The Spencers: Foiling Plans for World Domination Since the 80s

[dubbel zout]

It would have worked better if Lulu made that decision on her own not to tell Dante, because she thought Dante would immediately turn Luke in/or that luke wasn't right in the head, etc etc.

That part was so enraging. But then, this entire story gave me a rage blackout. It could have been interesting, but as usual, no thought was put into it. 

[HeatLifer]

Another thing that bugs me about this is the Lulu didn't trust Dante angle. Yeah, she could have overridden Luke, but imo a lot of the times parents can make you feel like your own instincts are not good and make you second guess yourself. It's annoying because it's not like Lulu didn't trust him at all . . . she wanted to and everyone else was telling her not to tell him.

It would have worked better if Lulu made that decision on her own not to tell Dante, because she thought Dante would immediately turn Luke in/or that luke wasn't right in the head, etc etc.

I'm honestly SO sick of hearing the women apologize. I don't care what Lulu supposedly kept from Dante, to be real. He screwed her COUSIN in their family home, in their BED multiple TIMES. And was trying to DATE HER. 2015 was the worst, my goodness. I need to remind myself to pretend it never happened.

[HeatLifer]

The Lulu/Val/Dante scenes today were just...ugh. I know why it was done (ooh! we're all better!), but it sucks.

I'm glad they showed a bit of Lulu/Dante working on the marriage, but the energy from Dom was just....not there. He's whispering and his hair is long and it's JT-itis.

[ulkis]

saw this tidbit:

Soap Opera Spy had an interview with JZ -- she says she hasn't taped GH since before last xmas -- she turned on TV and saw Tracy her sister in law [Jackie's mistakenly described her that way] in the hospital with worms in the head and wonders if she will get to visit

Doesn't sound like she is taping for the Nurses ball coming up as she has no idea on GH

well, that's too bad. Bobbie's face is cray cray but I enjoy having her pop up in scenes here and there.

[ulkis]

This is random, but I wonder if Tony Geary would care if they recast Luke or would he be pissed?

[dubbel zout]

I can see him not caring and being annoyed at a recast at the same time. Heh.

But why bring back Luke in the first place? I feel like if they can't get TG for whatever reason, don't write Luke in. As dumb as Luke's sendoff was, I think it did draw a line under the character. Not that he can't return, but it should be for weddings, funerals, etc. Or as the surprise witness in a court case. But don't shoehorn him into a story he doesn't need to be in just because TG is in L.A. and wants some cash.

[LeftPhalange]

I think he would only care about coming back if there was a story involving JJ or if JE decided to leave and wanted him to be a part of her exit. Maybe when the show gets cancelled. 

[ulkis]

@dubbel zout I don't think he's coming back. I was just musing about the recast subject.

[dubbel zout]

I know the question was hypothetical, ulkis. I wouldn't be surprised if the writers have a story on hold for Luke, just in case TG decides he wants to stay in L.A. for a while. And of course it uses him badly and isn't self-contained.

[HeatLifer]

20 hours ago, ulkis said:

This is random, but I wonder if Tony Geary would care if they recast Luke or would he be pissed?

I think he'd be pissed, for sure. Unless Luke is played by Michael Easton.

[ulkis]

I just want Lucky back. I'd take any good recast just so long as FV wasn't allowed anywhere near the decision

I really don't want GV back though. I was watching some clips and I forgot how he stumbled over lines so much. Maybe I could get used to him again though.

[Oracle42]

Nope. I want Lucky, not Larry. I already watched him turn Eric into Larry 2.0 on DOOL.  

I had to go back and edit my previous Lucky post to include a GV exemption. 

[HeatLifer]

I can't handle Lucky coming back to interact with Franco and Liz. That's just mean.

[Oracle42]

10 minutes ago, HeatLifer said:

I can't handle Lucky coming back to interact with Franco and Liz. That's just mean.

Well, now I need this.

[dubbel zout]

I don't need yet another holier-than-thou confrontation. Even when Franco is on the other end of it. I'm so tired of hearing the same old slurs and complaints hurled back and forth. Nothing changes, nothing improves.

[Oracle42]

I'd rather have that, than listen to one more person rubber stamping this farce of a relationship

[LeftPhalange]

Liez is going to do whatever she wants regardless of what Lucky says so I'd rather he just take the kids and not concern himself with her latest bullshit. 

[Oracle42]

Or....I finally get my Lucky/Maxie pairing and the reunion of Ducky - and the Tree/Claudette leave town never to be seen again

Edited September 7, 2016 by Oracle42

[LeftPhalange]

Surely he can do better than Maxie.

[Melgaypet]

I ship Maxie with Michael. Lucky can hook up with a recast - or get the original back, that's fine - Maya Ward. He can also shoot Franco in the head, that'd be awesome.

[NiqueAlexis]

Hmmmm Luxie, I along with tons of others shipped them hard back when JJ came back in 2010. JJ/KS were beyond sparkly together & while JJ isn't conventionally  good lookin(more cute 2 me)or has much sexual heat 2 me it works for me despite that & there ugly history. Unlike that abomination travesty that was Spinsuck & Spixie.

Biggest missed opportunity for Maxie besides Jomax when it comes to pairings. I was legit torn between Luxie & M&M (Matt & Maxie) back then. 2010 Maxie was free from the baboon & 2 good pairings on the horizon. Sigh

Sadly I don't see JJ ever coming back unless this show ends & that a be for Liz. Oh well there goes my chance at a legit realistic triangle for Maxie & not one that soley exist in the executive producers head who doesn't even watch the show.

Edited September 10, 2016 by NiqueAlexis

[ulkis]

Replying here because it became more about Lucky.

I liked Siobhan okay, but not at the expense of Liz/BH. Ridiculous.

I thought Claire had great chemistry with Lucky and Dante. So who does the poor woman sleep with? Sonny, but of course.

I think Liz and Dante work well together although them romantic would be weird. But I would love for them to have a conversation or two about having married into the Spencers.

[HeatLifer]

13 minutes ago, ulkis said:

I think Liz and Dante work well together 

You're just saying this bc you know I like Sam and Dante.

14 minutes ago, ulkis said:

I liked Siobhan okay, but not at the expense of Liz/BH. Ridiculous.

 I wasn't into her character at all. But I got some Dante/Lucky out of it...

[dubbel zout]

I really disliked Siobhan. A lot of that was because the show pushed so hard on her "I'm a feisty Irish lass, am I" shtick. I don't need to be force-fed, Show. 

[ulkis]

8 hours ago, HeatLifer said:

You're just saying this bc you know I like Sam and Dante.

Why can't both be okay?! sob. (I know, because Zeus will strike thunder upon the land or something.)

[Melgaypet]

I liked Siobhan, at the time. I think I was just so relieved to see Lucky having some fun. Looking back now, she was absurd.

[HeatLifer]

I miss friendships on this show like Lucky/Emily.

[Melgaypet]

3 minutes ago, HeatLifer said:

Well, on this specifically? We differ because I don't think a character who is suffering from emotional problems and most likely should seek help for what he's feeling should be accused of abandonment. It's not like he's having a good time elsewhere.

Well, we don't actually differ on this. Lucky's talk about "darkness" sounds like depression to me and I do think he needs help. But what I thought we were disagreeing about is whether Lucky has any obligation to Cam and Jake as their father.

[HeatLifer]

8 minutes ago, Melgaypet said:

Well, we don't actually differ on this. Lucky's talk about "darkness" sounds like depression to me and I do think he needs help. But what I thought we were disagreeing about is whether Lucky has any obligation to Cam and Jake as their father.

We were.

There were a lot of different things I was rambling about bc I'm nuts when it comes to Lucky. 

Edited January 4, 2017 by HeatLifer

[Melgaypet]

Cool. Lucky's a favorite of mine, I can get nuts about him, too. I was just a little confused, because I'm pretty sure I never said anything about Lucky having a good time elsewhere or that people with emotional problems abandon their children.

[HeatLifer]

13 minutes ago, Melgaypet said:

Cool. Lucky's a favorite of mine, I can get nuts about him, too. I was just a little confused, because I'm pretty sure I never said anything about Lucky having a good time elsewhere or that people with emotional problems abandon their children.

I wasn't trying to say you said that. It's hard to get my POV across on message boards, lol. I was talking in general about the idea that Lucky's character has been trashed. I don't think he has because I don't think he abandoned those kids. 

If I still make no sense, just ignore me! 

[ulkis]

1 hour ago, Melgaypet said:

Cool. Lucky's a favorite of mine, I can get nuts about him, too. I was just a little confused, because I'm pretty sure I never said anything about Lucky having a good time elsewhere or that people with emotional problems abandon their children.

Well, I remember my post said that Lucky's darkness sounded like an excuse on his part, so you could kinda read it in my post. Which I don't think he's living it up with hookers Luke style but imo it does come across like he is indulging in wanderlust. Which I hate, but that's how it comes across to me.

Re: Lucky's responsibilities, now that Jason is parenting Jake now, Liz and Lucky not being together, and Jake being gone for 5 years, I do think Lucky would feel awkward trying to assert himself as an equal dad figure even if he were in town, and I wouldn't be able to blame him for that.

[Oracle42]

5 minutes ago, ulkis said:

Re: Lucky's responsibilities, now that Jason Franco is parenting Jake, Liz and Lucky not being together, and Jake being gone for 5 years, I do think Lucky would feel awkward trying to assert himself as an equal dad figure even if he were in town, and I wouldn't be able to blame him for that.

[HeatLifer]

1 hour ago, ulkis said:

Re: Lucky's responsibilities, now that Jason is parenting Jake now, Liz and Lucky not being together, and Jake being gone for 5 years, I do think Lucky would feel awkward trying to assert himself as an equal dad figure even if he were in town, and I wouldn't be able to blame him for that.

Just out of curiosity, did you like the choice to have Lucky raise Jake to begin with? Or did you think it was a copout to please all fanbases? (Liason/JaSam/LL2)

[ulkis]

25 minutes ago, HeatLifer said:

Just out of curiosity, did you like the choice to have Lucky raise Jake to begin with? Or did you think it was a copout to please all fanbases? (Liason/JaSam/LL2)

I wasn't watching GH much by the time Jake was born, so I didn't really know how it all went down, so by the time JJ was back all I really knew was he had been raising him so I was ok with it. I think I was okay with out of spite lol because of that assy speech Luke gave on the dock to JJ Lucky about marrying Liz again and raising other men's kids and Lucky had a great speech in return.

Edited January 4, 2017 by ulkis

[ulkis]

@HeatLifer here's the scene I'm talking about

Luke: Good morning, cowboy.

Lucky: It's afternoon, Dad.

Luke: After what? Ooh. Man, that light is bright off the water, isn't it?

Lucky: You wanted to see me?

Luke: Did I?

Lucky: Yeah, you did. Something happen last night?

Luke: Single malt scotch. Thought it was really humid and hot last night. I didn't sleep well. Ah, it's kind of a blur.

Lucky: You were fine when Elizabeth and I left the Haunted Star. That 2 minutes where you were trying to hustle me was one of the best conversations we've had in years. So tell me, Dad, what, uh, what was it this time that made you dive head-first into a bottle?

Lucky: Did Mom call you last night?

Luke: No. Why would she?

Lucky: No reason. Just trying to figure out what would send you off to get drunk.

Luke: Did you talk to her?

Lucky: Yeah.

Luke: Is everything all right?

Lucky: Everything's fine. I called her.

Luke: Oh. Why?

Lucky: No reason. I just, uh, wanted to let her know how Elizabeth and I are doing.

Luke: Oh. What did she say?

Lucky: That's between her and I, Dad.

Luke: Do you have any doubts about...getting remarried?

Lucky: I don't have any doubts about remarrying Elizabeth, Dad. It's best for both of us and the kids.

Luke: So the fact that she had an affair with Jason and had Jake and tried to pass him off as your son doesn't bother you, you don't have any residual disappointments or anger, you don't have any--

Lucky: Is this really a conversation you want to have, given Ethan's unexpected arrival into our lives?

Luke: Don't do that. Don't take this off track. This is not about me 20 years and change ago. This is about you and Elizabeth today, now. Are you being honest with each other? Just to declare that you trust her and ignore any instinct that you have to the contrary is setting both of you up for failure.

Lucky: That's what trust is, Dad. It's trust. There's no way around it. And I trust Elizabeth, okay? She just doesn't trust herself because of what happened with Jake. She's judging herself, just like you're doing.

Luke: No, I'm not judging her. No, that's not it. I just, uh, I just don't want to see you get your heart broken.

Lucky: Dad, you know what? I don't care what you think you're doing. I really don't care. Go home. Get some sleep. Let me find my own way.

Luke: Do the two of you even want the same things?

Lucky: What does that even mean, huh? We want a family, Dad. A family. And just so you know, it's fine by me that cam and Jake don't share my DNA. It's not always something to brag about. Those boys are my sons. And they're perfect just the way they are.

Luke: Well...okay. I guess you told me.

Lucky: Yeah, I guess I did.

Nikolas: Hey.

Lucky: Hey.

Nikolas: What's up? You waiting for the launch?

Lucky: No, I'm just kicking myself for even attempting to talk to my father.

Nikolas: Oh. You guys fighting again?

Lucky: When are we not? He asked to see me and then he showed up an hour late, so hung-over he could barely stand.

Nikolas: I know how you feel about that.

Lucky: That's not what made me mad. I mean, sure, it's not fun having a dad who's a drunk, but I'm not gonna be the one to try to fix him. I'm going to those meetings myself trying to work on letting it go. I just hate when he tries to give me advice. He pulls out these insights and philosophies that are just nonsense, just three-quarters self-serving garbage and...

Nikolas: Ignore him.

Lucky: The problem is that one-quarter of it's not about justifying his own crap. That part's usually dead-on. It pisses me off because no matter how far apart we get or how much we disagree, the bastard still knows me better than anyone.

 

ucky: Dad started in on Cam and Jake, specifically Jake. How I must be carrying some lingering resentment or distrust because Elizabeth lied and told me I was Jake's biological father.

Nikolas: Well, you know, most-- most men would, to find out that their wife had been with another man.

Lucky: Yeah, but it's more than that. Elizabeth lied, in part, because she thought the truth would compromise my recovery. So, yes, she failed me, but I failed her first. And now what I want more than anything is to just let it be over. You know? I--I forgave Elizabeth. I just wish she could forgive herself. I don't know why I'm telling you this, anyway. It's between me and her.

Nikolas: Listen, if you're having second thoughts about marrying her, maybe--maybe you should look into that.

Lucky: Have you been talking to my dad?

Nikolas: No.

Lucky: Did the two of you get drunk together last night? I'm not having second thoughts, Nikolas. I'm just saying I need to be patient. I just need to give Elizabeth the time she needs to trust herself.

Nikolas: Well, I know that she loves you, Lucky, and it would kill her to hurt you again. Well, do you think there's some things that she may not be telling you?

----

That dialogue makes me wonder if TG was like, "wait, everyone thinks Luke is a drunk? Since when?!"

[HeatLifer]

If you feel like watching it...

Nik makes me rage-y. 

Edited January 4, 2017 by HeatLifer

[LeftPhalange]

2 hours ago, HeatLifer said:

Just out of curiosity, did you like the choice to have Lucky raise Jake to begin with? Or did you think it was a copout to please all fanbases? (Liason/JaSam/LL2)

This damn kid should've never existed in the first place. If you want to talk about trolling the fanbases, look no further. 

[peachmangosteen]

11 hours ago, HeatLifer said:

I was talking in general about the idea that Lucky's character has been trashed. I don't think he has because I don't think he abandoned those kids. 

 

10 hours ago, ulkis said:

Well, I remember my post said that Lucky's darkness sounded like an excuse on his part, so you could kinda read it in my post. Which I don't think he's living it up with hookers Luke style but imo it does come across like he is indulging in wanderlust. Which I hate, but that's how it comes across to me.

I personally can't really tell what the show wants us to think about the Lucky situation. Which, surprise surprise, since I can't tell what the show is going for in any story. But anyway, I think what @HeatLifer is saying makes more sense and keeps Lucky in character and still viable. But I think the way they wrote it actually makes it come off the way @ulkis is describing, which I find an odd choice because it really hurts Lucky's character and makes no sense. But ruining characters and making no sense is Jelly's (and RC's) bread and butter, so I get it lol.

11 hours ago, HeatLifer said:

I was talking in general about the idea that Lucky's character has been trashed. I don't think he has because I don't think he abandoned those kids. 

 

10 hours ago, ulkis said:

Well, I remember my post said that Lucky's darkness sounded like an excuse on his part, so you could kinda read it in my post. Which I don't think he's living it up with hookers Luke style but imo it does come across like he is indulging in wanderlust. Which I hate, but that's how it comes across to me.

I personally can't really tell what the show wants us to think about the Lucky situation. Which, surprise surprise, since I can't tell what the show is going for in any story. But anyway, I think what @HeatLifer is saying makes more sense and keeps Lucky in character and still viable. But I think the way they wrote it actually makes it come off the way @ulkis is describing, which I find an odd choice because it really hurts Lucky's character and makes no sense. But ruining characters and making no sense is Jelly's (and RC's) bread and butter, so I get it lol.

[dubbel zout]

11 hours ago, ulkis said:

it does come across like he is indulging in wanderlust. Which I hate, but that's how it comes across to me.

To me, too, and it's because the writers have been pretty offhand about it. One or two comments about Lucky needing to deal with his "darkness" and everyone is apparently okay with it. That's just Lucky. Whatevs! 

9 hours ago, ulkis said:

Lucky: That's between her and I, Dad.

"Her and me," Lucky. Ugh, this is not a hard pronoun choice. /grammar nitpicker

[HeatLifer]

2 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

But I think the way they wrote it actually makes it come off the way @ulkis is describing, which I find an odd choice because it really hurts Lucky's character and makes no sense.

But what scene is this obvious in? I may have missed it, so I'm genuinely asking. I really don't recall anyone acting, or Lucky acting, like he just left to go roam around and do whatever because he just didn't feel like raising kids.

[Oracle42]

I mean, then shouldn't there be at least one scene that indicates that his family is incredibly worried about his mental health given this wildly OOC behavior? 

[dubbel zout]

Or the fact that he's been away from PC for a long time (except NIk's memorial service) and seems to have no interest in staying in contact with his kids?

[HeatLifer]

9 minutes ago, Oracle42 said:

I mean, then shouldn't there be at least one scene that indicates that his family is incredibly worried about his mental health given this wildly OOC behavior? 

Like those scenes Anna and Patrick had when Robin was gone? 

Just bc those scenes never happened doesn't mean Lucky (or Robin) is a bad parent roaming around town.

Edited January 4, 2017 by HeatLifer

[Oracle42]

But they did talk about Robin, they just didn't do anything about it. There's been no indication from anyone in Lucky's family that something is wrong

[KerleyQ]

2 hours ago, HeatLifer said:

Like those scenes Anna and Patrick had when Robin was gone? 

Just bc those scenes never happened doesn't mean Lucky (or Robin) is a bad parent roaming around town.

With Anna and Patrick, though, it was pretty obvious that they were missing something.  Not to mention that story being written heavily depended on them not catching onto the obvious.  I mean, they couldn't be all happy and moving forward, playing one big happy family with Sabrina and Sam, if they thought there was reason to believe that something was off with Robin.  There's no story line that depends on Laura and Lulu (and Nik when he was alive) ignoring the red flags with Lucky.  Admittedly, JJ isn't around, so they can't play any payoff to it yet, but there's zero reason that we shouldn't have them acknowledge that they're concerned about his mental and emotional health.  Hell, with Lulu's obsession with Charlotte, now would be an excellent time for Laura to have a conversation with Kevin about how she is worried that both of her kids have inherited her (and Luke's) mental health issues.  She could mention how Lucky has separated himself from his sons because of this "Spencer darkness" BS, and Lulu has gone in the opposite direction, first with her desire to track down an embryo she believed to be hers with Stavros, and now obsessed Charlotte, not able to be rational and smart about how she approaches the situation.  

There are chances to show that Lucky's absence from the boys' lives is because of depression or any other condition, but there's been zero intention, by any writers, to make it so.  His most recent bow out was a combination of "the darkness" and "well, I want to let Liz have a chance to have a real family with Jason and my sons."  And he didn't even seem particularly torn over it.  He may have been a little wistful, but that was about it.  

Basically, the writers seem to have split the Spencer kids down the middle, by gender.  Since Lucky is Luke's son, this is just how he is (and it's an extension of that insulting retcon that Luke never wanted to be a father or enjoyed being part of a settled down family).  And since Lulu is Laura's daughter, she's focused on being a wife and mother.  Never mind that the categorizations of both Luke and Laura are beyond simplistic and ignore the total history of the characters, both as individuals and together, but that's what they've decided.  

Edited January 4, 2017 by KerleyQ
Because Stefan and Stavros are two entirely different people

[HeatLifer]

I'm just gonna have to agree to disagree here, although I hear you, @KerleyQ. I've also exhausted this topic way too much and I'm getting repetitive and boring myself!

[LeftPhalange]

Ron, Jelly, and Frank suck. The end.

[HeatLifer]

10 minutes ago, LeftPhalange said:

Ron, Jelly, and Frank suck. The end.

And Guza, for me. Tying Lucky to Liz and those kids while at the same time writing Jason as "the love of Liz's life/the one who got away" was gross.

Edited January 4, 2017 by HeatLifer

[ulkis]

1 hour ago, Oracle42 said:

But they did talk about Robin, they just didn't do anything about it. There's been no indication from anyone in Lucky's family that something is wrong

Yeah. Laura and Lulu have semi-regular conversations with him and they're never like, "oh man Lucky is really off."

 

1 hour ago, KerleyQ said:

first with her desire to track down an embryo she believed to be hers with Stefan

Tracking down a Stefan child would have been quite understandable. ;)

I agree with your assessment with how the writers want to write Lucky and Lulu Kerleyq. The funny thing is they keep kinda doing otherwise. Lulu is definitely acting like Luke did when Nik came to town.