Spoiler Discussion Thread

[dtissagirl]

That answer about not catering to any group of fans is making me think Felicty got Mayo dumped on her head because they killed Laurel. They're so worried about NOT fanservicing anyone that they need to anti-fanservice everyone.

[tangerine95]

Exactly it feels like they're trying to prove they're not pandering to anyone and aren't afraid to piss off olicity shippers either lol.That's such a horrible way to write tho, I can't even believe it lol.

[Angel12d]

Yeah, that answer reeked of "See, we didn't kill off Laurel for Olicity. Felicity has a boyfriend now!"

Laaaaaaaame.

[lemotomato]

2 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

That answer about not catering to any group of fans is making me think Felicty got Mayo dumped on her head because they killed Laurel. They're so worried about NOT fanservicing anyone that they need to anti-fanservice everyone.

I've suspected this would the case since MG made a pointed remark in the 418 post-mortem about how they totally, definitely, did not kill LL because of Olicity. (Although I still think that after LL got killed off, Olicity became the endgame 'ship so now it has to be put through the tried and true endgame 'ship stalls.)

[Thundercatmary]

1 minute ago, lemotomato said:

I've suspected this would the case since MG made a pointed remark in the 418 post-mortem about how they totally, definitely, did not kill LL because of Olicity. (Although I still think that after LL got killed off, Olicity became the endgame 'ship so now it has to be put through the tried and true endgame 'ship stalls.)

I've been thinking this ever since LL died, I was hoping they wouldn't go this route but here we are. 

[dtissagirl]

1 minute ago, lemotomato said:

I've suspected this would the case since MG made a pointed remark in the 418 post-mortem about how they totally, definitely, did not kill LL because of Olicity. (Although I still think that after LL got killed off, Olicity became the endgame 'ship so now it has to be put through the tried and true endgame 'ship stalls.)

Yeah, that makes sense. And if the network has assured them they're getting 2 more seasons after this one, then they REALLY have to stall, because that's the only way these fools know how to write romance.

But now I'm starting to think they took the premiere ratings worse than I imagined, and they are worried about losing the shippy fanbase, hence this hilarious and TOTALLY SPONTANEOUS social media PR blitz

[Thundercatmary]

If twitter and my fandom friends are to believed they did lose the 'shippy" fanbase, of course it remains to be seen what that will be in reality since some people are probably just upset right now and will still watch. 

[Sunshine]

I am actually okay with Oliver & Felicity not getting back together until the end of the season or even early S6.  I just don't care to watch them with other love interests.  (I know it's the CW.)  They have enough going on that it seems like they could just take baby steps back in that direction without involving 3rd parties.  

[SmallScreenDiva]

46 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

I just thought he missed the word BEEN -- Geoff and other people have BEEN lobbied to remove me.

Then it makes sense.

Yeah, that's how I read it, too. 

Also, where are you guys seeing this spontaneous PR blitz? So far, I've only seen Marc and an Instagram photo of people on a plane. Emily is still talking about sunsets or butterflies.

Edited October 11, 2016 by SmallScreenDiva

[way2interested]

2 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

Yeah, that makes sense. And if the network has assured them they're getting 2 more seasons after this one, then they REALLY have to stall, because that's the only way these fools know how to write romance.

But now I'm starting to think they took the premiere ratings worse than I imagined, and they are worried about losing the shippy fanbase, hence this hilarious and TOTALLY SPONTANEOUS social media PR blitz

My issue with that is, if it were because of the ratings, why did they wait until now to try to do social media damage control? Wouldn't they have done something right after the ratings came in? Or maybe their live+3 is now what they're reacting to.

It just puzzles me that the reaction to this poorly written article is what set them to send the Batsignal for the super-spontaneous social media blitz. How is that bad enough for them? Even given that one could argue that the decrease in ratings could still attribute to a number of things.

[Chaser]

6 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

Yeah, that makes sense. And if the network has assured them they're getting 2 more seasons after this one, then they REALLY have to stall, because that's the only way these fools know how to write romance.

But now I'm starting to think they took the premiere ratings worse than I imagined, and they are worried about losing the shippy fanbase, hence this hilarious and TOTALLY SPONTANEOUS social media PR blitz

I'm thinking they got some more numbers in and it was not good. 

When I first read the quote and started thinking about everything WM had said, I wondered if the data said that Olicity was not giving them what they needed anymore and they could go a different direction. This response tells me the opposite.

[Sunshine]

The quote was the last straw for many and even some very positive people started tweeting TPTB.  Then all the actors started tweeting randomly at the same time.  This sorta happened during the premiere too.  There was a tweet directed at PR about wondering if EBR was unhappy as she hadn't tweeted anything about the premiere.  Within minutes of that tweet both EBR and DR tweeted about it. Coincidence?  CW_Arrow might not be promoting much but they appear to be monitoring.

If anyone cares the Billy Joel song for 5.05 is "The Stranger".  The one for the season for both Arrow & Olicity is "Getting Closer." 

Edited October 11, 2016 by Sunshine

[lemotomato]

2 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

Yeah, that makes sense. And if the network has assured them they're getting 2 more seasons after this one, then they REALLY have to stall, because that's the only way these fools know how to write romance.

But now I'm starting to think they took the premiere ratings worse than I imagined, and they are worried about losing the shippy fanbase, hence this hilarious and TOTALLY SPONTANEOUS social media PR blitz

I think the lack of buzz on social media for the premiere-- Arrow didn't make it to the top 5 Twitter Nielsens for the first time in a while-- might have worried them too. I have no idea how shippers correlate with actual viewer numbers, but I can see for myself how they've essentially done free online promotion for Arrow the last 4 years. If the show loses that, the network might actually have to ::gasp:: spend its own time and money to advertise Arrow.

[way2interested]

11 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

I think the lack of buzz on social media for the premiere-- Arrow didn't make it to the top 5 Twitter Nielsens for the first time in a while-- might have worried them too. I have no idea how shippers correlate with actual viewer numbers, but I can see for myself how they've essentially done free online promotion for Arrow the last 4 years. If the show loses that, the network might actually have to ::gasp:: spend its own time and money to advertise Arrow.

Ha, maybe CW's message to them was just, "GET OUR FREE LABOR BACK."

[NumberCruncher]

Sorry but the whole brouhaha this evening is making me laugh.  I didn't think it possible after all these years of practice that both WM's and MG's media skills are progressively getting worse.  Way to completely shit on everyone all at once, LOL.

I'm still sticking by my earlier assertion:  they get 4 more episodes to keep me on the S5 train.  I knew that the whole O/F thing probably wasn't in the cards but I was willing to stick with it so long as I got something compelling in terms of storylines/characterization (i.e. the things that originally got me watching back in S1).   Now is the time for them to prove to me they still have it in them.  Otherwise, I'll wait and binge only if I get that the heads-up the season doesn't completely suck.

Edited October 11, 2016 by NumberCruncher

[EmilyBettFan]

Are they stupid? Do they not see a good thing in front of them in Stephen and Emily? If any other show had two actors with that much chemistry they'd have hookups all the time. What kind of mess is this? I know it's an action show but action shows also have steamy moments tied into it. 

Oh im sorry, apparently for Oliver to get any action the chick has to fight crime also on the streets. So stupid. They can't be that dense as to see that the only female he has real easy chemistry with is Felicity. We saw what happened with Laurel and Poppy.

Edited October 11, 2016 by EmilyBettFan

[looptab]

1 hour ago, way2interested said:

I find his yet again answering about how they don't cater to anyone some what funny given the circumstances of why he's on tumblr right now in the first place. Like, ok, they aren't catering, but it seems like your network has just blasted you for going too extreme in your not-catering.

Especially after it was rge network itself who mandated the stalling and and anti-catering in the first place 

1 hour ago, Sunshine said:

  Hmm..if they are not rebuilding Olicity anytime soon they might want to instruct SA & EBR to "act" differently in scenes.  

    

Actually, I think this 'writing away from the romance' is just crap. It's their alibi for when they inevitably put them back together,  so they can say, 'we tried to explore other things, but their chemistry was just too strong'.

[lemotomato]

42 minutes ago, way2interested said:

Ha, maybe CW's message to them was just, "GET OUR FREE LABOR BACK."

"Damn it, Wendy. We only have one intern and we need him to spend more time promoting Supergirl! Marc, go get those twitter folks back!"

[Belinea]

2 hours ago, Sunshine said:

the Oliver and Felicity relationship gave me something to care about after they took the Oliver/Felicity/Diggle dynamic from me. :(

This! I mean at this point I am no longer even disappointed but I also have lost any desire to watch. Maybe they shouldn't promote their episodes at all because I feel as though they are only making it worse. Adding insult to injury so to say. But I expect Oliver to see the new bf and decide to move on. The new love interest will be whoever they cast down the road as the new crime fighter. 

And even though I hate to be this way but really, I hope the fandom stops promoting them for free. Not all of those people are the kind of idiotic or horrible people that the producers try to troll. 

[thegirlsleuth]

This is the second time this year that the CW has broken the viewer/show contract with a big fandom--Clexa being the first--because they misread social media, didn't manage communications, left a fandom feeling jerked around and abused, and lost the trust of their viewers.  I wonder if Guggenheim jumped on tumblr in response to Wendy's interview or in response to the Live+3 numbers.  I don't know if the ratings are going to tank with the current fandom apocalypse, since super fans represent such a small part of the larger audience, but they will lose some, and in addition they will lose obsessive fans (like me) who will click on the clickbait-y article with Olicity in the title, which in turn means outlets will stop writing those PR puff pieces. They don't have the will? the talent?  the desire? to do PR properly, so Arrow will lose any promo power they had.

In books, they talk about the author making a contract with a reader.  Essentially, this says if you set up a certain tone, certain goals, certain conflicts in the beginning, and the reader counts on you to follow through. Got a guy heading off to fight a dragon?  Don't have him stop half way and open a yogurt shop.  Writing a moody neo-noir novel?  Don't start telling knock-knock jokes in Chapter 15.  For me, Arrow has broken this contract.  I am interested in the story of a guy getting his heart and soul back, and instead I get someone who has reverted to season one level murder. I was interested in seeing how Felicity wrestled with failing to save the lives of so many, instead I get the boyfriend.    I was interested in seeing how a guy who went from beaming at the love of his life as she broke into prison mainframes to saying "You are my always, and i just want the chance to be yours," was going to prove he could love and be loved, even after the baby mama garbage fire.  Instead I'm getting new boyfriends, new girlfriends, and probably Canary 3.0, now with even more comic canon.  

This is not fun.  The writers' plotting and character development have always been chaotic, at best, but I always gave credit to the show for making me care about characters, especially Oliver and Felicity--that emotional resonance is good writing. I haven't heard anything about the new season to care about.  I am going to walk away, probably going to go hang out on the Pitch boards, but I ask you all for one thing: Please DM me if Chico gets fired.  She deserves it.

[Chaser]

1 hour ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Yeah, that's how I read it, too. 

Also, where are you guys seeing this spontaneous PR blitz? So far, I've only seen Marc and an Instagram photo of people on a plane. Emily is still talking about sunsets or butterflies.

EBR, SA both tweeted and posted photos. DR posted a pic. Everyone is liking everyone's photos. MG jumps on tumblr for the first time in over a year. All this happened in what, an hour? It sounds to me like people got some phone calls. I would not want to be the EPs right now. WM has been doing must of the promos. I'm curious if MG is going to take over. I find all this a little bit hilarious.

I didn't think they would start being concerned until there were a few more low rated episodes, that's why I think they get some data back that sent them scrambling. 

Did anyone catch his answer to the question about bring KC back? Is it just me or did he basically confirm the choice to bring KC back was not theirs?

Speaking of, I know some said that KC was filming a couple days on Arrow but I'm doubting it. Her and her boyfriend went to Boston and normally she posts her flights and there has been nothing today. It really may just be one day of filming for her.

[Belinea]

5 minutes ago, Chaser said:

Is it just me or did he basically confirm the choice to bring KC back was not theirs?

Which basically tells you how much power they have themselves over the storylines. Also didn't they say they didn't need approval to kill her off? Why backtrack on that? However, if they have to do certain things, why on earth don't they use an outline? Maybe that would make it easier to tell a good story.  

[catrox14]

"I dun messed up, A-ron" - MG, et al, probably.

[looptab]

7 minutes ago, Belinea said:

Which basically tells you how much power they have themselves over the storylines. Also didn't they say they didn't need approval to kill her off? Why backtrack on that? However, if they have to do certain things, why on earth don't they use an outline? Maybe that would make it easier to tell a good story.  

When did they say they didn't need approval? My understanding was that things concerning the DC properties had to pass by them first. 

[arjumand]

7 hours ago, tangerine95 said:

Well I mean they kinda just basically said olicity won't be back together this season, it's to be expected. Idk if that's just WM wording it badly while trying to be vague and teasing but if it's true I really have no interest to watch them apart and probably with other people all season. 

 

7 hours ago, way2interested said:

. . . . executive producer Wendy Mericle tells TVGuide.com. "[But] I think there will always be lingering feelings between these two."

The thing is, WM's quote makes no sense together with 'not necessarily this season' - because that last one suggests that it's over, for good. 'Always lingering feelings' can't coexist with getting together in the future. No wonder the entire Olicity-verse who are online freaked out, and why there's a social media blitz.  Now, either WM can't word, or she doesn't know how to tease while still keeping the fans interested.  Or this is it.

Look, the latter half of season 4 already lost me so badly that it took me 5 months to finish a story (which I was strongly tempted to abandon). And even in Season 3, I hated the idea of Felicity who can't be single, gotta have a man (yes, I'm quoting Sarah Haskins here - I wish she was still making those shorts) - and now we're back there? I mean, are you kidding me, Arrow guys?

I was trying to figure out why I'm so deeply invested in Oliver / Felicity, and I realised it's because it's so rare that the quirky comic relief not only gets an inner life and a story, but also gets the hero. Yes, EBR is a beautiful woman. But when she was presented, with black-framed nerd type glasses, that was code for "never gonna get the hero". I'd just been through about ten seasons of Criminal Minds, with almost the exact type of character (except she was also not thin - strike two!) also with a crush on one of the handsome heroes, and being treated like his sister the entire time. Any boyfriends she ever got were either doomed or her nerdy male counterpart (and now, new season of CM - same thing's happening, with a different hot guy).

So when Oliver admitted in the Season 3 opener that he really had feelings for Felicity, it was something new and amazing to me. And I don't know that I'm prepared to put up with all of Arrow's bullshit without it.

Edited October 11, 2016 by arjumand

[thegirlsleuth]

2 hours ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Yeah, that's how I read it, too. 

Also, where are you guys seeing this spontaneous PR blitz? So far, I've only seen Marc and an Instagram photo of people on a plane. Emily is still talking about sunsets or butterflies.

I fully expect them to announce that Stephen/David/Emily/Echo and maybe Willa will do a live tweet on Wednesday.

[Belinea]

42 minutes ago, looptab said:

When did they say they didn't need approval? My understanding was that things concerning the DC properties had to pass by them first. 

Maybe I remember it wrong but I thought at some point he said that it was their decision and that decision was accepted as such. I will have to look it up. He gave some many interviews and I remember thinking 'Oh really'. I will look for it.

[BkWurm1]

4 hours ago, Mellowyellow said:

I know quite a few of you hated S3. Was it this depressing shipwise when you were waiting for S3 spoilers?

Because I loved S3 and if it looked this dire when you were waiting for S3 spoilers then maybe this season will be ok. 

Or is this the sh@ttiest season shipwise so far in terms of spoilers?

Season three makes this look pretty mild so far IIRC.  It was bad.  Real bad and I remember times thinking a few times that maybe they had decided to walk back the whole idea of putting Oliver and Felicity together.  They were soooo gung ho about how great Ray and Felicity were together that there was a while where the spoilers coming out seemed to say the dream was over.  And then at the same time Laurel was getting fast tracked to the mask so there were arguments over if they'd changed their mind and were going to revert to comic canon.  Killing Sara was a huge shake to my confidence about the show runners wanting to tell their own story. 

What kept me holding on was all the hopes for BR to get his own show (which meant he would leave so that relationship had to end) and experience on other shows that torture the audience before making it better was normal. And Laurel was having her story told in IMO a terrible way.

 I do still remember wondering if it was over after Oliver came back and he decided to work with MM and we got the I don't want to be a woman you love line.  I seriously wondered if it was time for me to walk away. The following episode that was all about Laurel and had Felicity throw Sara under the bus almost made me quit.

  I don't remember why I risked sticking around.  SO many bleak episodes back to back.  I think I was holding on because season two also had a number of really bad back half episodes that made me feel hopeless.  Maybe it was the Diggle wedding pictures.  I had hopes for a dance or something, lol. 

Season 4 had the same bad back half but I feel like I'm STILL waiting for the pay off for the pain I endured.  Now it sounds like it's going to be an even longer road to travel.  I still think the line about always have lingering feelings is just part of the ship stall rhetoric because I remember in season 3 they also said some comments that sounded like a death knell for Olicity.  So i haven't given up but the show sounds a hell of a lot less interesting, let alone enjoyable. 

Edited October 11, 2016 by BkWurm1

[smoaksmichaelas]

If they are recasting Black Canary then I'd say there's a good chance they are done with Olicity.

Edited October 11, 2016 by smoaksmichaelas

[Belinea]

2 minutes ago, smoaksmichaelas said:

 

If they are recasting Black Canary then I'd say there's a good chance they are done with Olicity

 

I am waiting for that casting announcement to make the rounds. Because the character was listed as option for season regular. Which means potential to stick around for a long time. 

Also what does the 'not necessarily' mean in WM's interview. If everyone drops the show, we might be forced to get back to it?

[Midnight Lullaby]

I fully believe they don't plan to put Olicity back together this season..that could change if the show doesn't create enough buzz without them IMO. The problem is to find someone else that has the same or more chemistry than SA and EBR have together and good luck with that.

For me the problem isn't how much time they keep them separated but the way they do it. I'd be on board if they made them talk, showed their feelings, their POVs but instead we have the characters acting like they have never been engaged and it's not the way to keep my attention.

[Mellowyellow]

@BkWurm1 your post made me feel SO much better! Gave me a bit of hope!

Lol until I read the post about them recasting Black Canary.

OMG Shipping is stressful! 

Do you guys know if they have written all the scripts? How are these things filmed? Do/Can they change things as they go along or is it all written and then taped? 

[looptab]

2 hours ago, Belinea said:

Maybe I remember it wrong but I thought at some point he said that it was their decision and that decision was accepted as such. I will have to look it up. He gave some many interviews and I remember thinking 'Oh really'. I will look for it.

But even that means that DC approved of their decision to kill her off, rather than them not having a say in the matter, I think. 

[Midnight Lullaby]

1 hour ago, Mellowyellow said:

@BkWurm1 your post made me feel SO much better! Gave me a bit of hope!

Lol until I read the post about them recasting Black Canary.

OMG Shipping is stressful! 

Do you guys know if they have written all the scripts? How are these things filmed? Do/Can they change things as they go along or is it all written and then taped? 

They are about to start filming episode 9 and a few days after the "Tina news" was out a writer said they were starting to work on episode 511..

[dtissagirl]

1 hour ago, Mellowyellow said:

Do you guys know if they have written all the scripts? How are these things filmed? Do/Can they change things as they go along or is it all written and then taped? 

They haven't written all scripts, no. During the first half of the season, writing is usually 5 episodes ahead of filming. And right now, filming is 8 episodes ahead of broadcast. Later in the season filming gets closer to broadcast, sometimes as close as 3 episodes ahead only.

[CabotCove]

Quote

If they are recasting Black Canary then I'd say there's a good chance they are done with Olicity.

Not necessarily, Black Canary persona doesnt have to be Oliver love interest especially when she is not even Dinah  who has history with Oliver/GA. If they want a new love interest for Oliver, they can just make up a new love interest or bring back an old love interest. The way I see it. Relationships are not interchangeable just because people wore the same mask. I certainly hope the show is not going this route?.

Edited October 11, 2016 by DCLeague

[dtissagirl]

I almost would like to watch them try to switch LIs AGAIN, after the complete hell of logistics it took the first time around.

It took them TWO SEASONS to make it so audiences didn't realize they totally broke the promise they made in the pilot to tell the love story of Oliver and Laurel.  And then spent the next 45 episodes undoing it in a way that looked like they planned it all along [organic!] when Felicity was positioned as the next LI in 201, and then took over officially in 223.

Not to mention it took them almost 90 episodes to be able to get rid of the Island Picture of Doom -- that was TOTALLY looming over the writers' heads all the time, a constant reminder of the fact that they had to spend so much time un-writing O/L for the show to go forward. And that was writers un-writing a pairing they didn't even like. Why would they un-write the pairing they like?

[smoaksmichaelas]

31 minutes ago, DCLeague said:

Not necessarily, Black Canary persona doesnt have to be Oliver love interest especially when she is not even Dinah  who has history with Oliver/GA. If they want a new love interest for Oliver, they can just make up a new love interest or bring back an old love interest. The way I see it. Relationships are not interchangeable just because people wore the same mask. I certainly hope the show is not going this route?.

Yea but these writers. Wouldn't put it past them since that's basically what they did with Laurel and Sara. 

[smoaksmichaelas]

So Felicity's arc start in 5x02. I'm actually excited about that (please don't let me down writers) & the newbies. Mainly Wild Dog. I'm probably going to have a soft spot for Artemis b/c the actress seems really sweet. 

Edited October 11, 2016 by smoaksmichaelas

[CabotCove]

Quote

I almost would like to watch them try to switch LIs AGAIN, after the complete hell of logistics it took the first time around.

Eh it didnt seem like they had any hard time doing that, looked to me they just pretended it never happened and retconned easily some bits without a sweat. I dont think they would have much of a problem, IF they were to switch again, they have had lots of experience in that department. Not just with romance but everything else, they will just click their fingers and it will be done. IMO.

Quote

Or is this the sh@ttiest season shipwise so far in terms of spoilers?

No, they have been screwing up ships ever since season 1. And has happened every season since then.

Quote

Yea but these writers. Wouldn't put it past them since that's basically what they did with Laurel and Sara. 

I know, I know, I know?, each time they resurrect a Canary sister I always dread it will start all over again. 

Edited October 11, 2016 by DCLeague

[Angel12d]

I'm guessing the Olicity scene in 505 is going to be the equivalent of the Lauriver hallway scene from s2. Probably not as harsh as that one but one where they basically move on for good.

The trouble is it was easy to show Oliver moving on from Laurel because he always treated her like shit and it came across as he never really loved her anyway. But I'm not sure they'll get away with it again after how they wrote him with Felicity. This is not just explaining the picture of doom, it's trying to get rid of Felicity being the last thought before Oliver died or how she's his always and he just wants to be hers. Like, good luck with that! Haha.

Edited October 11, 2016 by Angel12d

[looptab]

Don't take this the wrong way - I'm in no way criticizing or judging anyone for feeling what they feel - but how is this latest interview any different from the others? Why such a strong reaction and feeling of doom now? I thought most people had come to terms with the fact that they were stalling Olicity. Honest question, I feel like I'm missing something.

Edited October 11, 2016 by looptab

[way2interested]

2 minutes ago, looptab said:

Don't take this the wrong way - I'm in no way criticizing or judging anyone for feeling what they feel - but how is this latest interview any different from the others? Why such a strong reaction and feeling of doom now? I thought most people had come to terms with the fact that they were stalling Olicity. Honest question, I feel like I'm missing something.

I think because the wording basically implies that they won't get back together at all this year, instead of the past articles when she's basically said they won't get back together "for now," kind of making people not even want to waste time watching for the season.

My question is why CW decided to take this reaction seriously as apposed to throughout the summer or after 501.

[Carrie Ann]

I really don't think they are trying to drop O/F for good and write a brand-new love story*. I think they are trying to put structures in place for a longer-term ship stall--like, a whole season (based on WM's ill-considered words) plus maybe part of next to actually get them back together?

So they insert this out-of-nowhere boyfriend whom no one could be reasonably expected to ever care about, given that we didn't see them get together and we didn't even know him prior to that. Even Ray and Felicity got a romantic storyline arc, no matter how shitty, and they never intended that relationship to last.

And next will probably be the ships-passing-in-the-night moment in 505 where Felicity starts to come around, but Oliver turns the other way instead because they don't communicate properly, and then insert LI for him probably. 

IMO, this could all be over by sometime in 5B, or it could last until almost 6B (whether any of us are still around to see it by that point, who can say). But I highly doubt the writers have much interest in writing a brand new love story with Oliver + an unknown quantity. He's had some chemistry with his other female costars before, but that's no guarantee he'll have any with someone new (regardless of any chemistry testing beforehand, it doesn't always translate), or that viewers will engage with that character at all.

*The only way I think they would do this is if Emily wanted out, and that would be disastrous for them.

Edited October 11, 2016 by Carrie Ann

[Mellowyellow]

For me personally I think there are a few things:

*505 - I agree with Angel12d and really believe this is the Olicity break up episode. I am not sure why some people think this will be a positive Olicity episode. There is no evidence it will be anything good. More evidence that it will bury Olicity. Still an Olicity episode, THE ONE WHERE WE BURY IT

*They included that gawd awful "Don't make me the last Canary" thing in the first episode. Why put that in unless they are going to introduce a new BC

*The casting call for "Tina" - sounds like this will be new BC

*People on this board saying that they want to cater to those who want comic cannon which means they will bring back BC and shack her up with Oliver

*These are the people who wrote BMD and defended it to the death. They are TOTALLY going to bring in a random BC and defend it to the death

*I'm going to get smashed for this comment but as much as I love Olicity, I feel like it is becoming the Lauriver of S1 because of how badly they ffed it up in season 4 and made no attempts to redeem it. Had they gone without the proposal/engagement and "you are my always" business I would still think that they are just stalling and it will be ok in the end. But they went the WHOLE HOG and then took it all back which makes me think the only thing left for them to do is to burn it to the ground in season 5. It's like they have written the whole Olicity story and its over. Not sure if this makes sense! 

*This is CW. Have ya seen what happened on Reign?

[looptab]

Oh, I see. Funnily, I took that 'not necessarily this year' as 'of course this year, wink wink'. I don't know if that's due to my own delusions or a lack of a deeper understanding of the shades certain words can have.

Anyway, we've been talking about critics being 'fooled' by the set-up of the premiere into thinking the drama was over, wondering if they had ever watched TV, and I was surprised to see kind of the same going on. I do understand not wanting to see them with other people, especially after the huge steps made last year - proposals, vows, fake weddings. Sadly, I kinda expected to see it go this route, so maybe that's why I'm not that upset about it.

[Angel12d]

16 minutes ago, looptab said:

Don't take this the wrong way - I'm in no way criticizing or judging anyone for feeling what they feel - but how is this latest interview any different from the others? Why such a strong reaction and feeling of doom now? I thought most people had come to terms with the fact that they were stalling Olicity. Honest question, I feel like I'm missing something.

Personally I've always felt like they were stalling Olicity for a long while so the interview wasn't anything new to me. It's just disheartening to keep reading week after week. I think it got a big reaction on twitter though because it's the first time WM has basically said O/F aren't getting back together this season instead of talking around it. I think the finality of those words upset some people and removed whatever hope they had. 

Edited October 11, 2016 by Angel12d

[Belinea]

13 minutes ago, way2interested said:

My question is why CW decided to take this reaction seriously as apposed to throughout the summer or after 501.

Maybe because they, despite all the talk about not being interested in the normal rating system, care about ratings. Maybe they realize now that angry fans might create buzz but disappointed fans who don't watch any longer don't spend their time on promoting the show.  

Edited October 11, 2016 by Belinea

[apinknightmare]

3 hours ago, looptab said:

Oh, I see. Funnily, I took that 'not necessarily this year' as 'of course this year, wink wink'. I don't know if that's due to my own delusions or a lack of a deeper understanding of the shades certain words can have.

I took it that way too. I don't think Wendy was trying to send some kind of signal about how long they've been told to stall the ship, I think she's just really terrible at promoting the show and the "not necessarily this year" was Wendy speak for "keep watching and find out." 

Personally it's just irritating to have the status/potential future status of Oliver and Felicity's relationship repeatedly hammered home in clickbaity interviews coupled with the promo of newbies, not much at all regarding the original characters that have been with the show since the first season, and doubling down on the show's bleakness. 

What irritated me more than anything was Wendy's comment about Oliver and Felicity's "lingering feelings," like they just dated for a while and things never quite worked out for them as opposed to being two people who were going to get married. Ugh.

Edited October 11, 2016 by apinknightmare

[dtissagirl]

4 minutes ago, looptab said:

Oh, I see. Funnily, I took that 'not necessarily this year' as 'of course this year, wink wink'. I don't know if that's due to my own delusions or a lack of a deeper understanding of the shades certain words can have.

I think people were resigned to 'ship stall in 5A, but when Wendy said "this season", it made everyone collectively worry that this might last a full season. Maybe even more. And this is right on the heels of that other quote about writing against O/F romance, and the fact that they're doing it via Temporary Love Interests, which is something that HAS NEVER EVER WORKED ON THIS SHOW. I can totally see why this was the quote that made Twitter snap.

Slightly off topic, but not really: I'm still binge-watching Murdoch Mysteries. I'm now halfway through season seven, and they've stopped cockblocking the main 'ship via Temporary Love Interests, and have now changed methods to having a deranged psychopathic on-going villain/nemesis that threatens to fridge Julia every 5 episodes or so, and his threatening method is "if you and Murdoch get together I will kill you" because apparently the psycho dude hates ~love~. I figure Arrow is gonna get right into doing that once this season of Temp LIs is over and done.