S09.E09: Duggars in Cuffs

[Oldernowiser]

I'm not going to fry you. I think there are a lot of mothers who take short cuts with younger kids because...well, you have to. It's like the bed issue. I have the daughter with the beautiful bed who still sleeps on the floor.

But I think what people react to in the Duggar children really isn't any of the specific things. All of us have a child who is messier, or one who practically lives in pjs or one who sleeps on the floor or was late to potty train etc. It's the uniformity of the uncared for traits that seem to fall across all of the younger children that seem a little sad to me. Again, I do not think that any given thing is wrong, but I honestly do think they are in over their heads in ways other families don't seem to be. (For comparison sake, some parents I know have six or seven children under the age of ten and are similar ages to the Duggar parents but have no older children to help in any way.)

What people react to (well, meaning people = me) is the obvious evidence that not all is perfect/precious/neat in Duggarland yet the Dugger Elders insist that everything is not only good, but PERFECT. After all, God has given them so many Blessings that clearly he is 100% on board with everything they're doing as parents. It's a complete tautology of WTF: We are perfect parents because we keep becoming...parents. Go, God.

Positive thinking is one thing. Glossing over everything that doesn't fit with the family's image of themselves is another. I grew up with that crap and it's insanity-making to have parents who tell you in no uncertain terms that everything is precious and outstanding and wonderful, even in the face of glaring evidence to the contrary. As a result, you never completely trust your own judgment about anything. It's much worse for the Duggar kids because they have all of those siblings also spouting the party line at them.

If Michelle or JB ever once said, "You know, we had all of these kids because of our faith but some days are just brutal and we don't always do everything we should for each of them," I would actually have a tiny bit of respect for them. Very tiny.

This episode just proves it...when everything is perfection it's just boring. They're out of storylines and six more courtships/weddings/grandchildren isn't going to make it any more interesting.

Edited October 11, 2014 by Oldernowiser

[starfire]

Completely agree.  I taught first grade for 35 years and I can unequivocally say that every single child I worked with who was a preemie had either physical, behavioral or learning issues of some kind - and usually a mix of them.  Sometimes minor, sometimes not.  It all depended on if the parents intervened, and if yes, how much and how early.  So obviously here, the real miracle will be if Josie is ultimately found to have none of these - but I'd bet the farm this is not going to be the case.  Needless to say her parents, if they do suspect anything is wrong, will be in complete denial about it.

 

Just curious, how were you able to find out the preemie-or-not status of every child you ever taught? Did you ask every single child's parents? Is it on the school application form? Just wondering because it seems that parents of kids with delays would be more likely to inform the teacher/school of the reason their kid might be behind other children.

[NausetGirl]

Just curious, how were you able to find out the preemie-or-not status of every child you ever taught? Did you ask every single child's parents? Is it on the school application form? Just wondering because it seems that parents of kids with delays would be more likely to inform the teacher/school of the reason their kid might be behind other children.

 

Hello starfire. Yes, each year I read the files on each student in August before school begins and during the first week of school I send home a brief questionnaire, asking parents to basically describe their children to me.  And you're right - parents are usually very forthcoming about their kids, whether the child was a preemie or not.  They want me to know and understand their children as best I can.  I ask whether the child was full term or not, has allergies, has had [or has currently] any particular health issues I should know about, does the child have particular interests, hobbies, quirks, fears etc?  But I get the best information from the last question - "Is there anything else you feel I should know about your child in order to provide the best experience for him or her in first grade?" I usually get 2-5 page essays from parents on this one and learned a lot of information that was invaluable help in working with their children.

[GEML]

Hmmm... Interesting. Because when I filled out my child's form, during the parent teacher conference, my son's kindergarten teacher thanked me for being honest about me son on the form and listing things he couldn't do. She told me out of sixty students (half day kindergarten) not one other parent had listed a negative (I'd put down can't cut and can't write, struggles with fine motor skills, so nothing too dramatic).

[Jellybeans]

I did not put down anything when my kids were in school because I expect kids to have differing abilities and it is ok for kids to learn that.

[juneday]

I was born 2 months premature (one of twins, though my sister did not survive) 55 years ago, when there was a lot less sophisticated care available.

I've never had any learning issues, and no physical ones either (though I'm no athlete by any means...just more bookish). I was crushingly shy growing up, so there's that, but that's not unusual, even among kids who were born at term.

I was also born premature, on June 16th when my mom's due date was September 9th.

I had to be put on oxygen for a few days & I had a heart monitor for a while, but I never had any learning disabilities or anything else because of it.

Now I did have chronic migraines as a child until I was put on medicine for it (finally!).

I was a small child and was also very shy and quiet, but I'm still like that.

[GEML]

I have two children, one two weeks over, one four weeks early who was also IUGR. The former, late one who weighed in normally at birth had the learning issues.

These things are very complex. A preemie birth is only one small piece of a very large puzzle.

[Jynnan tonnix]

I was also born premature, on June 16th when my mom's due date was September 9th.

I had to be put on oxygen for a few days & I had a heart monitor for a while, but I never had any learning disabilities or anything else because of it.

Now I did have chronic migraines as a child until I was put on medicine for it (finally!).

I was a small child and was also very shy and quiet, but I'm still like that.

 

I was born Jan 2, and have a cousin born at the beginning of March who I was due within a couple of days of. We still argue over who is "older". No one really remembers which of us was due first  lol. I am also still very shy to this day. No intent to derail the thread. I'll be quiet now.

[VillaVillekulla]

I was full term but IUGR, so I weighed a smidgen less than 5 pounds at birth and had to be in the NICU for a few days. No lasting issues. I'm still quite small as an adult but I likely would have been anyway, owing to my genetics (my parents are not what you'd call vertically gifted).

[jilliannatalia]

 

Miracle worries me the more I see her.  My sister works with children and thinks there is a definitely a possibility of autism or downs.  I sincerely hope not - and hope she is just a spoiled brat.

 

I have a master's in ed psych, though I didn't complete a practicum and hence am not a licensed school psychologist. Josie doesn't have the classic look associated with Down Syndrome. That's nearly always diagnosed  at birth. I couldn't say definitively, but she doesn't present the overall affect of a child with autism. I do think she has major language delays, however, and possibly overall developmental delays.

 

I felt sorry for the poor child in an episode where I believe others were going to look at Jill's and Derrick's new temporary home. She was standing near the door asking , "Can I  go?' No one even acknowledged what she was saying. I understood their not taking her, but they could have at least given the poor child a decent answer.

Edited October 12, 2014 by jilliannatalia

[GEML]

I get that there is a lot going on and that children can ask endless questions to the point where even if you had all the time in the world, you wouldn't have enough time to answer them. But it does bother me a little but that over the years JB and Michelle almost never interrupt what they are doing to answer a question, and then tell one of their children, "And I will answer more question at a better time." Or something like that. Maybe that happens off camera, but the fact that they do seem to consistent ignore their youngest children (even Josie) is a little sad.

[frenchtoast]

Hi folks! We seem to have drifted into personal school stories. Can we please make our way back to discussing the episode? School and learning is a great topic to talk about, so feel free to continue that discussion here, in the Small Talk area. Thanks!

[StatMom]

I'm late for watching this episode, but turns out I only needed about three minutes. I was thoroughly cringing when JimBoob started his "acting" with his "bad driving" and I FF'ed through the whole handcuff ridiculousness. Even at double-speed, I could feel the embarrassment of all involved. Except possibly JimBoob who seems to have no sense of social awkwardness. "So, how's ya'll's relationship going?" Smoooooth, JB. It's really to the point where I can hardly watch when he's on screen anymore, with all his fakey fakeness. I know that's pretty much all reality TV, but he has reset the bar.