Spoiler Discussion Thread

[Buzzyspirit]

19 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I already gave you my prediction on Twitter but, here it is. 

Artemis breaks BS out of prison to work for Prometheus again. There's a big fight between TA and Prometheus, they think they've won, its all over, Chase is captured. They decided to have a celebratory/Victory party for Oliver's birthday. The "cake" is drugged, everyone passes out and Diggle, Thea, Felicity, Lance and maybe Curtis wake up on the Island. Surrounded by BS, Artemis and Prometheus, cut to black.

Plus someone else that we haven't seen since season 1...

[tv echo]

S1 ended with Oliver leaving Starling City (and Laurel), after Tommy's death, to hermit out on Lian Yu - cliffhanger: will Oliver ever return? (Duh. The show is called Arrow.) Tommy's death, period. Then we find out, through the Arrow tie-in comics (written by MG) and subsequent flashback scenes and 201, that Oliver fled to Lian Yu to hermit away in guilt and grief, until Diggle and Felicity went to get him.

S2 did not end with a cliffhanger - OTA on Lian Yu after putting Slade Wilson in ARGUS prison.

S3 ended with Oliver & Felicity leaving Star City to go on the road together - cliffhanger: is that the end of his GA crime fighting days?

S4 ended with Oliver & Felicity in the lair, with the rest of the team gone - cliffhanger: will Diggle and Thea return? will Olicity reconcile?

I think the S5 "cliffhanger" might be a Vigilante tease. Remember MG's complaint about how he wanted a shorter, 17-episode season (like LoT) but he's forced to fill up 23 episodes, which is why they did that shorter villain arc with Tobias Church to fill up 5 episodes before moving forward with the Prometheus villain arc this season?  I think they're probably going to do the same thing next season - a shorter villain arc with the Vigilante and then the season-long villain arc with a new Big Bad.

Edited April 5, 2017 by tv echo

[Primal Slayer]

2 hours ago, statsgirl said:

That would be a good way to open it.  Poor Quentin, it's likely to send him looking for a bottle again.

I agree, but they have to have some kind of plan for Black Siren since they're bringing KC back as a regular.  Arrow  doesn't need two Canary Cry birds on the team and they spent a season and a half killing Laurel's Black Canary and bringing on a new one, I doubt they are going to get rid of Dinah in order to put Black Siren on the Arrow team.

This show is messier then Glee, i dont even know what goes into their thought process so i wouldn'tbe surprised if they add her to the team but i wouldn't be surprised if they didn't. 

[way2interested]

I really hope given the description of what they were filming that Oliver isn't arrested again in 522. Although, I would guess that would at least show consequences against outting himself as the GA?

[tv echo]

I really don't think that Oliver will be outed as the GA this season or any time soon.

What if Quentin is the one who helps BS escape from ARGUS prison?  He goes to see her out of curiosity. She intentionally acts like E1 Laurel and gives him a sob story about how she just wants to return home to E2, how he reminds her of her own father, how her biggest regret is her estrangement from her E2 father, how she wants to reconcile with him, how E1 authorities will never let her out, etc. Once she gets out, she takes Quentin hostage, meets up with Evelyn, and they go to Lian Yu, where they're supposed to rendezvous with Chase. 

Edited April 5, 2017 by tv echo

[leopardprint]

Does BS know about Lian Yu? E2 Oliver never came back at all? I don't remember her backstory. Would LOL forever if it's Lance that's missing and kidnapped to Lian Yu. 

They could still put GA's kills on TSK and use Oliver continuously getting falsely arrested as a running gag.

ETA: Sorry I meant BS taking Lance to the island on her own. She only knows about GA from Chase. I know we have spoilers that everyone ends up on the island. 

Edited April 5, 2017 by leopardprint

[Morrigan2575]

We know from BTS pictures that Thea, Felicity, Lance, Diggle and maybe Curtis are on the Island. Additionally we know (from BTS pics) that Artemis, Prometheus and BS are there was well

[wonderwall]

2 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I already gave you my prediction on Twitter but, here it is. 

Artemis breaks BS out of prison to work for Prometheus again. There's a big fight between TA and Prometheus, they think they've won, its all over, Chase is captured. They decided to have a celebratory/Victory party for Oliver's birthday. The "cake" is drugged, everyone passes out and Diggle, Thea, Felicity, Lance and maybe Curtis wake up on the Island. Surrounded by BS, Artemis and Prometheus, cut to black.

It would definitely explain why BS is in 522... But I'm not sure though. I feel like Chase could escape on his own no? Or maybe Talia?

[Guest]

Have we seen Yao Fei since s1? I wonder if Oliver's gonna have a vision or memory of him when they're on Lian Yu, kinda like he saw Shado in flashbacks last season. It would link in to his legacy and everything.

Edited April 5, 2017 by Guest

[Morrigan2575]

3 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

Have we seen Yao Fei since s1? I wonder if Oliver's gonna have a vision or memory of him when they're on Lian Yu, kinda like he saw Shado in flashbacks last season. It would link in to his legacy and everything.

No Yao Fei since S1.  Was the S1 reference specifically for 523 or is it just for the end of the season? I was wondering if Oliver sees Yao Fei when he's being tortured in 522?

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

No Yao Fei since S1.  Was the S1 reference specifically for 523 or is it just for the end of the season? I was wondering if Oliver sees Yao Fei when he's being tortured in 522?

IDK, I can't remember exactly. But I can see him having a vision either when he's being tortured or he's struggling to fight and at his lowest point, like when he saw Tommy in s2 and he told him to keep fighting or whatever. And Yao Fei would be a nice surprise for s1 fans.

Edited April 5, 2017 by Guest

[tv echo]

[Guest]

Aha! I had a feeling. Cool.

Edited April 5, 2017 by Guest

[tv echo]

Per Byron Mann's IMDb page, his last appearance as Yao Fei on Arrow was in 1x22.

[leopardprint]

Perhaps we'll get a wondefully cheesy scene with hallucination Yao Fei telling Oliver to "live". 

Or a flashback in the flashback? 

[statsgirl]

This episode has more reunions than the 100th.

4 hours ago, theOAfc said:

Flash forward to Oliver being revealed as the Green Arrow? 

It's possible but if I were in the room, I'd tell them it's too risky.  It would turn off as many people as would be excited to see it. 

2 hours ago, tv echo said:

What if Quentin is the one who helps BS escape from ARGUS prison?  He goes to see her out of curiosity. She intentionally acts like E1 Laurel and gives him a sob story about how she just wants to return home to E2, how he reminds her of her own father, how her biggest regret is her estrangement from her E2 father, how she wants to reconcile with him, how E1 authorities will never let her out, etc. Once she gets out, she takes Quentin hostage, meets up with Evelyn, and they go to Lian Yu, where they're supposed to rendezvous with Chase. 

I like the idea of Quentin letting her out because she play son his loss of Laurel.  He had a rough enough time with losing Sara and she wasn't even the daughter he was closest to.

I still don't understand why Chase wants everyone close to Oliver on the island.

[insomniadreams88]

1 minute ago, statsgirl said:

I still don't understand why Chase wants everyone close to Oliver on the island.

Maybe Chase just really cares about Star City and figured this is the best way to keep it from being destroyed/needing to use more money to repair any damage after the past 4 Mays. He knows that the final battle has to take place in May because that's what's happened every year, but he figures he can switch up the location.

Or maybe it's just a matter of "Hey, look what I can do, kidnapping everyone you know and bringing them to the island." 

Or it's just easier to transport them than it is to free the ARGUS prisoners there and bring them to Star City. Maybe he thinks he won't be able to control them in the city but might have a chance on the island to use them for his endgame? 

[Morrigan2575]

Maybe it's some sort of bringing Oliver back to the place where his Darkness was unleashed? Or maybe it's about proving that Oliver destorys everyone he touches by making his family kill to survive and unleash their darkness?

[Sunshine]

4 hours ago, tv echo said:

 

S2 did not end with a cliffhanger - OTA on Lian Yu after putting Slade Wilson in ARGUS prison.

Amanda Waller and Oliver in Hong Kong was the cliffhanger.  

[Morrigan2575]

34 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

Amanda Waller and Oliver in Hong Kong was the cliffhanger.  

Yeah, S2 ended on the Waller flashback not, the island.

Below is just my general thoughts not directed at anyone in particular. 

I don't see any of the season finales as cliffhangers.  Cliffhangers usually invoke character in peril or some shocking reveal.

Oliver "dying" in 309, Felicity being injured in 409 and Laurel showing up "alive" in 509 are all cliffhangers.

Edited April 5, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[LeighAn]

There's only been two shows that I've felt had truly successful and suspenseful cliff hangers:

LOST Jacks We have to go back Kate

Alias Sydney you've been dead five years.

I don't hold much hope about Arrows cliff hanger TBH.

[Buzzyspirit]

1 hour ago, statsgirl said:

This episode has more reunions than the 100th.

It's possible but if I were in the room, I'd tell them it's too risky.  It would turn off as many people as would be excited to see it. 

I like the idea of Quentin letting her out because she play son his loss of Laurel.  He had a rough enough time with losing Sara and she wasn't even the daughter he was closest to.

I still don't understand why Chase wants everyone close to Oliver on the island.

Or maybe this is not about what Chase wants but someone else's, like Slade/Deathstroke? Is it possible that Prometheus, Deathstroke and Talia could join forces in 523? Directly or indirectly Slade/ Deathstroke must have a hand (or an eye) in all of this since they are in the island... Another possibility - the new character who's leading Helix could be Slade's son aka the new season bad...

[wonderwall]

So far in the 100th episode the people who are returning are:

• Black Siren
• Deathstroke
• Yao Fei

Who else is coming back?

[LeighAn]

Wait Manu is coming back? Really?

[wonderwall]

4 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Wait Manu is coming back? Really?

IDK if it'll be Manu. But you can have deathstroke without Manu. Just put him in his outfit

[BkWurm1]

3 hours ago, wonderwall said:

So far in the 100th episode the people who are returning are:

• Black Siren
• Deathstroke
• Yao Fei

Who else is coming back?

Artemis 

Doubledown. 

Is Malcolm back as well?

[BunsenBurner]

I keep thinking about Anatoly being disgusted and a bit fearful of Oliver when he was practicing carving up the prisoner so he could get information. Why would Anatoly be that way? Isn't the Bratva supposed to be the baddest of the bad? Aren't they to be feared? Why would what he did be so bad? It just doesn't feel right to me and makes it seem like the Bratva is more a boys club then a scary group of bad guys.

Just to be clear I don't condone what he did but in context to being in the Bratva it looks to me like something they would do.

[Hiveminder]

3 minutes ago, BunsenBurner said:

I keep thinking about Anatoly being disgusted and a bit fearful of Oliver when he was practicing carving up the prisoner so he could get information. Why would Anatoly be that way? Isn't the Bratva supposed to be the baddest of the bad? Aren't they to be feared? Why would what he did be so bad? It just doesn't feel right to me and makes it seem like the Bratva is more a boys club then a scary group of bad guys.

Just to be clear I don't condone what he did but in context to being in the Bratva it looks to me like something they would do.

Well, there's a difference between killing people or beating them up and peeling the skin off a man while he's still alive. 

[bijoux]

So that line that MG gave (I'll see you on the boat.) is pretty much confirmation that the fisherman boat was set up to pick up Oliver. Only question that remains is who it was. Currently, my money is on Talia, just for the contrast to their current state of affairs.

[Velocity23]

wasnt Anatoly on Lian Yu with Oliver? 

[BkWurm1]

1 hour ago, Velocity23 said:

wasnt Anatoly on Lian Yu with Oliver? 

For a little while.  Originally he was a prisoner on the Amazo that rescued Sara.

[bijoux]

I think @Velocity23 is talking about an upcoming episode, in which both DN and DL were filming on the location they use for the island with SA. And yes, he was. It's either 520 or 521. Still a way off from the finale, which I'm guessing is when Oliver will be rescued. That's why I assumed the line was from a later episode, I doubt Anatoly will be sticking around for long. Although I do think it will be funny if that's when Anatoly says the line and then something goes wrong, so Oliver ends up cooling his heels for a few months and actually being rescued by a random passing boat.

[BkWurm1]

9 minutes ago, bijoux said:

I think @Velocity23 is talking about an upcoming episode, in which both DN and DL were filming on the location they use for the island with SA. And yes, he was. It's either 520 or 521. Still a way off from the finale, which I'm guessing is when Oliver will be rescued. That's why I assumed the line was from a later episode, I doubt Anatoly will be sticking around for long. Although I do think it will be funny if that's when Anatoly says the line and then something goes wrong, so Oliver ends up cooling his heels for a few months and actually being rescued by a random passing boat.

Oh, that makes more sense.  But you never know what people forget, lol.  

Edited April 6, 2017 by BkWurm1

[BkWurm1]

Just sharing my train of thought on something.    

So on Tumblr, MG confirmed that Oliver aka THE MAYOR is still living in the Bunker.  I know, that's completely absurd but setting that aside, it occurred to me to ask myself why didn't they give Oliver a new place to live?  

The big reason of course would be they didn't want to build a set if they could get away with not building it.  Again, it's absurd that he's supposedly lived at the Bunker during his whole term and apparently nightly shakes off his security detail and refused to even hand over his home address for city documents, but there it is.  That's the story they are selling.  

So then the next question becomes, WHY would they feel like they didn't need to build a set?  Or why did they feel they could get away with not giving him a new place to live?  No one can really expect Oliver to live the rest of his days down in the bunker, right? And yet that's where we currently are even though previously, Oliver has ALWAYS had where he lives as one of the regular sets.  

So IMO, the show runners deciding not to spend the money on a new set speaks to the bigger picture (more than just saving a buck)  Logically then, the conclusion I come to is that building a new apartment set for Oliver would be a waste of time since they still have the loft and thus they've must have always planned for Oliver to move back into the loft with Felicity.  :D

Not hard core proof of anything, but I like to think of it as another sign that a return to Olicity was always the plan.     

Edited April 6, 2017 by BkWurm1

[bijoux]

I just remembered, Anatoly's on the island with Oliver in 521. All of SA's scenes in 520 are with EBR.

12 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

 

So then the next question becomes, WHY would they feel like they didn't need to build a set?  Or why did they feel they could get away with not giving him a new place to live?  No one can really expect Oliver to live the rest of his days down in the bunker, right? And yet that's where we currently are even though previously, Oliver has ALWAYS had where he lives as one of the regular sets.    

He was living in the lair between the end of S2 and whenever he moved in with Thea in S3. Yet another retread.

[BkWurm1]

Quote

He was living in the lair between the end of S2 and whenever he moved in with Thea in S3. Yet another retread.

In my mind that still counts as the show having where he lived as a set. (That and the hotel room where he at least talked about getting a place) His time homeless then was a lot shorter than this time.  And in that case, the show runners decided they did need to address where he lived and built him the set to use with Thea.     

[Hiveminder]

They didn't even have to build a new set, just mention he has an apartment. 

[Guest]

MG confirmed that he loves the loft set and it will be back in s6. There goes my dream of it burning down. Sigh.

[ComicFan777]

Just saw that Nyssa hasn't released Oliver from their marriage yet...please don't revisit this topic...let's keep it dead and buried like the league.

Edited April 6, 2017 by ComicFan777

[bijoux]

1 hour ago, BkWurm1 said:

In my mind that still counts as the show having where he lived as a set. (That and the hotel room where he at least talked about getting a place) His time homeless then was a lot shorter than this time.  And in that case, the show runners decided they did need to address where he lived and built him the set to use with Thea.     

What hotel room? I'm going senile, I swear.

[tv echo]

20 hours ago, wonderwall said:

So far in the 100th episode the people who are returning are:

• Black Siren
• Deathstroke
• Yao Fei

Who else is coming back?

I believe that Yao Fei is returning in 522. SA told a fan at the last HVFF that a character was returning in 522 that we hadn't seen since S1.

Edited April 6, 2017 by tv echo

[apinknightmare]

10 minutes ago, bijoux said:

What hotel room? I'm going senile, I swear.

There was a scene with Oliver and Sara in S2 where Oliver mentioned the two of them getting a place together - his friend loaned him the hotel room because Roy was in a mirakuru coma in the lair and they couldn't stay there. 

[leopardprint]

Quote

66olicityotp43 asked:

Just to check: this exploration of why Olicity broke up doesn't paint Felicity as being in the wrong, right? Oliver was in the wrong. Also, are Oliver and Nyssa still married?

I think it takes two people to fight and two people to end a relationship.

And, yes, Oliver and Nyssa are still married.

Ok, My wariness about this conversation just cranked up to 11.

I'm wondering if the manner and degree of blame assigned Felicity will finally make me totally quit the show. 

Did Oliver explicitly apologize for lying to Felicity? He told her he would never lie again at the fake wedding but the show also presented the lie as the right thing to do. They took time to show him initiating talks with Digg and Vixen. They did not show him talking to Felicity OR Samantha. Oliver/Felicity never asked or talked about her father at any point. 

I could maybe buy Oliver saying he didn't feel he had the right to talk to her because she told him he couldn't change BUT they walked that back in the casino episode. So I'm guessing that the flashback is going to be Oliver's apology/talk about reconciliation with Felicity's rejection so the status of the relationship is now on her. This causes her to immediately start dating whatshisface as distraction and not tell Oliver because she doesn't want to hurt him. 

Reasons for Felicity to Apologize: A List

• She didn't talk to him (He never tried to talk to her)
• She walked out on him (He gave her time and then more time and then hey more time (20+ episodes of time))
• It wasn't her business/decision (How he treats his children/family is her business)
• She walked out on him, part 2 (She came back for Laurel/ stayed with him the whole time after)
• She's a pistachio? So you leave the pistachio alone to remove its shell itself? Shouldn't he know that about her by now? He knows she has abandonment issues.

BTW, I by no means think Felicity is perfect or anything, I just think taking space for herself (especially since she gets snarky/lashes out) was the right thing to do. Oliver probably feels like he's not worth fighting for and gave her too much time and space and didn't know how to walk it back.

I'm probably missing some but I will refrain from boring you guys further

Edited April 6, 2017 by leopardprint

[Midnight Lullaby]

Sure it took two people..one that did something shitty and the other that decided that behavior wasn't fine with her.

I'm hoping it's just MG being unable to admit that they screwed up with that SL or that Oliver will want to get back together in the FBs and Felicity will refuse.

[apinknightmare]

I'm not sure what to make of Marc's answer - generally speaking, it doesn't bother me. With this particular set of writers, it is a little worrisome. 

ETA: redacting what I wrote here because I rewatched and was incorrect - yikes! In order to get back together, Felicity has to vocalize that's no longer an issue for her and why - that can be done without assigning "fault." Whether this set of writers can do it? IDK.

Edited April 6, 2017 by apinknightmare

[finnaire]

6 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Just sharing my train of thought on something.    

So on Tumblr, MG confirmed that Oliver aka THE MAYOR is still living in the Bunker.  I know, that's completely absurd but setting that aside, it occurred to me to ask myself why didn't they give Oliver a new place to live?  

The big reason of course would be they didn't want to build a set if they could get away with not building it.  Again, it's absurd that he's supposedly lived at the Bunker during his whole term and apparently nightly shakes off his security detail and refused to even hand over his home address for city documents, but there it is.  That's the story they are selling.  

So then the next question becomes, WHY would they feel like they didn't need to build a set?  Or why did they feel they could get away with not giving him a new place to live?  No one can really expect Oliver to live the rest of his days down in the bunker, right? And yet that's where we currently are even though previously, Oliver has ALWAYS had where he lives as one of the regular sets.  

So IMO, the show runners deciding not to spend the money on a new set speaks to the bigger picture (more than just saving a buck)  Logically then, the conclusion I come to is that building a new apartment set for Oliver would be a waste of time since they still have the loft and thus they've must have always planned for Oliver to move back into the loft with Felicity.  :D

Not hard core proof of anything, but I like to think of it as another sign that a return to Olicity was always the plan.     

They bought the building so Felicity/Oliver/GA LLC owns it. Conceivably, there could be apartments/lofts with other people living there so when his bodymen (when did they stop being guards?) drop him off, it's not entirely strange. At the least, his campaign office is still there so he does have an address to fill out the government forms! 

Of course, I don't actually think the writers put that much time into backing up their narrative, they just luck in to certain things. Money, or lack thereof, is probably the simple answer. But, your theory is a good one too. Keep the faith.

Edited April 6, 2017 by finnaire

[apinknightmare]

3 minutes ago, finnaire said:

They bought the building so Felicity/Oliver/GA LLC owns it. Conceivably, there could be apartments/lofts with other people living there so when his bodymen (when did they stop being guards?) drop him off, it's not entirely strange. At the least, his campaign office is still there so he does have an address to fill out the government forms! 

They showed him living in a room in the actual lair earlier this season. IIRC Felicity said something about it, and he replied "I don't need much." I think we're to believe that he's still living on a cot in that room, not in an apartment somewhere above it.

Edited April 6, 2017 by apinknightmare

[tangerine95]

They've been treating the lie as wrong and as the reason why they broke up but they've also been justifying Oliver as much as they can so idk how far they'll go in 5. 20. If Felicity says something like she should have talked to him again instead of shutting him out and closing the door on their relationship so firmly then I can be okay with that being her part in the break up even tho I think its totally understandable she did that because she can't really talk to him like that if she doesn't even trust him. But if they go with Oliver was okay to lie and thinks he did the right thing, then I'll be pissed. I hope they don't do that because I don't think thats how they've been presenting it so far either. 

[thegirlsleuth]

The one bit of hope I have that they won't let Oliver off the hook is Stephen Amell's comments on how the reason that Oliver and Felicity broke up was that Oliver lied, and that Felicity was RIGHT to end things with him.  Since he usually takes the party line, it's my hope that this is the position that the writers are taking is well.  There is the Guggenheim factor, where he likes to take a plot that people object to and double down,  but I hope they don't.

[leopardprint]

23 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I don't think anyone should expect an apology for the lie - getting one would be aces, but even Felicity said she understood why he did it, and that wasn't the reason she broke up with him - it was him reverting to doing things alone and not allowing her to be a partner. In order to get back together, Felicity has to vocalize that's no longer an issue for her and why - that can be done without assigning "fault." Whether this set of writers can do it? IDK.

I agree that this is the reason they give but it doesn't wash with me because post-Laurel's death, she never left his side and other than one comment in 423, he's never acknowledged that or addressed that he wants her there as a partner. Maybe THAT'S what the conversation will be about, he'll thank her for being there and say he wants to be there for her too, post-Helix when she shut him out? Though this would be far better placed post Billy's death, she takes a break and he tells her he can't do this without her.

(I may be missing some stuff my show memory is like a sieve, or my brain is staging a mutiny against S5)

Edited April 6, 2017 by leopardprint