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Season 11 Anticipation More Stabs, etc...

thewhiteowl

By thewhiteowl
in Criminal Minds

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secnarf
secnarf

Maybe with the lack of "brawn" on the team, they'll get back to the "brains" - profiling criminals' minds.

JMO
JMO

Regardless of how it's billed up front, or the credits, or whatever, it's an ensemble show.  Functionally, they are all main characters and they are all supporting characters, with the nature of their

missmycat
missmycat

There is simply no other possibilities. The mole has to be either Henry or Jack.

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JMO

JMO

(edited)

I'd be more excited about the finale idea if we hadn't just had Morgan targeted by a group of hitmen, or the Replicator targeting the team, or terrorists targeting JJ.  I don't mind the 'team member in peril' idea----I actually enjoy the angst.  But I'd rather they got there by chasing serial killers, rather than being on the target end of things.  

 

On the plus side, it looks like we get to see a little Mr. Scratch aftermath.

Edited by JMO
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smoker

smoker

Agree, but it seems this week is going to be Hotch free (or almost), so I'm going to take it as it comes while I hope we could enjoy an entertaining finale


Glad you're feeling better.

Thank you Bookish!

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Danielg342

Danielg342

*sigh*

 

Like the idea, but why couldn't they use a serial killer they've had on the show before? Why create a whole new one for this episode? I guess "yay" for Frances Fisher, but still...we've had some serial killers on this show before. Memorable ones. Can we bring them back?

 

I also really don't hope the finale is a cliffhanger. Unless the show is definitively coming back, it'll leave all of us with egg on our faces.

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smoker

smoker

(edited)

*sigh*

Like the idea, but why couldn't they use a serial killer they've had on the show before? Why create a whole new one for this episode? I guess "yay" for Frances Fisher, but still...we've had some serial killers on this show before. Memorable ones. Can we bring them back?

I also really don't hope the finale is a cliffhanger. Unless the show is definitively coming back, it'll leave all of us with egg on our faces.

I would have loved it if The Fox had been behind this.

I've always thought revisiting his part on Foyet's plan would be pretty interesting, actually, well written, it would be fascinating. After all, Foyet killed Haley in their home and that was where The fox murdered his victims. Moreover, their exchange of notes was inspired by Hannibal and The red dragon.

I never liked Gideon-Frank chemistry/dinamic, but Hotch-Foyet-The fox are an attractive threesome for me.

Edited by smoker
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Cobalt Stargazer

Cobalt Stargazer

Like the idea, but why couldn't they use a serial killer they've had on the show before? Why create a whole new one for this episode? I guess "yay" for Frances Fisher, but still...we've had some serial killers on this show before. Memorable ones. Can we bring them back?

 

In fairness, if you've seen Frances Fisher in anything ever, she's got that whole "woman on the verge of a psychotic break" thing going. Even when she played Kate Winslet's mother in Titanic, she seemed like the kind of broad who would have killed Rose in her sleep if it seemed like the financially beneficial marriage was about to fall through.

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Danielg342

Danielg342

I would have loved it if The Fox had been behind this.

I've always thought revisiting his part on Foyet's plan would be pretty interesting, actually, well written, it would be fascinating. After all, Foyet killed Haley in their home and that was where The fox murdered his victims. Moreover, their exchange of notes was inspired by Hannibal and The red dragon.

I never liked Gideon-Frank chemistry/dinamic, but Hotch-Foyet-The fox are an attractive threesome for me.

 

Yeah, The Fox...especially if it was to help "profile" Hotch. He seemed like he could be a valuable resource to get inside the minds of other killers and since he got inside Hotch's head, he'd sure know who else would have tricked him.

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MMC

MMC

I can't get enough of that promo.MGG is amazing. He can convey so much without having to speak a word.And in my opinion no one on this show does it better than him. The look on Reid's face is priceless.It is a damn shame that someone with his talent, as well as someone with TG's talents often have to take a backseat to their more mediocre cast members. Simply because A they are not the show runners favorites.And B CBS doesn't feel the need to have them constantly out front and center dominating so damn many episodes just so they can prove they aren't the sexist pigs they have been accused of in the past.

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Bookish Jen

Bookish Jen

I can't get enough of that promo.MGG is amazing. He can convey so much without having to speak a word.And in my opinion no one on this show does it better than him. The look on Reid's face is priceless.It is a damn shame that someone with his talent, as well as someone with TG's talents often have to take a backseat to their more mediocre cast members. Simply because A they are not the show runners favorites.And B CBS doesn't feel the need to have them constantly out front and center dominating so damn many episodes just so they can prove they aren't the sexist pigs they have been accused of in the past.

Matthew is very subtle with his acting; he doesn't chew scenery. He can say so much with just his eyes and facial expressions and a subtle gesture. The morgue scene where he wipes up that single tear with a shaking hand guts me every single time I see it. Too bad the powers that be don't treasure his talents the way we do.

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Droogie

Droogie

(edited)

Matthew is very subtle with his acting ... He can say so much with just his eyes and facial expressions and a subtle gesture. The morgue scene where he wipes up that single tear with a shaking hand guts me every single time I see it.

Oh me too. Just reading about it sends me.

Edited by Droogie
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ReidFan

ReidFan

that single tear, that's real and not a glycerin drop or eye irritant induced. Just like the real tears in Entropy and in Beautiful Disaster.

 

He's a master, he really is. And he deserves so much better than the drek they write for his character in the show most of the time. Gimme a Breen or Kirsten script for him, please.....

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Bookish Jen

Bookish Jen

ReidFan, while watching the snippet of the Mr. Scratch commentary you so lovingly sent to me, I noted how Matthew mentioned how something implied is more frightening than something that is totally in your face. And this is so true, which is why Mr. Scratch freaked me out so much that even my ponytail brushing the back of my neck kind of freaked me out for a moment while I was watching the first airing of Mr. Scratch last spring.

 

And you could say the same thing about Matthew's subtlety as an actor gets to me, too. Matthew's acting style is very empathetic; he doesn't just feel for Spencer; he also feels with him.

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ReidFan

ReidFan

(edited)

I've screencapped Nelson's Sparrow to death too. But no, that screencapture was in reply to smoker's post above about the promo for Devil's Backbone, and  MMC's post about not getting enough of it (I'm assuming she means the promo as well :D )

 

but in case I'm wrong....

 

Screen%20Shot%202016-01-02%20at%205.30.4

Edited by ReidFan
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ReidFan

ReidFan

oh, you're right, AutumnMtns--the single tear thing was from Nelson's Sparrow. The screencapture of Reid holding the tissue to his face is from Nelson's Sparrow.  I was merely saying that I thought they were talking about the promo for "Devil's Backbone" but I guess smoker and/or MMC will have to clarify that :) (hence, the OTHER screencap, from Devil's Backbone promo)

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MMC

MMC

OMG I totally loved that scene at the morgue with Reid, Morgan and Gideon's body. MGG was wonderful. And I loved Morgan's tenderness and compassion with an obviously greiving Reid,urging Reid not to shut them out like he has done in the past.

But yes Reidfan it is the Promo for 'The Devil's Backbone' I am talking about. The expression on Reid's face when she suddenly grabs hold of his hand is priceless. I am so hoping since this is a Sharon Lee Watson episode we wll get some good Reid. I also got to say that this is the first episode since 'Entropy' that I have even wanted to watch.

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autumnmountains

autumnmountains

(edited)

OMG I totally loved that scene at the morgue with Reid, Morgan and Gideon's body. MGG was wonderful. And I loved Morgan's tenderness and compassion with an obviously greiving Reid,urging Reid not to shut them out like he has done in the past.

But yes Reidfan it is the Promo for 'The Devil's Backbone' I am talking about. The expression on Reid's face when she suddenly grabs hold of his hand is priceless. I am so hoping since this is a Sharon Lee Watson episode we wll get some good Reid. I also got to say that this is the first episode since 'Entropy' that I have even wanted to watch.

Sorry about that, I think I got confused with the quote about the single tear and erugh. Sorry :) t wasn't trying to respond to your promo quote, I was trying to respond to the single tear in morgue post. :)

Edited by autumnmountains
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Bookish Jen

Bookish Jen

(edited)

OMG I totally loved that scene at the morgue with Reid, Morgan and Gideon's body. MGG was wonderful. And I loved Morgan's tenderness and compassion with an obviously greiving Reid,urging Reid not to shut them out like he has done in the past.

But yes Reidfan it is the Promo for 'The Devil's Backbone' I am talking about. The expression on Reid's face when she suddenly grabs hold of his hand is priceless. I am so hoping since this is a Sharon Lee Watson episode we wll get some good Reid. I also got to say that this is the first episode since 'Entropy' that I have even wanted to watch.

Yes, it is this scene that always gets to me. Just seeing the gif gets to me. And I would be remiss not to note Morgan showing a deep compassion for Spencer's grief and reminding him not to shut them out. I think Spencer is so used to not having his mental and emotional needs taken care as much as they should have of since he was a little boy that has made him put up walls rather than accepting the love and empathy the world wants to give him. I relate to this way too well, and this could be why Spencer is such a palpable character to me, and to probably a lot of others.

 

One of my friends decided to watch a few episodes of CM even though crime-related TV programs aren't her thing. I told her to catch a few of the earlier season episodes, which she did. After she watched a few episodes on ION or A & E she told me she finally knew why I am so drawn to Spencer. She said his empathy, kindness, introversion and love of knowledge are qualities I value in myself and in others, so wouldn't why value them in a fictional character? Yes, she noted Matthew's good looks, but she also said he is a very good actor.

Edited by Bookish Jen
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Bookish Jen

Bookish Jen

I just read this, there are Messer's comments related to the finale... they are "the bomb"...

http://www.tvguide.com/special/finale-preview/spoilers/

Thanks for this link, smoker. I'm thrilled to my ballet flats that Mr. Scratch is being revisited, and Hotch will play a pivotal role. Squee!!

But I have to comment on the picture accompanying the episode description copy-why is Spencer in the corner like a wayward schoolboy being punished?

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ReidFan

ReidFan

But I have to comment on the picture accompanying the episode description copy-why is Spencer in the corner like a wayward schoolboy being punished?

:::evil grin::: he's just back from the spanking I gave him?  O:-)

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Mislav

Mislav

oh, you're right, AutumnMtns--the single tear thing was from Nelson's Sparrow. The screencapture of Reid holding the tissue to his face is from Nelson's Sparrow. I was merely saying that I thought they were talking about the promo for "Devil's Backbone" but I guess smoker and/or MMC will have to clarify that :) (hence, the OTHER screencap, from Devil's Backbone promo)

Yes, that scene in the "Nelson's Sparrow" was (well, is) incredibly moving. Especially the part where Matthew so convincingly tries not to cry and loses it the mere seconds after Derek reminds him that Gideon didn't suffer. Beautifully acted.

I liked "Entropy" even better, since Spencer plays a bigger role there than in "Nelson's Sparrow" and has to stay professional while going through so much. The final scene is very poignant though I think it still ended on a more optimistic note than "Nelson's Sparrow".

Recently, I read some posts on IMDb saying that "Nelson's Sparrow" should have been the 200th episode. Though I am not sure about that, it is a great episode and it would have been much better than "200". The only thing I dislike is the mere fact that they killed off Gideon and the way the murder played out (what happened to that whole surveillance system in his cabin, first featured in "The Fisher King Part 1")? But hey, you can't have everything.

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SSAHotchner

SSAHotchner

Yes, that scene in the "Nelson's Sparrow" was (well, is) incredibly moving. Especially the part where Matthew so convincingly tries not to cry and loses it the mere seconds after Derek reminds him that Gideon didn't suffer. Beautifully acted.

I liked "Entropy" even better, since Spencer plays a bigger role there than in "Nelson's Sparrow" and has to stay professional while going through so much. The final scene is very poignant though I think it still ended on a more optimistic note than "Nelson's Sparrow".

Recently, I read some posts on IMDb saying that "Nelson's Sparrow" should have been the 200th episode. Though I am not sure about that, it is a great episode and it would have been much better than "200". The only thing I dislike is the mere fact that they killed off Gideon and the way the murder played out (what happened to that whole surveillance system in his cabin, first featured in "The Fisher King Part 1")? But hey, you can't have everything.

I didn't mind that they killed him off, only the way in which they did it. Gideon never would have been outsmarted by that unsub. He was completely crazy. And you're right about the surveillance system. If anything, it would have been more sophisticated by now. I also didn't like the fake relationship between Rossi and Gideon. Prior to Nelson's Sparrow, Rossi had never been anything but dismissive and contemptuous of Gideon. I'm sure the writers used Rossi to convey their annoyance at the way Mandy deserted the show and left them in the lurch having to rewrite scripts without him. 

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smoker

smoker

I didn't mind that they killed him off, only the way in which they did it. Gideon never would have been outsmarted by that unsub. He was completely crazy. And you're right about the surveillance system. If anything, it would have been more sophisticated by now. I also didn't like the fake relationship between Rossi and Gideon. Prior to Nelson's Sparrow, Rossi had never been anything but dismissive and contemptuous of Gideon. I'm sure the writers used Rossi to convey their annoyance at the way Mandy deserted the show and left them in the lurch having to rewrite scripts without him. 

Agree.

I think the line Rossi says maybe they were never friends in the first place, that was their real relationship, everything else was just nostalgia (bad writing) and of course, he was sorry Gideon was murdered. They were just coworkers, partners, and they had to be civil because they were building the "BAU". I've always had the theory Gideon and Rossi got the cases nobody else wanted because they were the freak and positive discrimination agents and they took advantage of that, Gideon because that was his goal and Rossi because he was ambitious.

I can envision Rossi being as bad partner as Max Ryan if he had been in a few episodes instead of being a main character. The kind of mentor who treats you like shit and teachs you nothing.At least, you could learn from Gideon.

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Danielg342

Danielg342

(edited)

"Nelson's Sparrow" screwed up the timeline even more because Max Ryan should have been on that case. Ryan trained Gideon and thus he started at the BAU before Gideon.

 

Ryan was always one character I would have loved to see again, especially with Rossi. He's so similar to Rossi- in fact, I think Rossi was based on Ryan- that I could see the two of them have rather heated and prolonged exchanges, full of Rossi's snark and Ryan's pomposity. Unfortunately, I don't see much of a role for Gideon except as peacemaker between the two- and it's not much of a use for him.

 

Still, Ryan vs. Rossi would be fun.

Edited by Danielg342
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Bookish Jen

Bookish Jen

I didn't mind that they killed him off, only the way in which they did it. Gideon never would have been outsmarted by that unsub. He was completely crazy. And you're right about the surveillance system. If anything, it would have been more sophisticated by now. I also didn't like the fake relationship between Rossi and Gideon. Prior to Nelson's Sparrow, Rossi had never been anything but dismissive and contemptuous of Gideon. I'm sure the writers used Rossi to convey their annoyance at the way Mandy deserted the show and left them in the lurch having to rewrite scripts without him. 

I agree with you so much on Gideon's sad demise. Like you mentioned Gideon was way too smart to be outwitted by an unsub, plus his cabin had a surveillance system. If Gideon had to die, it should have been of natural causes or perhaps he died due to a heart attack or of cancer. I can imagine Spencer really feeling horrible over losing Gideon to cancer because he didn't reach out to his old colleagues at the BAU to let them know and say their final goodbyes before Gideon died (and yes, this could have been done without Mandy Pantinkin). This would have crushed Spencer considering Gideon was a mentor to him and in a way, a father figure.

 

And as mentioned, the modern day Rossi seemed to have a bit of a contempt for modern day Gideon so the flashback scenes of Rossi and Gideon in their younger years, and the infancy of the BAU, just rang false to me. It would have made more sense if the scenes showed a professional, but somewhat chilly relationship between the two.

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smoker

smoker

(edited)

I've watched the sneak peaks, there is one thing I didn't like. The way Reid acted with Henry and Jack, I don't think it was an appropiate behavior under such circumstances. We know Henry is his godson but all that landed better on García's territory.

Another think it looked weird was in promotional pictures, agents walking next to Hotch when he is already arrested, they look like mafia bodyguards.

Aside of those things, I'm still crossing my fingers for a decent and entertaining finale :D

Edited by smoker
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Droogie

Droogie

Personally, I thought Reid was great with the children -- the "Reid effect" has long disappeared.  Henry approached him animatedly, considering the circumstances, and then Jack's response would've been pretty natural for a child who'd just seen his father arrested.  

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autumnmountains

autumnmountains

26 minutes ago, Droogie said:

Personally, I thought Reid was great with the children -- the "Reid effect" has long disappeared.  Henry approached him animatedly, considering the circumstances, and then Jack's response would've been pretty natural for a child who'd just seen his father arrested.  

Same here. I thought that in the promo, Reid was perfect with them . 

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smoker

smoker

(edited)

there is something off in my opinion, maybe is JJ (and her family), she's become so disgusting as a character (for me) I can't enjoy anything where her personal life steals the attention from the main plot. 

She should have let her family and Jack in Hotch's office and go to work with the team later, in my opinion. But no scene for AJ's Children then. And what about Jessica? Isn't anyone calling her to be with Jack?

Edited by smoker
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MMC

MMC

1 hour ago, smoker said:

there is something off in my opinion, maybe is JJ (and her family), she's become so disgusting as a character (for me) I can't enjoy anything where her personal life steals the attention from the main plot. 

She should have let her family and Jack in Hotch's office and go to work with the team later, in my opinion. But no scene for AJ's Children then. And what about Jessica? Isn't anyone calling her to be with Jack?

I too neither give a rat's ass about JJ and her personal life.And I am hoping that it isn't going to take up a good deal of the plot after all this is suppose to be about Hotch. However I will admit to looking forward to seeing Phoenix/Michael. I thought he was so adorable in that one behind the scene picture AJ posted of him.

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SSAHotchner

SSAHotchner

I feel like they've shown quite a bit of the episode in the promos, but it does look good. I'm thinking that Jack is safer at the BAU than with Jessica since they don't really know what is happening, who's behind it, etc. 

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MMC

MMC

2 hours ago, Droogie said:

Personally, I thought Reid was great with the children -- the "Reid effect" has long disappeared.  Henry approached him animatedly, considering the circumstances, and then Jack's response would've been pretty natural for a child who'd just seen his father arrested.  

I totally agree. Reid is Henry's godfather and the line about the magic tricks was very fitting as we've seen in the past Reid trying to teach him a magic trick. And I also feel that Jack's behavior was spot on considering the poor kid was probably still somewhat in shock after witnessing his father's arrest. In a way this was worse than when his mother was murdered.Because back then he was too young to have even grasp the horror of what was going on.Well Jack is older now and he is more aware of things even if he doesn't understand why they happen.

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ForeverAlone

ForeverAlone

I am rather leery of this episode based on the sneak peeks I've seen. Hotch's arrest seems just so over the top. I imagine there will be some explanation for all of this, but considering who is writing part of this episode, I fear it won't be a good one. 

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MMC

MMC

27 minutes ago, ForeverAlone said:

I am rather leery of this episode based on the sneak peeks I've seen. Hotch's arrest seems just so over the top. I imagine there will be some explanation for all of this, but considering who is writing part of this episode, I fear it won't be a good one. 

I agree that it was totally over the top especially since at that moment Hotch wasn't being any kind of threat.It is moments like these that I find myself missing Ed Bernero even more. Because as a former cop he was more realistic in his approach to stuff like this.Erica just seems to want to create drama for the sake of shock value.

And I am really hoping E.M. isn't just talking out of her ass about this episode being team centric. But my fear is, with her having co written it, it will be yet another season finale where Reid isn't all that significant.

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