S01.E09: 40 Days Filth and Fury

[Faitu]

And don't get me started on Chris throwing that fruit. If he didn't want to eat it, give it back to Honora. Throwing it in the dirt was a real dick move and then he blamed Honora for finding that rude. Chris' "Im sorry that you felt that way. " is not an apology. Honora shouldn't have reacted to it, but Chris was an ass.

I agree, Chris was an asshole from the start. Honora has the emotional stability of a child, so it was the perfect pairing to make some drama, as both of them previously had problems with their partners. At least she didn't bring a magnifying glass this time.

[XPac]

For what it's worth (which may not be very much at all), Alana did say on face book that Shane, Dani Beau and her are friends now.  Who knows how accurate that is or isn't... but I guess it's something to consider given the hug and all.

I agree, Chris was an asshole from the start. Honora has the emotional stability of a child, so it was the perfect pairing to make some drama, as both of them previously had problems with their partners. At least she didn't bring a magnifying glass this time.

 

Magnifying glass might have been useful in helping them to track down all the survival items Honora lost.

[anonymiss]

Is it me or did anyone find it odd the sitting positions those women were using? Their vah jayjays just on display. Being naked is one thing, but having your legs open while sitting around the fire and chatting....IDK... Im not pearl clutcher either.

Perhaps it was more comfortable and modesty be damned in this environment, or perhaps it was to curry more favor to continue to do the least in their new coed group. I definitely wouldn't put it past Allana for one.

[ClareWalks]

Is it me or did anyone find it odd the sitting positions those women were using? Their vah jayjays just on display. Being naked is one thing, but having your legs open while sitting around the fire and chatting....IDK... Im not pearl clutcher either.  

 

I think after a while you just kind of forget you're naked. Or you figure these people have already seen everything, so who cares? I wouldn't wanna see that shit either, though, so I'm with ya ;)

[blackwing]

Jeff came across very well, and I liked his post on Facebook, thanks for posting it.  EJ is great too.  I felt sorry for Good Dani and Shane to have been treated the way they were.

 

Good for Eva and Luke to apologise, but it was too little, too late.  Eva fell in with the pack mentality.  I feel Luke is even worse than Eva, because he apparently knew the way Chris was treating Honora and the way the group was treating Dani was wrong, and yet he just sat back passively all zen and "duuuuuuddde, like it's ok, broooo".  He sucks.

 

Alana and Chris are asswipes and there is nothing they can ever do to redeem themselves with me.  I truly hope we never ever see either of them again on N&A.  I don't want to see another Naked and Afraid XL:  Redemption where these two are brought back along with other failed/asstastic contestants from the past like Miley Cyrus Wannabe.  I think Chris is still single and probably will be forever if the way he treats women is the way he treated his first partner, Honora and Dani is how he behaves in real life.  He and Alana deserve each other.

[XPac]

Jeff came across very well, and I liked his post on Facebook, thanks for posting it.  EJ is great too.  I felt sorry for Good Dani and Shane to have been treated the way they were.

 

Good for Eva and Luke to apologise, but it was too little, too late.  Eva fell in with the pack mentality.  I feel Luke is even worse than Eva, because he apparently knew the way Chris was treating Honora and the way the group was treating Dani was wrong, and yet he just sat back passively all zen and "duuuuuuddde, like it's ok, broooo".  He sucks.

 

Alana and Chris are asswipes and there is nothing they can ever do to redeem themselves with me.  I truly hope we never ever see either of them again on N&A.  I don't want to see another Naked and Afraid XL:  Redemption where these two are brought back along with other failed/asstastic contestants from the past like Miley Cyrus Wannabe.  I think Chris is still single and probably will be forever if the way he treats women is the way he treated his first partner, Honora and Dani is how he behaves in real life.  He and Alana deserve each other.

 

I'll give Luke a bit of a pass for the Honora side of things. Once things got out of hand he did try and reason with Honora. And he ended up having just as many reasons to be angry at Honora as Chris did since she was tossing all of their survival gear away. I think anyone short of a saint would have been fed up with her once she really lost it. Chris may have been an @$$ but Honora had issues... we saw that even in her first appearance in Naked and Afraid. She's a difficult survival partner.

 

But yeah... Luke probably should have been more supportive in the Dani situation. I can't entirely fault him (or Jeff and EJ) for deciding to try and stay out of the drama, but it would have been the right thing to do.

[ari333]

I agree, Chris was an asshole from the start. Honora has the emotional stability of a child, so it was the perfect pairing to make some drama, as both of them previously had problems with their partners. At least she didn't bring a magnifying glass this time.

Chris just made me sick. I hated his comment to Dani which was a straight up insult: "You didn't bring anything to the table... no offense." No offense? Oh please.

Also, I want to throw in that old adage..  paraphrased - "Evil wins when good men do nothing." or something to that effect. Sitting back and letting it happen bothers me about Luke especially since he knows better and has some kind of training in therapeutic endeavors IIRC

[spaceghostess]

 

I would have preferred to see a woman from the first season, I can't remember her name.  I remember that she was born in Hawaii, was a bit of a free spirit and had more skills than the man (I think she told him off too).  

Yes! I know exactly who you mean. That was Alison, and she was great--one of my favorites of all the seasons of the show. Her partner was an ex-military guy who basically behaved like a tool toward her for about three quarters of the episode. Her skills were far better and she carried his ass much of the time. She was extremely patient, but yes, she finally blew up when she stepped in his waste because he was crapping, like, a yard away from their campsite.

 

I agree that she would have been a good candidate for XL. I doubt she'd have fallen for the nasty groupthink that went on, and I could envision she and Dani J. partnering up. She seemed to me quite tolerant and compassionate (her partner had a bad sunburn and was also sick part of the time for being stupid and drinking bad water, if I recall).  I think she'd have understood that Dani needed space.

Edited September 8, 2015 by spaceghostess

[peach]

I did like when Honora called Chris an asshole and chauvinist pig to his face. Amazing how his face really embodies "dickhead" too.

Unbelievably, I found myself on Honora's side.  She made me laugh in that moment.  She also did admit she was childish about it, but after watching the way the rest of of the challenge unfolded, she's right. Those guys can go f* themselves.  lol 

As for the rest of the "confessions" or whatever, you guys have already made excellent statements about everyone's character.  I will just sum my feelings of the loser 6 group by quoting Dani J.  "What the f* is wrong with you guys???"

[BkWurm1]

I think Luke didn't speak up in Dani's defense for the same reason that Jeff and EJ didn't want to take Dani into her group... he wanted to avoid the drama. Which isn't an excuse... helping Dani would be the right thing to do. But it's sort of understandable.

 

If you're already tired and hungry, I'm not sure you necessarily want to jump into the highschool drama on top of all of that. It's the nice thing to do for Dani, and the right thing to do morally speaking... but it just makes the already difficult situation tougher. It's easier to just stay silent and avoid the drama if possible.

It also shows the importance of speaking up right away before things get so heated.  Honestly, I'm not entirely sure it would have made a difference since the blow out seemed to heat up almost out of no where but maybe if Like had said something (or anyone) to Dani when the complaints first started trickling in, she could have talked it out with everyone and figured out the expectations and wishes.  Instead there was Luke who clearly could see what was going on and even tried a couple times to diffuse things but he just folded when they all jumped on board the complaint train.  The passive aggressive notion that Dani should have just figured out what people wanted from her without anyone saying anything was nuts.

 

 

I'll give Luke a bit of a pass for the Honora side of things. Once things got out of hand he did try and reason with Honora. And he ended up having just as many reasons to be angry at Honora as Chris did since she was tossing all of their survival gear away. I think anyone short of a saint would have been fed up with her once she really lost it. Chris may have been an @$$ but Honora had issues... we saw that even in her first appearance in Naked and Afraid. She's a difficult survival partner.

 

But yeah... Luke probably should have been more supportive in the Dani situation. I can't entirely fault him (or Jeff and EJ) for deciding to try and stay out of the drama, but it would have been the right thing to do.

I also really suspect that had Honora not been such a disaster that Luke probably would have tried harder with Dani...though I could be off on that.  Dani really wasn't the one that he needed to use his wilderness therapy skills on.  He should have pulled them out for Chris, Alana, Laura and Eva.  He could have been a great mediator between Dani and the other four but at that point he was more interested in not making waves than keeping the rest of his team from drowning Dani. 

 

I do think that not stepping up will haunt Luke.  I don't think he will forget his failure.  I really don't.    It already seemed to be eating at him.   I think that is why I was ready to forgive Luke because I think he will work harder in the future not to give in so easily.  I can easily imagine him incorporating his failure into conversations in his wilderness outings.  It's out there now and he's not going to be able to ignore it much more so than anyone else since this is his thing (does he make a living off of it?)  He's going to have to use it as a teaching moment since otherwise it is going to make him look like a hypocrite to any "students". 

Edited September 8, 2015 by BkWurm1

[ari333]

It also shows the importance of speaking up right away before things get so heated.  Honestly, I'm not entirely sure it would have made a difference since the blow out seemed to heat up almost out of no where but maybe if Like had said something (or anyone) to Dani when the complaints first started trickling in, she could have talked it out with everyone and figured out the expectations and wishes.  Instead there was Luke who clearly could see what was going on and even tried a couple times to diffuse things but he just folded when they all jumped on board the complaint train.  The passive aggressive notion that Dani should have just figured out what people wanted from her without anyone saying anything was nuts.

 

 

I also really suspect that had Honora not been such a disaster that Luke probably would have tried harder with Dani...though I could be off on that.  Dani really wasn't the one that he needed to use his wilderness therapy skills on.  He should have pulled them out for Chris, Alana, Laura and Eva.  He could have been a great mediator between Dani and the other four but at that point he was more interested in not making waves than keeping the rest of his team from drowning Dani. 

 

I do think that not stepping up will haunt Luke.  I don't think he will forget his failure.  I really don't.    It already seemed to be eating at him.   I think that is why I was ready to forgive Luke because I think he will work harder in the future not to give in so easily.  I can easily imagine him incorporating his failure into conversations in his wilderness outings.  It's out there now and he's not going to be able to ignore it much more so than anyone else since this is his thing (does he make a living off of it?)  He's going to have to use it as a teaching moment since otherwise it is going to make him look like a hypocrite to any "students". 

THIS!! ^^^^^

Luke should have made waves if waves were needed to help defend an innocent person. I didn't see what Dani's sins were. And talking behind her back was loathsome. Chris is an instigator. I expected him to throw fuel on the fire, but ot Luke and sometimes doing nothing IS doing something....it is allowing horrible things to happen and not stepping in... I mean... well... I know what I mean. :)

[XPac]

It also shows the importance of speaking up right away before things get so heated.  Honestly, I'm not entirely sure it would have made a difference since the blow out seemed to heat up almost out of no where but maybe if Like had said something (or anyone) to Dani when the complaints first started trickling in, she could have talked it out with everyone and figured out the expectations and wishes.  Instead there was Luke who clearly could see what was going on and even tried a couple times to diffuse things but he just folded when they all jumped on board the complaint train.  The passive aggressive notion that Dani should have just figured out what people wanted from her without anyone saying anything was nuts.

 

 

I also really suspect that had Honora not been such a disaster that Luke probably would have tried harder with Dani...though I could be off on that.  Dani really wasn't the one that he needed to use his wilderness therapy skills on.  He should have pulled them out for Chris, Alana, Laura and Eva.  He could have been a great mediator between Dani and the other four but at that point he was more interested in not making waves than keeping the rest of his team from drowning Dani. 

 

I do think that not stepping up will haunt Luke.  I don't think he will forget his failure.  I really don't.    It already seemed to be eating at him.   I think that is why I was ready to forgive Luke because I think he will work harder in the future not to give in so easily.  I can easily imagine him incorporating his failure into conversations in his wilderness outings.  It's out there now and he's not going to be able to ignore it much more so than anyone else since this is his thing (does he make a living off of it?)  He's going to have to use it as a teaching moment since otherwise it is going to make him look like a hypocrite to any "students". 

 

 

 

 

Unbelievably, I found myself on Honora's side.  She made me laugh in that moment.  She also did admit she was childish about it, but after watching the way the rest of of the challenge unfolded, she's right. Those guys can go f* themselves.  lol 

As for the rest of the "confessions" or whatever, you guys have already made excellent statements about everyone's character.  I will just sum my feelings of the loser 6 group by quoting Dani J.  "What the f* is wrong with you guys???"

 

The weird thing about the Honora/CHris conflict is that I was on both their sides, and neither.

 

Everytime she said Chris was a jerk, I agreed. Everytime Chris knocked her for her crazy behavior, I agreed. It's one of those instances where I'm not sure there's a "good" guy there. They both seemed clearly in the wrong to me.

 

Chris did seem to be a jerk, and Honora probably shouldn't have been there in the first place.

It also shows the importance of speaking up right away before things get so heated.  Honestly, I'm not entirely sure it would have made a difference since the blow out seemed to heat up almost out of no where but maybe if Like had said something (or anyone) to Dani when the complaints first started trickling in, she could have talked it out with everyone and figured out the expectations and wishes.  Instead there was Luke who clearly could see what was going on and even tried a couple times to diffuse things but he just folded when they all jumped on board the complaint train.  The passive aggressive notion that Dani should have just figured out what people wanted from her without anyone saying anything was nuts.

 

 

I also really suspect that had Honora not been such a disaster that Luke probably would have tried harder with Dani...though I could be off on that.  Dani really wasn't the one that he needed to use his wilderness therapy skills on.  He should have pulled them out for Chris, Alana, Laura and Eva.  He could have been a great mediator between Dani and the other four but at that point he was more interested in not making waves than keeping the rest of his team from drowning Dani. 

 

I do think that not stepping up will haunt Luke.  I don't think he will forget his failure.  I really don't.    It already seemed to be eating at him.   I think that is why I was ready to forgive Luke because I think he will work harder in the future not to give in so easily.  I can easily imagine him incorporating his failure into conversations in his wilderness outings.  It's out there now and he's not going to be able to ignore it much more so than anyone else since this is his thing (does he make a living off of it?)  He's going to have to use it as a teaching moment since otherwise it is going to make him look like a hypocrite to any "students". 

 

A lot of these guys are survival instructors, and they're going to have to deal with the positives and negatives of being reality TV stars. I'm sure their business are doing better because they're now B list celebrities and A listers in the survival community. But a LOT of people came off looking really really bad, and they probably do need to do some damage control.

 

On face book Luke even mentioned he got death threats against him and his family for some of the stuff on the show. Obviously that's ridiculous and uncalled for regardless of what he may or may not have done on a TV show, but the point being he put himself out there and that's going to have consequences good and bad.

 

I almost think some of these people NEED to go on TV again just to try and rehabilitate their image a bit.

Edited September 8, 2015 by XPac

[XPac]

Yes! I know exactly who you mean. That was Alison, and she was great--one of my favorites of all the seasons of the show. Her partner was an ex-military guy who basically behaved like a tool toward her for about three quarters of the episode. Her skills were far better and she carried his ass much of the time. She was extremely patient, but yes, she finally blew up when she stepped in his waste because he was crapping, like, a yard away from their campsite.

 

I agree that she would have been a good candidate for XL. I doubt she'd have fallen for the nasty groupthink that went on, and I could envision she and Dani J. partnering up. She seemed to me quite tolerant and compassionate (her partner had a bad sunburn and was also sick part of the time for being stupid and drinking bad water, if I recall).  I think she'd have understood that Dani needed space.

 

It really is hard to say who would or wouldn't fall into that whole toxic mob mentality. I wouldn't think Luke or Laura necessarily would have just gone along with it but they did.

 

Generally speaking I think a lot of people who I thought were pretty cool in their first showing on Naked and Afraid ended up coming off worse in XL. Though the reverse to some degree is also true... I thought Shane was kind of a jerk at first but he grew on me.

[BkWurm1]

According to Chris's face book he apparently did at one point pull Dani aside and talk to her about her issues with the group. That just didn't show up on camera.

 

They did though show Chris pulling her to the side and talking to her and he brought up feeding the fire and then she apologized and then apologized to the group if it looked like she was shirking any duties.  It didn't make any difference since the next day they were still saying awful things like her lying all the time and being mentally unstable and when she confronted them about their bad behavior and hurtful things they were saying they ran her out.  

[Liberty]

... Honora probably shouldn't have been there in the first place.

 

Honora definitely should not have been there.  She was just a plant by the producers, who could get the time off work and inject some friction.  The producers continue to demean those who work hard to be survivalists by not following their own guidelines consistently.

 

It is the producers who will bring the Naked & Afraid franchise to an end, not the participants.  Some of the participants have tried to (Afften, Honora etc.) but still it will be producer inconsistency that does the franchise in. 

[BkWurm1]

Though the reverse to some degree is also true... I thought Shane was kind of a jerk at first but he grew on me.

 

By the end of Shane's first time on N and A he'd grown on me.  He did come in it as a jerk but he came to appreciate his partner and she changed his view on her generation (or at least was open to having his mind changed on a case by case basis)  I think Danielle (and yes I keep writing Danielle because I think it would annoy her) probably set his viewpoint back a peg or too. 

[XPac]

They did though show Chris pulling her to the side and talking to her and he brought up feeding the fire and then she apologized and then apologized to the group if it looked like she was shirking any duties.  It didn't make any difference since the next day they were still saying awful things like her lying all the time and being mentally unstable and when she confronted them about their bad behavior and hurtful things they were saying they ran her out.  

 

Not to be overly pessemistic, but I wonder if frankly anything anyone would have said would have made a difference. If say Luke had stood up for her I probably would have resepcted Luke more but I'm not entirely sure that would have corrected the situation overall.

 

I know Laura was sort of implying that EJ could have taken a leadership position (though these are all adults so I'm not convinced he's obligated to do that), but maybe with this group of people in this particular situation it just couldn't be fixed. But again, that's probably being overly pessemistic. More people probably should have at least tried.

[XPac]

Honora definitely should not have been there.  She was just a plant by the producers, who could get the time off work and inject some friction.  The producers continue to demean those who work hard to be survivalists by not following their own guidelines consistently.

 

It is the producers who will bring the Naked & Afraid franchise to an end, not the participants.  Some of the participants have tried to (Afften, Honora etc.) but still it will be producer inconsistency that does the franchise in. 

 

Yeah, they were intentionally choosing people and creating pairs for the sake of drama.

 

Honora was paired up with quite possibly the most chill competitor in Naked and Afraid history in her first showing and she still blew up. There's just no way in hell things wouldn't blow up with a guy as volatile as Chris. Though maybe Luke being in the mix was meant to sort of mediate that.

 

Shane being paired with 2 girls was likely designed to get some drama too. I'm convinced if he was with the Alpha Males from day one he not only would have been happier but would have surivied the 40 days. He was a good mix with them as his survival philosophy of working hard was a good mix.

 

But it's a TV show, and they clearly wanted the drama.

[Neurochick]

It really is hard to say who would or wouldn't fall into that whole toxic mob mentality. I wouldn't think Luke or Laura necessarily would have just gone along with it but they did.

 

Generally speaking I think a lot of people who I thought were pretty cool in their first showing on Naked and Afraid ended up coming off worse in XL. Though the reverse to some degree is also true... I thought Shane was kind of a jerk at first but he grew on me.

 

I don't know.  I think some people may do fine with just one other person, but when there's a large group they shut down.  I think that's what happened with Luke and Laura.  Most adults don't have to tell another adult, "leave her alone," or "why don't you just let her be?"  That's stuff they might have done in junior high school.   I think Luke and Laura were like, "I'm not getting involved with this bullshit, it's not real anyway, we're only going to be here for forty days."

 

And I think that's the issue.  Everybody knew the situation wasn't real, there was no real sense of urgency especially since all of them had been on the show before.  It might have been interesting if these were completely new people, ones who hadn't been on the show before.

 

But like it's been stated before, Discovery wanted the drama, and I don't blame them.  I think I posted upthread, or on another thread, that there was a show where a group of people were surviving.  The first two seasons were in Alaska and the third season was, I think in the Amazon.  Anyway, that show didn't last because of low ratings, so the producers and Discovery probably felt, "we can't just have a show with people surviving, have to create drama."

Edited September 8, 2015 by Neurochick

[XPac]

I don't know.  I think some people may do fine with just one other person, but when there's a large group they shut down.  I think that's what happened with Luke and Laura.  Most adults don't have to tell another adult, "leave her alone," or "why don't you just let her be?"  That's stuff they might have done in junior high school.   I think Luke and Laura were like, "I'm not getting involved with this bullshit, it's not real anyway, we're only going to be here for forty days."

 

And I think that's the issue.  Everybody knew the situation wasn't real, there was no real sense of urgency especially since all of them had been on the show before.  It might have been interesting if these were completely new people, ones who hadn't been on the show before.

 

But like it's been stated before, Discovery wanted the drama, and I don't blame them.  I think I posted upthread, or on another thread, that there was a show where a group of people were surviving.  The first two seasons were in Alaska and the third season was, I think in the Amazon.  Anyway, that show didn't last because of low ratings, so the producers and Discovery probably felt, "we can't just have a show with people surviving, have to create drama."

 

Yeah, I understand why Luke and Laura chose not to get involved... it's likely the same reasons EJ and Jeff decided not to take Dani into their group. They didn't want or need to get involved with the drama in an already tough situation.

 

Still, I'll wager the next time around a lot of people will be a lot more careful in how they deal with other people. Even though this was just a TV show, a lot of viewers ended up generating some pretty strong feelings over what they saw. I'm sure several people on the show are going to need to take a nice long vacation from Face Book and Twitter over the outcome of that show.

[ari333]

But guys.... it WAS real in the sense that Dani... in real life ... got very hurt. That was real. imo. Calling her a sociopath is pretty out there. And saying they dont trust her. Don't trust her to do what? She was not a violent person that we saw or heard of in the whisper-fest.  They said that she was "Showboating" (their word) What the hell doe that even mean? If she was.... what? Weren't all of them trying to use their skills and let everyone know when they had success at whatever.".lizarding" whatever... How was Dani picked out for "Showboating?" I just want to understand.

Edited September 8, 2015 by ari333

[XPac]

But guys.... it WAS real in the sense that Dani really... in real life ... got very hurt. That was real. imo. Calling her a sociopath is pretty out there. And saying they ont trust her. Don't trust her to do what? She was not violent a person that we saw or heard of in the whisper-fest.  They said that she was "Showboating" (their word) What the hell doe that even mean? If she was.... what? Weren't all of them trying to use their skills and let everyone know when they had success at whatever.".lizarding" whatever... How was Dani picked out for "Showboating?" I just want to understand.

 

Well, I suppose that's the problem with watching this on TV rather than actually being there.

 

I'm not trying to take their side or anything, but maybe she WAS show boating or whatever and the show chose not to pick up on that. I'm not trying to defend their actions... regardless of editing or whatever they did what they did and said what they said, and they should be held accountable for that. But maybe they do have a side to the story that we simply didn't see.

 

It seemingly wasn't just one person that had issues with Dani... the group collectively seemed to have issues with her and MAYBE there was a reason for that. That doesn't make the group right, but it's possible there are aspects of the story we simply didn't see. That's up to the producers unfortunately.

[ari333]

Im just trying to envision some action that could be deemed showboating. I cannot think of anything. Thoughts? Did she belly dance in front of the fire? If so I'd think the producers would be all over that in editing. I just don't know ...as mentioned... we don't know. DId she catch crabs and sing "Ive got some crabs and you cant have any" a la Eddie Murphy in the famous "I got some ICE cream.... and you cant HAVE none" with the little dance heh. Now I feel compelled to post the link to that little song. omg... ok I'm just thinking out of the box.

Anyway....

 

I think Alana invented a problem. Maybe she was bored.  Chris stirred the pot. And the rest went along for the ride bc they were too weak to step up. imo

[ari333]

Forgive me and indulge me.. :)

Showboating... the dance starts at 28 seconds in. If you need a big laugh.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfU1LjFfyBI

[XPac]

Im just trying to envision some action that could be deemed showboating. I cannot think of anything. Thoughts? Did she belly dance in front of the fire? If so I'd think the producers would be all over that in editing. I just don't know ...as mentioned... we don't know. DId she catch crabs and sing "Ive got some crabs and you cant have any" a la Eddie Murphy in the famous "I got some ICE cream.... and you cant HAVE none" with the little dance heh. Now I feel compelled to post the link to that little song. omg... ok I'm just thinking out of the box.

Anyway....

 

I think Alana invented a problem. Maybe she was bored.  Chris stirred the pot. And the rest went along for the ride bc they were too weak to step up. imo

 

For what it's worth, Luke on face book in a response to someone criticizing some of his behavior said: "And once again, you don't know why the group was not in alignment with Dani, and sadly my contract prohibits me from talking about it."

 

So for what it's worth, Luke seems to feel there are reasons why the group didn't align with Dani which he can't talk about. Luke obviously did apologize at the reunion show... but at the same time that face book response to me at least implies there's a side to the story we didn't see.

[ari333]

I felt really bad for Shane when he was crying or almost crying. He seems like a sensitive  person who acts tough. I felt bad for Dani crying too and those bastards just sat there.

[Liberty]

For what it's worth, Luke on face book in a response to someone criticizing some of his behavior said: "And once again, you don't know why the group was not in alignment with Dani, and sadly my contract prohibits me from talking about it."

 

So for what it's worth, Luke seems to feel there are reasons why the group didn't align with Dani which he can't talk about. Luke obviously did apologize at the reunion show... but at the same time that face book response to me at least implies there's a side to the story we didn't see.

 

Poor guy is hiding behind the "editing" again.  

 

When was that posted? Interesting to think he was still under "contract".

[ari333]

I understand all the points being made. However, I don't care what Dani did. Calling her a sociopath was beyond the pale for me unless she molested someone or attempted murder or poisoned someone's food etc. "Sociopath" was just horrible. As for Luke and his posts... that's a great excuse Luke has. He cant say...

 

What? She didn't stir the fire at the assigned time? Oh the humanity. And Chris telling her that she didn't bring anything to the table.... what did HE DO? What did he bring to the table? What did Alana do for the group?  

[XPac]

I understand all the points being made. However, I don't care what Dani did. Calling her a sociopath was beyond the pale for me unless she molested someone or attempted murder or poisoned someone's food etc. "Sociopath" was just horrible. As for Luke and his posts... that's a great excuse Luke has. He cant say...

 

What? She didn't stir the fire at the assigned time? Oh the humanity. And Chris telling her that she didn't bring anything to the table.... what did HE DO? What did he bring to the table? What did Alana do for the group?  

 

At this point, even if he could contractually say what issues the group had with Dani I frankly think it's smarter on his part to just keep it to himself. It's obvious that public opinion is for Dani and against them, so publically saying anything against Dani really would likely just make them look worse.

 

Regardless of what his side of the story is, all that really matters to anyone outside the people actually there is what happened on TV. So all Luke can do is apologize (which he did) and try to move on. At this point trying to defend himself (especially if that defense comes at the expense of Dani) will only make him look worse. And the guys already gotten death threats, so I think he's playing it smart.

[BkWurm1]

It seemingly wasn't just one person that had issues with Dani... the group collectively seemed to have issues with her and MAYBE there was a reason for that. That doesn't make the group right, but it's possible there are aspects of the story we simply didn't see. That's up to the producers unfortunately

 

The mob mentality is no measure of guilt and even if there was grounds for irritation, there was no grounds for hate and vilification.  Nobody has claimed that Dani was misportrayed, only that they themselves suffered from editing.  Or in the quote for Luke's Facebook, you don't know and I can't say.  His face during the show both during the challenge and during the reunion said enough for me.  He may have understood why the group was shunning her but it was written all over his guilty face that he knew it was wrong and he apologized when given the chance. 

 

I don't have any doubts about who was in the wrong. 

And the guys already gotten death threats, so I think he's playing it smart.

 

And how insane is that?  Some people should not be allowed on the internet.  Nobody on the show was deserving of death threats. 

[ClareWalks]

Although I have no strong interest in seeing any of Bitch Group 6 on my TV ever again, I would kind of love to see a Naked and Afraid episode where Chris and Honora are paired off and sent to Antarctica in the middle of winter with a machete and a prom-queen tiara as their survival items. No extraction needed.

[BkWurm1]

Although I have no strong interest in seeing any of Bitch Group 6 on my TV ever again, I would kind of love to see a Naked and Afraid episode where Chris and Honora are paired off and sent to Antarctica in the middle of winter with a machete and a prom-queen tiara as their survival items. No extraction needed.

Sounds like the premise for a horror film.

[XPac]

Although I have no strong interest in seeing any of Bitch Group 6 on my TV ever again, I would kind of love to see a Naked and Afraid episode where Chris and Honora are paired off and sent to Antarctica in the middle of winter with a machete and a prom-queen tiara as their survival items. No extraction needed.

 

Naked and Afraid Halloween edition.

 

Seriously though, I do like the idea of seeing some of the previous survivors return apart from the XL stuff (which is more a social experiment than survival show). I recall the first episode of the second season having EJ and Laura step in after both survivors tapped out, and I thought that was cool. I kind of wish as a matter of format they would try and get previous survivors (the more proven capable ones) to take up the challenge in situations where both parties tap out. It makes for a nice learning experience as far as showing what the ones who tapped out did wrong... presuming of course the replacements don't tap out too.

[Liberty]

.... It's obvious that public opinion is for Dani and against them, so publically saying anything against Dani really would likely just make them look worse.

 

Your point here is really a good one.  His main goal is to obtain donations for his survival school and his N&A exposure is a big part of his fundraising.  To admit contributing to Dani J's demise could hurt his donations.  He creates a situation where he seems to be the victim of his contract and Dani, which could increase his donations.

 

If only he'd have stood up for her he would have increased his fund raising.

 

One of the posts on his facebook page about fundraising.... "Is your soul also for sale? Seems like everything else to do with you is..."

 

Luke responds: "No my soul is not for sale. Yes sadly I have been advertising myself a lot. That is because thousands of people have recently started following me because of naked and afraid. I wish the world lived off of dreams and wishes but sadly I need money to help teach people how to grow and connect to nature"

 

Is that being a "Fame Whore"?

Edited September 9, 2015 by Liberty

[seasick]

Guys help me out here--  What was the name of the original Ep. that Alana was on?    I wanted to look for comments on the other N&A forum to refresh my memory on her.  And Dani?

 

I just found this forum but have watched from the beginning.  I found the regular season to get redundant but watched regardless.  I truly enjoyed the XL season the best.

I'm glad to a some extent that they focus on the survival elements but the human interaction is a big part of that.   Seeing just Fire-water-shelter-food alone gets old IMO. 

 

I felt sold-short on the Dani issue.  I think it was unfair to everyone to that more was not revealed.  (contract issues? please)  I do agree however that Luke and others are in a no win situation if they begin to ding Dani at this point.  I wish they had a moderator at the reunion (for various reasons) who could have asked Dani what she thought the problem was and the others could have explained as well. 

 

I wish Luke or others would have thought that when they saw a teammate sinking into the muck and mire of their own head they would have reached out to try and pull her out just as they would if she were physically sinking in quicksand.  The toll this ostrasizing (sp?) took on them is what caused Dani and Shane to tap out.  That support is as  essential as any other.

 

Looking back I realized that none of the original 3some's did well.  The one guy tapped out that was with Jeff? and EJ too early to tell.  It does seem as though 2 always seem to hit it off and the 3rd is an odd man out.    And speaking of those 3..  it really drove me crazy that they busted ass for 2 days before locating water.  The other guy was dying of thirst and those two just were merrily moving along.  (guy 3 could have searched for water himself I suppose  but regardless, I  would think finding a water source is priority one when it's 112 degrees.  Did I miss something there?  

 

Despite late to the party it was fun to find this forum.

Edited September 9, 2015 by seasick

[ClareWalks]

For seasick and all others who care, Alana's original episode thread, Paradise Lost: http://forums.previously.tv/topic/3028-s02e03-paradise-lost/

 

And I agree about finding water with Hakim. I'm sure they did look for water, but why the hell they built a giant permanent shelter when they still hadn't found a reliable water source was completely baffling to me. The order should be, find the water, THEN built a shelter NEAR it. That was probably what "killed" Hakim.

Edited September 9, 2015 by ClareWalks

[XPac]

Guys help me out here--  What was the name of the original Ep. that Alana was on?    I wanted to look for comments on the other N&A forum to refresh my memory on her.  And Dani?

 

I just found this forum but have watched from the beginning.  I found the regular season to get redundant but watched regardless.  I truly enjoyed the XL season the best.

I'm glad to a some extent that they focus on the survival elements but the human interaction is a big part of that.   Seeing just Fire-water-shelter-food alone gets old IMO. 

 

I felt sold-short on the Dani issue.  I think it was unfair to everyone to that more was not revealed.  (contract issues? please)  I do agree however that Luke and others are in a no win situation if they begin to ding Dani at this point.  I wish they had a moderator at the reunion (for various reasons) who could have asked Dani what she thought the problem was and the others could have explained as well. 

 

I wish Luke or others would have thought that when they saw a teammate sinking into the muck and mire of their own head they would have reached out to try and pull her out just as they would if she were physically sinking in quicksand.  The toll this ostrasizing (sp?) took on them is what caused Dani and Shane to tap out.  That support is as  essential as any other.

 

Looking back I realized that none of the original 3some's did well.  The one guy tapped out that was with Jeff? and EJ too early to tell.  It does seem as though 2 always seem to hit it off and the 3rd is an odd man out.    And speaking of those 3..  it really drove me crazy that they busted ass for 2 days before locating water.  The other guy was dying of thirst and those two just were merrily moving along.  (guy 3 could have searched for water himself I suppose  but regardless, I  would think finding a water source is priority one when it's 112 degrees.  Did I miss something there?  

 

Despite late to the party it was fun to find this forum.

 

On Honora's face book she said the reunion was actually hours long, and obviously they had to cut it down to just one. So I suppose in theory they could have gone more in-depth into some of the Dani stuff and we just didn't see it. There was a lot going on even though the Dani stuff was probably the bigget (Honora drama, Shane drama, etc) so they could only give so much to each issue. Maybe it would have been nice if the reunion was longer and we could have seen more.

 

As far as the Alpha Males spending so much time on their shelter... I suspect they did probably go look for water and it just wasn't shown. But that issue aside, I think it does show one of the possible flaws in their surviving philosophy... they perhaps OVERDO everything a bit. Because Jeff and EJ spent so much time building a much better (and safer) raft, they actually got to the extraction point later than the other team, who just did it quick and dirty. So maybe if they had spent less time building the best shelter possible and the best raft possible, they would have had more time to search for water and they would have got to the extraction point quicker. There's no exact perfect formula for survival. Though I do think in the long term survival situation the Alpha Males strategy probably would have worked better.

 

I do think the 3 man teams as a whole did rather poorly... but I also think to some degree that was by design. I think for the same of drama they added people that didn't necessarily make the most harmonious enviroment. I think adding Shane to a group of 2 women and Honora with Chris was essentially going to gurantee some drama early on. I think the mixed groups at least did exactly what the producers were hoping for.

[XPac]

Your point here is really a good one.  His main goal is to obtain donations for his survival school and his N&A exposure is a big part of his fundraising.  To admit contributing to Dani J's demise could hurt his donations.  He creates a situation where he seems to be the victim of his contract and Dani, which could increase his donations.

 

If only he'd have stood up for her he would have increased his fund raising.

 

One of the posts on his facebook page about fundraising.... "Is your soul also for sale? Seems like everything else to do with you is..."

 

Luke responds: "No my soul is not for sale. Yes sadly I have been advertising myself a lot. That is because thousands of people have recently started following me because of naked and afraid. I wish the world lived off of dreams and wishes but sadly I need money to help teach people how to grow and connect to nature"

 

Is that being a "Fame Whore"?

 

Though I do think just the fact that Luke's on Naked and Afraid will allow him to get more money, I also think he'll end up getting less than he might have if he came off better on the show. Guys like EJ, Jeff, Shane and Dani if they have schools or any sort of fund raisers are likely going to get quite a boost because of how they came off in this show.

 

But now that the contestants know the potential downsides of looking bad on this show, I do wonder how they would perform the next time around on this show. I seriously wonder if a second time around everyone wouldn't suddenly become Dani and Shane's best friend (though I do honestly think a lot of these people are becoming better friends anyways simply because of the show). I actually want some of these people to return again if they do another XL just to see how they would handle the show differently. Except Honora... she probably should never do something like this again.

[ari333]

I think Luke would come off better if he shared the horrible things Dani supposedly did. If they were true, that is. Things that warrant the label sociopath have to be pretty bad. If he told the truth and she did horrific things then I'd change my tune about it. However, if Dani had done horrible things I'd think the edit monkeys would be all over that.

Edited September 9, 2015 by ari333

[seasick]

Thanks ClareWalks.   

 

I just read the comments on her season.  

  Jacknife gave a rundown of "unseen footage"  of some telling interaction btw Keith and Alana.  This is where I think the editing fails on this show.  Not that I want it to turn into "Survivor"  where it's only about the social,now  but it does give depth to the episodes and helps distinguish them. 

 

They So missed the boat on that aftershow..  It was exasperating that they turned it into a joke when I think they could easily have filled it with serious questions.  I think the producers/editors don't really get the true allure of the show that the fans get..   Same with the reunion.  I'm sure they must know that fans have tons of questions.  

 

Maybe they'll do threesomes or something to freshen it.  I look forward to the regular season shows but usually feel 'Meh'  after. 

 

Just want to say vegetarian Danielle and her smug looks and rule-book attitude bugged me to death.  Props tho for getting thru  and on a veg diet.

 

[XPac]

I think Luke would come off better if he shared he horrible things Dani supposedly did. If they were true, that is. Things that warrant the label sociopath have to be pretty bad. If he told the truth and she did horrific things then I'd change my tune about it. However, if Dani had done horrible things I'd think the edit monkeys would be all over that.

 

Honestly I think if anything he said comes at the expense of Dani, he's better off just keeping his mouth shut. Again, the poor guy said he's already gotten death threats.

 

But regardless, he says he can't talk about it because of his contract. Maybe he's lying, who knows.

[XPac]

Thanks ClareWalks.   

 

I just read the comments on her season.  

  Jacknife gave a rundown of "unseen footage"  of some telling interaction btw Keith and Alana.  This is where I think the editing fails on this show.  Not that I want it to turn into "Survivor"  where it's only about the social,now  but it does give depth to the episodes and helps distinguish them. 

 

They So missed the boat on that aftershow..  It was exasperating that they turned it into a joke when I think they could easily have filled it with serious questions.  I think the producers/editors don't really get the true allure of the show that the fans get..   Same with the reunion.  I'm sure they must know that fans have tons of questions.  

 

Maybe they'll do threesomes or something to freshen it.  I look forward to the regular season shows but usually feel 'Meh'  after. 

 

Just want to say vegetarian Danielle and her smug looks and rule-book attitude bugged me to death.  Props tho for getting thru  and on a veg diet.

 

I think the problem with making the show a 3 some is that it will potentially make it more of a drama fest. We saw in XL that often 2 people would buddy up and the third would become somewhat of an outside. The only scenario that didn't happen was the all guy group (though that didn't stay a group of 3 for very long). Probably depends on the people though.

 

As far as Vegi Danielle goes... it's interesting how different she was in her solo Naked and Afraid epsidoe than she was in XL or even at the Reunion. Hell, I thought she was half stoned at the reuion.

[XPac]

Looking back at the Paradise lost thread, it's interesting to consider how the stuff they left on the cutting room floor.

 

Some commented that Alana came off sort of mean to Keith... but in the additional footage that didn't make the show, Keith arguably deserved some of that. But we didn't see on the show.. just with some of the extra stuff.

 

I suppose that's something to consider as far as XL goes too. Some of the people (not shockingly the ones that came off looking bad) are implying that. Though in that case, I'm not entirely sure anything would have justifed the degree of negativity we got.

[seasick]

On Honora's face book she said the reunion was actually hours long, and obviously they had to cut it down to just one. So I suppose in theory they could have gone more in-depth into some of the Dani stuff and we just didn't see it. There was a lot going on even though the Dani stuff was probably the bigget (Honora drama, Shane drama, etc) so they could only give so much to each issue. Maybe it would have been nice if the reunion was longer and we could have seen more.

 

As far as the Alpha Males spending so much time on their shelter... I suspect they did probably go look for water and it just wasn't shown. But that issue aside, I think it does show one of the possible flaws in their surviving 

 

 

This pisses me off.  I think Discovery and TPTB are just plain cheap and lazy (regarding the reunion etc.) If this was a first season show with a few odd followers I could  understand it.  If they can make 3 reunion eps on those dumb housewives shows (some of which I admit I watch) or do those dumb get-togethers with stupid Taaahdd on Gold Rush they could have put more effort into this one. 

 

It did show them looking for water but too many thorns or something...  Meanwhile Hakim is dying of thirst and they're busy tiling the bathroom or hooking up  the cable or some (i think) superfluous shit considering.  I'm just frustrated that we weren't given a platform for questions obviously.   (i'm not on Twit or FB.  maybe that would reduce my frustration)

 

The only reason I can think of that they need to avoid contractual issues is that Dani had some interaction with staff be it sneaking help to her, eyelash batting, or something.  It could be why no questions allowed and them just rehashing stuff with little depth.   She may have health issues which off-camera they were allowed to support and the other people grew suspicious of.   Just a guess.

 

Xpac.. I don't want it to be all drama either but the regular season shows need something.  Yes.. D did look quite stoned now that u mention it!!

[haydensterling]

All the XL cast Facebooks are a mess.  Honora posted a text supposedly from Shane where he says he found peanut butter and oreos, and that his whole group was surviving on it.  Why he had to tap and looked so skeletal if he was eating peanut butter is beyond me, but...Chas, from Veggie Dani's episode keeps threatening Jeff to 'tell the truth or he will' on Twitter, and Veggie Dani keeps telling people that someone was sexually harassed but refuses to say who it was.

 

The relevant facebooks and twitters to look at are Honora Bowen and Dani Beau.

Russell Sage, who was on the first season, is saying that Shane was the harasser, but Honora says very firmly that she would love to do a N&A episode with Hakim, Dani J, and Shane and that she really likes all of them.

 

Who knows.  It's crazy town over there.

[Juliegirlj]

I am seemingly the only one here who feels this way, but I think Dani didn't do enough to integrate with the group. Part of the challenge was getting along with the people you are with. Dani seemed to have a lack of confidence from the very beginning. I feel bad that her feelings were hurt, but when everyday survival is that taxing it leaves no energy left to coddle someone who feels left out. She had to realize that going off alone everyday was isolating her from the others. To me it didn't seem like she made much effort at all to bond with anyone in her group.

[XPac]

I am seemingly the only one here who feels this way, but I think Dani didn't do enough to integrate with the group. Part of the challenge was getting along with the people you are with. Dani seemed to have a lack of confidence from the very beginning. I feel bad that her feelings were hurt, but when everyday survival is that taxing it leaves no energy left to coddle someone who feels left out. She had to realize that going off alone everyday was isolating her from the others. To me it didn't seem like she made much effort at all to bond with anyone in her group.

 

I do think she failed to integrate with the group as well. That doesn't make her a lyer or a psychopath like some of the girls alluded to, which is why they're firmly in the wrong regardless of what Dani did... but she was choosing to isolate herself from the others, but that probably didn't help herself or the group dynamic one bit.

All the XL cast Facebooks are a mess.  Honora posted a text supposedly from Shane where he says he found peanut butter and oreos, and that his whole group was surviving on it.  Why he had to tap and looked so skeletal if he was eating peanut butter is beyond me, but...Chas, from Veggie Dani's episode keeps threatening Jeff to 'tell the truth or he will' on Twitter, and Veggie Dani keeps telling people that someone was sexually harassed but refuses to say who it was.

 

The relevant facebooks and twitters to look at are Honora Bowen and Dani Beau.

Russell Sage, who was on the first season, is saying that Shane was the harasser, but Honora says very firmly that she would love to do a N&A episode with Hakim, Dani J, and Shane and that she really likes all of them.

 

Who knows.  It's crazy town over there.

 

If things are crazy to that point, it's probably a good idea for people to keep their mouths shut.

[ClareWalks]

I am seemingly the only one here who feels this way, but I think Dani didn't do enough to integrate with the group. Part of the challenge was getting along with the people you are with. Dani seemed to have a lack of confidence from the very beginning. I feel bad that her feelings were hurt, but when everyday survival is that taxing it leaves no energy left to coddle someone who feels left out. She had to realize that going off alone everyday was isolating her from the others. To me it didn't seem like she made much effort at all to bond with anyone in her group.

 

That's the thing, though, she wasn't looking to be coddled for feeling "left out." She was just looking to be left alone for a good amount of the day, because she is an introvert (which she could have said at some point, it certainly would have helped this group of idiots to "get it"). Coworkers need to be able to work together, but they don't need to be friends. It seems like Bitch Group 6 had messed-up expectations that they'd all be so similar and be besties, and anyone who didn't fit perfectly into that perception was useless.

[XPac]

That's the thing, though, she wasn't looking to be coddled for feeling "left out." She was just looking to be left alone for a good amount of the day, because she is an introvert (which she could have said at some point, it certainly would have helped this group of idiots to "get it"). Coworkers need to be able to work together, but they don't need to be friends. It seems like Bitch Group 6 had messed-up expectations that they'd all be so similar and be besties, and anyone who didn't fit perfectly into that perception was useless.

 

I think that ultimately was the question mark about Dani. Was she able to work together with her co-workers despite not necessarily being BFF's.

 

If she pulled her share of work and did what she needed to do in the group, then any complaints they may have about her are pretty moot. But if she's not bringing anything to the table and they don't like her on top of that, it was a given that it would be an unpleasant situation for her.

 

And this to a degree is where the shows editing makes it difficult for us to judge. They did show that one scene where Dani didn't take care of the fire, and I believe Chris mentions or at least implies that she didn't pull her own weight. But it's hard for us to really know. Maybe she for the most part didn't do jack. Or maybe she did a ton of stuff at Chris is just being a jerk. It's hard to say, because we weren't there.

 

Utlimately though even if she didn't pull her own weight, they did go way to far as far as labeling her a psycho path or whatever. So at least in regards to how extreme they took things, they were firmly in the wrong. Whether or not their criticism for Dani apart from that is justified we'll never know.

Edited September 9, 2015 by XPac

[Watcher0363]

 Coworkers need to be able to work together, but they don't need to be friends. It seems like Bitch Group 6 had messed-up expectations that they'd all be so similar and be besties, and anyone who didn't fit perfectly into that perception was useless.

I share your coworkers theory. However in today's work environment companies want everybody to be or at least give the appearance that they are family or at the least besties. For me when I walk into work I always think of this movie exchange.

 

Joachim: They're still running with shields down.

 

Khan: Of course! We are one big, happy fleet! Ah, Kirk, my old friend, do you know the Klingon proverb that tells us revenge is a dish that is best served cold?

[pause]

 

Khan: It is very cold in space!