Mr. Robot Spoiler Discussion

[formerlyfreedom]

Spoiler tags are not necessary here. Proceed at your own risk!

[edhopper]

So my guess is Christian Slater is Eliot's Tyler Durdin.

[Cardie]

So my guess is Christian Slater is Eliot's Tyler Durdin.

 

That's what a number of early commenters said in the episode thread. I assume those posts will move here eventually. My take is that Elliott is indeed a vigilante hacker and that he makes E Corp his fantasy of all the evils of capitalism. I don't think either the revolution espoused by Mr. Robot or the counter-cabal headed by the smooth and knowledgeable E Corp IT exec are real; indeed I'm not sure any of the support personnel we see with them are real either. On the other hand, Elliot is doing what he can to further the revolution and his access to E Corp via his job at All Safe allows him triumphs that his fantasy credits to Mr. Robot rather than his own expertise. He speaks of saving everyone. He has a savior complex (see his rescue of the dog, as well as his friend and his therapist.) I suspect we'll discover that he needed saving when he was a kid and no one showed up for him.

 

Besides those in Fight Club, his delusions remind me of the ones in A Beautiful Mind, in which Russell Crowe imagined both a sympathetic friend who helped him make his mathematical breakthroughs and a spy who embroiled him in a huge conspiracy. Both were totally in his head.

[edhopper]

Cardie; that sounds reasonbable. I think the other hackers are real, the conversaion outside the arcade with the girl hacker sounded like she has on familiar terms with him. And the way Slater showed up just as she left was the clue for me.

The question for me is when they do the reveal about what is halucination, to us and also his realization. And where the show goes form there. If they wait too long, it could become tiresome. But they need a plot to keep it going after the reveal.

[ToastnBacon]

So my guess is Christian Slater is Eliot's Tyler Durdin.

Elliot is definitely an unreliable narrator, Evil Corp is a nickname that he gave for E Corp, yet when he was in Times Square, we were seeing the news scrolls read Evil Corp about the arrest of the executive.

We are looking at the world through his eyes and some of what we are seeing, isn't real.

I wouldn't be surprised if Christian Slater (Mr Robot) and Elliot are the same person.

I noticed another Fight Club borrow, whe he was talking about E Corp for the first time, the screen jumped as it did in Fight Club when Tyler Durden was mentioned the first time.

It could be misdirection on the part of the writers, but I think there were some obvious Fight Club hints being dropped in this.

Edited June 25, 2015 by ToastnBacon

[djsunyc]

no doubt in my mind this is a fight club type situation.  when he goes to fun society in coney island with slater, the dude that opens the door doesn't even look at christian slater.  there is no eye contact or even acknowledgement of slater at all.

 

as for that particular reveal - i'm hoping they don't think it's their huge "sixth sense" moment and wait till the end of the series to do it.  secondly, i am not convinced this can last for more than 10-13 episodes a season.

 

we also never actually see anyone say "evil" for evil corp.  it's always said but not on screen.  don't know if there's any siginifcance to that.

 

also, in the first scene of the shadows of the "people in power", we saw the building in the background with a huge crane doing work on it.  then in the final scene, the building doesn't have any crane on it.  any signifiance to that or was i just seeing things?  was the crane meant to symbolize him starting to "build" this fake reality in his head?

Edited June 29, 2015 by djsunyc

[editorgrrl]

Spoilers from the character bios at https://www.usanetwork.com/mrrobot/cast

Originally from Washington Township, New Jersey, Elliot now lives alone on the Lower East Side. He suffers from crippling anxiety, which stems from memories of his difficult childhood. His father died when Elliot was young, and his now-estranged mother was brutally cruel. 

 

Angela’s mother died when she was young, from cancer which developed after her exposure to toxic chemicals at a factory owned by Evil Corp. She has a strong relationship with her father, Don, though events at Allsafe begin to strain their relationship. As Angela navigates corporate politics, Don worries that his daughter approaches moral compromise.

 

Darlene is a malware coder whose skills are fundamental to fsociety’s master plan. Though biting and jaded, she becomes Elliot’s confidante. He relies on her resilience and creativity for quick problem solving and fast hacks. She is an excellent lock picker, a crass jokester and a jobless transient. She obtains money from hacking ATMs.

[Cardie]

The first season only has 10 episodes, according to imdb. Other current USA shows have had 13 episode summer seasons or 16 episode split seasons. I agree that Mr. Robot will be better served with fewer episodes per season.

 

That crane could be a symbol or could just have moved in real life between the shooting of the two scenes.

[wilnil]

Hmm... I think Elliot's lying about his hometown to make it hard for the conspiracy to dig up his background -- there are at least five "Washington Townships" in NJ (in five different counties), and there used to be more.

[ToastnBacon]

Gideon is Elliot and Tyrell is also Elliot. He has at least two split personalities...

Actually, I think the real person is Tyrell and Elliot is a split

[CheetaraThunder]

I honestly think the bigger surprise would be that it Slater's character isn't a hallucination, but actually real.

[editorgrrl]

I honestly think the bigger surprise would be that Slater's character isn't a hallucination…

… and someone totally unexpected is. For example, Krista (the therapist)—but that'd be too much like Perception, the Eric McCormack series. Shayla (and therefore Vera)? Edited to add: didn't Angela see Shayla in Elliot's bed?

The push makes me think Mr. Robot is Elliot's projection of his father. The flashback in the pilot only showed his mother.

Edited July 2, 2015 by editorgrrl

[Cardie]

The push makes me think Mr. Robot is Elliot's projection of his father.

 

I agree, editorgrrl.

[editorgrrl]

Right now it feels like they all could be figments of Elliot's imagination--even furry little Flipper who shat on the bed--maybe especially him.

So maybe we should be trying to figure out which one is real. I'm guessing it's a female person who is a damsel in distress, but it would be a nice twist if the damsels in distress are all representations of Elliot too.

Shayla was dead to the world when Angela saw her in Elliot's bed. I suspect she's a doll. Does Katrina ever blink?

Darlene starts conversations "already in progress," and Angela has agency: "Let me lose, okay?" I hope Angela's real—just because I love the idea of Ollie snarkily inviting Elliot to bring his sex doll on a double date.

[cardigirl]

Just checked out the cast on IMDb and Ollie, Krista (the therapist) and Shayla are only shown to be in 3 episodes.  Does that mean we've seen everything they're in or is IMDb unreliable?

[Cardie]

Just checked out the cast on IMDb and Ollie, Krista (the therapist) and Shayla are only shown to be in 3 episodes.  Does that mean we've seen everything they're in or is IMDb unreliable?

Their accounts can be unreliable until after a season has ended. I suspect they've only tracked the guest stars through episodes already aired.

[cardigirl]

That makes sense as the leads are shown to be in all 10 episodes.

[CodeNameDuchess]

Check out the language of this filming notice that mentions a simulated protest:

 

[areca]

The language is not abnormal.  I walked past one of those last year saying there would be a something along the lines of a bomb-threat simulation with a simulated response from SWAT at the end of the block at X time on Y day. 

[Ronin Jackson]

I honestly think the bigger surprise would be that it Slater's character isn't a hallucination, but actually real.

 

I've been actively hoping for this... if knowing the way the internet breaks everything down this was actually a big double fake out. One potentially cool twist on it would be if Elliot starts to believe Mr. Robot is just a figment of his imagination, and perhaps he believes himself responsible for crimes committed by Mr. Robot. He confesses, only to have the cops ask him why he's covering up for someone... then they show him a security camera still of a very real Mr. Robot committed the crime Elliot's just confessed to. Something to that effect at least...

 

Regardless if they go the Tyler Durden route it should have been revealed in the pilot. I'm not sure it isn't a potential copyright case for Chuck Palahniuk if that's all that's up here.

[djsunyc]

i am now of the mind that everyone and everything we are seeing is fake and in elliot's mind.  he is telling someone this story.  i can easily see him being in a mental institution telling this story to another person in there, or a therapist.  all the people in the show could be other mental patients or just people he encountered before he was institutionalized.

[that one guy]

Re: Tyrell - 

He was in the complex and in the actual washroom at the time the RPi was installed.  I'm more and more convinced that Tyrell will be the fall-guy for whatever goes down.

Moving this from the episode thread because the question about Mr. Robot's conversation with Tyrell is not who is Mr. Robot or why is Mr. Robot there, but why is Tyrell there, and the answer is Tyrell is behind the hack. He's responsible for getting Elliot to the second floor at Steel Mountain, making sure the door was unlocked from the bathroom. He's alarmed when he finds out about the honeypot. He's behind the attacks on his own company. Why?

[Cardie]

I wondered at the beginning whether Elliot's fragmented psyche had given him two choices about how to bring down Evil Corp. One was the ranting radical embodied in Mr. Robot and the other was the suave executive who destroys from within, embodied in Tyrell. This would require that the whole show be a story told by a madman rather than real world events skewed by his mental illness's perceptions. 

[Eldon]

i think tyrell and elliot are related. they are twin brothers.

[Eliz]

Sooooo, now that we know the finale includes a scene of someone being shot on live tv, what's the speculation on what those circumstances are?

[Human]

I'm speculating that it's a member of fsociety who does the shooting or is shot.  That Chekov's popcorn gun is just sitting there being all chekov-y.  Would be brilliant if it's Tyrell who shoots Elliot.  Tyrell gets to be the savior, I'm sure wifey would take him back.  This is, of course, assuming Tyrell does this with everyone knowing that he's shooting the kid responsible for global panic.  

Edited August 26, 2015 by Human

[Cardie]

Sooooo, now that we know the finale includes a scene of someone being shot on live tv, what's the speculation on what those circumstances are?

 

I wonder if they will pull the episode because three people got shot on live TV this morning. ETA: I see in the media thread that they have.

Edited August 26, 2015 by Cardie

[Hecate7]

Except that Tyrell isn't the suave executive at all. Not one single plan he's had has turned out. Every single thing we've ever seen him do, has backfired. He's lost his job, his wife, his child, and his self respect. He is a total loser, actually. AND he killed a person. I don't actually want to be asked to root for him.

[Human]

Except that Tyrell isn't the suave executive at all. Not one single plan he's had has turned out. Every single thing we've ever seen him do, has backfired. He's lost his job, his wife, his child, and his self respect. He is a total loser, actually. AND he killed a person. I don't actually want to be asked to root for him.

Sorry, I thought it was pretty apparent I was just talking out of my bum, especially since I called Tyrell a savior.  I assumed those watching would be aware that he's a pretty terrible person.  

[Cardie]

I think Tyrell will be the shooter but that he will target Scott Knowles or Michael Cristofer's character while they are being interviewed abut the attack or averted attack on ECorp. Of course that would make the situation even more like the Virginia one--crazy disgruntled employee gets revenge. Could the coincidence be that great? Tyrell will of course blame the shooting on fsociety.

[Hecate7]

Tyrell might be the shooter, but I kind of think the shooter is actually going to be someone who knows where the gun is.

[Avaleigh]

Tyrell totally wants to kill again IMO. That little speech he had when he described killing Sharon Knowles, I thought it seemed like he totally got off on the experience. His only regret is that he might have to face consequences.

[Hecate7]

I really, really, really hope Tyrell is not one of Elliott's personalities. He could be. All of their meetings have had a strange quality to them, a sort of surrealness that left me wondering if they really happened at all.

 

What worries me the most, is that if I'm not mistaken, the timing of the rooftop murder coincides too neatly with the death of Shayla for comfort. Someone tell me I'm getting that wrong, because I really, really like Elliott.

[Avaleigh]

Two things I've thought about when I consider whether or not Tyrell and Elliot could be the same person is that it seems like their downward spirals are kind of coinciding. Another thing is I feel like there's a similar quality in the men that are following them around even though they're being followed for different reasons.

Hecate7, I had similar thoughts about the timing of the deaths.

Edited September 6, 2015 by Avaleigh

[Hecate7]

So, has it been cancelled?

[formerlyfreedom]

So, has it been cancelled?

 

It was actually renewed for season two before it even started. So nope!

[xaxat]

Here's a spot to start season two speculation. A post finale interview with Sam Esmail where he discusses Chekhov's popcorn, what he told Michael Christofer during casting and thoughts on where the show might be headed.

 

https://youtu.be/r9L9t80VkjA

Edited September 3, 2015 by xaxat

[editorgrrl]

In the finale, Joanna treated Elliot like a disassociate personality—and he knew that she knew. ("She can hear us.") What if both he and Tyrell Wellick are alters, and she's only controlling with Tyrell?

In episode 9, Phillip told Tyrell, "There was a moment, Tyrell, a point in your recent past—a mistake, a compulsion, decision, something—that led you to this point right now. My only advice to you is find that moment, understand it. It's the only way to reconcile this this failure with yourself."

The personalities must reconcile themselves, so Tyrell went to talk to Elliot. But who's the "real" one—and who are the other alternates? After the finale's shot of her with "Elliot hair," I think Whiterose is one.

[Avaleigh]

It'll probably take me a couple of weeks but I'm going to rewatch the series with the idea that Tyrell and Elliot are the same person and see what works and what can't be explained. 

 

The main thing that is throwing me is the secretary not recognizing him but since Elliot is such an unreliable narrator I wonder if that simply comes down to him sometimes blocking out what he doesn't want to hear. 

 

I think Darlene and Joanna are keys to helping figure all of this out. There's a reason why we aren't seeing Darlene in any of the flashbacks and why Elliot almost seemed like an only child. 

 

Right now I think that Darlene is actually Tyrell's sister but again, there are a bunch of things about this that I haven't worked out yet and are just confusing in general. 

 

However it shakes out, I think this show is incredible so far. Very imaginative and exciting. 

[xaxat]

In episode 9, Phillip told Tyrell, "There was a moment, Tyrell, a point in your recent past—a mistake, a compulsion, decision, something—that led you to this point right now. My only advice to you is find that moment, understand it. It's the only way to reconcile this this failure with yourself."

 

I interpreted that as a sign that Phillip knew Tyrell had killed the CTO's wife.

[Avaleigh]

Tyrell walks into AllSafe with Terry Colby and the others. They're walking around the office and for whatever reason Tyrell immediately stops by to chat with Elliot. He introduces himself and says that he started out "exactly" where Elliot is and then says "To be honest, you know, my heart is still there."

Shayla comments that Elliot isn't on FB. I know obviously everyone doesn't have a FB account but I thought it was interesting to look at Elliot's reaction after she said that because he almost seemed nervous that she was looking into him even though it was likely only a basic search.

In the meeting, Angela doesn't really seem to notice Tyrell and Elliot seems like he's more of a presence. There wasn't really anything from the meeting to make me think that Elliot and Tyrell can't still be the same person.

Thoughts from Episode 2:

The meeting with Tyrell, Elliot, and the lawyers where Tyrell offers Elliot a job to come and join him at E-corp--to me it seems like it's a fantasy sequence and with me looking at it as Tyrell and Elliot possibly being the same person, I thought it seemed like Tyrell was trying to somehow unify these two personalities. He seems to already know what Elliot's response is going to be but he wants to try anyway. He's disappointed and sad but he thought he'd ask and see if it's a possibility.

Later on, Elliot is able to hack into whoever he's interested but when he hacks into Tyrell he completely freaks out. He sees a picture of Joanna and shots to indicate that Tyrell is happy and all of a sudden he flips out and wonders if Tyrells wants him to see this. He does his whole wipe routine after only getting the briefest glimpse of Tyrell's life. He hasn't had that sort of reaction with any other person he's tried to hack.

I didn't finish the second episode but I thought Elliot's freak out after hacking Tyrell was an interesting point in favor of the theory that they're the same person.

ETA:

A couple of other observations.

Elliot thinks 'something isn't right' once he starts to look at pics of Tyrell's life. It reminded me of when he thought 'there's something about her'.

Also, Tyrell desperately wanting Elliot to "join him" at E-corp makes me think that Tyrell already realized that he was on the verge of flipping out again and this was an attempt to fix things before they ended up getting out of hand to the point where he does something similar to whatever landed him in hot water in the first place so that he has to have these sessions with Krista. (Again, assuming Elliot = Tyrell.)

Edited September 5, 2015 by Avaleigh

[editorgrrl]

I think it's preposterous to suspect everyone of being either one of Elliot's alter egos, or a figment of his imagination.

I watched Lost this way, and ended up enjoying it a lot more than most, gauging from viewer reaction on the internets. I watch

Last Man on Earth that way, too. And the series finale of Breaking Bad.

(Those aren't actual spoilers, but I don't want to "ruin" anyone's viewing experience of those other shows with my worldview. Once you trust no one, you watch the show differently.)

Can [Gideon] not be corrupt or die? Fuck corruption or death. I really am rooting for this one. Please don't make him the sacrificial lamb you are aiming for, show!

Elliot said that Gideon is a good man. What if he's the real protagonist—a middle-aged worker bee with a rich fantasy life in which he owns his own business, fights cyber crime, and has a perfect boyfriend.

What I like about this show is the ambiguity. xaxat and I can watch the same scene and have two interpretations—both of which are valid.

Edited September 5, 2015 by editorgrrl

[Avaleigh]

Since the show has gone out of its way to show what an unreliable narrator Elliot is in addition to showing that he has fullblown and long running hallucinationson a rregular basis, I don't think it's preposterous at all to keep in mind the possibility that something might be a figment of his imagination.

i think tyrell and elliot are related. they are twin brothers.

I've considered the possibility that they're related but I feel like there's too much that doesn't fit especially if they're supposed to be identical twins.

They have different last names. Elliot doesn't speak Swedish or understand Danish. They don't look like twins. Elliot's childhood memories don't include a twin or brother. Darlene never mentions another sibling and neither does Angela. Neither does Mr. Robot.

[qtpye]

Does anyone think there could be anything to the fact that Elliot's last name is of Scandinavian origin and Tyrell is Swedish?  Is Elliot actually Mr. Robot's step son and Tyrell is biological son from a previous marriage, whose mother took him back to Sweden?  Or perhaps they are both his biological sons from different women and Elliot's looks just favor his mother's more exotic coloring? 

 

I am obviously grasping at straws.

Edited September 5, 2015 by qtpye

[WentMissing]

Well you're not completley grasping at straws with the first question. There is an interview with Esmail where the interviewer asks him to respond to a Buzzfeed post where the writer felt Esmail whitewashed Elliot with the name. Esmail said there was a specific reason he named Elliot what he did. So it will be interesting to see if you're on to something with that. Good catch.

Edited September 5, 2015 by WentMissing

[qtpye]

Well, thank you guys for humoring my crackpot theories.  If we go further with Elliot and Tyrell are half brothers then perhaps they suffer from the same mental illness because of biology and because they were raised by Christian Slater's character.  Perhaps Mr. Robot, in real life, was a very ordinary man who had visions of grandeur.  Maybe he pushed his sons to be competitive in very different ways.  Tyrell went for the more traditional route of wealth and power, while Elliot became the counter culture revolutionary.  It is this relentless drive to succeed that is causing both of them to become unraveled.

 

Mr. Robot could have been a total narcissist who only saw his children at extension of himself.  He could not separate where he began and his sons ended.

 

This also caused his son to be ultra competitive with each other.

 

Again, these are only shots in the dark theories.

Edited September 5, 2015 by qtpye

[Hecate7]

Does anyone think there could be anything to the fact that Elliot's last name is of Scandinavian origin and Tyrell is Swedish?  Is Elliot actually Mr. Robot's step son and Tyrell is biological son from a previous marriage, whose mother took him back to Sweden?  Or perhaps they are both his biological sons from different women and Elliot's looks just favor his mother's more exotic coloring? 

 

I am obviously grasping at straws.

 

Tyrell is Swedish. The first thing he converses with Elliot about is Linux. Linux is Swedish. I think that's it right there. I don't think Tyrell is real. He symbolizes what Elliot loses, by being Elliot.

 

At the beginning, Elliot doesn't remember his father--he remembers the grudge with Evilcorp, but not what his father looked like. He doesn't remember that Darlene is his sister. So he could also be forgetting a wife, a job, a whole life somewhere. He seems at the beginning to be given a choice between Tyrell, and Christian Slater. He makes the better choice.

 

Shayla and Sharon bother me, because they start with the same letters and they died at the same time. I don't like the thought, but I can't help wondering. Maybe Tyrell IS real, and Elliot doesn't remember helping him fake his own death and leave the country. Or maybe Tyrell is in prison already. Or maybe he's not real and didn't actually do the murder either--he's dissociative, so he might have just witnessed a murder, as opposed to committing it. Sounds unlikely, I know, but it's possible. One thing we have definitely established is that Elliot doesn't remember most of his life, and is not at all sure who he is or who he knows.

[Avaleigh]

I'm super excited to dive into this once I have some time off because I feel like there are all sort of things that we are going to notice that we didn't necessarily catch before. 

 

Tyrell is Swedish. The first thing he converses with Elliot about is Linux. Linux is Swedish. I think that's it right there. I don't think Tyrell is real. He symbolizes what Elliot loses, by being Elliot.

 

At the beginning, Elliot doesn't remember his father--he remembers the grudge with Evilcorp, but not what his father looked like. He doesn't remember that Darlene is his sister. So he could also be forgetting a wife, a job, a whole life somewhere. He seems at the beginning to be given a choice between Tyrell, and Christian Slater. He makes the better choice.

 

Shayla and Sharon bother me, because they start with the same letters and they died at the same time. I don't like the thought, but I can't help wondering. Maybe Tyrell IS real, and Elliot doesn't remember helping him fake his own death and leave the country. Or maybe Tyrell is in prison already. Or maybe he's not real and didn't actually do the murder either--he's dissociative, so he might have just witnessed a murder, as opposed to committing it. Sounds unlikely, I know, but it's possible. One thing we have definitely established is that Elliot doesn't remember most of his life, and is not at all sure who he is or who he knows.

I actually wanted Elliot to be the real one. It was in thinking that Elliot was the real one that I felt like I'd stumbled upon evidence for the opposite. 

 

I strongly got the impression that Elliot knew that Shayla was on a wild goose chase when she tried to search for info on him online. 

 

I'm totally speculating here. I just want to throw out some ideas to see if anything makes sense. 

 

If Elliot and Tyrell are brothers (and I have huge doubts about this to the point where I lean away from this part of it being true) could that be what Elliot's name is all about? Elliot Alderson. It makes me think of Elliot being the eldest son. Also, the comments abot Esmail saying that he chose Elliot's name very deliberately. I know they aren't the same but I can see a similarity in the names Tyrell and Elliot. Another thing this makes me consider are the names Joanna and Angela. While I don't see a direct connection between Joanna and Angela yet I do think that there is a kind of similarity in their names. Joanna is supposedly a gift from God while Angela is basically another godly gift in the form of an angel. 

 

Huge what if, I don't have anything to back this up yet I'm just trying to consider possibilities other than Elliot and Tyrell being related or at least not being brothers. 

 

Could Elliot have been a friend of Tyrell's? Or, apart from that, could young Elliot and his mother and father all be dead? I'm thinking of Elliot seeing all of them at the same specific age when he's in Times Square and again, without Darlene in anywhere in sight. There's something ageless about them. It's timeless. Like why doesn't Elliot imagine them at various points before his father's death or afterward? Also, doesn't Darlene seem to have clear memories of her father? Yet, from what we've seen, it seems like her father would have died when she was super young if her mother was indeed pregnant in the flashbacks where Elliot is about nine(?) or so. This is one of the things that made me think that Darlene could in fact be Tyrell's sister. I honestly won't be a bit surprised if we end up seeing pics of Darlene and Tyrell together at some point when they were younger. I think there's a significant reason why Darlene has been left out of the flashbacks. 

 

I definitely have more thoughts but have to run. Hopefully I'll get a chance to finish episode 2 and then start on three. I think we get the first Joanna appearance in episode three. 

[Cardie]

Have we ever seen a photograph of adult Elliot? Does he look like Rami Malek? What I'm getting at is, if Elliot and Tyrell are one (on which I'm decidedly torn), does he actually look like Martin Wallstrom even if it's the Tyrell personality that he's fabricated? This still doesn't fix the fact that Gideon knows both of them and doesn't comment upon their looking alike.

[formerlyfreedom]

Folks, we have a new topic for Season Two Anticipation; let's please keep this topic for spoilers, and take our wild ideas over to Anticipation. Thanks!