Spoiler Discussion Thread

[kismet]

Think the ratings will stay stable. No big slide or jump. The on-demand watchings, internet downloads and the tweets/social media might be a better estimation of how the story is going over with the audience. But in the end, the season is already written & in the bag so not sure TPTB will even look that closely at the ratings. I think they will be more interested in how the critics & fans handle the next coming episodes and that will impact any changes they make for season 4.

 

On a side note - rewatching the first couple of episodes of s1 & they do seem to be capping off some of the stuff they laid out for identity in s1. And in doing so have shown growth on OQ's part. I sorta forgot how much Oliver Queen did not want to be Oliver Queen when he initially returned. So maybe they are bookending their Who is Oliver Queen? journey and these 3 seasons could be perceived as a trilogy. Fingers crossed they don't mess it up just to fulfill some silly need for their's to be so cool & groundbreaking just for reasons. They spent s1-2 setting up a pretty decent origin story, s3 has been all over the place. But at the heart of the show, is OQs journey & I hope they don't fail him or us.

[Morena]

as everyone here points to a likely pair, could be Ra's and Thea?

And Ray?Who knows is not he who is getting married? Thea? Laurel? Sara? Felicity?

And Oliver and Sara?

[statsgirl]

Killing people with a Virus is what Ra's did in the Contagion/Legacy Comics

Oh, in that case, that's what will happen.   Their default is always the Batman comics.

[BkWurm1]

About a possible marriage between Oliver and Nyssa and if there would be consummation. I've worried over it but yeah, the general ickiness of forcing a man on a gay woman seemed to make that a no go storyline BUT wasn't there a comic storyline where the Green Arrow was raped by a woman?

IF TBTP equated Oliver's brainwashing as out of his control and IF Nyssa was for some reason set on carrying out the whole thing, then I could see it happening, especially if something was slipped into his wine to make him more agreeable to the process.

Then Nyssa could also have his child and nExt year they could be coming out Of the woodworks!! Toss in a little time travel and they could have a grown son for Olive to contend with.

Yes it is all crazy talk but they just said they want to blow up the show! Well they've already done that.

Call me confused but just a few weeks ago I swore the season was only supposed to end on a kinda cliffhanger. Maybe Oliver saying, naw I'm retired when he gets free really is the final twist. It doesn't feel like a much of a twist anymore since the show has already taken the Arrow away from him.

Edited April 29, 2015 by BkWurm1

[AyChihuahua]

It's sweeps.  They'll pay attention to the ratings for sure.  I believe these ratings help determine how much cash the showrunners get next season.

[Carrie Ann]

Yeah, MG says they've already blown up the show (eps 18-20), so I take that to mean: Roy is gone, and he kinda took the Arrow persona with him, and Oliver has joined the LOA. So from here, I think the only turn is him thinking he can't be the Arrow anymore, and accepting that he can be Oliver Queen.

 

There's Stephen's thing about how the craziest thing ever (or something to that effect) will be the trailer for S4, so that says to me that there will either be some brand new direction (TA working for an international agency, not based out of Starling for awhile, for example), or the "kinda" cliffhanger will be that we don't know what anyone is going to do next. So the finale ends with Oliver being himself again but not knowing what the next step is for him, and the team is at loose ends. Dig still recovering (physically or emotionally) from whatever Oliver does to him, Laurel still training with Nyssa maybe or taking over vigilante duties on her own, Thea spending the summer with Roy and Mama Smoak, and Oliver and Felicity driving off in to the goddamn sunset JUST let me have this please.

[SleepDeprived]

I really have no horse in this wedding race. I waffle being about 25% convinced it is Oliver/Nyssa, 25% convinced it is  Oliver/Felicity, 25% convinced it is Roy/Thea, and 25% whoever the fuck else. Ultimately, I just find this plot point exhausting and potentially pointless. I wish MG never teased anything so that when the wedding does happen, I might actually be surprised and deal with whatever emotions I might feel then than exasperation and dread now.

 

Anyway, not to derail the wedding speculation discussion but regarding tonight's episode, I found it a little weird/interesting that Ra's uses the exact same phrase about Oliver dealing with Nyssa and Diggle. He told Oliver that he had to "eliminate this threat." Is Ra's going to manipulate Oliver into thinking that Diggle is a contender to Oliver's reign as Heir, too? Is the brainwashing not enough and his plan is to eliminate every threat to Al Sah-Him's reign by having him kill all those connected/beloved to Oliver Queen, as well?

 

I, also, wonder if we're ending the episode on the cliffhanger of Nyssa facing her fate with Oliver and Ra's OR with Diggle bleeding/seemingly dying in Nanda Parbat after his fight with Al Sah-Him. At least, in the shot of Diggle, Maseo, Ra's, and Oliver (which, I think, is different to the one where Thea saves Diggle), it seems like they have Diggle at NP for that duel. Maybe the shocking offer of Malcolm to Team Arrow in 3x22 is that he knows of Tatsu and he'll help them take Diggle to her for some of that magical penicillin tea.

[statsgirl]

I am so sick of this wedding.  Will we find out who it is tonight, or have to wait till ep 322?

 

Call me confused but just a few weeks ago I swore the season was only supposed to end on a kinda cliffhanger. Maybe Oliver saying, naw I'm retired when he gets free really is the final twist. It doesn't feel like a much of a twist anymore since the show has already taken the Arrow away from him.

The "kind of a cliffhanger" I took to mean that Damian Darhknd HIVE is introduced as a threat for next season or or something about Felicity's father or maybe even Oliver returning to Nanda Parbat (less likely), as opposed to a major cliffhanger of "Will Oliver/X survive?" or "What will be X's fate?"

 

Kinda like Will Quentin live? as opposed to Will Oliver stay with the LoA brainwashed forever?

Edited April 29, 2015 by statsgirl

[Reba]

I just find this plot point exhausting and potentially pointless. I wish MG never teased anything so that when the wedding does happen, I might actually be surprised and deal with whatever emotions I might feel then than exasperation and dread now.

I so agree.  

 

I guess they think people worried and talking about it will make ratings go up.  But for me it makes me want to not watch live, find out what everyone thinks and find a way to wean myself off of my addiction to the show.

[kismet]

It's sweeps. They'll pay attention to the ratings for sure. I believe these ratings help determine how much cash the showrunners get next season.

Good point hadn't thought of that.

[apinknightmare]

So, Malcolm's totally working for the League again, isn't he? That's who Felicity's saying "We trusted you!" to, right? He offers to help them, but he's just being a backstabbing D.

[jay741982]

So, Malcolm's totally working for the League again, isn't he? That's who Felicity's saying "We trusted you!" to, right? He offers to help them, but he's just being a backstabbing D.

Can't be Shes never trusted that SOB in the same preview she calls him a liar again. I sadly think it's at Oliver

[lemotomato]

So, Malcolm's totally working for the League again, isn't he? That's who Felicity's saying "We trusted you!" to, right? He offers to help them, but he's just being a backstabbing D.

 

Yep, I think you're right. Malcom's overdue to show his real agenda. In a way, I'm comforted that they cut the commercial to make it look like she's yelling at Oliver, because that just makes me sure that it's not Oliver she's not yelling at.

Edited April 30, 2015 by lemotomato

[wonderwall]

Felicity needs to wear more pants. She looks awesome here!

 

[apinknightmare]

LMAO why is Laurel wearing her BC outfit there. Why is Tatsu in a mask? You can wear cargo pants. It's got to be hot as hell in all that leather. Thank god she left the mask and wig at home.

[Carrie Ann]

Katana! Yay a thing to be excited about.

[apinknightmare]

I wonder why Team Arrow goes to Nanda Parbat? They all seemed resigned to the fact that Oliver was lost to them forever. Is it to get the virus? Why would Nyssa have the real one? Be smart and stash it away in a safe place and use a decoy, gah. Or, maybe she did and they're going to break Oliver out while they get the real/fake virus? 

Edited April 30, 2015 by apinknightmare

[jay741982]

Yep, I think you're right. Malcom's overdue to show his real agenda. In a way, I'm comforted that they cut the commercial to make it look like she's yelling at Oliver, because that just makes me sure that it's not Oliver she's not yelling at.

Felicity has never trusted Malcolm though. I find it hard to believe she would yell that at Malcolm

[nksarmi]

So, Malcolm's totally working for the League again, isn't he? That's who Felicity's saying "We trusted you!" to, right? He offers to help them, but he's just being a backstabbing D.

I posted in the episode thread - he HAS to have been working for Ra's all along.  If the previous Ra's had to destroy Alexandria, and this Ra's had to kill his hometown, and Oliver has to destroy Starling City - there is clearly no freakin CODE here and there was never any blood debt.  Ra's turned his sites on Oliver last season - maybe before during the missing five years. 

 

Ra's ordered Malcolm to kill Sara to get her out of the way.  Malcolm used Thea to do it to get Oliver to do this stupid challenge/fight so Ra's could arrange for this prophesy to come to pass (Maseo was only following orders when he saved Oliver's life).  Now Ra's gets what he wants - Oliver as heir and Nyssa as his wife.  Malcolm was working for Ra's all along.  Hell, this is why Malcolm was still alive and just "being tortured" in NP when Oliver got there.  It was always a game to get Oliver to become Ra's.

 

I want them (Ra's and Malcolm) both dead, dead, dead.

[jay741982]

Felicity needs to wear more pants. She looks awesome here!

 

LOL Like someone on here said when Felicity wears pants SHIT is going down lol

[apinknightmare]

Felicity has never trusted Malcolm though. I find it hard to believe she would yell that at Malcolm

 

Who else would she have yelled it at? She wouldn't trust Oliver at the moment, because she knows he's messed up in the head. She knows Malcolm is a liar, but he's been oddly not terrible the last few weeks, and if he offers them help to get into Nanda Parbat, why wouldn't she believe him? He helped her try to get Oliver out of NP after she drugged him, and he was oddly caring toward Thea. 

 

I will be really, really surprised if he's not the one she yells that at.

[jay741982]

Who else would she have yelled it at? She wouldn't trust Oliver at the moment, because she knows he's messed up in the head. She knows Malcolm is a liar, but he's been oddly not terrible the last few weeks, and if he offers them help to get into Nanda Parbat, why wouldn't she believe him? He helped her try to get Oliver out of NP after she drugged him, and he was oddly caring toward Thea. 

 

I will be really, really surprised if he's not the one she yells that at.

Good points but she is Yelling that like she's heartbroken. Ugh these writers.

[Reba]

Is it some secret that the Ra's has to destroy his home to acsend? Otherwise I am really mad at Malcom and Nyssa and Maseo for not mentioning that the threat Ra's was making to destroy everything Oliver cared about is part of what Oliver is forced to do. Seems like a hard thing to keep secret.

"Agree to destroy everything or I will destroy it" is a somewhat stupid threat.

I am surprised though that the speculation of what should happen in these 3 episodes is so spot on. I guess not as WTF as MG wanted it to be?

[lemotomato]

Picking up the wedding speculation again, what if the wedding is Oliver/Nyssa, but it gets interrupted, and the marriage is Thea/Roy, because they elope (and we don't see the ceremony)? That would fit the "we see a wedding and a marriage" spoiler.

Edited April 30, 2015 by lemotomato

[apinknightmare]

Picking up the wedding speculation again, what if the wedding is Oliver/Nyssa, but it gets interrupted, and the marriage is Thea/Roy, because they elope (and we don't see the ceremony)? That would fit the "we see a wedding and a marriage" spoiler.

 

This is my ideal scenario, but this show has beaten all hope out of me. 

[wonderwall]

Yeah I'm pretty sure the whole Nyssa/Oliver wedding thing is a fakeout. 

[statsgirl]

LOL at the BC and Tatsu masks.  Someone has a hard-on for comics and costumes.  Although I can see the advantage of leather if  you're going into battle. Aren't their costumes supposed to be kevlar insulated or something?

 

After tonight, I'm even more convinced that Oliver is faking being brainwashed.  He took Lyla who was best able to defend herself, he didn't kill either Diggle or Nyssa (convenient that Thea was there and Ra's was only testing him).  And Nyssa better have hidden that virus somewhere in Starling City.

 

I think Felicity is yelling "we trusted you" at Oliver but he's still faking being brainwashed hence "Oliver Queen is dead".

 

I wouldn't be surprised if Malcolm dies heroically in Nanda Parbat.

 

Amazing, I look forward to these two episodes not at all.  Just get them over with already.

[lemotomato]

Yeah I'm pretty sure the whole Nyssa/Oliver wedding thing is a fakeout. 

I really hope so, if only because I don't believe Nyssa would just passively go along with it, especially if she's only being threatened with execution if she doesn't.

[apinknightmare]

I really hope so, if only because I don't believe Nyssa would just passively go along with it, especially if she's only being threatened with execution if she doesn't.

 

Yeah, she told Ra's she wasn't afraid of him, so I don't see what's stopping her from hiding a long-ass sword under her dress and just going straight for Ra's with it. 

[blixie]

 

"Agree to destroy everything or I will destroy it" is a somewhat stupid threat.

 

Only some what? Hee. I supposed it's destroy everything and be a KING of Murders, or I destroy it and you die too. But yeah Ras is a moron.

 

Ironically I think Katie looks great in her costume with her real hair and without the mask, and like why was she wearing her mask tonight yet not while actually in Nanda Parbat, same audience honey, yet Tatsu has hers. :shrugs: Okay, I give up.

[Starfish35]

Someone asked MG on his tumblr if Caity (Lotz) was done for season three and he said yes. So does that mean no Sara return this season? Pardon me, but what am I putting up with all this bullshit for? *headdesk* *cries*

Edited April 30, 2015 by Starfish35

[nksarmi]

No I totally think Felicity is yelling that line to Malcolm.  We have had to endure countless plot points this season that can only be explained if Malcolm is still working for Ra's - including this newly reveled one that the Undertaking violated a "code" but the new Ra's has to destroy his old hometown (I REALLY want to know if Ra's killed the woman he loved and his kids now!).

 

If Malcolm is working for Ra's it explains the killing of Sara in particular and not just some random LoA person, it explains why Malcolm sent Oliver to the trial by combat in the climb, it explains why Maseo saved Oliver's life but seems to buy into this whole Oliver is destined to be the new Ra's thing, it explains why Ra's let Malcolm live and sent him back to SC with Oliver, it explains how Malcolm seems to always know that Ra's is up to, it explains why Ra's didn't kill Maseo for trying to help TA escape (it was always a fake escape because Malcolm was involved), etc... I mean shit if this isn't all some master plan by Ra's - why didn't he kill Maseo as he represented the "past" for Oliver Queen?

 

The only thing I can believe right now is Malcolm is working for Ra's and Oliver and Nyssa's wedding was always his game plan. Nothing else will make this stupid season make sense to me.

[lemotomato]

Yeah, she told Ra's she wasn't afraid of him, so I don't see what's stopping her from hiding a long-ass sword under her dress and just going straight for Ra's with it. 

Nyssa skewering Ra's (and/or Malcom. Why not both!) is only the acceptable ending to the LoA storyline.

Edited April 30, 2015 by lemotomato

[Sunshine]

Per MG's tumblr the Billy Joel songs he would use for 3.22 is Surprises and for 3.23 is Famous Last Words.

If Felicity is yelling at Oliver in that scene, maybe he's locking them up to keep them safe.

3.23 Famous Last Words makes me think the Porsche/girl/sunset scene is Oliver hanging up the hood and embracing life, not going to be a vigilante again - until sometime in S4.

[AyChihuahua]

Katana! Yay a thing to be excited about.

Katana WITH TA.  Total excitement!  (Still not watching, but I love tough chicks.)

[jay741982]

LOL at the BC and Tatsu masks.  Someone has a hard-on for comics and costumes.  Although I can see the advantage of leather if  you're going into battle. Aren't their costumes supposed to be kevlar insulated or something?

 

After tonight, I'm even more convinced that Oliver is faking being brainwashed.  He took Lyla who was best able to defend herself, he didn't kill either Diggle or Nyssa (convenient that Thea was there and Ra's was only testing him).  And Nyssa better have hidden that virus somewhere in Starling City.

 

I think Felicity is yelling "we trusted you" at Oliver but he's still faking being brainwashed hence "Oliver Queen is dead".

 

I wouldn't be surprised if Malcolm dies heroically in Nanda Parbat.

 

Amazing, I look forward to these two episodes not at all.  Just get them over with already.

Ugh im at hoping He's not faking being brainwashed. It sucks that these Fakata writers have to Put Diggle OLiver at odds. I just want Oliver not at odds with everyone. This season needs to end with some kind of light JC

[AyChihuahua]

Picking up the wedding speculation again, what if the wedding is Oliver/Nyssa, but it gets interrupted, and the marriage is Thea/Roy, because they elope (and we don't see the ceremony)? That would fit the "we see a wedding and a marriage" spoiler.

Yes, please!

 

I usually like being right, in terms of spoilers and just life, but I'd be so happy to be wrong on the wedding.  But the writers have pulled off one swerve (Roy) all season, so I really think it will be Oliver and Nyssa.

Edited April 30, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[wonderwall]

Things to be excited about in the last two episodes: 

• Katana
• More Diggle/Felicity interactions (hopefully)
• Thea/Roy reunion
• Intro of Damien Darhk (I'm curious to see whether he's Felicity's dad or not... Also I'm curious how intimidating the guy is. Hopefully he's better than RAG)
• For the O/F fans, the sunset/porsche scene (hopefully)
• More Nyssa
• For the season to be over and RAG gone for good. 

 

That's all I can think of? Yikes

[lemotomato]

Someone on tumblr said that Oliver's doing the thumb/forefinger motion in the wedding scene in the episode trailer. Can anyone confirm?

[Guest]

Katana! Yes! Time to fillet some baddies girl. I'm ready.

I've been saying all season that Malcolm is in on some devious plan because it's Malcolm. He can't be redeemed. He's a villain. He should stay that way. And I wouldn't be surprised if Ra's asked him to get Sara out of the way. It all feels like some overarching plan all along.

I'm not even gonna talk about the wedding because I don't even care. We all predicted it. But ugh, the people banging on about wedding theories on tumblr are gonna get worse aren't they? MAKE IT STOP!

[apinknightmare]

Someone on tumblr said that Oliver's doing the thumb/forefinger motion in the wedding scene in the episode trailer. Can anyone confirm?

 

He appears to be, but it's really dark and tough to make out for sure.

[statsgirl]

The latest wedding theory is that the mysterious woman in the back of the trailer has a jawline like EBR, not Katrina Law.  I thought it was a random priestess.

[calliope1975]

The latest wedding theory is that the mysterious woman in the back of the trailer has a jawline like EBR, not Katrina Law.  I thought it was a random priestess.

 

I'm guessing this week is going to be full of speculation/fanwanking/wishful dreaming on how O/N are not happening, in whatever ways we can think up because many people find it disgusting. But I could be wrong, maybe the general public thinks it's an awesome idea.

[AyChihuahua]

I tweeted to Guggie re how foul it was and that he's a disgusting human being.  Somehow doubt he'll care.

 

I really want to know how TA and Katana hook up.  

[calliope1975]

I tweeted to Guggie re how foul it was and that he's a disgusting human being.  Somehow doubt he'll care.

 

I sent a tweet to the writers. Means nothing but it made me feel better. 

[apinknightmare]

The latest wedding theory is that the mysterious woman in the back of the trailer has a jawline like EBR, not Katrina Law.  I thought it was a random priestess.

 

What trailer are they talking about? Because the person in the wedding dress in the preview is pretty clearly KL.

 

Wait, I just saw that post and now it looks like EBR to me. NO, don't do this to yourself, self.

Edited April 30, 2015 by apinknightmare

[statsgirl]

No, they're saying it's EBR because of the jawline. 

 

 

Edited April 30, 2015 by statsgirl

[apinknightmare]

No, they're saying it's EBR.  (Sorry, I don't know how to get the picture smaller.)

 

 

Yeah, I had to go back and edit because it looked like her to me in the trailer, but then seeing the post (with the pic from Emily super made up when she signed PB elephant shirt), I see it. 

 

I don't see how it could be anyone but Nyssa given the veil is sheer and there are a bunch of LoA members there. I guess Ra's could be persuaded to let Felicity marry him but why would he when he basically told Oliver he wanted Nyssa to give him an heir?

 

If anything I'm guessing Oliver hallucinates/sees Felicity's face at some point as she's walking toward him.

Edited April 30, 2015 by apinknightmare

[tarotx]

If it's EBR it's probably Not!Felicity like it was Not!Diggle being skewered...

[AyChihuahua]

I want to believe!

 

It probably is a hallucination if it's EBR, but would he imagine his wedding to her as an LOA-style wedding?  He seems like more of a classic white wedding guy.

Edited April 30, 2015 by AyChihuahua