dtissagirl January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 I think they have a serious logistics problem with the kid -- the actor is very inexperienced [his IMDb lists 3 episodes of tv total, all this season, and his work on Flash/Arrow barely clocked 5 minutes, and demanded zero range from him], and a 10 year old boy needs to be written as a real character on a tv show if he's gonna be in it in a more significant capacity. That will certainly be taken into consideration by the network. 4 Link to comment
AyChihuahua January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 But now, because the woman is Felicity instead of Laurel, the lie seems especially contrived. I wouldn't find lying to Laurel great either but at least it's consistent with that mess of a relationship and their history. I agree with all that, but I think if they'd stuck with Laurel, they wouldn't necessarily have written him lying. They had to do that with Felicity, bc there's be no particular relationship drama otherwise...so he got some woman pregnant ten years ago, when Felicity and Oliver had never even met. She would have no reason to mind, so they had to write the lying to get to the drama. If it were Laurel, though, she would have reason to care, because the kid is a physical embodiment of what a cheating bastard Ollie was, which could cause relationship drama on its own. She is embarrassed, wonders if he's really changed from that guy, and boom, she wants a break to think things through. Link to comment
tangerine95 January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 I don't think they planned for the kid to be more than a romantic stall and maybe if they could have made him Connor, comic book easter eggs.Yeah I agree if they want more they will have a huge issue with the actor since imo he's not impressive at all and this kid would have to be in order to make any storyline with him halfway decent. I also get the impression there's no interest with the audience in Oliver as a father to this random kid.All I saw was people being interested in how it affects Olicity or people being interested if he was Connor.Then after the episode aired it was just hate for the storyline from every side.I wouldn't be suprised if that caused the kid and BM to appear less then planned after this storyline is done. 7 Link to comment
Velocity23 January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 Seems flashback might be more prominent in 4x15. Yesterday poppy seed actress posted this https://www.instagram.com/p/BAdC5eALIbG/?taken-by=elysiarotaru Today the actor playing Baron Reiter posted this https://www.instagram.com/p/BAfO5IGhcmN/?taken-by=jimmyakingbola 1 Link to comment
Morrigan2575 January 13, 2016 Author Share January 13, 2016 Hmm, I wonder if 415 will end up being the Mostly Flashback Episode? If so, how does that affect Vixen's appearance? Is the actress even in Vancouver at this point? 1 Link to comment
Velocity23 January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 She is. I think. Got to see the first dailies of Vixen in the flesh today on #Arrow. @Megalyn is crushing it. You guys are gonna love her! https://twitter.com/briforsul/status/687101864140091392 Link to comment
tv echo January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 Yesterday poppy seed actress posted this https://www.instagram.com/p/BAdC5eALIbG/?taken-by=elysiarotaru Thanks for the laugh. 1 Link to comment
AyChihuahua January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 O/F breakup end of 4.14, O/Poppy hookup sometime 4.15. Fun! Link to comment
dtissagirl January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 Seems flashback might be more prominent in 4x15. Yesterday poppy seed actress posted this https://www.instagram.com/p/BAdC5eALIbG/?taken-by=elysiarotaru Today the actor playing Baron Reiter posted this https://www.instagram.com/p/BAfO5IGhcmN/?taken-by=jimmyakingbola #thanks #grateful #hashtags 9 Link to comment
Morrigan2575 January 13, 2016 Author Share January 13, 2016 She is. I think. https://twitter.com/briforsul/status/687101864140091392 Cool, thanks! Link to comment
calliope1975 January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 Poor Poppy. I'm sure she's a lovely human being, but anything related to the flashbacks is snooze and fast forwardville for me. 4 Link to comment
Chaser January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 Smart move putting Vixen in the flashback episode. But can Vixen outweigh Poppy, etc and Olicity Angst? 1 Link to comment
statsgirl January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 The only flashback episode I liked was the one from season 1 so if they want to spend this year's on Poppy and the Evil Island, I'm good with that. The big problem is that right now Oliver's plan is occasional visits to this kid who won't ever know he's his father, because that's what he agreed to. He might want more than that, but is he ever going to try to get it? Is he just going to pop by whenever he's in Central City? Is he going to stage elaborate lies to sneak away for a visit in the hope that BM will eventually let him be a father? It seems like he would eventually want more, but who knows what he'd actually dare to ask for when he thinks BM holds all the power. Oliver's intentions make this secret way more or way less shitty, IMO, and we were given no indication about what his intentions are. If he really thinks he's only going to be Uncle Oliver to this kid forever and ever, then I would consider this a stupid but minor transgression, since he isn't planning on springing an instant family on Felicity at some point in the future. If he is planning on doing that, then it's incredibly shitty and worthy of all the anger. I'm guessing the show is going to go with the former with Oliver not really considering all that much about the future. I think we've put far, far more thought into this than Oliver did. He's the king of compartmentalizing. This is the only deal BM offered him; he took it. He'll work the details out later. It's hard to judge where they're going with the baby mama/kid storyline because this has been part of the plan since the beginning. So it makes me wonder if they did want Oliver to play at being a father at some point down the line (s5) but not before causing relationship drama between him and Laurel. Because, let's face it, this was always supposed to be a spanner in the works in that relationship, seeing as O/L was their original plan. What's a bigger problem than the appearance of the kid you fathered when you cheated on your girlfriend years ago? It would have been much bigger if Laurel had still been his love interest but when they shot it, they had already decided to move on from her so maybe it was never meant to get into Oliver cheating on Laurel. I think they're just going to play it for maximum angst for Oliver and Olicity, and maybe Diggle offering him some Big Bro advice if he can get his head out of the Andy situation. They probably could have had Isaiah Tootoosis (his only role is the boy in The Revenant) if they wanted someone who could act rather than someone who looked like SA might have at that age. 1 Link to comment
tarotx January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 I've really enjoyed all 3 flashback episodes but somehow I think s4 will be be soooo boring .... If Laurel was still the actual female lead than Baby mama drama could be something used to affect her as she was dealing with a new love interest. Even though she wasn't Oliver's love interest. But I personally think the moment they killed Moira, any good from the Baby mama drama was lost. 1 Link to comment
apinknightmare January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 I think Baby Mama drama would've been pretty much the same if Laurel was still the love interest, only Oliver would have a legit personal reason to be compelled to keep the secret BM asked him to. Because the kid was conceived back when he was a dirty cheater (on Laurel), and would've been a stark reminder of that right around the time Oliver finally overcame a bunch of nonsense to win her back. Link to comment
looptab January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 (edited) Sorry to butt in- I really have nothing new to add to the BM discussion- but I wonder how they'll introduce Vixen, whether what happened on the animated series will count, or they'll start from scratch. Edited January 13, 2016 by looptab 2 Link to comment
Morrigan2575 January 13, 2016 Author Share January 13, 2016 I think they'll have to give her a true introduction. They can't assume that all Arrow viewers watched the animated short. Link to comment
bijoux January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 Today the actor playing Baron Reiter posted this https://www.instagram.com/p/BAfO5IGhcmN/?taken-by=jimmyakingbola There's the confirmation that he's part of Shadowspire. It's in the hashtags. If anyone even cares. I only care that it actually connects Oliver's time on the island to the Diggles. I think they'll have to give her a true introduction. They can't assume that all Arrow viewers watched the animated short.True. But they could do it like they did with Constantine, someone that Oliver already knows. 2 Link to comment
calliope1975 January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 They should introduce Vixen like they do in the comics - an asterisk on screen with "see CW Seed show Vixen on cwseed.com" text. 8 Link to comment
tv echo January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 (edited) I believe that what happened in the Vixen animated series counts as part of the show canon, just like what happens in the Arrow tie-in comics counts as canon. The EPs have said that Vixen is part of the Flarrowverse, and Oliver, Barry, Felicity (via phone) and Cisco all made appearances on Vixen (the fern was referenced, Oliver found out that Barry kissed Felicity on Vixen). When Mari appears on Arrow, they'll probably work some background exposition into the dialogue - or maybe use the ever popular device of flashbacks (shooting live action versions of key scenes from the animated series). Edited January 13, 2016 by tv echo 1 Link to comment
Morrigan2575 January 13, 2016 Author Share January 13, 2016 There's the confirmation that he's part of Shadowspire. It's in the hashtags. If anyone even cares. I only care that it actually connects Oliver's time on the island to the Diggles. True. But they could do it like they did with Constantine, someone that Oliver already knows. Which is fine but they're still going to have to give the audience a proper introduction. They can't assume that everyone would know or care about this character from an animated online show. 2 Link to comment
kismet January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 We desperately need some new shows & spoilers because I feel like we are on the same merry-go-round of conversations about the BM drama. Really I think what they intended with the story in the beginning of the season will be changed as a result of how they bumbled the story in the crossover. Whatever masterplans they had I think are being reevaluated. And I do think that the logistics of having a 10y old actor will also keep the reality of William being a regular character sparse. As for Vixen, I hope they do some type of introduction. I don't feel like watching CW Seed just to know about a character, especially if she is a flashback character. I enjoyed Constantine because they gave just enough of an introduction by we're not overbearing. So in many ways it felt perfect for someone like me who has not watched or read Constantine/Vixen shows/comics. I do think if they keep her primarily in the flashbacks that would be better than bringing her in the present, because it allows them more freedom to do what they want with the character. It also would feel less repetitive. We know she is alive in the present, we don't actually need to see her in the present. The show is cluttered already. 3 Link to comment
way2interested January 13, 2016 Share January 13, 2016 I do think if they keep her primarily in the flashbacks that would be better than bringing her in the present, because it allows them more freedom to do what they want with the character. It also would feel less repetitive. We know she is alive in the present, we don't actually need to see her in the present. The show is cluttered already. Only problem with that, though, is that she didn't get her powers until last year in the canon (around 316 according to MG), so there wouldn't be much of a point of seeing her five years ago. She could only be Vixen if we do see her in the present, but I wouldn't be surprised if they did just wave that detail to incorporate her better into the story. Although how and why Mari would be on the island is a complete mystery to me. 2 Link to comment
Velocity23 January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 (edited) So this poped up on my TL a few moments ago. Any idea what is happening for 4x16? My first thought was oooh Replicators from SG1. Edited January 14, 2016 by Velocity23 2 Link to comment
Morrigan2575 January 14, 2016 Author Share January 14, 2016 I don't think we know anything about 416. Link to comment
Velocity23 January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 I don't think we know anything about 416. Just Laurel in court as a lawyer. Link to comment
Morrigan2575 January 14, 2016 Author Share January 14, 2016 Oh yeah, forgot about that. Link to comment
wonderwall January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Oh yeah, forgot about that. Pretty much the epitome of the character lol that and being lied to and being. Pretty much almost useless 90% of the time 2 Link to comment
apinknightmare January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Per MG's Twitter, 4x15 is titled "Taken". Ugh. Link to comment
wonderwall January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Per MG's Twitter, 4x15 is titled "Taken". Ugh. Wait.. Why is that a bad thing? I don't remember what happens in 15 :p Link to comment
Ann Mack January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 (edited) Aw fuck someone is probably going to take the kid, baby mama, or both (I can just picture some sort of Liam Neeson rip off with BamBam going hard for the action shots, SMDH already). Hoping its not about them but hey this is Arrow where some of the worst writing decisions for drama sake happens! This is probably when William and Samantha is made known to Felicity, WTactualF!!! She is going through so much already. Now she'll learn this and have to watch Oliver in panic mode because his son (the one he never told her about) is missing. These damn writers. Episode 4x15: Taken https://twitter.com/mguggenheim/status/687480692045787136 Edited January 14, 2016 by Ann Mack Link to comment
apinknightmare January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Wait.. Why is that a bad thing? I don't remember what happens in 15 :p I assume it means someone's getting kidnapped. Hopefully I'm wrong. If news of the kid comes out in 4x14, then... 1 Link to comment
wonderwall January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 I assume it means someone's getting kidnapped. Hopefully I'm wrong. If news of the kid comes out in 4x14, then... I refuse to believe this. I REFUSE. I hope the Taken thing is all a flashback thing Link to comment
calliope1975 January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Best case - this is what leads BM and Kid to decide disappearing forever is the right thing to do. If they can't pretend this story line is a dream, the least they can do for me is wrap it up in one episode instead of dragging it out. 7 Link to comment
HighHopes January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 With the way the season seems to be piling everything on Felicity, I wouldn't be surprised if she somehow ends up getting kidnapped- and since she couldn't defend herself/escape because she's in a wheelchair it will fuel more of Oliver's manpain. 2 Link to comment
Chaser January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Maybe someone steals Poppy. How much you want to bet they put her in a room and forget she's there? 5 Link to comment
kismet January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Worst case scenario- FS, BM & William are all kidnapped together by a Present Day Poppy and their sole source of help is LL who is forced to use her law skills to interrogate the truth out of DD on the stand. OQ is somehow incapacitated by something stupid. Ok I might want to actually see NM do his best Nicholson impression on the stand. 1 Link to comment
apinknightmare January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 How much you want to bet they put her in a room and forget she's there? With Nyssa, maybe? Link to comment
Ann Mack January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Episode 4x15 is when Vixen makes her appearance. Looking forward to that I watched the web series! Link to comment
bijoux January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 So this poped up on my TL a few moments ago. Any idea what is happening for 4x16? My first thought was oooh Replicators from SG1. This looks like a giant crab. 1 Link to comment
chaos is welcome January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 My first thought was transformers lololol. Link to comment
BkWurm1 January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 (edited) Taken does imply a kidnapping but what if it is DD's child? That would tie in to doing something they've never done with a big bad, have him turn to them for help. Don't we also believe that 4-15 is the flashback heavy episode? Who could be taken in the flashbacks to parallel the present? Edited January 14, 2016 by BkWurm1 Link to comment
looptab January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Taken is also written by Keto, so..yeah, definitely not so much looking forward to that. I agree they should do a proper introduction for Vixen (personally I didn't watch the animated series, just the bits with Oliver, Barry, and Felicity in gif form), but I remembered them saying it was canon, so that's mostly why I'm curious about it. How will they handle it? I don't think she will show up in the flashbacks, but, I don't think it's a good idea if they ignore the series completely and have the characters meet anew. One could wonder, why the hell should I bother following your other projects, or spending money on the comics, if they don't matter? Link to comment
chaos is welcome January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 That would be so annoying, moral dilemma of helping the person responsible for paralyzing you/your fiancee. I've been worried they will do that. Link to comment
Morrigan2575 January 14, 2016 Author Share January 14, 2016 (edited) Yeah the title certainly makes me think of the kid since that was the point of the movie. Of course I also remember KC's obnoxious character gets killed in that movie... :D I guess we'll have to keep an eye/ear out for the Samantha/William actors going to Vancouver/filming. On the brightside if this is about BMD it might be the way to write them out. Get that "Arrow Witness Protection" that people were hoping for. Edited January 14, 2016 by Morrigan2575 Link to comment
apinknightmare January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 I'm not some cold hearted a-hole, and never ever want to see anything happen to a child. But if Billiam getting kidnapped is the first step of entry into the Arrow Witness Protection Program, then someone should snatch him. Yesterday. Today. Soon. 5 Link to comment
dtissagirl January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 Get Oliver to kidnap him, he does that super gently and low key, ask Lyla. 8 Link to comment
apinknightmare January 14, 2016 Share January 14, 2016 (edited) Get Oliver to kidnap him, he does that super gently and low key, ask Lyla. His MO is to take the mom and leave the kid, so...curveball! Edited January 14, 2016 by apinknightmare 3 Link to comment
Morrigan2575 January 14, 2016 Author Share January 14, 2016 I'm trying to figure out how Vixen plays into the title. Is it possible that it's something magical that's taken (from her tribe)? She comes to town to recover it? Maybe it ties into whatever super special game changing thing they're doing with their Villain in 415? Link to comment
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