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Celebrating 25 Years Of The West Wing

Spoiler Discussion Thread

Morrigan2575

By Morrigan2575
in Arrow

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Starfish35

Starfish35

I cannot fathom any possible scenario where there's another wedding in present day. Flashbacks are the only option I see here. Maybe Maseo is spying on the wedding and flashes back to his and Tatsu's wedding.

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Carrie Ann

Me for all of last summer hiatus and 5A: Me after reading the WM interview from a few weeks back about Felicity's arc giving her a more profound understanding of Oliver: Me after r

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BkWurm1

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calliope1975
calliope1975

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

MG didn't say ceremony though, he said wedding:

He did say wedding, but he's also a level 10 troll, so I take nothing he says at face value.

I cannot fathom any possible scenario where there's another wedding in present day. Flashbacks are the only option I see here. Maybe Maseo is spying on the wedding and flashes back to his and Tatsu's wedding.

Could also be something as simple as Oliver running through/interrupting a wedding while chasing/running from someone either in the past or present day.

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Starfish35

Starfish35

(edited)

Could also be something as simple as Oliver running through/interrupting a wedding while chasing/running from someone either in the past or present day.

Oh yeah, I could definitely see that too. And MG rubbing his hands together and cackling at how he got the fandom worked up over something that is technically true but actually doesn't amount to anything.

Edited by Starfish35
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DrSpaceman10

DrSpaceman10

I looked up the dictionary definition of the word wedding and the second definition is:

 

"an act, process, or instance of joining in close association"

 

so it could be Oliver wedding himself to the LOA, which going by MG's insane troll logic is probably exactly what he meant. 

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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)

Oh Gods. It's totally going to be the baby mama and Oliver marries her because he doesn't want his child to be illegitimate which I despise that term BTW.

Edited by catrox14
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Menrva

Menrva

See, I imagined that the reason Mama Smoak is in town is because Ray had arranged to fly her in so he could ask for her blessing to propose to Felicity. And it had nothing to do with Ray being in the hospital, or her showing up to lend emotional support to Felicity. 

Now that I see it typed out, I guess it's kind of a dumb theory…but it can't be anything worse that what's already happened, right?

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statsgirl

statsgirl

 

Don't let your recalcitrance take any more lives.

Way to play the mind games, Maseo.

 

If Diggle and Felicity don't tell Oliver repeatedly that Ra's is messing with his head, I will be very unhappy.

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Guest

Guest

(edited)

So that comic preview just posted…Oliver has seemingly just killed some LOA members and then it seems like the ATOM appears (I'm guessing that's what the 'FOOM' noise is) so does this mean Ray actually sees the Arrow kill people? It makes sense why he'd want to go after him, although he wouldn't have any clue about the LOA or what they're there for. 

 

The more I think about this, the more I realize everything can be solved by simple communication and it's super frustrating.

Edited by Guest
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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

So that comic preview just posted…Oliver has seemingly just killed some LOA members and then it seems like the ATOM appears (I'm guessing that's what the 'FOOM' noise is) so does this mean Ray actually sees the Arrow kill people? It makes sense why he'd want to go after him, although he wouldn't have any clue about the LOA or what they're there for.

Wouldn't he wonder why Arrow was killing dudes who were dressed like him? Looks like they're all in hoods and wearing quivers. Common sense would have to come into play at some point, haha

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Guest

Guest

(edited)

Hmm no I don't believe Oliver is killing the assassins.

 

Well, I don't think so either but Maseo says "You can't kill them all, Oliver." Maybe he didn't mean literally? I don't know.

 

 

Wouldn't he wonder why Arrow was killing dudes who were dressed like him? Looks like they're all in hoods and wearing quivers. Common sense would have to come into play at some point, haha

 

Does Ray have common sense?! Common sense would have told him that you shouldn't turn up on an employees doorstep early in the morning but he did.  And I don't think Ray is thinking clearly because IMO he's nowhere near ready to be wearing that suit but he just seems eager to get out there and play hero without all the facts or thinking of the consequences.

Edited by Guest
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wonderwall

wonderwall

I wonder why Maseo would tell Oliver he couldn't kill them all if he wasn't killing some of them? Ugh, show.

 

I think it's because it's Oliver's fault that they're dying. Therefore, Oliver is the one who's killing them? And you know how Oliver is, he'll totally grab the bait

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dcinmb

dcinmb

(edited)

So that comic preview just posted…Oliver has seemingly just killed some LOA members and then it seems like the ATOM appears (I'm guessing that's what the 'FOOM' noise is) so does this mean Ray actually sees the Arrow kill people? It makes sense why he'd want to go after him, although he wouldn't have any clue about the LOA or what they're there for. 

 

I thought the 'FOOM' was Maseo and Co. doing that LOA flashbang-disappear-in-a-puff-of-smoke thing?

 

ETA: Or what SonofaBiscuit said.

Edited by dcinmb
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Guest

Guest

I thought the 'FOOM' was Maseo and Co. doing that LOA flashbang-disappear-in-a-puff-of-smoke thing?

 

Oooh. Yes. I like that theory better. Nice!

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wonderwall

wonderwall

Wouldn't he wonder why Arrow was killing dudes who were dressed like him? Looks like they're all in hoods and wearing quivers. Common sense would have to come into play at some point, haha

 

Maybe Ray is an eager beaver and like Laurel, acts first and then thinks later? I always compare Ray's rise to vigilantism to premature ejaculation tbqh. It makes sense in my head :p

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

(edited)

I just thought that Maseo was tossing some sort of LoA smoke bomb and disappearing. Hmm.

I thought that too. But the background is similar to the one that was behind Atom during the confrontation with Arrow in the stills that were released.

I think it's because it's Oliver's fault that they're dying. Therefore, Oliver is the one who's killing them? And you know how Oliver is, he'll totally grab the bait

He was talking about the LoA members though-Maseo is saying that Oliver won't be able to kill all of them because for every one he takes down, two will take that person's place. So Oliver would literally be killing these people, haha. Edited by apinknightmare
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lexicon

lexicon

Maybe Ray is an eager beaver and like Laurel, acts first and then thinks later? I always compare Ray's rise to vigilantism to premature ejaculation tbqh. It makes sense in my head :p

 

Premature ejaculation reference ftw!

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wonderwall

wonderwall

He was talking about the LoA members though-Maseo is saying that Oliver won't be able to kill all of them because for every one he takes down, two will take that person's place. So Oliver would literally be killing these people, haha.

 

IDK what's going on tbqh. Maybe MG will clarify when he's answering tumblr questions lmao -- how sad

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dcinmb

dcinmb

(edited)

I thought that too. But the background is similar to the one that was behind Atom during the confrontation with Arrow in the stills that were released.

 

The similar background may be due to the limited production budget. Guess we should just be thankful that Lyla and Diggle's wedding isn't happening there. ;)

Edited by dcinmb
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Password

Password

(edited)

I mean I say so because MG confirmed none of the assassins were killed in Nanda Parbat. Why would he suddenly start killing them now? Injure them, sure, but killing them makes him Ra's Ollie Ghul.

Edited by Password
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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)

I figure the Walking dead reference is either the destruction of the lair = destruction of the prison. Or the virus is unleashed and people look like death warmed over and are dropping like flies

Edited by catrox14
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lemotomato

lemotomato

So, how does the Arrow set look like the Walking Dead set, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT, STEPHEN? Are they throwing a pile of dead people into the Lazarus Pit, or something?

Could be the alpha-omega virus coming into play? The name makes me think it's a zombie making virus.
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Starfish35

Starfish35

(edited)

Could be the alpha-omega virus coming into play?

Yeah there has got to be a point to the flashbacks eventually, other than just that Oliver knew Maseo and Tatsu back then. That's why I used to think it would be revealed that Waller was behind Sara's murder. But if it's not about Waller, then it's got to be about that virus.

Edited by Starfish35
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dtissagirl

dtissagirl

Could be the alpha-omega virus coming into play? The name makes me think it's a zombie making virus.

 

RIGHT, the virus. If Ra's Ollie Ghul happens in 321, something else has got to threaten Starling City in 322/323. And it gels with what Stephen said at NYCC, that all of the heroes being around would help Oliver with his decision, or whatever.

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Guest

Guest

(edited)

I definitely think the virus will come into play.

 

Subject change but I want to know when we'll see Tatsu become Katana. I saw a picture of the actress on twitter where she had the short hairstyle and they said it would happen before the end of the season. So whatever happens in the flashbacks must sync up with the present day. It has to.

Edited by Guest
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Starfish35

Starfish35

I'm starting to wonder if the Katana storyline will carry over into next season, although the problem with that is that Rila may be on another show. It just doesn't seem like there's enough time left to do that storyline any justice whatsoever.

If I had a tumblr I'd ask MG. Not that he would answer. :)

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kismet

kismet

I'm starting to wonder if the Katana storyline will carry over into next season, although the problem with that is that Rila may be on another show. It just doesn't seem like there's enough time left to do that storyline any justice whatsoever.

If I had a tumblr I'd ask MG. Not that he would answer. :)

Too Spoilery... He'd probably tell you to keep watching! If hes in a good mood he might even thank you for your question.

 

But I have been thinking about the virus coming back into play as well. I wonder if it too will continue onto s4. I wonder if Ras is not behind the virus at all. Perhaps his arc ends in 21 and then the beginnings of the virus hits 22/23 in SC. Perhaps the big villain of s4 is behind the virus and it is completely not connected to Ras at all. Moving fwd I would like to see Arrow attempt to have multiple enemy arcs going on, esp if they are going to have HIVE & Damien Dhark (if that is even who they are using & not just nameholding). That way they can break up some of the monotony of every cliffhanger being linked back to the same plot line they established in 1st episode. It can be a shuffling of evil plots with setbacks & small victories. They did it in Alias and many other shows as well where they have episodic missions/villians and then long-standing season(s) arc that are based in the shows mythos. But for some episodes they would let the long arcs just linger in the background and sometimes never address them maybe they might drop little clue here & there, but sometimes not even that. Imagine how much better this season could have been if they didn't need to somehow link everything back to Sara's death (which has proven itself unnecessary as of yet) & MM. It leads to plot fatigue, especially when your plot looks like every road after a bad winter riddled with potholes of shape & style of broken & semi-repaired.

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Starfish35

Starfish35

Actually....

So am I. I didn't actually think they would go there, but didn't SA say something about his and Diggle's relationship changing forever, and MG said something on his tumblr about doing something most showrunners wouldn't consider (don't remember exactly how it was worded).

I'm suddenly thinking they're going to parallel Maseo and Tatsu losing Akio to Diggle and Lyla losing baby Sara.

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Starfish35

Starfish35

(edited)

It could mean something else. Maybe Lyla gets badly hurt or something. Or maybe she and/or the baby are kidnapped as leverage. But....I could see them jumping at the parallels. And that would certainly be something that would change Oliver's and Diggle's relationship.

I'm starting to lean toward the idea (put forth by others in this thread) that this season isn't going to end on a high note necessarily. They may win, but it could be that Team Arrow ends up being shattered, and they all kind of go their separate ways over the summer. I know others have suggested it before me - I'm just saying, I'm signing on to the theory now I think.

Edited by Starfish35
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kismet

kismet

I hope not... I really would hate for them to do anything bad to her.... I mean possibly killing Akio was bad enough in my head but lil Sara too?? It also would go along with SA saying that some of the storylines hit a little too close to home and he wanted them to change the plotlines. I don't have children, but the thought of losing one of my niece/nephews is truly unthinkable, I can't imagine what a parent must feel like. And with him being the father of a young child similar in age to Baby Sara that must be a little too close to home. I hope that if they did proceed down this path of hurting innocent children, they find some way to resolve it. Maybe one lives in past/present while the other dies? Either way the story just sounds very painful & too emotional to watch, tbqh not really my cup of tea. So I hope it is all rampant worry & speculation about Lil Sara.

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wonderwall

wonderwall

It could mean something else. Maybe Lyla gets badly hurt or something. Or maybe she and/or the baby are kidnapped as leverage. But....I could see them jumping at the parallels. And that would certainly be something that would change Oliver's and Diggle's relationship.

I'm starting to lean toward the idea (put forth by others in this thread) that this season isn't going to end on a high note necessarily. They may win, but it could be that Team Arrow ends up being shattered, and they all kind of go their separate ways over the summer. I know others have suggested it before me - I'm just saying, I'm signing on to the theory now I think.

 

Yeah I could totally see a role reversal where Digg relies and counts on Oliver for support because Lyla and Sara have been kidnapped? HIVE could be brought into this as the organization that took part in kidnapping them?

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

I can't imagine them killing off an infant, good lord. 

 

But - if they're going to be introducing Oliver's kid, then maybe they'd do it to give him more fear about getting involved because of enemies using kids to exact revenge? Although Sara could get kidnapped or whatever and still live and that would still drive the point home for Oliver, I'd think.

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Belinea

Belinea

(edited)

I'm suddenly thinking they're going to parallel Maseo and Tatsu losing Akio to Diggle and Lyla losing baby Sara.

 

I thought that as well but I cannot imagine they'd kill a baby. I mean killing a child is pretty cruel and awful but killing a baby just takes it a step too far. Maybe it will be a parallel where Maseo and Tatsu lose their son with Oliver not being able to help and now he can help Diggle and Lyla.

I don't really expect Lyla to get hurt again. They already had her injured this season and I don't know if they'd kill her. That would give Diggle some new storyline but he'd also be a single father and that would take up time as well.

 

Oh and frankly I am not surprised that Oliver will be somewhat angry at Felicity in 3x17 or the fact they once again don't see eye to eye. And I also am not cool with the fact that she is on Ray's side and "is growing to love" him. When will it stop?!

Edited by Belinea
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calliope1975

calliope1975

The Walking Dead hasn't even killed off a baby on-screen yet. Jeez, Arrow, do you want families to watch your show?

 

I admit, though, there's a part of me that wouldn't mind seeing a baby LP'd and come back crazy. They'd be cranky all the time.

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kismet

kismet

Rescuing Lyla would also be a redo of Russia last year, so I can't see them doing that. But paralleling the kidnapping of Akio in past & Sara in present with Oliver helpless could be plausible. If Argus was behind both of the kidnappings that would also put some pressure on Diggle, Lyla & Oliver's relationship with each other. But when would they squeeze an abduction in. It doesn't fit with Public Enemy in 318l maybe Broken Arrow in 319, but then I would imagine they would have to get Lyla back on that episode (have we heard if she is guesting on any eps this season?) I can't imagine they would have something happen to Lil Sara & not have Lyla there, but I guess there are work arounds in the script. It would add some punch to his brokenness if he felt powerless to save the children of 2 of his closest friends.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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I thought that as well but I cannot imagine they'd kill a baby. I mean killing a child is pretty cruel and awful but killing a baby just takes it a step too far. Maybe it will be a parallel where Maseo and Tatsu lose their son with Oliver not being able to help and now he can help Diggle and Lyla.

I don't really expect Lyla to get hurt again. They already had her injured this season and I don't know if they'd kill her. That would give Diggle some new storyline but he'd also be a single father and that would take up time as well.

Oh and frankly I am not surprised that Oliver will be somewhat angry at Felicity in 3x17 or the fact they once again don't see eye to eye. And I also am not cool with the fact that she is on Ray's side and "is growing to love" him. When will it stop?!

Are you referring to SAs quote in the TTV Line blurb? If so, I don't get the objection other than it's not Olicity Yay!

That's one of the thing's talked about before the season even started. That in order for Oliver to realize he can get the girl and be both Oliver and Arrow he has to see that Ray can do it. Right now, Oliver is all no can't happen, even telling Barry it can't happen for either of them.

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

 

But going toe-to-toe with Ray could put Oliver at odds with Felicity, who you may be surprised to hear actually sides with Ray. “She does end up supporting it because we need it, but she’s nervous and anxious because he’s out in the field and he’s in danger,” Emily Bett Rickards says. “It’s a friend and it’s someone she knows and is growing to love. You’re putting your teammate in danger, so she doesn’t necessarily feel gung-ho.”

 

Bleh. 

 

Excitement for this episode dying...

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dtissagirl

dtissagirl

(edited)

Are you referring to SAs quote in the TTV Line blurb? If so, I don't get the objection other than it's not Olicity Yay!

That's one of the thing's talked about before the season even started. That in order for Oliver to realize he can get the girl and be both Oliver and Arrow he has to see that Ray can do it. Right now, Oliver is all no can't happen, even telling Barry it can't happen for either of them.

 

Yup. This. They've actually wrote themselves into a corner there with Oliver believing he can't have it all. Because he kind of thinks nobody can. Which is why he wanted to sideline Diggle, and why he told Barry they don't get the girl. So if Palmer can have it all -- and with Felicity to add more salt to Oliver's wound -- it's hopefully what's gonna open his eyes, FINALLY.

Edited by dancingnancy
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Guest

Guest

(edited)

Felicity is 'growing to love' Ray? Please tell me they're kidding me with this shit. Haha, I knew last week's high wouldn't last. Oh well.

Edited by Guest
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Guest
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