Jump to content

Type keyword(s) to search

Spoiler Discussion Thread


Morrigan2575
  • Start Topic

Recommended Posts

I'm with you. After the disaster of the second half of s2 they really have to tread lightly in this next season.

The phrase Fan Pandering has started to annoy me.

 

Me too. Because it's usually used in reference to Oliver and Felicity or just Felicity by comics purists to explain away things they don't like.

  • Love 4
Link to comment

I suspect that Laurel will be front and center, right next to Oliver/Arrow, in the Season 3 cast poster.

 

 

Don't you think the marketing people are smarter than that? There's a reason she was all the way in the back in the S2 poster. Not that I think she'll be in the shadows again, but I don't know...I think they're aware they have to tread lightly with her.

 

When do cast posters usually come out?

Link to comment

If Laurel has her "hero training " during the season, then Thea ,who has already trained for 5-6 months with Merlyn, should be able to kick Laurel's ass anytime and anywhere. This is hardly the way to turn Laurel into Black Canary. and besides, she will be the DA who will be short on time. I think this indicates that the EPs are taking the route of changing laurel into Manhunter.

  • Love 1
Link to comment

I'm sure Laurel's going to be big this season. Just because the viewers have no empathy with the character, doesn't mean the EPs are done with her. And just because they aren't talking about Laurel, doesn't mean they're going to stay mum forever.

I think the EPs know that the 2nd half (barring the last 3 episodes) didn't sit well with most viewers and some of them are debating whether to keep on watching Arrow or not. So what do they do: they dangle the Oliver/Felicity date in front of us while plotting to shove Laurel down our throats.

I mean SA shot his first few scenes with KC. As they stood by the road, what do you think they were talking about? There is no criminal to discuss in ep. 1, they weren't fighting or arguing, there was no resentment or lingering animosity that was apparent to me. Ergo the EPs are up to something.

Not to sound too pessimistic...but the Laurel obsession is not just going to die. They gave her the JACKET. Oliver tells Felicity the whole Because of the life I lead...' nonsense and what does he say to Laurel: 'I thought about telling you EVERY NIGHT'.

Why the heck was he thinking about her at night? Irrelevant question. Point being...the importance of Laurel has not ended for the EPs and therefore it couldn't have ended for Oliver either. I just hope that the significance of Felicity in his life trumps that of Laurel.

I also hope that if and when they decide to make Laurel BC (This will happen sooner or later so I'm just resigned to it now) they do it in a believable way that makes us like her a bit and not hate her completely.

  • Love 3
Link to comment
(edited)

They went from season 1 Laurel, Tommy, Thea and Diggle important to season 2 Laurel in the back and Felicity and Diggle important.

 

If that is any indication, the marketing team know what's up concerning the poster.

 

Yes I don't think Laurel is going anywhere. Before I could ignore her because she didn't have much to do with the storyline or plot but now she's in the know, she'll be around more. If Laurel is placed into a position of importance, i.e. right next to Oliver in the poster, I would say that's a good indicator of the amount of screen time she'll get.

 

For reasons unknown the writers and EPs want Laurel to be an important part of Oliver's life. We'll see how they handle it. I just really hope they don't tank the ship called Arrow by doing whatever they feel instead of whatever makes sense to the story.

Edited by ArrowLimbo
  • Love 1
Link to comment
I mean SA shot his first few scenes with KC. As they stood by the road, what do you think they were talking about? There is no criminal to discuss in ep. 1, they weren't fighting or arguing, there was no resentment or lingering animosity that was apparent to me. Ergo the EPs are up to something.

 

They were there to support Captain Lance giving a Press Conference (Candagraphs blog write up).  My guess would be that the Press Conference is Lance officially announcing the ending of the Anti-Vigilante task force...which was mentioned in the S3 PR from the CW Website.

Link to comment
(edited)

I'm sure Laurel's going to be big this season. Just because the viewers have no empathy with the character, doesn't mean the EPs are done with her. And just because they aren't talking about Laurel, doesn't mean they're going to stay mum forever.

I think the EPs know that the 2nd half (barring the last 3 episodes) didn't sit well with most viewers and some of them are debating whether to keep on watching Arrow or not. So what do they do: they dangle the Oliver/Felicity date in front of us while plotting to shove Laurel down our throats.

I mean SA shot his first few scenes with KC. As they stood by the road, what do you think they were talking about? There is no criminal to discuss in ep. 1, they weren't fighting or arguing, there was no resentment or lingering animosity that was apparent to me. Ergo the EPs are up to something.

Not to sound too pessimistic...but the Laurel obsession is not just going to die. They gave her the JACKET. Oliver tells Felicity the whole Because of the life I lead...' nonsense and what does he say to Laurel: 'I thought about telling you EVERY NIGHT'.

Why the heck was he thinking about her at night? Irrelevant question. Point being...the importance of Laurel has not ended for the EPs and therefore it couldn't have ended for Oliver either. I just hope that the significance of Felicity in his life trumps that of Laurel.

I also hope that if and when they decide to make Laurel BC (This will happen sooner or later so I'm just resigned to it now) they do it in a believable way that makes us like her a bit and not hate her completely.

 

Marketing and the actual show product are different, and what one does isn't always indicative of what's happening in the other. All I'm saying is that I don't know that she's going to be front and center next to Oliver on a cast poster.

 

As far as what she and Oliver are talking about during the press conference? It's exposition, I bet. If he's catching criminals and she's putting them away, it'll probably be a nice little summary of how crime has dropped and the city became more peaceful over the last few months. (ETA: and like @Morrigan2575 wrote above, an announcement that the anti-vigilante task force has been disbanded). They're probably going to use that talk to give a status update on Lance and the state of the city.

 

Yeah, they gave Laurel the jacket. And then, the very first episode of the next season, they took it back. Don't know what it means, but I'm not going to obsess over it. I think we all need to accept the fact that this show is going to continue to sell Oliver and Laurel as being "close" whether that's in a romantic capacity or not, and I agree that she's not going to go away. But thinking about telling her "every night" is hyperbole on Oliver's part. I buy that Oliver might have wanted to tell her his secret often. It would've made his life a hell of a lot easier. But Oliver wanting Laurel to know his secret and telling Felicity he doesn't think he should get involved in a serious romantic relationship don't really have anything to do with each other?

Edited by apinknightmare
Link to comment

I'm trying to be hopeful that whatever they set up and planned at the end of S2 changed during the break when they saw fan response. Laurel becoming Manhunter is the perfect compromise. She still gets to be a superhero and they don't piss off the Sara fans. It's also a much more realistic path for her.

Link to comment
(edited)

 

I think the EPs know that the 2nd half (barring the last 3 episodes) didn't sit well with most viewers and some of them are debating whether to keep on watching Arrow or not.

 

What are you talking about? Do you have a poll or stg.

 

Here is the IMDB rating of the episodes up to episode 20. I would think the second half of the season had a more stellar performance in comparison to the first half of the season. And the approximate average people having rated these episodes is around 1500, which is good enough I think.

 

Name Rating

1 City of Heroes 8.9

2 Identity 8.7

3 Broken Dolls 8.9

4 Crucible 8.9

5 League of assasins 8.9

6 Keep your enemies Closer  8.5

7 State vs Queen 8.6

8 The Scientist 9

9 Three Ghosts 9.4

10 Blast radius  8.5

11 Blind Spot 8.9

12 Tremors 8.9

13 Heir to the Demon 8.9

14 Time of Death  8.9

15 The Promise 9.2

16 Suicide squad 8.7

17 Birds of Prey  8.5

18 Deathstroke 9.4

19 The Man under the Hood 9.1

20 Seeing Red 9.6

Edited by abhi
Link to comment
(edited)

That. Is. Shocking.

 

To me anyway. In particular the first 9 episodes which I thought were the bomb dot com. I wonder if the EPs look at IMDB.

Edited by ArrowLimbo
Link to comment

TV Guide interview with AK 

 

Just give me Felicitys backstory. Jesus. x.x 

 

http://www.tvguide.com/News/Arrow-Season3-Andrew-Kreisberg-1084620.aspx

 

Well, at least he did mention her with regards to flashbacks.

 

So, Tommy and Oliver just miss each other in Hong Kong.

 

Laurel's getting a love interest.

 

Sara's back for 3 eps and hopefully more

 

Digg and Oliver are going to have disagreements over how Digg handles missions now that he's a father.

 

I'm kind of excited? Cautiously excited.

  • Love 1
Link to comment
Sara (Caity Lotz) passed on her Canary jacket to Laurel (Katie Cassidy). Is that a mantle she'll take up fairly quickly and what will her relationship with Oliver look like this season?

Kreisberg: As always with all of these things, you can't just put on a mask and go running around. You'll get killed. Laurel is still just an attorney. She's an attorney with a jacket. I think Katie Cassidy fans are going to be very, very excited about her trajectory this year. Laurel is going to have a new love interest this season.

 

They're not even pretending anymore, they know that Laurel fans aren't Arrow fans or even really fans of Laurel, Black Canary or Green Arrow comics...Laurel fans are Katie Cassidy fans LOL.  Shit he's not even pretending that what they're going to do with Laurel means the rest of fandom will like her...just the KC fans...hahah

  • Love 8
Link to comment

Just that they only ever talk about Felicity as a LI. I truly dislike that. She deserves more than that. 

 

Oh, I completely agree. I want to know more about her. I can honestly say I wouldn't still be watching this show if she wasn't on it.

Link to comment
Just that they only ever talk about Felicity as a LI. I truly dislike that. She deserves more than that.

 

Not to defend AK or any of the producers but you have to look at the answers in terms of the questions asked. I'm still reserving judgement until we Matt M's article comes out where he was going to ask specifically about Felicity backstory.  If they turn that into talks about LI or Oliver then I'll be annoyed.

Link to comment
They're not even pretending anymore, they know that Laurel fans aren't Arrow fans or even really fans of Laurel, Black Canary or Green Arrow comics...Laurel fans are Katie Cassidy fans LOL.

 

A bit of a exaggeration, I think. 

 

I've always wanted a flashback with Tommy in it, so I'm thrilled about this. 

Link to comment
(edited)

I love how AK said that KC fans are going to be excited, not LAUREL fans. I'm pretty sure this is a nod towards Laurel not becoming BC.

 

ALso 99% sure that Sara isn't dying because he said that he would LOVE for CL to be in more future episodes. HALLELUJAH MY FAITH HAS BEEN RESTORED (pls just let me be optimistic :p).

Edited by wonderwall
  • Love 3
Link to comment

This is interesting:

 

What path is Thea on after leaving town with Malcolm (John Barrowman)?
Kreisberg: We always say that if you're ever going to become who you are in the comics, you have to go to the island. Oliver literally went to the island. We always said last year was Roy's trip to the island. This season is about Thea's trip to her version of the island.

 

I thought last year was Laurel's trip to the island?

  • Love 4
Link to comment
(edited)

I love how AK said that KC fans are going to be excited, not LAUREL fans. I'm pretty sure this is a nod towards Laurel not becoming BC. Also, I'm pretty sure that Ray will be Laurel's love interest, not Felicity's. I'm sorta happy about this because I never really wanted Felicity to have a love interest because I want this season to be solely about her and not her drama with Oliver/Ray. This helps put more focus on her character development instead of her relationships. 

 

ALso 99% sure that Sara isn't dying because he said that he would LOVE for CL to be in more future episodes. HALLELUJAH MY FAITH HAS BEEN RESTORED (pls just let me be optimistic :p).

 

Felicity's getting a LI, it says so in the article. And based on the answer about Ray, it's definitely him.

 

ETA: Guessing that Laurel's LI will be Ted GRANT (wrong name posted originally, I've got work on my mind).

Edited by apinknightmare
Link to comment
(edited)
Laurel's LI will probably be Ted Stevens.

 

Dinah's first husband?  

 

ETA: Nope looked it up, Craig Windrow was Dinah Lance's first husband...who is Ted Stevens? My Google-Fu has failed me...unless you're talking about the Real Life Ted Stevens.

Edited by Morrigan2575
Link to comment
(edited)

The new spoilers are interesting.  Even though AK says that both Felicity and Laurel are getting new love interests, you just know that by the end of Season 3, it'll all come back to Oliver in some way - like Oliver realizes which gal pal getting a love interest disturbs him more (in other words, who he loves more).  And AK's enthusiasm about getting Brandon Routh on the show (as the "gamechanger") makes me think that his character, Ray Palmer, may stick around past Season 3, which maybe means he'll stay Felicity's love interest for the forseeable future.  It's also possible that Laurel's new love interest gets killed at the end of Season 3, providing impetus for Laurel's journey toward becoming Black Canary (if the EPs haven't given up on that).

 

Otherwise, why not get rid of Laurel altogether?  She doesn't add anything to the show.  If Oliver needs an ally in the D.A.'s office, he isn't going to need one every week.  Just introduce a new, recurring character who's a good lawyer with integrity (someone who didn't have to use blackmail to get his job).  You could kill off that character at the end of Season 3 in a tragic Whedonesque move.  Maybe make that a thing - like every season, Oliver gets a new ally in the D.A.'s office who gets killed off.

 

Again a mention of Joss Whedon, which is ominous.  JW is infamous for not letting his characters be happy.  I guess the ultimate prize for all comic book-loving TV producers now is to end up being in charge of overseeing a superhero movie universe.

Edited by tv echo
  • Love 1
Link to comment
(edited)

Ted Grant is a great guess.  If Grant is Laurel's new love interest, then I guess the EPs haven't given up on Laurel becoming Black Canary since as others have previously mentioned, in the comics, Ted Grant is Wildcat, a mentor who trained the second Black Canary.  He was present at the original Black Canary's death and vowed to look after her daughter.

Edited by Lisin
Don't need spoiler tags in the spoiler topic
Link to comment

Ted Grant is a great guess.  If Grant is Laurel's new love interest, then I guess the EPs haven't given up on Laurel becoming Black Canary since as others have previously mentioned, Ted Grant is Wildcat, a mentor who trained the second Black Canary.  He was present at the original Black Canary's death and vowed to look after her daughter.

 

Oh, it's totally a guess, I wasn't trying to imply otherwise.

Link to comment

Ted Grant is a great guess. If Grant is Laurel's new love interest, then I guess the EPs haven't given up on Laurel becoming Black Canary since as others have previously mentioned, Ted Grant is Wildcat, a mentor who trained the second Black Canary. He was present at the original Black Canary's death and vowed to look after her daughter.

Ugh! I was happy. Thanks for stomping on my kitten!

Link to comment
(edited)

Oh, it's totally a guess, I wasn't trying to imply otherwise.

Yes, but you picked up on the boxing ring clue and made the connection to Ted Grant.

 

If true, would it be too wild if both new love interests (Ray Palmer, Ted Grant) turned into costumed superheroes?

Edited by tv echo
Link to comment

Yes, but you picked up on the boxing ring clue and made the connection to Ted Grant.

 

If true, would it be too wild if both new love interests (Ray Palmer, Ted Grant) turned into costumed superheroes?

 

I went back and edited my original post to clarify that it is a guess. It's just the interview with the mention of Laurel POSSIBLY getting her "hero training" the boxing ring and such, I wouldn't be surprised if it was him.

 

Arrow is big on origins, so would both of them have to be their superhero counterparts while on this show? I agree though, it would be too wild.

Link to comment

If they announce Ted Grant for Laurel then I am out, because that means they going full steam ahead with Laurel for BC. I just wish they'd own up to it. These vague answers and teases while keeping the talking going over the summer is not going to end up helping the show or Cassidy when the show starts. 

 

What is also hilarious besides the Cassidy fans instead of Laurel fans is with all the workout pics Cassidy keeps posting, they bring up Caity Lotz's skills in a question that didn't even ask about it. So I really wonder if they are going to continue showing Laurel being just a love interest while showing Sara being a badass. 

  • Love 4
Link to comment
(edited)

I am not crazy :) And those KC and Lauriver stans are actually planning a trend. All 10 of them i guess. They want new writers because they played KC and DC comis very dirty.

But i would love the Laurel thread to be renamed into : Lawyer with a jacket xD 

Hope they give some clues at TCAs

Edited by Velocity23
Link to comment
(edited)

Yeah, I saw some freak outs on Twitter. Don't tell them the Ted Grant speculation! I

 

I wish I hadn't posted that, because it's based on nothing really. I need my own island flashback to delete, delete.

Edited by apinknightmare
Link to comment
(edited)

I'm still waiting for TVLine's version....hopefully Matt Mitovich got to talk to someone other than Kreisberg so we can compare stories. :)

However, some interesting stuff here. A glaring lack of anything substantial Felicity related (hopefully Matt makes up for this).

1. AK says a seven-eight months time jump. That's a little odd - there's only five months between finale and premiere. Maybe he misspoke, or maybe it'll be made up later. Assuming he did not misspeak, however, that changes the timeline for Lyla's pregnancy considerably. She'd be just about to have the baby when the season starts (how far along was she in the finale?).

2. Laurel is getting a new love interest! Hopefully they chemistry tested this one. Ted Grant is an interesting guess - that would be an interesting way to work that in. I kinda thought they might do this though since there was a quote from Colton Haynes awhile back saying everyone gets new love interests this season (hopefully that does not include Diggle, 'cause Lyla and baby).

3. Laurel is not going to be Black Canary right away. She's still just an attorney - I'm assuming she'll be the DA. And interestingly enough no promises on the Black Canary front. Maybe this is not as much of a done deal as many of us assumed. I don't know. Since last years finale, I've been ruthlessly trying to crush any optimism on my part about the show, but....for the first time I'm kind of feeling hopeful.

4. Colin Donnell back for flashback! Awesome. Although I think this episode is going to make me hurt.

5. Flashbacks - this is interesting.

and then this one is a flashback to any one of the other characters, whether it's Sara, Dig (David Ramsey) or Felicity or Laurel

Felicity is the only he mentioned there that we haven't yet seen flashbacks for on the show, so...maybe we have at least one episode coming up with Felicity flashbacks. Yay. :)

6. Caity Lotz booked for three episodes and hopefully more....yay. But, ok, still not a regular? What? But I think I can calm down now about her dying. It's still possible that she could just appear in flashbacks - he did point out that "even when you die in the present day, you can still be alive in the flashbacks. " But since she's not in Oliver's flashbacks anymore, I think it's less likely....although she could be in Laurel's flashbacks. Still, with Laurel still apparently quite a ways away from Black Canary, I think/hope I can relax a bit about Sara dying right away.

7. Looks like lots of Diggle in the early episodes. I'm not sure what to think about the thing about conflict between Oliver and Diggle about Diggle being a father. Why would that bother Oliver? Maybe I'm not thinking about it right.

8. Last year was Roy's trip to the island. Ah. Ok. Except he doesn't remember any of it. Whatever. This year is Thea's trip to the island. Hopefully her storyline fares better than Roy's did last year.

Edited by Starfish35
  • Love 2
Link to comment
(edited)

The CW's DC Comics properties: "We occasionally speak to the studio... it's the studio's call, we've had no further discussions whether Arrow or Flash will appear in any of these movies... You will see organically, characters shifting over, villains shifting over back and forth [between shows]. Flash and Arrow will be introducing more villains that are part of the DC Comics universe." Pedowitz on #TheFlash / #Arrow crossovers #TCA14

Edited by Velocity23
Link to comment

7. Looks like lots of Diggle in the early episodes. I'm not sure what to think about the thing about conflict between Oliver and Diggle about Diggle being a father. Why would that bother Oliver? Maybe I'm not thinking about it right.

 

I have a theory as to why - I posted it this morning in the Speculation without Spoilers thread.

Link to comment

Yeah, I saw some freak outs on Twitter. Don't tell them the Ted Grant speculation! I

 

I think that I had seen some KC fans speculating about Ted Grant showing up when those boxing ring photos showed up, so I think it's already out there.  I'm sure that whoever the love interest is, he will somehow have to be tied to Oliver since everything on Arrow revolves around him.  If he's not associated with Oliver, then it will just be more of Laurel's storyline being completely separate from the rest of the show (which is good for those who fast forward through those scenes, I guess).

Link to comment
Caity Lotz booked for three episodes and hopefully more....yay. But, ok, still not a regular? What? But I think I can calm down now about her dying. It's still possible that she could just appear in flashbacks - he did point out that "even when you die in the present day, you can still be alive in the flashbacks. " But since she's not in Oliver's flashbacks anymore, I think it's less likely....although she could be in Laurel's flashbacks. Still, with Laurel still apparently quite a ways away from Black Canary, I think/hope I can relax a bit about Sara dying right away.

 

I'm still calling shenanigans on CL not being a series regular or major recurring character (like 14+ episodes) in S3.  I could be entirely wrong and I freely admit that most of this hinges on the Upfronts Press Release but man it just seems so weird to me that CL gets listed by character/actor name as part of Team Arrow in S3.  I can't believe they'd do that for a character that was only signed for 3 episodes.

  • Love 2
Link to comment

I'm still calling shenanigans on CL not being a series regular or major recurring character (like 14+ episodes) in S3.  I could be entirely wrong and I freely admit that most of this hinges on the Upfronts Press Release but man it just seems so weird to me that CL gets listed by character/actor name as part of Team Arrow in S3.  I can't believe they'd do that for a character that was only signed for 3 episodes.

 

I agree. Plus, it would be such a waste not to fully explore her history with the LoA. IDK what all they can do with it in three episodes.

Link to comment
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...