S02.E04: Valerie Saves The Show

[Tara Ariano]

Valerie reacts impulsively when she finds out that some of her "Seeing Red" scenes may be left on the cutting-room floor. Later, she polishes her improvisational skills with the Groundlings.

[Primetimer]

In an episode of The Comeback loaded with even more awkward moments than usual, Jane's discomfort lights up the dark.

Read the story

[CofCinci]

“Hope it wasn’t the cow I just lassoed because it was a baby.”  The cancer improv line.  I love the continued glimpses of Valerie’s dark sense of humor.

 

“Do they really need this ramp?”  and then the wheelchair producer appears --- I howled.

 

That suicide?  Oh my.

[Kris117]

The look Mark gave the camera when Valerie was talking about actors was priceless.

[pasdetrois]

The scenes jammed full of people and jerky hand-held camera are annoying.

 

Were those the real Groundlings? I have to give Valerie credit, she's up for anything in an effort to further her career, even when she's out of her element.

 

Was the older Asian woman roaming about the apartment building supposed to have something wrong with her? I was confused by that character.

[pomme de terre]

I do improv and I hate bad improv so very much. Nothing brings out the high school Mean Girl in me like someone bombing on stage through their own personal choices.

Related: I live in a smaller city and a fairly famous character actor known for darker roles enrolled in our beginner class. The teacher asked if he'd like to skip the 101 class since he IS a working actor, and he said he was really bad at improv and 101 was the right place for him. This was actually correct and kudos to him for knowing it. That said, I cannot imagine the poor bastards who walked into Smaller City Improv class and saw the equivalent of say, Tony Sirico standing there. What newbie can do a cafe scene with Paulie Walnuts sitting right there?

[Kris117]

The best part of the improv class was Valerie's version of climbing the ladder. Instead of being committed to appearing to climb a ladder, she was committed to her part of a famous actress being a good sport for the cameras. Painfully perfect. 

[iMonrey]

So far in "Seeing Red," Paulie G. has imagined himself making "Mallory" blow him, and now, driving to her house with a gun in his car. I don't know if I find it hard to believe, or if it's just surprising to me, that he had this level of resentment towards her when he was writing "Room and Bored." He basically ignored her whenever he wasn't forced not to, he  had no interest in writing for her or her character, I never really perceived that he even thought about her that much. I know he hated her for whatever reason, but to this extent, bordering on obsession?

 

One thing that kind of stuck out for me was when the cops were at the crime scene and Valerie asked if they had ID'd the "perp." But, she already knew the guy shot himself, she'd seen the bloody aftermath with her own eyes. I don't know if she was just trying to show off the lingo she knew from doing CSI but the moment felt clumsily written to me.

 

I've said this before, but the reality show cameras gimmick doesn't really work very well for this season's premise. I can see cameras following Valerie around at work, since the footage is supposed to be for BTS bonus material on the HBO website, but I can't see them going to the lengths they are, following Valerie home, and I can't imagine why there's a camera in her bedroom.

[hoodooznoodooz]

iMonrey, I agree with you that during the first season, it seemed that Paulie G resented her, but never gave her a second thought, unless she was irritating him. He considered her a waste of space, time and effort.

Is there a joke I am missing with regard to the Rockford Files reference?

I loved Seamus's reaction to Valerie implying that there was something humorous about his name.

[junemeatcleaver]

 

Is there a joke I am missing with regard to the Rockford Files reference?

 

I think Mickey said Seeing Red is not the Rockford Files because he thinks the Rockford Files is a better and classier production and show than Seeing Red will be.  I would have to agree with that, I'd rather watch Rockford than a show about a never-was, drug addicted writer fantasizing about violating and killing some washed up actress.  And I may be projecting, but I think there was a larger point being made by the show that "prestige" cable shows aren't automatically better than anything else on tv, including 35 year old procedurals.

Edited December 1, 2014 by junemeatcleaver

[LotusFlower]

Does anyone know how long the season is? I was wondering if the "6 episode" remark about HBO shows was an inside reference to this show.

[txhorns79]

But, she already knew the guy shot himself, she'd seen the bloody aftermath with her own eyes. I don't know if she was just trying to show off the lingo she knew from doing CSI but the moment felt clumsily written to me.

 

She saw the bloody aftermath, briefly, for what appeared to be ten or twenty seconds before Mark closed the door.  I don't know if she saw anything to indicate the guy's death was a suicide.

 

The improv failure was perfect.  It makes sense that the only role Valerie can commit to is "Valerie," and I kind of loved Jane's looks of general annoyance and horror.     

 

 

I was wondering if the "6 episode" remark about HBO shows was an inside reference to this show.

 

I think this season has eight episodes. 

[CMH1981]

I loved Mickey's reply when it stated that this show isn't the Rockford Files.  "No it isn't."  I'm betting that Lisa had to bite her cheek when she turned to him after he said that line b/c he delivered that line so strongly and with conviction that I just laughed out loud for awhile and kept rewinding it.

 

I felt so bad that Valerie's first thought when told most of her character would be cut was to assume it was b/c Paulie G forced his hand on it.  I wanted to hug her, and Lisa Kudrow played that scene perfect w/the stuttering and confusion and sadness.

 

What was w/the look Jane was giving Mickey after Valerie kept mentioning "cancer" during her improv?  Jane looked like should could kill Mickey w/that look, it was very weird.  Was Mickey not supposed to mention that on camera at all considering Valerie inadvertently pushed him to say it.

[hoodooznoodooz]

I enjoyed Valerie asking Esperanza to move Marky Mark's Nespresso machine to the laundry room or garage, someplace "convenient".

Maybe this was discussed nine years ago on TWOP, but I didn't have a chance to read it: was "I'm it!" a really popular show? Did Valerie have a lot of fans? Was she more self-aware back then? According to imdb, Valerie used to be an A-list celebrity. But she is so awkward and dorky now, it makes me wonder.

Edited December 2, 2014 by hoodooznoodooz

[CMH1981]

Well if I recall "I'm IT!" was cancelled just before it could reach syndication numbers so that's why she isn't as relevant as she thinks she is.  She won a People's Choice Award for the role, and that's about it.  I don't think she was really A-list to be honest.  I think she thought she was, as i'm sure most people seeking fame see themselves that way when they land the staring role in a tv-show.  I think her first and only Tonight Show appearance while being on "I'm IT!" was probably to promote the show during the premier of the show.  When someone brings up the show to her, it's usually a vague reference and it's remember it was a kitschy show.  I think the show was on par w/the robot daughter show "Small Wonder."  People vaguely remember that show and the only difference is the cast has moved on with their lives yet still reminisce about it and for what it was, whereas Valerie kept trying to be relevant and makes the show more than what it was.  I really wish they would have Valerie meet up w/former cast members of "I'm IT" and they have either moved on with their lives or maybe one had become more successful than she could ever dream, like George Clooney in the Facts of Life or Roseanne.  I really think that one of them telling Valerie a hard truth about "I'm IT!" could help, and yes I remember Jimmy Burrows tried to get through to her in the first season.

[hoodooznoodooz]

CMH1981: your memory is impressive! Thank you for your analysis and opinion. It would be so entertaining if she did bump into a former I'm It! cast member who had gone on to achieve the level of fame and success that GC did after Rosanne, or Facts of Life (which I completely forgot about).

Love the comparison to Small Wonder. Heehee!

Edited December 2, 2014 by hoodooznoodooz

[CMH1981]

Well to be honest hoodooznoodooz, I watched the first season marathon the day before the new season started.  I've been a fan of the show since the first season originally aired, and I usually would watch the series once every few years b/c I always thought it was brilliant and Lisa Kudrow was robbed of an Emmy that year.

 

I think today that "I'm IT!" would be cancelled after a few episodes.  We have to remember that back then, the early 90's, that lots of shows weren't cut short like shows today, after two or three episodes.  

 

I know this is odd, but I kind of wish they would film an entire episode of "I'm IT!" so we could see what the show was really like, maybe a pilot version so we could get the whole story on Valerie Cherish and why she is like she is.

Edited December 2, 2014 by CMH1981

[JohnnyGilda]

 

I loved Mickey's reply when it stated that this show isn't the Rockford Files.  "No it isn't."  I'm betting that Lisa had to bite her cheek when she turned to him after he said that line b/c he delivered that line so strongly and with conviction that I just laughed out loud for awhile and kept rewinding it.

 

The line and his delivery killed me.  I could fully imagine Mickey's pre-Red days, bouncing around Hollywood trailers, sets and studios of the 70s and 80s.  A few seasons of Rockford, a season or two of Maude, The Flip Wilson Show.  Maybe stuntman turned producer Ron was there, too.  Deadpan moments like him rolling in perfectly on-cue to Mark's rant about the ramp, or rolling away from Valerie like his sanity depended on it, have me looking forward to Ron's every appearance.

Edited December 2, 2014 by JohnnyGilda

[CofCinci]

I could fully imagine Mickey's pre-Red days, bouncing around Hollywood trailers, sets and studios of the 70s and 80s.  A few seasons of Rockford, a season or two of Maude, The Flip Wilson Show. 

Yes!  I'd love to see an HBO 'dramedy' about Mickey in the 1970s.

With Chris Pine as Mickey.

[CMH1981]

With the show "Seeing Red" only being 6 episodes, wouldn't the show already have the scripts ready to go or at least an outline of where it is all going?  I only ask this b/c so far we have seen the Paulie G character having Valerie giving him a blow job, and then he is outside her house shooting up w/a gun, I mean where can this go next?  I'm guessing eventually the Valerie character will end up sleeping w/the Paulie G character on the show.  I would hope that they aren't keeping Valerie in the dark here and it's Valerie who isn't asking to know the arc of her character w/the Paulie G character.  

 

I really can't figure out where Paulie G is going w/this show as it makes no sense compared to how they didn't interact that much during the tenure of "Room and Bored."  Are we going to find out that the real Paulie G actually has a hard-on/obsession for Valerie Cherish?

Edited December 2, 2014 by CMH1981

[hoodooznoodooz]

CMH1981: I would loooove to see the pilot of I'm It! They showed us that scene with the necktie and file cabinet, and I definitely wanted to see more. I agree with you that Lisa Kudrow deserved an Emmy for her Valerie performance. I have no idea where they plan to take this: Valerie having sex with Paulie G? You're right, that would be bizarre. They showed us Paulie's reaction to a poster of Valerie in her peak years, but I still find that incompatible with a Valerie/Paulie hook-up. I am optimistic that the writers will not jump the shark....

[Kris117]

So far in "Seeing Red," Paulie G. has imagined himself making "Mallory" blow him, and now, driving to her house with a gun in his car. I don't know if I find it hard to believe, or if it's just surprising to me, that he had this level of resentment towards her when he was writing "Room and Bored." He basically ignored her whenever he wasn't forced not to, he  had no interest in writing for her or her character, I never really perceived that he even thought about her that much. I know he hated her for whatever reason, but to this extent, bordering on obsession?

I remember him as being actively hostile, and going out of his way to humiliate her any chance he got. It was as if he believed that forty-something women had no reason to be living on the same planet he occupied. I can't remember, but did the network force him to take Valerie? That would certainly caused some of the hostility, but I also think Valerie is strongly associated with his addiction in some way—in his head he knows she's not to blame, but she represents everything bad from that time. I also think it's possible that he is or has been attracted to her, and resents her for it, since she's not a nubile young blonde. So Paulie G. thinks he's made amends, but he really hasn't.

Edited December 5, 2014 by Kris117

[missy jo]

was "I'm it!" a really popular show? Did Valerie have a lot of fans?

 

I always took it to be an allegory of "Friends," but I guess it wasn't as popular as that.