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Emily Prentiss: Sin to Win

Wilowy

By Wilowy
in Criminal Minds

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normasm

normasm

Yeah, dusang, i think they laid the groundwork for Prentiss to be an ambitious mole whom Strauss would promote in exchange for helping her marginalize and ruin Hotch. That is what unfolded and had a logical conclusion in In Name and Blood, when Emily resigned rather than "whisper in (Strauss's) ear."

 

When they decided to ratchet back the Prentiss character and Paget called them on it, they decided to dump her altogether, and that, I think was the origin of the Doyle spy arc in 6.

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JMO
JMO

I think Paget, and thereby Emily, had a hard time finding her footing with this return.  She was asked to play a role that was both familiar, and yet different, without having been through an on-scree

ForeverAlone
ForeverAlone

Emily was definitely one of my favorite characters when she was on the show. There was just something about her that I really responded to, and since we weren't given a huge window into Emily's backgr

idiotwaltz
idiotwaltz

I miss her, that's all.

normasm

normasm

From what I understand (and people, I'm ready to stand corrected) the Prentiss character was going to be cut back to recurring. Paget asked if she could be allowed to try for the pilot season, and they decided just to ax Prentiss at that point. I'm sure all this was network directed, and Paget was trying to salvage the best deal she could.

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ForeverAlone

ForeverAlone

From what I understood at the time, the network fired AJ outright (though they did concede to two final episodes) and they amended Paget's contract for a reduced number of episodes. Part of that contract was an option for Paget to pursue pilots. From what I remember, CBS offered her a return to her old contract of series regular in December 2010, but Paget elected to keep her new contract that had the pilot option. Of course that contract also had the clause that CBS could force her back to work if her pilot wasn't picked up, and they exercised that clause at the end of season six. 

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dusang

dusang

(edited)

Yeah... I'll never understand what CBS was thinking at that point.  And then introducing the Seaver character by the abominable Rachel Nichols... the only worse move would have been to hire Elisabeth Rohm.  Blergh.  Sorry, I think I'm straying from topic.

 

I just saw an early Emily episode where she confesses to being a nerd and then bonds with Morgan over Kurt Vonnegut.  I'll buy Emily as a nerd but I do not buy being a fan of Vonnegut to be evidence of said nerdiness.  Or maybe I'm defining nerd too narrowly?

 

Also, to quote a great man of our time: "You know, "nerd culture" is mainstream now. So, when you use the word "nerd" derogatorily, it means you're the one that's out of the zeitgeist."

Edited by dusang
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idiotwaltz

idiotwaltz

From what I understood at the time, the network fired AJ outright (though they did concede to two final episodes) and they amended Paget's contract for a reduced number of episodes. Part of that contract was an option for Paget to pursue pilots. From what I remember, CBS offered her a return to her old contract of series regular in December 2010, but Paget elected to keep her new contract that had the pilot option. Of course that contract also had the clause that CBS could force her back to work if her pilot wasn't picked up, and they exercised that clause at the end of season six. 

 

I think this sounds about right. There's an interview Paget did with Riki Lindhome (who played Vanessa Holden in 52 Pickup) in which she explains her decision to leave CM after Season 7. According to her (and some of this is PB's own speculation, mind you), CBS saw the pilot of the spinoff and decided that CM needed new women. So they fired her and AJC and got RN on board. AJC was fired nearly immediately but PB got to do 17 episodes, and then did a pilot. Things didn't work out the way CBS wanted, and PB's pilot didn't get picked up, so contractually, she had to go back when CBS wanted her back for Season 7, or they could've and probably would've sued her. When her contract ended after Season 7, she didn't want to continue working on the show since, well, CBS basically treated her like shit. 

 

Speaking of the spy arc, I used to hate it with a fervent passion, because it's so OOC and retcons the way Prentiss was written since the beginning, but having rewatched it a few times, I've learned to enjoy it as some bizarre spy AU spinoff. To me Season 6 is really just an AU, with JJ gone and Seaver joining the team and really crappy episodes. 

 

 

the only worse move would have been to hire Elisabeth Rohm.

 

Are you kidding? It would've been awesome. When they fired her, she could've stomped into Hotch's room and said, soberly, "IS THIS BECAUSE I'M A LESBIAN?" 

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normasm

normasm

Dusang, I bet they were working with the definition of "nerd" that Emily would have grown up with, and it was an insult back in the day. And a lot more broadly defined, I think. 

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Cobalt Stargazer

Cobalt Stargazer

(edited)

Are you kidding? It would've been awesome. When they fired her, she could've stomped into Hotch's room and said, soberly, "IS THIS BECAUSE I'M A LESBIAN?" 

{OT]Hey, leave Serena out of this. At least she was qualified to do her job, unlike the unfortunate Seaver.[/OT]

 

So the question is, why did the network decide to dump Prentiss when Brewster's performance made her one of their more memorable characters? Like Gubler, she breathed life into the inconsistent writing and made Emily both relatable and rootable. I'm one of the few who liked Alex, but getting involved in the tug-of-war between Messer and  the suits didn't do Tripplehorn any favors as far as actually being allowed to act. So I'm thinking somebody's doing some bullshitting somewhere, and I don't think Paget's the guilty party. Why fix what wasn't broken?

Edited by Cobalt Stargazer
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idiotwaltz

idiotwaltz

{OT]Hey, leave Serena out of this. At least she was qualified to do her job, unlike the unfortunate Seaver.[/OT]

 

So the question is, why did the network decide to dump Prentiss when Brewster's performance made her one of their more memorable characters? Like Gubler, she breathed life into the inconsistent writing and made Emily both relatable and rootable. I'm one of the few who liked Alex, but getting involved in the tug-of-war between Messer and  the suits didn't do Tripplehorn any favors as far as actually being allowed to act. So I'm thinking somebody's doing some bullshitting somewhere, and I don't think Paget's the guilty party. Why fix what wasn't broken?

 

Re Serena, I'll take your word for it as I stopped watching Mothership long before she joined. No ADA was ever as good at her job as Alex Cabot though. [/OT]

 

I think CBS wanted to skew a younger audience as well as cut down their budget, which is why they brought RN in for a lower salary than AJC and PB. It obviously didn't happen and they were losing viewers, so they decided, Whoopsie, let's get those girls back. Which makes me wonder why, two years later, they decide to get Tripplehorn on board - the only logical explanation I can come up with is that The Good Wife happened and CBS realized that older women, strong women, could draw audiences in AND become critical darlings, but by then it was too little too late.

 

Back on topic ... which are your favourite Prentiss episodes? My top 3 are:

 

1. Demonology 

2. Minimal Loss

3. Honor Among Thieves <---- I can't help it, I love watching her and her mother. 

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zannej

zannej

I vaguely recall Paget saying something about how CBS wanted to reduce her episode number but the fan outcry made them adjust it and give her more episodes than planned.

Rachel Nichols wasn't bad in her first appearance on CM but the writing was so inconsistent for her and she didn't seem to know what to do with the character (mostly the writers' fault). She can be hit and miss. She was absolutely horrible as Scarlet in GI Joe: The Rise of Cobra (that movie just sucked out loud) but she's great on Continuum. But then, she's the lead on Continuum and they give her a lot to work with.

 

I can't say for sure what CBS was thinking, but Nina Tassler did say that they wanted to change the original CM to make it fit better with the spinoff. I never watched the spinoff (aside from "The Fight" CM episode that sparked it) because I couldn't get past the whole "rogue team" thing they announced in the beginning. They said "rogue team" and I clicked the remote. Plus they had a convicted felon and foreign national as members. That would never happen. I guess maybe they just wanted to make CM less realistic. I think the action chick stuff was popular and they didn't have any females on CM that were believable as young sexy asskickers. I do think that was one of the reasons they changed JJ so much when she came back.

 

Speaking of Rikki Lindholme, I saw she has her own show now. I wonder if they will ever play the You, Me, and Steve song. For anyone who hasn't heard yet (which might be nobody) it was rumored that Riki tried to date Matthew for awhile and that Steve kept cockblocking to the point that Rikki wrote a song about it. This relates back because Steve is the one who is marrying Paget.

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Cobalt Stargazer

Cobalt Stargazer

I think CBS wanted to skew a younger audience as well as cut down their budget, which is why they brought RN in for a lower salary than AJC and PB.

I suppose its true about skewing younger, but hell, Paget's only forty-five, and I thought she was younger than that. Rachel Nichols turned thirty-four in January, which by Hollywood standards isn't really young. And you're right, it doesn't make sense to later hire the fifty-year-old Tripplehorn if some stereotypical young thing was what they wanted. But I'm digressing, so.

 

I would definitely agree with your choices for the top three Emily-sodes, Demonology being my favorite. Her vulnerability when she tells Rossi about her abortion is mingled with her toughness from Minimal Loss, since it was clear IMO that although she remembered the fear and the panic, Matthew gave her the courage to hold her head up, and she carried that lesson forward. Bloodied but not broken, as it were.

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mstaken

mstaken

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yqZZzFo-AU

 

Someone sent me the above Prentiss video and, despite the slightly cheesy music, I loved it enough to share. It focuses on S2 Emily, which is actually when I found the character at her very most lovable, relatable and interesting. She was (IMO, of course), endearingly adorkable, candid to the point of slight tactlessness and a little personally insecure while still extraordinarily professionally competent, smart, strong, snarky, compassionate etc. (By S4, she was a little more of an edgy, badass, generically 'awesome at everything' extrovert, which didn't quite work for me as well) Rest assured that there are plenty of shots of our other team members here as well. And sometimes the music stops long enough to include one of her better S2 quotes :) 

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idiotwaltz

idiotwaltz

(edited)

What I love about newbie!Prentiss is that as good as she is at compartmentalizing, there were still moments when she was taken aback by the horror of her job, such as when she and Hotch had to interview the dying woman in Ashes and Dust and her conversation with Morgan on the plan at the end of Open Season, wondering how different they, being profilers, really are from the UNSUBS they hunt. 

 

By Season 7, she just seems world-weary, like nothing surprises her anymore. That just makes me feel really bad for her. 

Edited by idiotwaltz
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mstaken

mstaken

(edited)

It's so true, Idiotwaltz! For all the alleged 'compartmentalizing', I actually felt like Original Recipe Prentiss was endearingly real and even raw in a way---she had strong reactions and showed them. She was emotional, she was sometimes endearingly awkward, she blurted out things she probably shouldn't have, she was openly appalled by some of what they witnessed. By the end, she was more of the typically smooth, cool, badass female law enforcement agent we see on so many other shows. Paget Brewster still made me love the character anyway, but I felt like original Prentiss had Favorite Character EVER potential for me that was never fully realized. 

Edited by mstaken
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zannej

zannej

I forgot to mention that one of the few things I disliked about early Prentiss was when she asked things like "How are we different from the people we hunt".. I wanted to slap the writers and say "Because, you are trying to save lives and stop people from raping/killing/torturing whereas the people you are hunting are trying to rape/kill/torture!"

 

Paget, Joe, Matthew, and AJ went to the recent Pageant of the Masters. Paget looked beautiful. (I'll have to dig up a photo later).

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idiotwaltz

idiotwaltz

 

I wanted to slap the writers and say "Because, you are trying to save lives and stop people from raping/killing/torturing whereas the people you are hunting are trying to rape/kill/torture!"

 

I've always read it as Emily basically wondering if everyone is capable of turning into an UNSUB, a question she flat-out asks Rossi at the end of True Night. Hotch puts it perfectly in Demonology, "I think deep down we're all capable of unspeakable things" and the show repeatedly emphasizes that serial killers are the best profilers themselves, so no, they're not too different in that sense. Given the childhoods our darling BAU members have had (from what we know anyway), any one of them could've veered down a different path and become an UNSUB (there are at least two dozen fanfics on this very premise), but they turned out to be the protectors instead. I've always assumed that was the message the writers were trying to send: that we all have untapped potential to be UNSUBS, we all have dark impulses at some point or another, what keeps us from caving in? And what's to say we won't just snap one day like Mitch Pileggi did in Normal?

 

That said, it's entirely possible that I'm giving the writers too much credit. 

 

Back on topic: I've been rewatching Huff, which is mediocre at best, but Paget is devastatingly gorgeous in it. I can't believe the show was from 10 years ago. The years have been much kinder to Paget than they have been to  me. 

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SparedTurkey

SparedTurkey

@idiotwaltz - I agree that the years have been great to PB. I can only hope she showers in the blood of virgins or something, because I never looked that good at 20, let alone now.

 

I miss Prentiss, she was my favourite character and I agree with whoever said that PB was the best actor among the women, and frankly, better than many of the men. While I hated the spy-route they show took (and I will never defend it) I did think PB still acted the hell out of what she was given and tried to stay in character (as much as the writing would allow). Similarly, while I think Honour Among Thieves isn't the best case by a long shot (though better than many from the recent seasons), I did like it for the Prentiss/Her Mum relationship and the trying to speak Russian scene. Similarly, the 200 episode was crap, but I only watched for PB, who did her best. While I wish CBS did screw her around, leading to her eventually leaving, I am kinda glad that she did, if only to spare her from the current writing. She'd be shoved in the background, much like Hotch/Rossi/Reid.

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Shanna

Shanna

Just picked up this show on netflix this summer and holy casting changes! After they reset s6 I thought we were safe but I just got to s8 to discover that Emily is gone. I this show has terrible writing much of the time but paget was one of the actors who really brought life to the whole thing so I am sad to see her go. This Blake stuff is not promising!!!

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Shanna

Shanna

(edited)

Jennifer love Hewitt, right? That's an odd choice.

I'll see with Blake. I'm only a couple episodes into the season. I don't enjoy her dynamic with Reid so far and they came on annoyingly strong in the first few episodes, marginalizing the original cast a bit IMO. But we will see.

I just had hoped we were done with recasting after s6. I liked Emily better than hotchner.

Edited by Shanna
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Wilowy

Wilowy

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The introduction of Blake went a long way in re-establishing REID as a force to be reckoned with and appreciated as a vital team member. I'll always be appreciative towards her character for that reason, but also because she brought a calm confidence and professionalism that was very welcome in a new cast member. If anyone had been marginalized in s7 it was him, and I was glad to see his contributions brought back to the forefront as the team, one by one, remembered his gifts. I'm not saying that's the sole reason she was brought to the show, she wasn't a prop... but it didn't hoit. ;)

 

I also liked how when her and Emily finally met, it was genial and warm. This show has never tried to give us "catty women co-workers" trope, and I'm always glad for that. Our people have always gotten along. At least, in service of the story. 

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idiotwaltz

idiotwaltz

Paget was in one of the sketches in Key & Peele this week. I found it gross more than funny (the sketch was a spoof on crime procedurals and probably even CM) but I liked how Paget had her Prentiss stance going the whole time. 

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Cobalt Stargazer

Cobalt Stargazer

Paget was in one of the sketches in Key & Peele this week. I found it gross more than funny (the sketch was a spoof on crime procedurals and probably even CM) but I liked how Paget had her Prentiss stance going the whole time. 

 

I need to see this. I looked on the Comedy Central website, and the title of the episode is Sex Detective, which is just.....yes, I must see this. Why do they make you sign in to see their streamed content?

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idiotwaltz

idiotwaltz

zaneej, you must watch Paget's episodes of Drunk History stat. It's brilliant stuff. 

 

From Wikipedia

 

 

Drunk History is an American television comedy series produced by Comedy Central, based on the Funny or Die web series created by Derek Waters and Jeremy Konner in 2007. In each episode, an inebriated narrator struggles to recount an event from American history, while actors enact the narrator's anecdote and lip sync the dialog.

 

But it is so much more than that. So much more. And for someone who doesn't know anything about American history, this show has been entertainingly educational. 

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Calamity Jane

Calamity Jane

Emily was always my favorite character (didn't start watching until several seasons in), and I think the show has gone downhill steadily since she left.  That may also be a factor of age in general, as they seem to stretch and strain for new plots, but she left a gaping hole they have not been able to fill. Much of what made it really watchable left with her.

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amensisterfriend

amensisterfriend

I've been rewatching (i.e., obsessing over!) S2, and I'm surprised all over again by how much Emily changed---IMO, of course :) She was initially kind of adorably awkward, a self-proclaimed nerd, an interesting contrast between some personal insecurities and her academic and professional competence. She was blunt, both because she valued honesty as a result of witnessing her mother's mandatory 'diplomacy' and because she seemed a little too charmingly socially oblivious to know better. I freaking LOVE this version of Emily. She came across as a little sheltered, the product of an upper middle class upbringing and an Ivy League education who was still feeling her way about how exactly her intelligence and gifts would translate to this dark world of which she was now a part. She seemed to specialize in languages and cultures, back when the show at least pretended that each team member had even slightly different strengths and areas of expertise :) 

 

By S3, she was already sort of a 'generically flawless, blandly awesome-at-everything agent' IMO. Then towards the end we learn about her goth-y past, setting the stage for S4's (and beyond) 'edgy' Emily, who's super tough, a bit of a 'party girl' (e.g., in LV, and the classic 'sin to win' comment, etc!), Suddenly she dressed in tighter fitting, sleek and often black clothing, which is a whole different wardrobe than what she brought with her in S2! (I don't usually even notice changes in hair and clothing, but it was pretty noticeable here.) 

 

Mostly, they just stopped developing and defining her altogether, but what we did get seemed somewhat at odds with the Emily we first met IMO. And I'm not even counting the super secret spy reveal, which in my own weird little head never happened ;) In general, it's like they belatedly decided to make her a bit more of an 'Elle' than the character she was first introduced as. 

 

I absolutely adore Paget Brewster, and for me she was nearly always able to elevate an underwritten and/or sloppily written role, making me care about Emily and enjoy spending time with her even at her most poorly and inconsistently defined.  And maybe the writers deliberately made her initially awkward not as a personality trait but simply to show how hard it is for most people to fit into this close knit team. Whenever I rewatch S2, though, I can't help but miss that earliest incarnation of Emily's character. I thought she was an awesome mix of strengths and vulnerabilities, and I related to her all too well! 

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Droogie

Droogie

I was really fond of Blake, but Emily is my true love. I liked Elle a real lot, but she just wasn't on the show long enough. She could come back, though, and I'd be happy.

Prentiss was the absolute shizz.

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secnarf

secnarf

I think I love Emily far too much for a fictional character.
I'm not sure how much of that stems from not having had her on the show in a while (absence makes the heart grow fonder) but I feel like I could watch her on my screen forever.

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