RW: Boston (1997)

[Liamsmom617]

On 10/19/2021 at 5:33 PM, Bastet said:

Thank goodness (that he won't do a Homecoming season, not that he intends to inflict himself on the public again).  Hopefully that means if there is a SF season, Rachel won't appear.

Okay, I know the reason why is he didn't respond and they didn't want to keep spamming his phone with something he wasn't part of, but this still makes me laugh.

That's sweet.

I'd actually be surprised if Rachel the camera whore DIDN'T appear. I hated her ass back then and I hate her even more now.  It's like her eventual friendship with Pedro meant NOTHING to her. She's reprehensible.

[Tatum]

I've tried watching Boston a few times on YouTube. Boston and Chicago (2002) were the only seasons I watched in entirety. Elka was my favorite, probably because watching it I was a sheltered 13 year old white suburbanite, and Kameelah was my least favorite. I thought she was a total bitch. Watching it as an adult, it's amazing to see what I didn't notice at 13. Because Elka was polite to people's faces (most of the time), and non confrontational (although all the roommates agreed she was the biggest shit talker behind people's backs), and Kameelah was just so straight forward all the time in what she said, I thought Elka was the kinder of the two. They were both 19, so really, a lot can be forgiven, but it's a very interesting contrast.

 

I remember in the Real World Boston book, Anthony said Elka was nice to the kids for the most part but spent a lot of time gossiping, while Kameelah was a doer, not a dreamer, and the only cast member he would have hired of his own accord.

 

That said, all five Road Rulers unanimously agreed during their meetup that Kameelah was unpleasant. I think Vince called her an evil ball breaker, Kalle called her a snot, and Erika said all the women of RW were some of the most unfriendly, rudest women she had ever met.

[choclatechip45]

5 hours ago, Tatum said:

I've tried watching Boston a few times on YouTube. Boston and Chicago (2002) were the only seasons I watched in entirety. Elka was my favorite, probably because watching it I was a sheltered 13 year old white suburbanite, and Kameelah was my least favorite. I thought she was a total bitch. Watching it as an adult, it's amazing to see what I didn't notice at 13. Because Elka was polite to people's faces (most of the time), and non confrontational (although all the roommates agreed she was the biggest shit talker behind people's backs), and Kameelah was just so straight forward all the time in what she said, I thought Elka was the kinder of the two. They were both 19, so really, a lot can be forgiven, but it's a very interesting contrast.

 

I remember in the Real World Boston book, Anthony said Elka was nice to the kids for the most part but spent a lot of time gossiping, while Kameelah was a doer, not a dreamer, and the only cast member he would have hired of his own accord.

 

That said, all five Road Rulers unanimously agreed during their meetup that Kameelah was unpleasant. I think Vince called her an evil ball breaker, Kalle called her a snot, and Erika said all the women of RW were some of the most unfriendly, rudest women she had ever met.

Didn't Erika sleep with Sean? Real World women love to get all possessive of their guy roommates.  

[Black Knight]

21 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Didn't Erika sleep with Sean? Real World women love to get all possessive of their guy roommates.  

I don't remember about Erika, but I don't think Kameelah would have cared about that. Sean wasn't part of her side of the Boston house split. She did care about who Syrus was sleeping with, but that was because they were both Black.

[Asp Burger]

Kameelah probably just wasn't into the Road Rules crossover and didn't go out of her way to be pleasant. I liked a lot of what she had to say in Boston, but she'd be the first to admit that she grew up a lot and being more tolerant in the few years after her season. The Kameelah of Extreme Challenge and the reunion shows was much improved.

I listened to an interview with her from last year, and I was surprised she totally blanked on Seattle Rebecca being her Challenge teammate. They seemed close, both there and in the 2001 reunion, where I remember a scene of Kameelah talking to Irene from LA and then screaming and running to hug Rebecca when Rebecca walked in. In the 2021 interview, Kameelah was naming just about everyone else, even Susie from the Road Rules team. 

[choclatechip45]

1 hour ago, Asp Burger said:

Kameelah probably just wasn't into the Road Rules crossover and didn't go out of her way to be pleasant. I liked a lot of what she had to say in Boston, but she'd be the first to admit that she grew up a lot and being more tolerant in the few years after her season. The Kameelah of Extreme Challenge and the reunion shows was much improved.

I listened to an interview with her from last year, and I was surprised she totally blanked on Seattle Rebecca being her Challenge teammate. They seemed close, both there and in the 2001 reunion, where I remember a scene of Kameelah talking to Irene from LA and then screaming and running to hug Rebecca when Rebecca walked in. In the 2021 interview, Kameelah was naming just about everyone else, even Susie from the Road Rules team. 

Kameelah did an interview with Susie it sounded like they kept in touch over the years.

[snarts]

9 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

Didn't Erika sleep with Sean? Real World women love to get all possessive of their guy roommates.  

Who is Erika?  Elka did not sleep with Sean, she was a virgin.

[choclatechip45]

3 hours ago, snarts said:

Who is Erika?  Elka did not sleep with Sean, she was a virgin.

Erika was from Road Rules Island. The first ever crossover episode was between Road Rules Islands and Real World Boston.

[Tatum]

Erika and Sean made out, I don't think they had sex. They could have, but I kind of doubt it. I don't think Kameelah and Genesis were very possessive of Sean; they both pretty much hated him at that point. I am drawing a blank on that episode; I don't remember the groups being hostile to each other but each cast had really mean things to say about the opposing cast. I read it in my Insider's Guide to RW: Season 7 back when I was in middle school :).

[snarts]

7 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

Erika was from Road Rules Island. The first ever crossover episode was between Road Rules Islands and Real World Boston.

Thanks, read it before my coffee and thought you meant Elka. 

I forgot all about the Sean/Erika hookup, 

Damn, I wish P+ (or someone) would stream Road Rules. 

[Tatum]

1 minute ago, snarts said:

Thanks, read it before my coffee and thought you meant Elka. 

I forgot all about the Sean/Erika hookup, 

Damn, I wish P+ (or someone) would stream Road Rules. 

Road Rules Islands and Europe are both intermittently available on Youtube. I don't see them now, but they'll be back up at some point. The video quality can be pretty poor, but it's cool to hear all the original songs playing, a lot of them I'd forgotten about. I heard years ago that the Road Rules was sold to some syndicate in the late 90s and it's not clear who currently has the rights to the early seasons of the show.

[Asp Burger]

Something I liked about this season that may be unique is that they were shooting in winter in a city that can have harsh winters. At least for the first part of the season, they were stuck in that damn firehouse with each other with nowhere to run, unless they were bundling up like ticks about to pop (tm A Christmas Story) to go for walks. It gives it a very different vibe from the other seasons of the golden age, such as the two California seasons, Miami, Hawaii. Only New York had anything like the same potential.

And 1997 was a long winter for that region, with Boston getting the worst of the April Fool's Day blizzard.

By the time they did Chicago (and the weather was, to my understanding, the reason it took so long for Real World to get to Chicago), they were shooting two seasons a year, and they could defer that one until summer/fall.

Edited April 26, 2022 by Asp Burger

[choclatechip45]

I am watching this season,  how much was the Genesis/Adam storyline manufactured by editing? or was she really in love with him?

[BelleBrit]

I enjoyed seeing the brief clip from the Boston season/Kameelah in the last episode of Homecoming: New Orleans. I wish that they could just do a Homecoming season without Sean-no reason he is needed. I generally liked everyone on the season, but there were many problematic things about Sean, especially in retrospective, before even taking into account his career as a congressman. I remember him saying in the Puerto Rico episode that he really got the sense that he would have gotten into a better law school if he had been African American (eye-roll), and the worst was when he was making some bizarre claim towards the end of the season that Kameelah wanted to “enslave white people.” I did like seeing his friendship with Montana and Syrus. It’s interesting that for some cast members like Sean who reportedly came in with a girlfriend (even though we later see him hook up with other girls), it doesn’t become a storyline for the season.

 I wonder if it works against them that the others are all in contact and on good terms with each other. I saw an interview with Montana where she said that there were some things she would not look forward to revisiting, like being called a whore and the claim that she gave wine to the kids (which she still denies-and then there was a separate interview I watched with Genesis where she was like “Oh yeah, didn’t Montana get fired for giving wine to kids?” HAHA).

[Black Knight]

3 hours ago, BelleBrit said:

I wonder if it works against them that the others are all in contact and on good terms with each other.

I wonder that too. It would be very easy for them to make a pre-homecoming agreement about how they'd handle everything in a way that eliminates any potential for drama. Avoiding certain topics, agreeing that if someone wants to claim something about their time on the show the others won't challenge it (like Montana giving wine to kids), etc. There's no RW:NO Julie in the group who would want to manufacture conflict and drama. So MTV would be left with the six of them just relaxing with each other, which sounds fine to me because I like all of them, but MTV I'm sure wants more.

[choclatechip45]

I think if Sean didn't become so well known it would be easier to do the homecoming without him, but I'm sure the execs thinks he will bring in viewers just for the curiosity factor alone. 

[ljenkins782]

13 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

I think if Sean didn't become so well known it would be easier to do the homecoming without him, but I'm sure the execs thinks he will bring in viewers just for the curiosity factor alone. 

He's got, what, 9 kids? I'm fairly certain he could use the paycheck, plus it's kinda shitty that his refusal is stopping the others from collecting theirs too. He couldn't pop in via video screen or something? 

Quote

I wonder that too. It would be very easy for them to make a pre-homecoming agreement about how they'd handle everything in a way that eliminates any potential for drama. Avoiding certain topics, agreeing that if someone wants to claim something about their time on the show the others won't challenge it (like Montana giving wine to kids), etc. There's no RW:NO Julie in the group who would want to manufacture conflict and drama. So MTV would be left with the six of them just relaxing with each other, which sounds fine to me because I like all of them, but MTV I'm sure wants more.

The original NY cast did exactly this, they were in contact and set boundaries ahead of time and it worked out fine. Becky managed to bring the drama anyway and watching the rest of them reconnect and talk through things from back then and their lives now was perfectly interesting to me. Even just seeing the split screens of NY in 92 vs NY in 2021 were fun to see. Catching up with Elka as an adult vs the 18 year old she was then, seeing where Genesis ended up in life, and revisiting drama like Montana getting fired.*

An a-hole like RWNO Julie stirring shit up to make "current" reality tv is probably going to hurt the possibilities of Homecoming seasons with the older casts because those people were on reality TV back when it was still a social experiment and not a competition to be the drunkest, most dramatic, etc, and I doubt they want any association with the current iteration of reality tv.

*Is there anyone who doesn't think she let those kids drink the wine? For some reason, when I saw this back in the day, I wanted to believe her, but watching it back now, it seems clear as day that she was lying and it's SO awkward. 

[choclatechip45]

21 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

He's got, what, 9 kids? I'm fairly certain he could use the paycheck, plus it's kinda shitty that his refusal is stopping the others from collecting theirs too. He couldn't pop in via video screen or something? 

The original NY cast did exactly this, they were in contact and set boundaries ahead of time and it worked out fine. Becky managed to bring the drama anyway and watching the rest of them reconnect and talk through things from back then and their lives now was perfectly interesting to me. Even just seeing the split screens of NY in 92 vs NY in 2021 were fun to see. Catching up with Elka as an adult vs the 18 year old she was then, seeing where Genesis ended up in life, and revisiting drama like Montana getting fired.*

An a-hole like RWNO Julie stirring shit up to make "current" reality tv is probably going to hurt the possibilities of Homecoming seasons with the older casts because those people were on reality TV back when it was still a social experiment and not a competition to be the drunkest, most dramatic, etc, and I doubt they want any association with the current iteration of reality tv.

*Is there anyone who doesn't think she let those kids drink the wine? For some reason, when I saw this back in the day, I wanted to believe her, but watching it back now, it seems clear as day that she was lying and it's SO awkward. 

Yeah I agree. Melissa was the last one to sign on for New Orleans and only did it because 1) Kelley signed on she didn't think she would 2) she didn't want to prevent someone from getting a paycheck they might need since she didn't know her former roommates financial situations. 

[Tatum]

On 5/7/2022 at 7:17 AM, BelleBrit said:

and the claim that she gave wine to the kids (which she still denies...

 

39 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

Is there anyone who doesn't think she let those kids drink the wine? For some reason, when I saw this back in the day, I wanted to believe her, but watching it back now, it seems clear as day that she was lying and it's SO awkward. 

Is she using a technicality here...if I recall, she did not physically give a kid a cup of wine, the kids asked her for one and she said something like, just don't let me see you take it, and literally and figuratively looked away while they were doing it. Maybe she said it like, I better not see you doing that, which is a bit more open to interpretation? I think it's the former, but the actual exchange was not caught on camera so Montana could probably finesse that one. I am 99% sure in the book it was more like, I'm telling you no (wink, wink), but if you take it behind my back, I guess that's on you.

 

40 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

He's got, what, 9 kids? I'm fairly certain he could use the paycheck, plus it's kinda shitty that his refusal is stopping the others from collecting theirs too. He couldn't pop in via video screen or something?

think it was stated in another thread that the remaining 6 only want to do the show if it's all 7 of them, so it's not that they aren't able to do it without him, it's that they don't want to- but I can't remember where exactly I read that.

[choclatechip45]

2 minutes ago, Tatum said:

 

Is she using a technicality here...if I recall, she did not physically give a kid a cup of wine, the kids asked her for one and she said something like, just don't let me see you take it, and literally and figuratively looked away while they were doing it. Maybe she said it like, I better not see you doing that, which is a bit more open to interpretation? I think it's the former, but the actual exchange was not caught on camera so Montana could probably finesse that one. I am 99% sure in the book it was more like, I'm telling you no (wink, wink), but if you take it behind my back, I guess that's on you.

 

think it was stated in another thread that the remaining 6 only want to do the show if it's all 7 of them, so it's not that they aren't able to do it without him, it's that they don't want to- but I can't remember where exactly I read that.

Genesis mentioned it in a podcast interview she did. She also brought it up on Amaya's instagram comments. 

[Tatum]

1 minute ago, choclatechip45 said:

Genesis mentioned it in a podcast interview she did. She also brought it up on Amaya's instagram comments. 

She physically gave them a cup of wine? Or she just basically said she wouldn't stop them?

[choclatechip45]

19 minutes ago, Tatum said:

She physically gave them a cup of wine? Or she just basically said she wouldn't stop them?

Oh I thought you were talking about homecoming !

[ljenkins782]

4 minutes ago, Tatum said:

She physically gave them a cup of wine? Or she just basically said she wouldn't stop them?

I think she abdicated responsibility in the moment and didn't consider the consequences. So either she turned her back or she was basically like "don't tell anyone if you do it." I could see both sides of it, I think it truly didn't seem like a huge deal in the moment and then when Anthony was bawling her out, she realized how serious it was.

Quote

think it was stated in another thread that the remaining 6 only want to do the show if it's all 7 of them, so it's not that they aren't able to do it without him, it's that they don't want to- but I can't remember where exactly I read that.

I wonder why though. Like, yeah, he was there the first time, but who would turn down a six-figure check for a week of hanging with people you still keep in contact with? I know Kameelah's a doctor so she's probably fine, money-wise, but what about the rest of them? 

[Tatum]

5 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Oh I thought you were talking about homecoming !

Oh, okay, I misunderstood. Genesis said she would go on Homecoming, with or without Sean, or she said she would not do the show unless it was all 7?

 

3 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

I wonder why though. Like, yeah, he was there the first time, but who would turn down a six-figure check for a week of hanging with people you still keep in contact with? I know Kameelah's a doctor so she's probably fine, money-wise, but what about the rest of them? 

Yeah, Sean not being on there certainly wouldn't stop me- so I don't know. I mean, there are reasons why I wouldn't do it personally, but not getting the whole 7 there together definitely wouldn't be one of them.

5 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

I could see both sides of it, I think it truly didn't seem like a huge deal in the moment and then when Anthony was bawling her out, she realized how serious it was.

Yeah, I mean, if you're not thinking about legalities and liability (Anthony said he could lose his childcare license for something like that, which, if I recall, the center was largely made up of underprivileged children and the impact to the entire community would be massive ), a sip of wine isn't going to kill anyone, even a young kid, and Montana probably comes from the school of "my mom let me try a sip of something when I was 8 and I'm still standing"....

[choclatechip45]

27 minutes ago, Tatum said:

Oh, okay, I misunderstood. Genesis said she would go on Homecoming, with or without Sean, or she said she would not do the show unless it was all 7?

 

Yeah, Sean not being on there certainly wouldn't stop me- so I don't know. I mean, there are reasons why I wouldn't do it personally, but not getting the whole 7 there together definitely wouldn't be one of them.

Yeah, I mean, if you're not thinking about legalities and liability (Anthony said he could lose his childcare license for something like that, which, if I recall, the center was largely made up of underprivileged children and the impact to the entire community would be massive ), a sip of wine isn't going to kill anyone, even a young kid, and Montana probably comes from the school of "my mom let me try a sip of something when I was 8 and I'm still standing"....

She said that everyone said they would do it except Sean. The producers won't do it without Sean and he doesn't want to do it because he plans on running for office again. 

Edited May 9, 2022 by choclatechip45

[Tatum]

35 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

She said that everyone said they would do it except Sean. The producers won't do it without Sean and he doesn't want to do it because he plans on running for office again. 

OK, now that I think about it, I am pretty sure the post I am thinking of said something to the effect of everyone but Sean agreed to do Homecoming, but they won't do it without Sean, and I thought the "they" in that case was the cast, but "they" could have been production.

[choclatechip45]

Just now, Tatum said:

OK, now that I think about it, I am pretty sure the post I am thinking of said something to the effect of everyone but Sean agreed to do Homecoming, but they won't do it without Sean, and I thought the "they" in that case was the cast, but "they" could have been production.

Yes. It sounds like it is production who won't do it without Sean from everything Genesis has said. 

[Tatum]

9 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Yes. It sounds like it is production who won't do it without Sean from everything Genesis has said. 

It was driving me crazy where I read this, so I found it....it was you! I read your quote as the cast said no without Sean. This makes more sense, but still a weird rule for production. I get not wanting only half the house, but 6 out of 7 seems perfectly reasonable.

 

On 4/24/2022 at 11:19 AM, choclatechip45 said:

Genesis said only Sean said no for a Boston Homecoming, but they won't do it without Sean...

[choclatechip45]

21 minutes ago, Tatum said:

It was driving me crazy where I read this, so I found it....it was you! I read your quote as the cast said no without Sean. This makes more sense, but still a weird rule for production. I get not wanting only half the house, but 6 out of 7 seems perfectly reasonable.

 

I figured it might be me! Since I had listened to that podcast interview and was very surprised that everyone else would do it. I know Kameelah has said before we knew homecoming was a thing that she would do reality tv again as long as they gave her a platform to talk about maternal health issues especially with black women dying in child birth. 

I think production looks to see if the missing person would bring in drama or not and they think Sean will bring in drama with his political views. I know Kameelah mentioned in a podcast interview she got into a debate with Sean about masks during the zoom reunion they did during lockdown. 

For some reason they won't do Vegas without Frank and the only reason I can think of is because it's been rumored that he had a falling out with Steven. They were willing to do Hawaii without Matt. 

[Black Knight]

1 hour ago, choclatechip45 said:

They were willing to do Hawaii without Matt. 

And I think they could actually get quite a bit of drama from Matt - but the thing is that there are at least a couple of people in the 6 who are willing to do it who would be good for some drama.

The Boston cast doesn't have that. I don't see anybody in the other six who would bring drama on their own. You'd have to have Sean there for that. Again I don't mind that, I'd be perfectly happy just seeing what these six are like now and watch them having fun with each other, but MTV moved away from a more chill version of reality tv a long time ago. It's a pity because in certain ways the Boston cast is my favorite out of all the seasons I've watched.

[Bastet]

7 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

He's got, what, 9 kids? I'm fairly certain he could use the paycheck, plus it's kinda shitty that his refusal is stopping the others from collecting theirs too. He couldn't pop in via video screen or something? 

Sean's public record has made quite clear the welfare of others does not make an appearance on his priority list.

[Asp Burger]

7 hours ago, Black Knight said:

And I think they could actually get quite a bit of drama from Matt - but the thing is that there are at least a couple of people in the 6 who are willing to do it who would be good for some drama.

I had heard that the only ones from Hawaii willing to do a reunion are Amaya, Justin, Ruthie, and Teck, Matt, Colin, and Kaia are all holdouts. If that's true, I see why it's a no-go. Four out of seven just wouldn't do it. 

Matt was one of my most disliked housemates of all time during his season, but I'd be willing to give him a clean slate if he came back for a Homecoming. I'd actually be interested to see what that cast is like today. I thought all of them probably were at least a little better than they looked on the show. Whereas with the Boston cast, I think we got a pretty accurate picture of the 1997 models of them. 

[Black Knight]

Someone said Colin and Kaia were originally yeses, and then Colin changed his mind and Kaia ghosted everybody, I think.

6 minutes ago, Asp Burger said:

Whereas with the Boston cast, I think we got a pretty accurate picture of the 1997 models of them.

That's one of the reasons the Boston cast is my favorite in some ways. We got a real sense of them without much in the way of editorial shenanigans. And I actually liked all of them, flaws and all.

The thing I would really love to hear them talk about in a homecoming is how they worked things out in the years since the show, because they had such a severe house split during the season and some of them hated each other then. It's stunning they ended up being the most tight-knit cast. They'd hang out with each other for free!

[Asp Burger]

I remember Kameelah and Syrus getting along so well during the Extreme Challenge. They would cheer each other on, although it was funny that when she cheered him on, she was yelling "Go, Syrus!" and when he cheered her on, he was yelling, "Ten grand, baby! Ten grand!" or whatever the dollar amount of the prize was. On-brand. Ha ha.  

Kameelah seems very open to seeing who people are now, rather than fixating on who they were in prior encounters. She had that friction with New Orleans Jamie during the casting special (when she said he came off as a privileged white boy, and he called her "Shaka Zulu" on camera but behind her back). They said they talked that out off camera on the first day of the Extreme Challenge, and that was the end of it.

[choclatechip45]

11 hours ago, Black Knight said:

Someone said Colin and Kaia were originally yeses, and then Colin changed his mind and Kaia ghosted everybody, I think.

That's one of the reasons the Boston cast is my favorite in some ways. We got a real sense of them without much in the way of editorial shenanigans. And I actually liked all of them, flaws and all.

The thing I would really love to hear them talk about in a homecoming is how they worked things out in the years since the show, because they had such a severe house split during the season and some of them hated each other then. It's stunning they ended up being the most tight-knit cast. They'd hang out with each other for free!

Yup according to Amaya and Teck they had the whole cast onboard minus Matt. Colin had second thoughts decided against it and Kaia decided against it and according to Amaya blocked everyones phone numbers which sounds super on brand for her. Teck was not happy that his cast in his words couldn't get there shit together and do the season like New Orleans did and they lost out on money. 

I think the Boston cast from interviews even Sean all have a healthy perspective on The Real World experience none of them seem bitter and think of it as a cool thing they did in their 20s. I wasn't watching RW Boston while it aired so I have no idea how popular the show was when it aired. 

[SilverLake0315]

23 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

They were willing to do Hawaii without Matt. 

This made me laugh quite a bit!

[Asp Burger]

23 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

 I wasn't watching RW Boston while it aired so I have no idea how popular the show was when it aired. 

Boston wasn't an especially popular season when it was airing or for a few years thereafter. Someone at B/M commented in one of the books that Boston's viewership was a drop from the previous season. The consensus in those days was "not 'London dull', but a big drop from Miami." Seattle and Hawaii, which followed, also overshadowed it. Those seasons got more mainstream media coverage while they were going on.

It was perceived as a misstep (never repeated) to shoot in a cold-weather city in the winter. And as mentioned above, 1997 was a tough winter in Boston.  

But Real World Boston aged well. People remember things now like Kameelah and Genesis talking about gay issues to the little girl at the children's center. All the members of this cast also stayed pretty visible in reunions and Challenges, which probably helped people give it a first look or another look in the marathons.

[choclatechip45]

52 minutes ago, Asp Burger said:

Boston wasn't an especially popular season when it was airing or for a few years thereafter. Someone at B/M commented in one of the books that Boston's viewership was a drop from the previous season. The consensus in those days was "not 'London dull', but a big drop from Miami." Seattle and Hawaii, which followed, also overshadowed it. Those seasons got more mainstream media coverage while they were going on.

It was perceived as a misstep (never repeated) to shoot in a cold-weather city in the winter. And as mentioned above, 1997 was a tough winter in Boston.  

But Real World Boston aged well. People remember things now like Kameelah and Genesis talking about gay issues to the little girl at the children's center. All the members of this cast also stayed pretty visible in reunions and Challenges, which probably helped people give it a first look or another look in the marathons.

Thank you that makes sense! It's funny that they did New York in the winter months for Back to New York. I remember Lori saying she had no motivation going out some nights because it was cold outside and she was from NJ and went to school in Boston so it's not like cold weather was a foreign concept to her. 

[heatherchandler]

On 4/26/2022 at 10:58 AM, choclatechip45 said:

I am watching this season,  how much was the Genesis/Adam storyline manufactured by editing? or was she really in love with him?

Where are you watching it?  

On 5/9/2022 at 12:16 PM, choclatechip45 said:

They were willing to do Hawaii without Matt. 

We're ALL willing to do Hawaii without Matt.

[Tatum]

16 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

Where are you watching it?  

We're ALL willing to do Hawaii without Matt.

I think it's on either Youtube or Daily Motion. The video quality is pretty poor though.

[Marigold66]

On 11/28/2021 at 12:16 AM, Lovecat said:

I think of this scene every time I hear “More Than A Feeling.”

I know this post is from last year but I will never not listen to this song and think of Jason, Sean and Syrus just rocking out in that pickup trunk.  It was over 25 years ago and the attachment will always be there for me!

[ljenkins782]

On 8/29/2022 at 10:12 PM, Marigold66 said:

Quote

I think of this scene every time I hear “More Than A Feeling.”

I know this post is from last year but I will never not listen to this song and think of Jason, Sean and Syrus just rocking out in that pickup trunk.  It was over 25 years ago and the attachment will always be there for me!

Ha, same. The 3 of them fake drumming in the air is the mental image I get as soon as that song comes on. I love little moments like that.

[snarts]

On 8/29/2022 at 10:12 PM, Marigold66 said:

I know this post is from last year but I will never not listen to this song and think of Jason, Sean and Syrus just rocking out in that pickup trunk.  It was over 25 years ago and the attachment will always be there for me!

Same.

Similarly, I think of Sean, Rachel, Eric, Cynthia & Jon whenever I hear Bruce Springsteen's Glory Days, 

[seltzer3]

 

This was an interesting casting special.  Damn Kameelah's interview was really emotional.  I'm curious that Cana didn't get casted she was really interesting (apparently she got on road rules, but had to withdraw).

[seltzer3]

So.  I just watched the whole season.  Thought it was pretty good.

The one thing I thought was super weird was how in a lot of the editing they did a lot of telling and not showing.

For example.  The second episode (or the first episode), there was discussion about Elka feeling like she was being pressured by her castmates at the dinner table about her catholic faith (and how she was sheltered naive for having that faith).  And there were several confessionals about that from her Montana etc.  But was super weird was that they never show the conversation at all. Even though you see cameras of them at the table conversing, but you don't hear the conversation.  That was an interesting choice?

Or this talk about how the house is split between Jason/Kameelah/Genesis vs Sean/Syrus/Montana/Elka.  Like it just randomly is talked about that in the middle of the season, but there was never explanation on how it got there.  The relationships in the house felt very sporadic.  Like how Montana and Syrus hated each other, but then all of a sudden they were on the same side of the split.

 

 

[Tatum]

11 hours ago, seltzer3 said:

Or this talk about how the house is split between Jason/Kameelah/Genesis vs Sean/Syrus/Montana/Elka.  Like it just randomly is talked about that in the middle of the season, but there was never explanation on how it got there.  The relationships in the house felt very sporadic.  Like how Montana and Syrus hated each other, but then all of a sudden they were on the same side of the split.

 

 

The book talked a little more about this, although I still maintain the deep friendship between Jason and Kameelah really came out of nowhere since he did not seem to like her in the beginning.

 

Sean pestered Kameelah and Syrus nonstop with questions about what it was like to be Black. I think he was well intentioned (he really did want to know what it was like and recognized how ignorant he was), but went about it the wrong way and expected Kameelah to be grateful that he cared to know. It bothered Kameelah; it did not bother Syrus. Syrus and Kameelah were at frequent odds because Kameelah felt like Syrus only dated white women which she found annoying.

 

Sean was also all about the Midwestern niceties and couldn't stand that Genesis would walk by him in the morning and not say hello or acknowledge him in any way (Jason said this was not personal, Genesis often did not greet anyone she came across unless she had something specific she wanted to talk to them about). Jason did not mind; Sean thought it was rude.

 

Both Genesis and Kameelah thought that Montana was exhausting to be around, and was a compulsive liar. She would tell stories that varied a bit each time she told them.

 

Elka was nice to everyone's face, but a shit talker behind everyone's backs. When Kameelah or Montana (depending on whose side she was on at the moment) would confront her about what she said behind their backs, Elka would backpedal or say she didn't remember. Elka also frequently stole, although I don't know if she ever stole from her roommates. I think it was stated that if Elka was at a store, and the line was too long, she would shoplift rather than wait in line. I can't remember where I heard that.

 

Both Genesis and Jason stated that while Kameelah's bluntness could be offputting, she was honest and straightforward and they always knew where they stood with her. Whereas Elka was a flip flopper and Montana was a liar, and Sean just annoyed everyone. Syrus went out a lot.

 

I think Jason summed it up best. Montana, Syrus, and Sean were all fun to go drinking with and just shoot the shit, but he never felt very close to any of them.

 

I don't think anyone in that house was a bad person, but it was an extreme clash of personalities, and everyone assuming the worst possible motivations of the other person in any conflict.

[seltzer3]

On 8/15/2023 at 11:20 AM, Tatum said:

The book talked a little more about this, although I still maintain the deep friendship between Jason and Kameelah really came out of nowhere since he did not seem to like her in the beginning.

 

Sean pestered Kameelah and Syrus nonstop with questions about what it was like to be Black. I think he was well intentioned (he really did want to know what it was like and recognized how ignorant he was), but went about it the wrong way and expected Kameelah to be grateful that he cared to know. It bothered Kameelah; it did not bother Syrus. Syrus and Kameelah were at frequent odds because Kameelah felt like Syrus only dated white women which she found annoying.

 

Sean was also all about the Midwestern niceties and couldn't stand that Genesis would walk by him in the morning and not say hello or acknowledge him in any way (Jason said this was not personal, Genesis often did not greet anyone she came across unless she had something specific she wanted to talk to them about). Jason did not mind; Sean thought it was rude.

 

Both Genesis and Kameelah thought that Montana was exhausting to be around, and was a compulsive liar. She would tell stories that varied a bit each time she told them.

 

Elka was nice to everyone's face, but a shit talker behind everyone's backs. When Kameelah or Montana (depending on whose side she was on at the moment) would confront her about what she said behind their backs, Elka would backpedal or say she didn't remember. Elka also frequently stole, although I don't know if she ever stole from her roommates. I think it was stated that if Elka was at a store, and the line was too long, she would shoplift rather than wait in line. I can't remember where I heard that.

 

Both Genesis and Jason stated that while Kameelah's bluntness could be offputting, she was honest and straightforward and they always knew where they stood with her. Whereas Elka was a flip flopper and Montana was a liar, and Sean just annoyed everyone. Syrus went out a lot.

 

I think Jason summed it up best. Montana, Syrus, and Sean were all fun to go drinking with and just shoot the shit, but he never felt very close to any of them.

 

I don't think anyone in that house was a bad person, but it was an extreme clash of personalities, and everyone assuming the worst possible motivations of the other person in any conflict.

Okay that makes more sense.  Its really weird that they don't show any of that stuff leading to the split but just saying oh yeah their is a schism between two groups.  Like that's really bad storytelling.

Like I said before, the Elka getting grilled on her faith was such a weird editing choice.  Like why don't they show footage of the castmembers actually grilling Elka, instead of just showing confessionals?  Like the most we see footage is them talking in the restaurant (but it is mute), and then a scene of Kameelah telling Elka afterwards "don't let them push you around"

[ljenkins782]

On 8/25/2023 at 11:56 PM, seltzer3 said:

Like I said before, the Elka getting grilled on her faith was such a weird editing choice.  Like why don't they show footage of the castmembers actually grilling Elka, instead of just showing confessionals?  Like the most we see footage is them talking in the restaurant (but it is mute), and then a scene of Kameelah telling Elka afterwards "don't let them push you around"

I think Montana routinely gave Elka shit about her religion. Montana was a very specific type of 20-something city girl in the 90s, she was extremely dismissive of any type of faith and not shy about saying so. Jason was all into his exploration of spirituality over organized religion and the rest didn't seem to have much affiliation at all (despite Sean's latter day belief system that seemed to develop along with his conservative politic aspirations.) The Sean on this show doesn't resemble the person he became later on, whose values would have been closer to Elka than Montana.

Quote

Or this talk about how the house is split between Jason/Kameelah/Genesis vs Sean/Syrus/Montana/Elka.  Like it just randomly is talked about that in the middle of the season, but there was never explanation on how it got there.  The relationships in the house felt very sporadic.  Like how Montana and Syrus hated each other, but then all of a sudden they were on the same side of the split.

I don't know that Montana and Syrus ever fully mended their rift, more like they just let it go over time and ended up on the same side sort of by default. Syrus took the high road when Montana was fired and didn't retaliate against her for campaigning to get him removed when he got in trouble for dating a mom at the center and I think that humbled her slightly and made her less abrasive toward him.

 

[Tatum]

On 9/8/2023 at 4:17 PM, ljenkins782 said:

The Sean on this show doesn't resemble the person he became later on, whose values would have been closer to Elka than Montana.

Yeah, that was so funny, on the first night in the house, Elka asks if anyone else in the house is Catholic, to which Sean replied that he was. Elka eagerly asks if he will come with her to church and Sean is like "...". Like you could tell he absolutely did not want to go, and is vacillating between making up an excuse and then dealing with dodging her next time she asks (and again and again), or just admitting on camera he has no intention of going to church while in Boston.

 

While he was a Catholic and probably from a politically conservative family, you're right, that wasn't an archetype he leaned heavily into while on the show.

 

He was much more about bar hopping, with a propensity to randomly debate people about social issues at times (in his defense, I thought he was pretty respectful and willing to listen to the other side. Even if his views were offensive or ignorant to a lot of people, I thought he came across as more open minded and well read than Rachel did on her season. Then again, low bar and all).

[Bastet]

2 hours ago, Tatum said:

He was much more about bar hopping, with a propensity to randomly debate people about social issues at times (in his defense, I thought he was pretty respectful and willing to listen to the other side.

When I re-watched this a couple of years ago, I was struck by how sad it was that the Sean who left Boston had potential -- he said he realized his insular upbringing affected how he interacted with Genesis and Kameelah, that if he'd walked into the house as the person he is leaving it things would have been different, and he's sorry it wasn't. 

But he went back and marinated in that blinkered culture, hooked up with obdurate Rachel, turned it all up to eleventy when he got political ambitions, and now truly seems that detestable for real.