Spoiler Discussion Thread

[apinknightmare]

Chase not planning on being outed knocks him down a few pegs for me. How do you not plan for the most obvious thing? Surely he knows about Felicity's tech prowess - he went to the lengths to scramble his image but didn't anticipate the team finding a way around that? Yikes, villain! 

[statsgirl]

Vixen, who is Amaya's not-yet-born granddaughter, help saved William and then smashed to totem that gave DD his power. And then the idiot on Team Arrow put it back together so Andy could help DD regain his power.

If Chase didn't expect Oliver to out him, then he wasn't expecting that phone call that let him to kill the feds.  (He must have telepathic powers,)  So it appears that he is not connected to Helix and neither is Vigilante because Helix knows Oliver is the Green Arrow and the Vigilante doesn't.

[BkWurm1]

3 minutes ago, bijoux said:

It's a weird article. How does Amaya dying on LoT affect 415 of Arrow? In which the kid got kidnapped and rescued, and Felicity broke up with Oliver. I don't remember what, if anything else happened in that one. Well, Oliver dropped out of the mayoral race.

Mari, Amaya's Grandaughter is the one to save William.  If Amaya is dead, then sorry Will!

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, bijoux said:

It's a weird article. How does Amaya dying on LoT affect 415 of Arrow? In which the kid got kidnapped and rescued, and Felicity broke up with Oliver. I don't remember what, if anything else happened in that one. Well, Oliver dropped out of the mayoral race.

I imagine if Mari's not around to help with Darhk/convince Oliver that William is better off having a normal childhood without Oliver that would change things. 

[BkWurm1]

1 minute ago, statsgirl said:

f Chase didn't expect Oliver to out him, then he wasn't expecting that phone call that let him to kill the feds.  (He must have telepathic powers,) 

I think it's reasonable that Chase picked up on a change of body language and tone of voice.   I also would say he was probably always ready for the possibility of being exposed.  Contingency planner, he seems to be IMO

[bijoux]

Thanks, guys. I forgot it was Mari who saved him. In fact, it still doesn't ring bells, but I'll take your word for it.

[statsgirl]

7 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I imagine if Mari's not around to help with Darhk/convince Oliver that William is better off having a normal childhood without Oliver that would change things. 

You mean we could have had William around all the time?  Quick, someone save Amaya!

[BkWurm1]

5 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I imagine if Mari's not around to help with Darhk/convince Oliver that William is better off having a normal childhood without Oliver that would change things. 

Good point.  Mari's comments about getting to grow up without the dangers and complications of her mother's life seems to be what convinced Oliver to send William away.  Though why Mari ever gave that advice puzzles me since she seemed in the animated episode to be decidedly unhappy with growing up in foster care even if she loved her foster parents.  

Edited April 4, 2017 by BkWurm1

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, BkWurm1 said:

I think it's reasonable that Chase picked up on a change of body language and tone of voice.   I also would say he was probably always ready for the possibility of being exposed.  Contingency planner, he seems to be IMO

The agents didn't say anything though, did they? One just showed the other the text? He seemed poised to kill them the second he heard the text notification, before he even turned around, haha. 

[insomniadreams88]

2 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

The agents didn't say anything though, did they? One just showed the other the text? He seemed poised to kill them the second he heard the text notification, before he even turned around, haha. 

I think they just wanted that scene to be "cool" - look, the agents get a text, Chase knows he's been outed, so he kills them, one with a pen repeatedly, while his shoulder bleeds through his shirt and he doesn't even care, then he drives all bloody past the cops heading where he was.

But it is odd that he didn't plan on Felicity and Helix outing him. Yes, that does seem to suggest that he can't be behind Helix, but I'm sure if they want him to be, they'll come up with some reason why it still works. 

[tv echo]

FYI, here's the EW recap of 415. Personally, I've blocked that episode from my memory.

Anyway, it's just wild speculation. Most likely, Amaya will be saved in the LoT finale and nothing will be changed about 415. 

[BkWurm1]

7 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

The agents didn't say anything though, did they? One just showed the other the text? He seemed poised to kill them the second he heard the text notification, before he even turned around, haha. 

For all we know they changed their behavior compared to how they'd reacted previously to getting texts or even that they got a text rather than a call may have been enough of a deviation to alert Chase.  Or he'd been ready to pull out the knife every time they got a text or call and this time he went through with killing them cause of a glint in the agent's eye or maybe Chase just plain got lucky in his guess and had just gone unhinged at the right time, lol.  

I will say from personal experience, there have been several times in my life when I've totally known what a call or a text was going to be about without there really being any discernible explanation why I was so sure ahead of time.  So I'm good with him sensing what the text was about without us seeing any specific clues WHY he'd know.  The subconscious is a powerful tool.    

[leopardprint]

He wanted to and he liked it!

Edited April 4, 2017 by leopardprint

[apinknightmare]

11 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

So I'm good with him sensing what the text was about without us seeing any specific clues WHY he'd know.  The subconscious is a powerful tool.

I'm good with that too. I was just responding to a change in body language or any other sort of visual clue because Chase didn't look at them before he attacked, that's all. 

[leopardprint]

I hope that's a throwaway comment just to Vixen's presence because they need to leave 415 alone and not make it worse than it already is. 

I'm actually glad that Chase wasn't expecting Felicity, I was concerned they would make the Helix storyline about Oliver just like Billy. I don't want them to show Felicity being duped and if they do end up unambiguously evil then I want her to have used them with eyes wide open. Chase shouldn't know Felicity is working with them because Evelyn left before that, I think.

 

Quote

“This is definitely an examination of the state of their breakup,” the EP reiterates. “It comes out of the events of 519 [titled ‘Dangerous Liaisons’ aka ‘Team Arrow vs. Team Felicity’] and, quite frankly, all the other episodes that led up to it. Something happens in 519 [airing Wednesday, April 26] that really tees up this conversation.”

Do you think he means the catalyst is hiding things in general or specifically something about William? I still say it would make sense for Felicity to be keeping tabs on William or perhaps Helix has their location. 

Edited April 4, 2017 by leopardprint

[Velocity23]

So we probably getting a sizzle reel

[bijoux]

[Morrigan2575]

43 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

The agents didn't say anything though, did they? One just showed the other the text? He seemed poised to kill them the second he heard the text notification, before he even turned around, haha. 

I'm working under the assumption that it was the lack of talking or typing after receiving the text that clued him in. 

[leopardprint]

20 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

So we probably getting a sizzle reel

Yay, let the wild speculation commence! 

Edited April 4, 2017 by leopardprint

[BkWurm1]

Oh there is sure to be a sexy shot.  :D

[SmallScreenDiva]

Someone RT'd the Season 3 sizzle reel recently and I realized I'd forgotten half of what was in it (including a shot of Laurel that was cut from 320). All I could remember really were the very quick clips of the love scene, LOL! The shot where Oliver was taking off Felicity's glasses was a different shot from what was in the ep (it was from farther away in the teaser). Anyway, I need this sizzle reel soon. And it better damn sizzle!

[Guest]

Ah, the s3 sizzle reel. Happy days. I didn't get online until a couple of hours after it had dropped and everyone was in meltdown mode. That day was so much fun. I miss fandom being like that.

[Cleanqueen]

I'll never forget them deleting that Laurel scene from 3x20. Pretty epic in my book.

I need this sizzle reel to include a lot of kissing.

[Velocity23]

I am glad they deleted that 3x20 Oliver and Laurel scene. What a disaster. 

[wonderwall]

IIRC fandom was very much like how it was now before the sizzle reel dropped. It's quite funny looking back because people were hopeless/resigned into thinking it won't happened and angry about Rat Palmer and Felicity not having a PoV etc. much like this year.

And then the sizzle reel dropped and people were happy again. 

I expect the same to happen in the next couple of weeks haha

5 minutes ago, Cleanqueen said:

I'll never forget them deleting that Laurel scene from 3x20. Pretty epic in my book.

I need this sizzle reel to include a lot of kissing.

I still laugh at how MG said that not all clips in the sizzle reel made it to the final cut and people thought it was the part where Felicity took her bra off - instead it was the Laurel scene LMAO

It's stuff like this that makes me not feel worried about her having that much of a presence next season.

[Cleanqueen]

7 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

I am glad they deleted that 3x20 Oliver and Laurel scene. What a disaster. 

the acting was atrocious but then again that was always every Laurel/Oliver scene.

[Primal Slayer]

ah good times. The writers/Oliver leaving and lying to Laurel to keep her on the outside this late in the game was so stupid.

[apinknightmare]

Just now, Primal Slayer said:

ah good times. The writers/Oliver leaving and lying to Laurel to keep her on the outside this late in the game was so stupid.

But totally in character for him and them, sadly.

[wonderwall]

He was right to keep her in the dark considering the bullshit pulled in 4A. 

[Primal Slayer]

Meh, at that moment in time, Laurel wouldve been fine knowing. The whole 4A plot was dumb as hell. Laurel had accepted and moved on from Sara's death. The writers didnt have to set up Legends so she wouldnt have gotten any ideas about Sara or actually following through with it. It is still such a good storyline they missed out on though, having Damien be the one to bring Sara back to hold over Quentins head.

[Cleanqueen]

But then what would have Laurel's purpose been in season 4 before she died?

[leopardprint]

25 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

IIRC fandom was very much like how it was now before the sizzle reel dropped. It's quite funny looking back because people were hopeless/resigned into thinking it won't happened and angry about Rat Palmer and Felicity not having a PoV etc. much like this year.

And then the sizzle reel dropped and people were happy again. 

I expect the same to happen in the next couple of weeks haha

Speaking for myself, I watched all of S3 and have not watched all of S5. I would have finished S3 without the sizzle reel which I can't remember if I even saw. I'm at a case by case basis with the episodes which kind of points to how terrible they are at writing an overall season. Even though I have liked the last two episodes, I have no desire to watch the ones I've missed nor do I feel like I need to to get the storyline. They pretty much exhausted any patience and goodwill I had left with 4b. 

ETA: I'm glad if people are excited though! There are definitely certain aspects I'm looking forward to see how they are handled.

Edited April 4, 2017 by leopardprint

[wonderwall]

10 minutes ago, Cleanqueen said:

But then what would have Laurel's purpose been in season 4 before she died?

As always... Nothing. Lol

Seriously Laurel hasn't done much throughout the series except for a few things:

• Suss Blood out
• Be a big reason Tommy died - for papers for a law firm that she never even went back to
• Bringing back Sara
• She helped a couple of times here and there before she put on the mask
• Throw Oliver a baton to help break the glass to free Felicity/Digg/Thea

What a waste. 

Edited April 4, 2017 by wonderwall

[Primal Slayer]

4 minutes ago, Cleanqueen said:

But then what would have Laurel's purpose been in season 4 before she died?

Saving her sister would've been plenty of purpose, her father being forced to work with the big bad is plenty of purpose. Plus there was a whole subplot they missed out on, Laurel was being followed which never went anywhere. That could've let them get more intel on Darhk. Plus she was in

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, Primal Slayer said:

Saving her sister would've been plenty of purpose, her father being forced to work with the big bad is plenty of purpose. Plus there was a whole subplot they missed out on, Laurel was being followed which never went anywhere. That could've let them get more intel on Darhk. Plus she was in

That would've required them actually caring about Laurel though.

[Velocity23]

Just now, Primal Slayer said:

Saving her sister would've been plenty of purpose, her father being forced to work with the big bad is plenty of purpose. Plus there was a whole subplot they missed out on, Laurel was being followed which never went anywhere. That could've let them get more intel on Darhk. Plus she was in

Why do the Lance family deserve to have people brought back? Everybody else had to deal with loss. If Sara was being brought back one of the Lances had to go. Its obvious the show decided that LL was expendable.

LL forced her way into the team. And made even more obvious with her speech to Oliver in 4x05. 

[tv echo]

What if no one gets kidnapped in 522? Here's speculation about what might draw team members to Lian Yu without Oliver...

In 521, William finds out that Oliver is his father and/or GA, so Oliver goes to visit William in 522 (visit not shown on screen). While he's away, Felicity gets a lead on Chase's whereabouts through Helix that indicates he might be on Lian Yu. She talks to Diggle and they decide to go to Lian Yu without Oliver just to check it out. Thea and Quentin happen to be visiting the Arrow Bunker and insist on going with them as backup. Diggle tells Curtis, Wild Dog and Tinah to stay behind to protect Star City and let Oliver know. When Diggle, Felicity, Thea and Quentin get to Lian Yu, they discover ARGUS prison has been broken open and its prisoners are loose.  522 ends with a cliffhanger - the four of them facing Chase, Black Siren and Artemis, plus some past villains.

Alternatively - while Oliver's away visiting William, Felicity finds out that Black Siren has escaped and might be on Lian Yu. She talks to Diggle and they decide to go to Lian Yu without Oliver (but with the sonic dampener). Thea and Quentin happen to be visiting the Arrow Bunker and insist on going with them, Thea as backup and Quentin to see this alt-Laurel. Diggle tells Curtis, Wild Dog and Tinah to stay behind to protect Star City and let Oliver know. When Diggle, Felicity, Thea and Quentin get to Lian Yu, they discover ARGUS prison has been broken open and its prisoners are loose.  522 ends with a cliffhanger - the four of them facing Chase, Black Siren and Artemis, plus some past villains.

Edited April 4, 2017 by tv echo

[leopardprint]

13 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

 

15 minutes ago, Cleanqueen said:

But then what would have Laurel's purpose been in season 4 before she died?

As always... Nothing. Lol

Seriously Laurel hasn't done much throughout the series except for a few things:

• Suss Blood out
• Be a big reason Tommy died - for papers for a law firm that she never even went back to
• Bringing back Laurel
• She helped a couple of times here and there before she put on the mask
• Throw Oliver a baton to help break the glass to free Felicity/Digg/Thea

What a waste. 

 

The papers! Will never understand why they didn't have her go back to save a coworker or something! 

I also don't understand why if they knew they were making The Flash they didn't send Laurel to Central City to get turned into a meta human, then it would make sense to add her to the team. She's always been treated like an afterthought which doesn't bode well for Black Siren. 

 

4 minutes ago, tv echo said:

What if no one gets kidnapped in 522? Here's speculation about what might draw team members to Lian Yu without Oliver...

In 521, Williams finds out that Oliver is his father and/or GA, so Oliver goes to visit William in 522 (visit not shown on screen). While he's away, Felicity gets a lead on Chase's whereabouts through Helix that indicates he might be on Lian Yu. She talks to Diggle and they decide to go to Lian Yu without Oliver just to check it out. Thea and Quentin happen to be visiting the Arrow Bunker and insist on going with them as backup. Diggle tells Curtis, Wild Dog and Tinah to stay behind to protect Star City and let Oliver know. When Diggle, Felicity, Thea and Quentin get to Lian Yu, they discover ARGUS prison has been broken open and its prisoners are loose.  522 ends with a cliffhanger - the four of them facing Chase, Black Siren and Artemis, plus some past villains.

Hmm, interesting, maybe the visit comes from whatever the conversation from 520 is? Oliver is totally dumb enough to visit his son while Chase is threatening him. 

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, leopardprint said:

Oliver is totally dumb enough to visit his son while Chase is threatening him. 

I don't think it much matters at this point - Adrian knows about him and made it clear he could find him (if he hadn't already - not sure where the show intended to land with that one).

[leopardprint]

5 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

7 minutes ago, leopardprint said:

 

I don't think it much matters at this point - Adrian knows about him and made it clear he could find him (if he hadn't already - not sure where the show intended to land with that one).

True, and maybe Oliver is going to ask Felicity to find him in 519 or Lyla to get them Argus protection? She's in 519, right? I think Chase said "it was a matter of time" before he finds them so I think he is supposed to be actively looking for them (which makes it crazier Oliver didn't bring it up). 

Edited April 4, 2017 by leopardprint

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, leopardprint said:

True, and maybe Oliver is going to ask Felicity to find him in 519 or Lyla to get them Argus protection? She's in 519, right? I think Chase said "it was a matter of time" before he finds them so I think he is supposed to be actively looking for them (which makes it crazier Oliver didn't bring it up). 

I thought Chase made some kind of snide reply about bothering to look (or something along those lines) when Oliver said that he didn't know where William was?

But yeah - he's being plot dumb about the threats to William and Felicity.

[Sunshine]

Someone is going missing in 5.22 even if it's the villains.  

Is Felicity still using Helix in 5.22? Isn't 5.19 (maybe even 5.20) about getting her out of Helix ?

[way2interested]

I would have thought that any kid mention in 519 and/or 520 would get resolved in 521 (with any visit/call/whatever happening just then).

[leopardprint]

Quote

"She didn't even know I was in her apartment."

"Oh, I swear to God, if you hurt her..."

"You'll do absolutely nothing because you're here. You see, until you confess your secret, Oliver, everyone that you love is at play, even your son."

Oliver: You're bluffing. He--he's in hiding. I--I-- I don't even know where he is.

'Cause you haven't really looked. But for me, we both know it's just a matter of time. Confess.

This is the scene transcript but it may not be accurate.

Edited April 4, 2017 by leopardprint

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, leopardprint said:

This is the scene but it may not be accurate.

Ah, okay. Thank you!

[SmallScreenDiva]

Is William being part of the final episodes a spoiler or speculation based on Chase mentioning him in "Kapushion"? (I really don't want to see that kid ever again) 

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Is William being part of the final episodes a spoiler or speculation based on Chase mentioning him in "Kapushion"? (I really don't want to see that kid ever again) 

It's spec based on SA saying that William is going to find out that Oliver's his dad and the Green Arrow sooner rather than later.

Edited April 4, 2017 by apinknightmare

[SmallScreenDiva]

8 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

It's spec based on SA saying that William is going to find out that Oliver's his dad and the Green Arrow sooner rather than later.

Ahh, thanks. 

[Midnight Lullaby]

Did Oliver say he is the GA in the video he recorded for him? I can't remember. I think he should know who is dad is but telling a ten years old that acts like a five years old a secret that could land Oliver and the whole team in jail or put them all on the criminals' radar seems a bit risky to me. Kids on shows like this one is too messy for me.

[ComicFan777]

If Oliver goes to find the kid after Chase mentions him, it feels like he's playing into Chase's hands.  If Chase hasn't been able to find him up until this point, it could be Felicity has been erasing William's trail, then he could be waiting for Oliver to lead him to him.