Patsy: Keeping Dark Secrets

[maraleia]

Let's chat about Patsy and the ways she navigates being a lesbian in the early 1960's.

[Raffles]

I was impressed that the show managed to slowly clue people into Patsy being gay without hitting us over the head with it, even from the first episode I think people speculated that Patsy was gay. 

 

As being gay goes in the 60's I think she's not so badly off. She's got her own career that pays decently and some women dedicate their lives to, avoiding getting married. Her failure to marry wouldn't be questioned too much. Plus it seems that her immediate family are dead so she won't have family pressures there. She's got a friend who seems accepting, understanding and supportive. Plus, she's working with people who may not like it but will probably be mostly tolerant. If the residents of Poplar found out that would be another kettle of fish,...I'm sure the vast majority would not want her as their midwife.

 

I don't think she will tell anyone but Trixie. The more people that know the more dangerous it is for her. Loved Trixie being inspired to stand up to the bigots at the Rose Queen, although I didn't really like her "love the sinner" comment but I don't think she really believes its a sin.

 

I though Delia seemed nice but I was seriously expecting someone less plain and more Trixie like but then again I'm all for shipping Patsy/Trixie. Yes, I know its madness. Also, half of me doesn't want Patsy to have a girlfriend as I think it might be interesting to see a little bit of a lesbian scene from the 60's.

Edited February 2, 2015 by Raffles

[staveDarsky]

Oh, people question. Don't kid yourself that they won't because there are still people out there who question the unmarried in the 21st century. I had a young coworker who openly stated that those who had no love partner were unnatural.

 

Patsy will probably be scrutinized, albeit privately. She's young and attractive without ailing family members to tie her down from dating. And this is set in the early 60s before women's lib. I'd be surprised if it didn't come up in a storyline.

[LeGrandElephant]

When Patsy and Delia were both living at Nonnatus House, were they roommmates? It seemed like they weren’t, but then why not? 

[HazelEyes4325]

1 hour ago, LeGrandElephant said:

When Patsy and Delia were both living at Nonnatus House, were they roommmates? It seemed like they weren’t, but then why not? 

They weren't, but I also remember a scene before Delia moved in where Sister Julienne realized that their relationship was not platonic, which is probably why...

[latetotheparty]

On 11/14/2018 at 8:01 PM, HazelEyes4325 said:

They weren't, but I also remember a scene before Delia moved in where Sister Julienne realized that their relationship was not platonic, which is probably why...

I don’t remember such a scene at all.  Must be one of the scenes PBS cut. 

[HazelEyes4325]

Just now, latetotheparty said:

I don’t remember such a scene at all.  Must be one of the scenes PBS cut. 

It was on PBS and it wasn't so much a scene as a very pointed look within a scene (it was the last scene of the episode when everyone was having a meal together).  I *think* it was in the episode that had the closeted young father, but I'm not sure about that.

[latetotheparty]

1 minute ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

It was on PBS and it wasn't so much a scene as a very pointed look within a scene (it was the last scene of the episode when everyone was having a meal together).  I *think* it was in the episode that had the closeted young father, but I'm not sure about that.

Okay I’m going to have to watch that again. 

[Ceindreadh]

On 15/11/2018 at 12:54 AM, LeGrandElephant said:

When Patsy and Delia were both living at Nonnatus House, were they roommmates? It seemed like they weren’t, but then why not? 

IIRC, Patsy was already sharing a room with somebody when Delia moved in. Asking to swap might have drawn undue attention. Also, Delia wasn’t a midwife, Julienne offered her a room to stifle her mother’s protests about Delia coming back to London. So maybe as a paying guest rather than a midwife living in, she was entitled to her own room. 

 

I thought it was Phylis who’d figured out about Patsy and Delia. 

[OnceSane]

23 hours ago, latetotheparty said:

I don’t remember such a scene at all.  Must be one of the scenes PBS cut. 

It was during the Season 5 premiere, at the end of the episode.  Sister Julienne offers Delia a place with them as she tells Mrs. Busby that they treasure their young women at Nonnatus.  She gives Patsy and Delia a little look that makes it clear that she thinks there may be more than friendship there.

19 hours ago, Ceindreadh said:

thought it was Phylis who’d figured out about Patsy and Delia. 

She figured it out in Season 6 when she saw Delia leaving Patsy's room very early in the morning.

[latetotheparty]

9 hours ago, OnceSane said:

It was during the Season 5 premiere, at the end of the episode.  Sister Julienne offers Delia a place with the. as she tells Mrs. Busby that they treasure their young women at Nonnatus.  She gives Patsy and Delia a little look that makes it clear that she thinks there may be more than friendship there.

She figured it out in Season 6 when she saw Delia leaving Patsy's room very early in the morning.

I took that look to mean that Sister Julienne was pleased to have overcome Delia’s overprotective mother’s objections. I don’t think Sister Julienne has a clue about them. And it was Phyllis who observed Patsy leaving Delia’s room.  

[HazelEyes4325]

12 minutes ago, latetotheparty said:

I took that look to mean that Sister Julienne was pleased to have overcome Delia’s overprotective mother’s objections. I don’t think Sister Julienne has a clue about them. 

 

Again, it has been a while since I saw that episode so I may be wrong on this, but I really thought that there was something in the voiceover in that scene that indicated that Sister Julienne recognized that Delia and Patsy's relationship was more than platonic.  Of course, now that I know which episode it was (thanks @OnceSane !) I can go back and check it when I have time.

[OnceSane]

1 hour ago, latetotheparty said:

And it was Phyllis who observed Patsy leaving Delia’s room.

I know, which is why I said Phyllis was the one who saw them.  And I'm pretty sure it was Delia leaving Patsy's room and not the other way round.

[caitmcg]

3 hours ago, OnceSane said:

I know, which is why I said Phyllis was the one who saw them.  And I'm pretty sure it was Delia leaving Patsy's room and not the other way round.

Patsy regularly snuck off to Delia’s room at night, because Delia had her own room. Patsy was roommates with Trixie, as I recall, so it was in Delia’s room that they had privacy. 

[OnceSane]

7 hours ago, caitmcg said:

Patsy regularly snuck off to Delia’s room at night, because Delia had her own room. Patsy was roommates with Trixie, as I recall, so it was in Delia’s room that they had privacy. 

We've seen Patsy leaving Delia's room in the past, but Delia's room was down the hall.  Phyllis saw Delia leave Patsy's room at the top of the stairs in early Season 6.  Trixie was still in South Africa helping with the mission.

[LeGrandElephant]

They aren't very consistent about the number of rooms. If they can give Delia her own room, why are the other nurses sharing? When Valerie shows up later she even asks for her own room and is denied. 

But if Delia has her own room, then I guess that is almost as good as she and Patsy sharing. 

Edited November 18, 2018 by LeGrandElephant

[HazelEyes4325]

4 hours ago, LeGrandElephant said:

They aren't very consistent about the number of rooms. If they can give Delia her own room, why are the other nurses sharing? When Valerie shows up later she even asks for her own room and is denied. 

But if Delia has her own room, then I guess that is almost as good as she and Patsy sharing. 

 

It might be that it is just "policy" that the midwives will share rooms (unless there is an odd number of midwives at any particular time).  I think we have to accept that there are a fair number of bedrooms at Nonnatus House because there are a fair number of nuns--more than the 3 or so who are actual characters in this show, and we've seen that the nuns (or at least the ones who are characters) have their own rooms.  It could have been that a room that would have gone to a nun but was vacant at the time and because Delia was not a part of the midwife program, but more a guest of Sister Julienne, she was given that room.

ETA: I just typed this and now I can't remember....was Delia part of the midwife program?  I know she wasn't an actual midwife, but I sort of remember her being in training?

Edited November 18, 2018 by HazelEyes4325

[caitmcg]

2 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

It might be that it is just "policy" that the midwives will share rooms (unless there is an odd number of midwives at any particular time).  I think we have to accept that there are a fair number of bedrooms at Nonnatus House because there are a fair number of nuns--more than the 3 or so who are actual characters in this show, and we've seen that the nuns (or at least the ones who are characters) have their own rooms.  It could have been that a room that would have gone to a nun but was vacant at the time and because Delia was not a part of the midwife program, but more a guest of Sister Julienne, she was given that room.

ETA: I just typed this and now I can't remember....was Delia part of the midwife program?  I know she wasn't an actual midwife, but I sort of remember her being in training?

I think the difference is that for the midwives, room and board is part of their compensation, so it is probably a financial consideration as much as anything else that they share. Delia was paying for her room and board at Nonnatus House while she worked as a nurse. She didn't start out being in midwifery, but after living there for a while she decided to train as a nurse-midwife, as I recall.

[doodlebug]

1 hour ago, caitmcg said:

I think the difference is that for the midwives, room and board is part of their compensation, so it is probably a financial consideration as much as anything else that they share. Delia was paying for her room and board at Nonnatus House while she worked as a nurse. She didn't start out being in midwifery, but after living there for a while she decided to train as a nurse-midwife, as I recall.

I think that we also need to remember that there are other nuns living at Nonnatus House, nuns who aren’t midwives but who we see, usually at church services. Presuming they are also in residence, I can see the number of rooms available fluctuating as well as the number of single rooms as they come and go.

And, as stated above, when Delia first came there to live, she was working as a staff nurse at the hospital and only lived there because her parents didn’t want her living alone after her accident.  I expect she paid full room and board while the midwives don’t pay full price but receive it as part of their compensation.

[Ceindreadh]

4 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

 

ETA: I just typed this and now I can't remember....was Delia part of the midwife program?  I know she wasn't an actual midwife, but I sort of remember her being in training?

She was originally a staff nurse (i.e. fully trained and on staff at a hospital).  There was an episode where she was on the phone to an expectant mother and had to talk her through the delivery until the midwife got there.  The following season I think she appeared to be back in training for her midwifery qualifications. 

[craziness]

When Delia moved in, Sr. Mary Cynthia showed her to her room, and said something to the effect that "I hope you enjoy this room as much as I did."  So it was a mid-wife room, but only space for 1 bed. Not sure what the difference is between mid-wife and nun rooms.

[debraran]

I teared up a little when Phyllis gave Patsy the book of poems, that quiet acceptance. I read recently that Patsy and Delia wont return, which is sad. I liked them and hope they make a special appearance another day when not as busy.

[jschoolgirl]

On 2/1/2015 at 11:50 PM, Raffles said:

even from the first episode I think people speculated that Patsy was gay. 

Yes. How did they know?