is this interesting idea that there's some sort of eventual inevitable Stark reunion, which I regard as no more likely than a Targaryen, Baratheon, Arryn, or Lannister, or Greyjoy reunion, and in fact probably less. I still find no trace of a reason in your post for any sort of reason for Jon Snow to dash to Winterfell to rescue Sansa.

 

I could see Alayne invisibly manipulating Boltons and Freys until she is somehow caught and ejected from their midst. If Sansa is there for the wedding of fake Arya to Ramsey, that's going to be interesting, because it won't be just Theon swearing it's Arya--it will be Sansa. The karma of that is sort of staggering.

[Winnief]

http://www.salon.com/2015/03/25/im_boycotting_game_of_thrones_next_year_but_not_because_of_spoilers/

 

I think the author is being a little in assuming that the show is automatically a second rate adaption of the book material...and consciously or not is being over optimistic in assuming the books will be finished.

[fantique]

Interesting read... There is a quote I totally agree with though.

 

Our fixation on novelty and surprise has resulted in too much popular entertainment with increasingly contrived plots, all in the service of delivering an empty, forced twist.

Seriously, in the age of binge watching and re-watches everyone's motto in the industry should be "Character Development is KEY". If I'm only watching a movie/show for the twist, you can bet I am not buying that DVD, itunes, etc. because I won't care about the character and don't particularly want to see more of them.

Edited March 26, 2015 by fantique

[Advance35]

I could see Alayne invisibly manipulating Boltons and Freys until she is somehow caught and ejected from their midst. If Sansa is there for the wedding of fake Arya to Ramsey, that's going to be interesting, because it won't be just Theon swearing it's Arya--it will be Sansa. The karma of that is sort of staggering.

 

I don't think The Boltons are going to be let in on the fact that Alayne is really Sansa Stark.  Though I do feel like Alayne/Sansa  will come between Ramsay and Myranda.   She may even befriend Roose's Frey wife for the chance to sow discord.  In Winterfell the only one's in the "know" will probably be LF and Theon Greyjoy.  F!Arya just seems so pointless to me in this storyline now.

 

  Based on reviews It sounds like LF and Sansa will be heading to Winterfell in the 1st episode and Robin Aryn will remain in the Vale with Lord Royce, this makes me wonder if Robin Arryn will be murdered in the books.   The show seems to just be phasing him out as of now, if he was going to bite it by either the hand of Littlefinger or Sansa, I think they would include it.   So maybe Robin Arryn defies expectations and lives to rule in the future.

 

Unrelated but I'm also beginning to wonder if Loras Tyrell survives the season.  If he's not going to DragonStone he's got to be put out of commission somehow.  We know he is going to be captured by the Faith, but that storyline will likely funnel to center on Margaery, since the book seems to be building up these Queen Trials.   And if Loras were executed by the Faith that would certainly raise the stakes for House Tyrell.  It would make the audience AND book walkers wonder if Margaery will survive her trial and will give House Tyrell a real emotional motivation in terms of their role in the Game of Thrones.   I also find it interesting that Mace Tyrell won't be in Kings Landing but in Bravos (Per Photo's posted this past Summer).

[ElizaD]

As for the three weddings....this is gonna sound nuts but could it be the third wedding is Trystane/Myrcella? 

 

That could work on the show if Jaime negotiates with Doran so that Cersei gets her way (Myrcella returns) but Doran doesn't lose the alliance (the Martells and Romeo & Juliet insist on marriage as the price of her departure). Marrying Trystane/Myrcella could have a little bit of the Arianne/Aegon vibe, but who knows how completely they've decided to cut the elements of that plot.

 

Based on reviews It sounds like LF and Sansa will be heading to Winterfell in the 1st episode and Robin Aryn will remain in the Vale with Lord Royce, this makes me wonder if Robin Arryn will be murdered in the books.   The show seems to just be phasing him out as of now, if he was going to bite it by either the hand of Littlefinger or Sansa, I think they would include it.   So maybe Robin Arryn defies expectations and lives to rule in the future.

 

Unrelated but I'm also beginning to wonder if Loras Tyrell survives the season.  If he's not going to DragonStone he's got to be put out of commission somehow.  We know he is going to be captured by the Faith, but that storyline will likely funnel to center on Margaery, since the book seems to be building up these Queen Trials.   And if Loras were executed by the Faith that would certainly raise the stakes for House Tyrell.  It would make the audience AND book walkers wonder if Margaery will survive her trial and will give House Tyrell a real emotional motivation in terms of their role in the Game of Thrones.   I also find it interesting that Mace Tyrell won't be in Kings Landing but in Bravos (Per Photo's posted this past Summer).

 

I agree that this could be good news for Book Robin if the show character is left as Royce's ward so he can undo the damage caused by Lysa.

 

Finn Jones mentioned throwing the 5x10 script at the wall, IIRC, so Loras is probably in the episode, but I think that was due to a big shocker like Jon's stabbing rather than a spoiler about Loras. Even though his interviews are strange, I think he would have been a little more cautious about hinting at his own non-book demise. I now think that Loras will be arrested first, establishing the Faith's views on sexual activity outside marriage and allowing Cersei to end the engagement after he's outed. Then she'll use the same strategy to get rid of Margaery (and since she's the queen she'll face execution for adultery rather than simply humiliation) only for the High Sparrow to reveal that he knows about her own crimes. Since Show Mace is in Braavos (and was treated pretty much as a non-character in season 4), Loras could take his and Tarly's place as the leader of the Tyrell side after Cersei falls and Kevan takes over. Perhaps Cersei sends Mace to Braavos as a fake olive branch to the Tyrells after Loras is questioned about Olyvar, getting him out of the way on a respectable mission so she can move against Margaery.

Edited March 26, 2015 by ElizaD

[Advance35]

But it seemed like Olenna Tyrell was going to be a much stronger presence in Kings Landing this year.  I can't see a scandal the size House Tyrell is going to be facing, being managed by Loras Tyrell.   I just cant see Olenna letting that happen.

 

And doesn't the Faith usually require something DRASTIC as a penalty or atonement.   I could see a Loras execution being held in Episode 10, with Cersei and Margaery's trials being left for Season 6. 

 

Do we know when Cersei does her "Walk"?  Is that episode 10?  If so, maybe a Loras execution as the Episode 9 death?  Cersei does the walk, makes it back to the Keep, does dinner with Tommen and Kevan, and we eventually see Varys murder Kevan.   Cersei blames The Tyrells for Kevan, The Tyrells blame Cersei for Loras.  And we've got chaos in Kings Landing.

[SeanC]

it does give credence to the rumors of an upcoming battle at Hard Home where Tormund dies.

That was debunked.  It's not happening.

[Winnief]

Good points all about how having LF and Sansa leaving the Vale, and having SR placed with Bronze Yohn is a good sign for his continued survival.  I for one am of the theory that the reason everyone keeps yapping about how Robin is too feeble to make it to adulthood is to set up the irony that the kid is actually one of the few who survives at least long enough to father the next Arryn heir-and yeah if you get him away from Lysa and/or Baelish and to a more appropriate guardian like Royce's he might turn out ok after all. 

 

ANd yeah, I have a bad feeling about Loras's prospects this season-yes Margaery and Olenna would fight tooth and nail to stop it from happening, but by re-arming the Faith Militant, Cersei may have created a monster that nobody, (without dragons) could control. 

 

That could work on the show if Jaime negotiates with Doran so that Cersei gets her way (Myrcella returns) but Doran doesn't lose the alliance (the Martells and Romeo & Juliet insist on marriage as the price of her departure). Marrying Trystane/Myrcella could have a little bit of the Arianne/Aegon vibe, but who knows how completely they've decided to cut the elements of that plot.

 

That makes sense.  It makes a LOT of sense, and it would give even more motive for the Sand Snakes against Tommen, since they'd be making Trystane the royal consort to the Queen, and thus promoting the interests of their House and Dorne-as well as taking vengeance.  And I definitely think that poor Tommen will pre-decease Myrcella and that somehow or other the latter will be re-united with Cersei for a time, before her death.  (Which will probably take place at the Rock.) 

[Hecate7]

I don't think The Boltons are going to be let in on the fact that Alayne is really Sansa Stark.  Though I do feel like Alayne/Sansa  will come between Ramsay and Myranda.   She may even befriend Roose's Frey wife for the chance to sow discord.  In Winterfell the only one's in the "know" will probably be LF and Theon Greyjoy.  F!Arya just seems so pointless to me in this storyline now.

 

  Based on reviews It sounds like LF and Sansa will be heading to Winterfell in the 1st episode and Robin Aryn will remain in the Vale with Lord Royce, this makes me wonder if Robin Arryn will be murdered in the books.   The show seems to just be phasing him out as of now, if he was going to bite it by either the hand of Littlefinger or Sansa, I think they would include it.   So maybe Robin Arryn defies expectations and lives to rule in the future.

 

Unrelated but I'm also beginning to wonder if Loras Tyrell survives the season.  If he's not going to DragonStone he's got to be put out of commission somehow.  We know he is going to be captured by the Faith, but that storyline will likely funnel to center on Margaery, since the book seems to be building up these Queen Trials.   And if Loras were executed by the Faith that would certainly raise the stakes for House Tyrell.  It would make the audience AND book walkers wonder if Margaery will survive her trial and will give House Tyrell a real emotional motivation in terms of their role in the Game of Thrones.   I also find it interesting that Mace Tyrell won't be in Kings Landing but in Bravos (Per Photo's posted this past Summer).

 

How long do we think Theon can keep his mouth shut about who Sansa is? How long will it take before Ramsey asks him for the lowdown on these two uninvited guests?

 

As for Myrcella coming home, I suspect not. I suspect Myrcella dies in Dorne so that Cersei can blame Tyrion for having sent her there in the first place.

Edited March 27, 2015 by Hecate7

[WearyTraveler]

Interesting thoughts, but I don't think show Theon would give up show Sansa to Ramsey.

 

In the books Theon is on a redemption path, which is triggered by Jeyne Poole's suffering and fueled by Bran's whispers from the trees.  In the books he does rebel against Ramsay in small ways, at first, and in giving Jeyne advice (which I'm sure Ramsay would prefer he didn't do, as he enjoys her suffering).  The show has taken pains to do Theon's story as close to the books as possible, and he's now in Winterfell, which is where he last was in the books.

 

It seems to me that the show is planning on starting Theon's redemption right about now.  So, him keeping quiet about Sansa could be the start of that.  Also, I don't think Ramsay would ask Theon about Littlefinger.  Theon has never met the man (in the show or in the books), but he's apparently an ally to House Lannister, which is curretly a friend (to put it mildly) of House Bolton, so, Ramsay might think he knows more about Littlefinger than Theon would.  Thus eliminating the possibility of Theon directly lying to Ramsay, which removes the biggest risk to Theon (Ramsay presumably knows when Theon lies).

 

Also, since it's been confirmed that Bran will not appear this season, we need someone to motivate Theon's change.  Sansa in Winterfell would be perfect for such a purpose.

[Holmbo]

I think if Ramsay asked Theon if he knew this woman and how Theon would answer honestly to everything. That she is Sansa stark and they grew up together in winterfell. But he wouldn't take any own initiatives to reveal anything i think.

[Hecate7]

Interesting thoughts, but I don't think show Theon would give up show Sansa to Ramsey.

 

In the books Theon is on a redemption path, which is triggered by Jeyne Poole's suffering and fueled by Bran's whispers from the trees.  In the books he does rebel against Ramsay in small ways, at first, and in giving Jeyne advice (which I'm sure Ramsay would prefer he didn't do, as he enjoys her suffering).  The show has taken pains to do Theon's story as close to the books as possible, and he's now in Winterfell, which is where he last was in the books.

 

It seems to me that the show is planning on starting Theon's redemption right about now.  So, him keeping quiet about Sansa could be the start of that.  Also, I don't think Ramsay would ask Theon about Littlefinger.  Theon has never met the man (in the show or in the books), but he's apparently an ally to House Lannister, which is curretly a friend (to put it mildly) of House Bolton, so, Ramsay might think he knows more about Littlefinger than Theon would.  Thus eliminating the possibility of Theon directly lying to Ramsay, which removes the biggest risk to Theon (Ramsay presumably knows when Theon lies).

 

Also, since it's been confirmed that Bran will not appear this season, we need someone to motivate Theon's change.  Sansa in Winterfell would be perfect for such a purpose.

 

This is a guy who screamed to be put back in his cage when his own sister tried to rescue him, and you think he's going to get all protective of Sansa just because she's in Winterfell?

 

It made sense for him to rescue Jeyne Poole because 1) if he hadn't Ramsey would have cut off her feet. He was threatening to. He'd already scarred and whipped her, had her raped by dogs, and possibly had already taken a toe from her. (We learn that before he takes hands, he takes fingers, and before feet, toes. So he's probably cut a few bits off Jeyne already.) It took a LOT of suffering, for Theon to feel responsible and concerned enough about Jeyne to risk saving her. Oh, and 2) he had been  intimate with Jeyne Poole and was hearing that Ramsey was going to cut his lips off as revenge. He was running out of parts for Ramsey to cut off, and at this point wanted to die rather than lose any more bits or be tortured more, which made it worth it to risk his life for Jeyne's in spite of everything.

 

But Sansa's going to walk in completely safe. She's in no danger from the Boltons, nor will she ever be unless she marries one or becomes their prisoner. She's got soldiers with her from the Vale, and she's there with Littlefinger, so exactly what on earth does she need Theon for? What will she EVER need him for?

 

Unlike Jeyne, she's much more able-bodied than Theon. They're never going to be intimate, and there is not nor will there ever be any clock ticking, forcing Theon to act, and so for him to suddenly overcome a year of conditioning that's cost him half his body, just because Sansa's pretty and her last name is Stark, is going to be not only unrealistic, but kind of gross really.

 

Not only that, but Theon's whole opportunity to save Jeyne came from his job of bathing her. Without that, there was no opportunity at all. There will probably not be any such interaction with Sansa, unless of course she becomes the Farya.

 

I'm wondering why on earth Littlefinger wants to take her to Winterfell at all. What is there for Littlefinger, that would make him want to bring Sansa there? Unless they are combining the "Harry the Heir" and the "Farya" plots, I don't get it. Even if they ARE combining those plots I'm having a hard time getting my mind around Littlefinger voluntarily going to what is now basically the Bolton seat, with the actual Stark heiress under his jacket----why? What does his victory dance here look like?

Edited March 27, 2015 by Hecate7

[Shanna]

I'm not sure how they are going to play the winterfell thing. I can see some options I think it would enjoy (although I'm still going to be sad about no mance). The one thing I don't want is Sansa abused by Ramsey.

As for theon, could he have the Jeyne motivations with farya while also having some Sansa concerns as well and maybe working together at the end? I don't know. It did take him a lot to rescue Jeyne, but I could see his guilt about all of his stark betrayals (the maester, rob, etc) making him feel even more for Sansa. I think he didn't go with his sister because he thought it was a trick? It will take a lot to knock the brainwashing out of him.

[Advance35]

I just think Theon will be in a state of disbelief at first but he'll keep quiet because nobody is going to ASK him.  It was mentioned up thread, as far as Roose and Ramsay are concerned, LF and Alayne are just an upjumped pimp and his bastard daughter from the South, nothing more.   I don't see why anyone would probe Theon for information on them.    At the same time I don't see him prescisely HELPING Sansa either, I think for Theon/Reek to break his conditioning in the TV Version the jig would need to be up for Sansa and Ramsay would need to be planning to perform a "hunt" with her.

 

I could even see Ramsay forced to keep "Reek" out of sight and away from their Southron Guest, by order of Roose.

 

As for abuse suffered by Sansa...I don't think it's going to be a trip to Paradise but I don't THINK she'll end up disfigured or anything.  In the books didn't some old witch prophecize that Sansa would slay a savage giant in a castle made of snow?   Everyone always assumed it would be LF but what if it's Ramsay?

 

I think LF/Sansa will live at least until the final season than all bets are off.   But I expect to see them continue to manuever to gain control of The North, The Vale and The Riverlands.   Now that the Lannister/Tyrell regime is at it's weakest, as it will be with Tywin dead, Tyrion a fugitive, Cersei and The Tyrells feuding before mutual imprisonment, it's the opprotune time to sow discord, dissention and seeds of betrayal.   He started in the Vale (with House Arryn), The North is next (with House Bolton).

[Holmbo]

That is totally my thought about Theon too Advance. He won't take any initiatives on his own either to hurt or help sansa in the beginning. I don't know how things will progress from there. That depends on what role Sansa has in the story.

[Meredith Quill]

The discussion of how Sansa may go to Winterfell and what Theon would or wouldn't do if she does is interesting.

However, can we take that discussion to the Season 5 Spec thread please, because as we know, Sansa hasn't gone to Winterfell in the books...yet. So at this point is it is, at best, a show only plot.

 

Thanks.

[Hecate7]

I'm not sure how they are going to play the winterfell thing. I can see some options I think it would enjoy (although I'm still going to be sad about no mance). The one thing I don't want is Sansa abused by Ramsey.

As for theon, could he have the Jeyne motivations with farya while also having some Sansa concerns as well and maybe working together at the end? I don't know. It did take him a lot to rescue Jeyne, but I could see his guilt about all of his stark betrayals (the maester, rob, etc) making him feel even more for Sansa. I think he didn't go with his sister because he thought it was a trick? It will take a lot to knock the brainwashing out of him.

 

He knew it wasn't a trick. He just didn't want to leave Ramsey, and is so convinced that it's pointless to try that he almost got his own sister killed for trying to rescue him.

 

If people don't like the Farya plot I get it, it's icky. So is the entire Theon plot. But there's really no way to get all the way through one, without the other, is what I'm saying. The Farya plot IS the Theon Greyjoy plot. Without it, he never leaves.

[fantique]

Theon specifically said to Yara/Asha when she opened the cage "You can't trick me. Tell him you couldn't trick me" and he kept shouting "I don't believe her! I'm Reek" while looking around the kennel because he was so sure that Ramsay or one of his acolytes were around, waiting for him to betray them.

[WearyTraveler]

Having Sansa influence Theon is not mutually exclusive with the Fake Arya plot.  We know that the show didn't cast book Jeyne Poole but they did cast a Winterfell worker who looks looks like Arya.  She could easily take on the role of Jeyne and provide similar motivations for Theon.

Theon specifically said to Yara/Asha when she opened the cage "You can't trick me. Tell him you couldn't trick me" and he kept shouting "I don't believe her! I'm Reek" while looking around the kennel because he was so sure that Ramsay or one of his acolytes were around, waiting for him to betray them.

 

Yes, in the books they finally take Theon out of the kennel, clean him up and make him act as Theon again.  I think that might actually have helped Theon see himself as a human again and feel the pain of others.  Keeping him as a dog helped keep Theon de-humanized.  Obviously that's not enough, but it helps.  If the show also takes him out of the kennels in Winterfell, then that could also be a factor in his redemption arc.

[Hecate7]

He did say that he thought it was a trick. My bad. He actually thought he was being tricked into admitting he was Theon Greyjoy and losing another body part. He actually thought that his sister and a small army were cooperating with Ramsey, and would hand him right back over to Ramsey. He bit her to get away from her. And a person who has been subjected to that degree of abuse doesn't just stand up and snap out of it. This is Stockholm Syndrome x 10.

 

I would find it insulting to POWS, victims of real abuse, abductees, and victims of torture, if Theon's "redemption" were treated as if it's just a matter of snapping out of it--of recognizing a duty to someone else and taking a risk on their behalf. Theon watched dogs eat Tansy. I can see not wanting to help the girl who helped castrate him, but I think it could have been anybody and he'd have been too afraid to move. He's missing a lot of parts at this point--he is in no position to fight anyone. One thing GRRM did right was give that process time and plenty of realistic motivation, and an actual inner monologue that showed how Theon managed to get from point A to point B. The show did a fair job of showing that process. It should give as much to getting from point B to C, to the recovery (or perhaps further deterioration past any sense of self-preservation--not really sure which was going on in the books).

[Winnief]

He's missing a lot of parts at this point--he is in no position to fight anyone. One thing GRRM did right was give that process time and plenty of realistic motivation, and an actual inner monologue that showed how Theon managed to get from point A to point B. The show did a fair job of showing that process. It should give as much to getting from point B to C, to the recovery (or perhaps further deterioration past any sense of self-preservation--not really sure which was going on in the books).

 

 

Agreed. But given the show's track record where Theon's story arc is concerned, (whatever missteps they've done elsewhere,) I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt for now, that they'll make his 'recovery' or what have you seem realistic and earned.  No "aha!" moment, but gradual signs that his true personality is beginning to reassert itself before he takes the literal tower leap.  In any event whatever they've got planned for Theon, you just know Alfie Allen is going to kill it. 

[BookEater]

It does seem odd, Littlefinger taking Sansa not just North but actually to her home, unless maybe he's planning to get rid of the Bolton's and pronounce Sansa, Lady of Winterfell/Queen in the North in a bastardized version of the fAegon plotline. That seems like too much of an overstep even for him though, I just don't understand his logic in taking her there.

  I don't like the idea of Sansa being fArya, for obvious reasons, but I don't think that would make sense for her story arc at this point anyway. She made a significant character progression last season, covering up for Lysa's murder without any prompting or coaching from LF, followed by her very last scene walking confidently down the stairs, power dressed to the max, filmed in a very similar style to Dany's exit from Quarth after locking XXD in his vault. Throwing her back into the role of victim, this time to Ramsay seems like backwards progression to me.

 

As for Theon's motivations for covering for her, the shows been pretty consistent showing his remorse for the Stark's downfall, and his part in it. "My real father died in Kings Landing" was a very poignant scene, one of AA's best, and his reaction to Robb's death, even though he didn't slit Ramsay's throat, showed he was devastated hearing it. I think coming face to face with a living breathing Stark, any Stark, and having the chance to atone even in some small way could be just the jolt he needs to find a little courage and rebel against Ramsay, even if that rebellion is only his silence. It's a start.

[SeanC]

I don't like the idea of Sansa being fArya, for obvious reasons, but I don't think that would make sense for her story arc at this point anyway. She made a significant character progression last season, covering up for Lysa's murder without any prompting or coaching from LF, followed by her very last scene walking confidently down the stairs, power dressed to the max, filmed in a very similar style to Dany's exit from Quarth after locking XXD in his vault. Throwing her back into the role of victim, this time to Ramsay seems like backwards progression to me.

It's not like the show hasn't done that before, either -- see Sansa season 3, which tossed any notions of character advancement from season 2 in the rubbish heap in favour of a season-long running joke about her being an idiot.

[Winnief]

I understand your pessimism SeanC, but I don't think that they're gonna make that mistake again.  Everything Sophie's been saying so far suggests Sansa as player rather than as victim this season.  I'm not saying she won't be in danger at some point, (she like everyone else in this show is always in danger,) but I don't think we're going to have watch any more scenes of Sansa being helpless and abused.  This time the danger is going to be a conscious decision on her part, which makes all the difference.

 

As for Theon's motivations for covering for her, the shows been pretty consistent showing his remorse for the Stark's downfall, and his part in it. "My real father died in Kings Landing" was a very poignant scene, one of AA's best, and his reaction to Robb's death, even though he didn't slit Ramsay's throat, showed he was devastated hearing it. I think coming face to face with a living breathing Stark, any Stark, and having the chance to atone even in some small way could be just the jolt he needs to find a little courage and rebel against Ramsay, even if that rebellion is only his silence. It's a start.

Agreed.  Just having Theon decide not to tell Ramsay Sansa's true identity would be a triumph for his returning to his true self-that would make sense with his characterization so far.  And I have to say I do think AA and ST together could make for very good viewing indeed. 

[SeanC]

I understand your pessimism SeanC, but I don't think that they're gonna make that mistake again.  Everything Sophie's been saying so far suggests Sansa as player rather than as victim this season. 

That's not really true.  She's also said this is Sansa's hardest season, that "crap" is the word to describe the character's condition in season 5, that she her character has to focus on staying alive for her brothers, focusing mainly on how her "mentality" is different compared to past abuses, and that she's thrown back into the deep end and has to figure out how to survive.  No real indication of actual actions, and she presumably ends up having to be rescued by Theon.

 

Sophie also tried to spin season 3, prior to its release, as Sansa graduating from pawn to player, which obviously didn't happen, and all of her interviews this season just focus on the idea that she has a different attitude.  Granted, she can't go into detail about the plot, but from all indications she is Ramsey's new "plaything", to use Entertainment Weekly's wording.

Edited March 28, 2015 by SeanC

[Hecate7]

OMG. That's really horrible. And one really wonders where Baelish is going to be in all of this. Does he drop her off and then leave? Does he bring her, then get killed? What do you suppose happens?

[Winnief]

OMG. That's really horrible. And one really wonders where Baelish is going to be in all of this. Does he drop her off and then leave? Does he bring her, then get killed? What do you suppose happens?

 

 

For now let's wait before we get to see some episodes, (or at least get some early episode reviews,) before we all panic ok?!?

[Holmbo]

In looking forward to get some new material so we have something else to discuss than speculations about Sansa in Winterfell.

So now since it's drawing to a close what are you all most excited about? Any particular scenes you're going for either from the books or original ones?

I'm actually really excited about everything connected to winterfell (sorry to bring it back to that again) theon, sansa, boltons, stannis threat. Will yara get thrown in somehow? Who knows. A lot of stuff will be going on in the north. Its probably gonna be the most exciting place but i have high hopes for kingslanding too. New and returning characters and lots of change in the power dynamic.

[BlackberryJam]

I'm looking forward to the changes in Brienne's story as well as the changes in Jaime's. By having Brienne in the Vale and Jaime in Dorne, I think their stories will remain the same but the details changed. Brienne will still get beaten down and become disillusioned and Jaime will still break away from Cersei and become the leader his father wanted him to be. But moving them both out of the Riverlands is exciting. Their character development can happen anywhere. That's fine. But if most of the Riverlands, the Freys, the Inn, Gendry, the Blackfish, what does that say about endgame? D&D are leaving the story pretty much in tact, but changing locations, details and cutting the fat. Is the Riverlands just fat?

Also looking forward Tyrion or Barristan to do a little truth telling to Dany. Her story of wandering around Essos, the same as Tyrion wandering around Essos, bores the crap ouf of me. I really want to see progress on that front.

I do not care about Sansa. Just don't. I seriously doubt they have her be another abuse toy. I mean, why have her wear the dress and hair of empowerment just to put her back in the submissive role? Anyway, don't care.

I'm interested in Arya's story only if it progresses. An entire season of her in the HoBaW sounds like a yawner. Now, if she is able to interact during that training with other established characters, I'm for it. I do not like isolating a character from all other existing stories for a whole season.

I was excited about the Sand Snakes until I saw the casting of "interchangeable bland pretty girls." I might be surprised. I am looking forward to Ellaria. She fades out in the books, but I will love her taking on the Arianne revenge role. Looking forward to Doran. Not interested in teen romance with Trystane and Myrcella.

AND, the trailer has made me really exciting to see what they have planned for Loras. I think he dies this season, but it looks really good.

Also, Lancel for the win!

Edited March 28, 2015 by BlackberryJam

[Winnief]

 

In looking forward to get some new material so we have something else to discuss than speculations about Sansa in Winterfell.

 

And on that angle...

 

Synopses for episode 4-7 of Game of Thrones right here!

 

Season 5 Episode 4: “The Sons of the Harpy”: Margaery seeks prudent counsel. Jaime struggles in foreign lands. Dany answers the Harpy’s call. (Written by Dave Hill; directed by Mark Mylod.)

•Season 5 Episode 5: “Kill the Boy”: Cersei plots a dangerous game. Jon swings his sword. Melisandre studies the signs. Tyrion sees the ghosts of the past. (Written by David Benioff & D. B. Weiss; directed by Jeremy Podeswa.)

•Season 5 Episode 6: “Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken”: Margaery receives a grim surprise. Jon hears dark tidings. Winterfell prepares for a wedding. Doran Martell speaks his word. (Written by Bryan Cogman; directed by Jeremy Podeswa.)

•Season 5 Episode 7: “The Gift”: In Meereen, Dany must compromise or flee. Stannis comes into trouble on his way south. Brienne finds shelter in the woods. Arya is faced with her destiny. (Written by David Benioff & D. B. Weiss; directed by Miguel Sapochnik.)

 

So does the trouble Stannis finds mean bad weather or a possible meeting with the Iron Born? Or both?  And in whose woods is Brienne hiding?

 

It certainly sounds like Margaery gets arrested in episode 6.  Also my guess is the Sand Snakes will originally want to kill Myrcella in retribution, but Doran will convince them that the better plan is to have her marry Trystane-and then let her be crowned, either by war or by assassinating Tommen. 

[benteen]

I do love how vague and basic the descriptions are.  I imagine Jon executes Slynt in the fifth episode.  Tyrion seeing ghosts of his past is intriguing?  Tysha perhaps?  Or perhaps he sees an illusion of Tywin? 

Edited March 28, 2015 by benteen

[Winnief]

I definitely think "Ed, fetch me a block." happens in episode five.

 

As for Tyrion's 'ghosts' Jorah seems a likely candidate.

[Holmbo]

Based on the wording i don't think it's Tyrion's ghost per say. I think it just refers to the ruins by the sorrows.

[BlackberryJam]

And on that angle...

 

Synopses for episode 4-7 of Game of Thrones right here!

 

Season 5 Episode 4: “The Sons of the Harpy”: Margaery seeks prudent counsel. Jaime struggles in foreign lands. Dany answers the Harpy’s call. (Written by Dave Hill; directed by Mark Mylod.)

•Season 5 Episode 5: “Kill the Boy”: Cersei plots a dangerous game. Jon swings his sword. Melisandre studies the signs. Tyrion sees the ghosts of the past. (Written by David Benioff & D. B. Weiss; directed by Jeremy Podeswa.)

•Season 5 Episode 6: “Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken”: Margaery receives a grim surprise. Jon hears dark tidings. Winterfell prepares for a wedding. Doran Martell speaks his word. (Written by Bryan Cogman; directed by Jeremy Podeswa.)

•Season 5 Episode 7: “The Gift”: In Meereen, Dany must compromise or flee. Stannis comes into trouble on his way south. Brienne finds shelter in the woods. Arya is faced with her destiny. (Written by David Benioff & D. B. Weiss; directed by Miguel Sapochnik.)

 

So does the trouble Stannis finds mean bad weather or a possible meeting with the Iron Born? Or both?  And in whose woods is Brienne hiding?

 

It certainly sounds like Margaery gets arrested in episode 6.  Also my guess is the Sand Snakes will originally want to kill Myrcella in retribution, but Doran will convince them that the better plan is to have her marry Trystane-and then let her be crowned, either by war or by assassinating Tommen. 

 

Watchers on the Wall is now saying these are fake.

 

https://twitter.com/WatchersOTWall/status/581914919781711872

[Winnief]

So they are.  Well at least we don't have to worry about a possible Sansa/Ramsay wedding anymore. 

 

Another teaser but not much new.  It feels like they're deliberately holding back on the promos this year....possibly because there's more to be spoiled?!?

 

http://watchersonthewall.com/new-game-of-thrones-season-5-teaser/

[SeanC]

Based on the most recent spoilers on the site recapped.com, the Sansa-as-bride-of-Ramsey theory has more backing.  They're a weird site that seemingly has some manner of BTS sources at a bunch of different shows, but only use them to report upcoming nude/sex scenes (I first heard of them last season of GOT, where their spoilers were posted on a few GOT fandom boards, and were reliable).  They posted at the end of February:

We’re going to start posting some Game of Thrones season five rumors with each of our columns. First, you may have seen the bath scene from Sansa (Sophie Turner) in the trailer. What you don’t know is that bath is right before Sansa’s wedding. And unlike the last time, Sansa will lose her virginity. Of course, it’s highly doubtful any skin will be shown.

There was a debate in the fandom as to whether these were actual spoilers or just them speculating based on trailers, since the manner didn't really fit with past spoilers.  Their first two followup rumours didn't really shed any light on this either way, since they were either easily guessed or known for a while.  But today they posted another one:

Our next Game of Thrones rumor is that Gilly (Hannah Murray) will indeed have a sex scene with Samwell in episode 7. No word on whether or not there’s nudity.

This is more like past spoilers of theirs.  Granted, these could be from different sources, with the latter more legit than the former, but given their track record I wouldn't bet on it.

Edited March 29, 2015 by SeanC

[Constantinople]

Based on the most recent spoilers on the site recapped.com, the Sansa-as-bride-of-Ramsey theory has more backing.

 

May the Father grant us mercy and judge those responsible justly.

May the Warrior grant us courage and protect us in these dark times.

May the Smith grant us strength, that we might bear this heavy burden.

May the Mother defend the young and the innocent.

May the Crone show us the path we must walk and guide us through the dark places that lie ahead.

May the Maiden protect Sansa's virtue, to keep her from the clutches of depravity.

May the Stranger visit those who are responsible.

[Winnief]

Crazy theory SeanC, but even if Sansa is getting 'married' this season would it even have to be to Ramsay?!?  It could easily be an strategic match to a  Vale or Northern lord, (remember LF's plan to wed her to Harry Harddyng in the books,) as a way of helping take back WF and frankly it seems more plausible ESPECIALLY if that was scheduled to happen in the books anyway.  D&D sometimes like to outstrip the books themselves in terms of bleakness, but this one seems kinda pointless...again unless something similar happened in the books.

 

LOL Constantinople!  At this point I don't know what to believe about Sansa's story arc so I've decided not to get bent out of shape until we have more concrete info either way.  I do think Sam and Gilly will bang this season but that's for reasons even apart from the spoiler. 

[SeanC]

Crazy theory SeanC, but even if Sansa is getting 'married' this season would it even have to be to Ramsay?!?  It could easily be an strategic match to a  Vale or Northern lord, (remember LF's plan to wed her to Harry Harddyng in the books,) as a way of helping take back WF and frankly it seems more plausible ESPECIALLY if that was scheduled to happen in the books anyway.  D&D sometimes like to outstrip the books themselves in terms of bleakness, but this one seems kinda pointless...again unless something similar happened in the books.

No, it really couldn't be such a person, since nobody like that has been cast, and Sansa's going to Winterfell all season.