S03.E19: A Change in the Wind / S03.E20: I'd Do It Again

[Danielg342]

Quote

When a fire erupts at a gas station, Bode and Manny jump into action to protect the patrons and property/Extremely high winds and dangerous conditions push the Zebel Ridge fire into Edgewater, threatening Three Rock and Walter's care facility

 

Edited April 26 by Danielg342

[Danielg342]

To be honest, I watched the end of this show and I'm not sure how excited I am to want to continue with it.

S4 faces the prospect of losing three main characters- Sharon, Vince and Jake- as well as the prospect of losing two regularly recurring characters in Walter and Audrey.

Three of those characters- Vince, Sharon and Audrey- are my three overall favourites for the series (aside from Freddy). So the thought of losing those three doesn't sit very well with me.

That said, there was far more wrong with this episode than the prospect of the show sacrificing characters I like.

The main problem is that the show is up to its old tricks again with plot contrivances galore, with characters either acting stupid or doing very little of value at all.

We also had an episode that moved slower than a snail.

I'm not going to go into everything that went wrong because I'd be here all night.

I will highlight something that really rankled me in this episode and compare it to how another show treats the same concept differently.

By now, we all know Bode's got a thing for heroism. We also know he's impulsive and doesn't hesitate to go rogue.

The show keeps painting Bode's rogue tendencies as very bad, but Bode never faces any consequences for them.

So I don't know why, three seasons in, the show still insists on having this stupid game where Bode's superiors tell him not to do something and Bode does it anyway.

It's tiring at this point, and Bode's more than proven his effectiveness.

Meaning that if the show is never going to made Bode's recklessness have anything meaningfully negative happen, the show's characters ought to start treating him with respect.

On S.W.A.T., which airs after Fire Country, the dynamic is different.

There, the main character- Hondo- is also known to be a bit of a rogue. One of the early season storylines involved Hondo's own commander- Robert Hicks- trying to reel him in.

However, as the seasons wore on, Hondo more than proved his effectiveness when he made the decision to take matters into his own hands.

How does S.W.A.T. handle this situation? It doesn't do it by continuing with Hicks trying to rein in Hondo- it evolved to a point where Hicks and Hondo develop a mutual respect and a mutual trust with each other.

Hicks doesn't try to keep Hondo on a metaphorical leash, and Hondo doesn't abuse that trust by picking his spots wisely.

It's the kind of thing that I wish FC would do more often with Bode.

Now, I'm not sure about the wisdom of Bode charging, head first, into a burning building with no supplies and no gear.

I'm not sure there's a firefighter alive who is that stupid.

However, that's more on the writing staff deciding Bode needs to be stupid to create drama, which is more indicative of the inherent problems with this show.

After three seasons, I'm not sure any character has any real, appreciable development. Yes, I know a Hollywood serial- especially one produced by Jerry Bruckheimer- doesn't typically have a lot of character development anyway, but FC's lack of growth in just about anything is really jarring.

We're three seasons in and the show is still recycling storylines from S1, only with slightly different character arrangements.

The show may have altered the settings and the landscape of the series, but can we really say that any of the characters themselves are any different from when we first met them?

It's no wonder this show relies on cheap drama to fuel plots, because the writers couldn't be arsed to do the work needed to develop the characters and develop newer conflicts as the characters progressed.

I may still miss Dianne Farr, Billy Burke and Leven Rambin if they're gone from the series for good. Then again, maybe it's for the best so they can evacuate this sinking, rudderless ship.

[Dowel Jones]

52 minutes ago, Danielg342 said:

S4 faces the prospect of losing three main characters- Sharon, Vince and Jake-

Well, Jake may become the new BC at Edgewater if Vince dies.  In the meantime, don't give me no crap that there's not one Engineer in the Unit that can promote to Captain to replace him.

I thought the Leonis lived near Station 42, at least in Edgewater.  How did the house suddenly end up 30 minutes outside of town?

Gabriella...you have a weapon, and you hear something outside.  You know you're in danger so what do you do?  You put said weapon on the table and forget all about it.  Of course, the show would be a lot shorter if she had just plugged Finn as he walked in the door, but I have a feeling she is one of those TV characters that stand there shaking with the gun in her hand while said bad guy walks up and takes it away from her.  On the other hand, I like Audrey, but one shot was two too few.

Was Eve's valedictory supposed to be impressive?  Bullshit.  It's a rundown fire camp with substandard buildings, and they will rebuild it later, after the snow melts.  By the way, in real life, every fire camp has an in-house engine for that very reason.

[Madding crowd]

I don’t see them losing Vince and Sharon unless the actors want out. I actually appreciate a long married middle age couple who are still affectionate with each other. Usually  older couples are cheating, have been married four times or they have an “aw-old people kissing” vibe which is just annoying. I don’t like Audrey and Bode together. They just don’t have chemistry in my opinion. I hope they decide who they want Manny to be; he has always been a hot head but now they treat him like he’s a hardened criminal because he punched someone. All that being said I didn’t mind the finale because everyone got a part and they did a good job of showing everyone’s strengths.

 

[buckboard]

Bode keeps playing hero and disobeying orders because Max Thierot co-created the show and sometimes writes and produces and directs episodes.  Bode's character is the superhero/savior and center of attention that Thierot wants.

Audrey confessing that she shot Finn and gets taken away by the sherrif is so stupid, without her explaining how it was so obviously self-defense of herself and Gabriela.

I'd hate to lose Vince and the Sharon/Vince couple, but if Vince is gone next season, Jake can stay at 42 and not go off to Butte.

Danielg342, thanks for your comments every week.  They are much appreciated.

 

Edited April 26 by buckboard

[Thalia]

I agree that the show has gotten very predictable.   The minute, nay the second, nay the very millisecond that Manny walked in and it looked like Gabby had shot Finn, I said to myself, "self, Manny, who JUST got his record cleaned up again is going to want to say he did it to protect Gabriela.  DESPITE the fact it was clearly self-defense." 

I'm still convinced he would have tried argue over to the cops, saying he did it if it turned out she had been the shooter and not Audrey. 

The other predictable thing was, that of course Bode would run into the nursing home without protective gear or equipment.   Had anyone even called 911 at that point?  

And my eyes practically rolled out of my head when the nursing home manager began an evacuation based on the word of a mostly delusional resident and his grandson.  If no fire arrived and a resident had been harmed, that resident's family would have owned that facility.   Even though the fire DID arrive, I can see some lawyer trying to bring a cause of action based on the fact that the home didn't have official authorization for the evac. 

This show doesn't seem the type to kill off major beloved characters, so if I had to pick any one for a death pool, it would be Nonno, who is beloved but not part of the main cast.  As for Audrey, I do like her and hope she is cleared on grounds of self-defense.  

Edited April 26 by Thalia
I like italics :-)

[mythoughtis]

The Jake promotion issue is so contrived.   Of course there is no promotion available right now.  And that’s nothing to do with Bode.  Sharon isn’t retiring and neither is Vince.  Since we’ve not been shown any chain of command other than those two… just what position has Jake ever thought he could get at 42? Captain actually seems pretty good for his age and years of experience.    Maybe if the house had more than three firefighters not named Leone? Oh wow there were actually a couple others on screen during these episodes.  
 

I’m glad the ‘let’s pretend Gabriella or Manny shot Finn’ plot didn’t last long.  Although we all know Audrey was justified in shooting Finn… and the damage to the house supports that. 
 

I’m also glad Cole didn’t die during this episode. 

[The Wild Sow]

2 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

I don’t see them losing Vince and Sharon unless the actors want out. I actually appreciate a long married middle age couple who are still affectionate with each other.

I read somewhere that Billy Burke is leaving.  And I also love Vince & Sharon's relationship!  

Oh well, (speculation here of course!): Vince dies,  Sharon retires, Jake's the new chief, Manny's the new Cap, Bode is still Bode (or maybe becomes Cap of the new Three Rock if Eve leaves(?) ...which would leave no more drama except for the actual fires and stuff, and the show has never been about that! 😆

I do like Audrey and Bode together (much more so than him and Gabby), and I didn't expect to like Audrey when she was introduced.  I figured she's just be some one-dimensional spoiler between Bode and Gabby, but she turned out to be a cool, nuanced character.  And I'm loving her friendship with Gabby, including Gabby teaching her to swim!   I think she has better chemistry with Bode and with Gabby (friendship-chemistry), than Gabby and Bode ever had, really.

I mostly knew of Leven Rambin when she was "Autism-Spectrum-Disorder-Lily" on All My Children, which was a great character.  Them she took on the dual role of Lily's "evil-lookalike-half-sister-Ava," which was a boring and cliched annoyance who brought nothing to the show, which was on its last legs then anyway.  (Sorry, all evil twin stories are always boring and cliched -- unless it's David Canary when he played Adam/Stuart -- neither of whom was "evil!")  I may have seen her in a few guest spots, but I don't watch Hunger Games movies,  and I hated Grey's Anatomy the time or 2 I tried to watch it. So I wasn't familiar with much of her work, and I guess I expected her to just be a bitch or a villain in Fire Country.  And she's not.  I hope she stays.

Quote

Audrey confessing that she shot Finn and gets taken away by the sherrif is so stupid, without her explaining how it was so obviously self-defense of herself and Gabriela.

Finn was conscious and talking, so as long as he's still alive they can't very well claim either Manny or Gabby shot him (and yeah, Manny offering to say he did it was sooooo predictable! 

Edited April 26 by The Wild Sow

[possibilities]

I'm really hung up on how, when Eve decided to evacuate, everybody walked slowly, like they weren't actually in a hurry. I've never seen such a low energy evacuation in my life. Whether it's slow motion camera work to indicate grief, or slow walking away that's supposed to indicate reluctance to leave, it took me completely out of the moment. Show us some hustle if it's an emergency!

I also have a hard time with how this show's firefighters don't wear any kind of gear over their faces, and they don't get smoke inhaltion even when they are covered in soot. I know that TV thinks we need to see faces, but other fire shows have handled this with close ups through the face mask, well-identified names-on-jacket, clear sound so you can recognize their voices, and people saying their names over the radio. I'm not talking about Bode rushing in without equipment because he's breaking the rules-- that's a different issue. I mean Sharon and Vince running into the fire without any protection. They didn't bring anything for the people they were rescuing, either. 

I love Audrey. What she did was self-defense and Manny acted like she was the one doing the stalking and threatening. He wasn't there, and he comes in and starts blaming the women for protecting themselves against an intruder he knows to be dangerous. He can't claim it's just fear for the way the system will treat them, because he wasn't trying to even find out what happened before he started taking over and hurling commands. I'm sick of Manny. Audrey protected herself and Gabriella, and he's acting like she fucked up. 

I agree with everybody's criticisms of Bode's arc. Either he's a maniac who needs to be taught to behave or he's a brave hero who needs to be treated like one. Why do they think that making him a disobedient fuck up who never learns and simulatenously an incredible hero who no one appreicates is a good story? Pick a lane or look like your writers don't understand basic logic.

What I think is that now they've written themselves into a corner-- he will either go into major moping mode if his family member(s) die (and learn his lesson and stop going rogue, which I doubt because the show doesn't seem interested in that), or he will blame Jake for holding him back from going in and dying with them. Or, he will shake it off like it's nothing, which is also a terrible choice. I don't want to watch any of those scenarios, honestly.

I love Eve and I was really excited to see her enjoy her nephew but also say: "I love you but I don't think I'm going to change my mind and want kids." I was disappointed they wrote her girlfriend as wanting them, though, because that means misery ahead. Either they break them up, or Eve caves in and agrees to be a mom, or the girlfriend implausibly drops her own desire to have a kid. None of that interests me.

I read some stuff in the media thread that made me think I don't like what they have planned for next season, but before that I was thinking I don't know if I have the right temperament to keep watching this-- because I am full up on stress and angst and horror in real life. I'm just not sure I'm in the mood for more coming from fiction, especially if it isn't well-plotted and serving some interesting purpose. I don't see misery for misery's sake as compelling enough. Some people find it cathartic, and I respect that. But it's not where my head is at lately.

They have also reduced the relevance of 3 Rock a lot. I liked when they developed the characters there, like Freddy and Cole, but they seem to mostly only do that with one per season and only just enough to learn their name and then write them off the show. The camp seems to mostly be a vehicle for administrative hassles and background noise for the leadership team.

I really like some parts of the show, but I am not sure if the balance tips far enough in those directions vs against them. I don't need a tv show to be totally realistic or totally perfectly written. I can handwave things and get over some missteps. But the things I like best seem to be being minimized and the things I like least seem to be being doubled down on, and that's really disappointing.

 

 

[TeapotDiva]

I'm really impressed with all the thoughtful commentary on the show that's being  expressed in the comments for these two episodes.  Everyone seems to have put more thought into their opinions than the show's writers put into the scripts!

[possibilities]

One more thing: how stupid do you have to be to keep using the phone your stalker gave you? Especially without checking to make sure it isn't bugged with tracking apps?

Also, she would have been much safer with the crew on the job than sitting by herself alone, or even hiding out with one companion who was then going to be blamed if they defended her.

[PattyorSelma]

Bode was supposed to keep an eye on Finn at the gas station, but he could have done that from down the road, basically out of sight. But no, he pulled up close enough to be noticed and identified by Finn.  That caused the gas station chaos fire.  I don’t remember if that particular fire spread, but Sharon was worried about it being so close to another fire.  The next thing we see is out of control flames with embers flying.  
Can we blame Bode for all of that because he couldn’t discreetly observe Finn at the gas station?

[JamieLynn832002]

7 hours ago, possibilities said:

One more thing: how stupid do you have to be to keep using the phone your stalker gave you? Especially without checking to make sure it isn't bugged with tracking apps?

That drove me nuts. I just automatically assumed she'd dumped the phone (especially since as Manny is free he wouldn't need her original phone for communication in prison) until Audrey mentioned the FitBit then it was "she still has the phone, doesn't she?" I know they needed a way for Finn to find her for the drama but 'he's psycho so maybe don't keep the phone he gave you' seems pretty obvious and I feel like they could have just said he'd secretly followed someone (or even tracked the phone) to the Leone house before we/they knew he was a psycho.

[The Wild Sow]

6 hours ago, PattyorSelma said:

Bode was supposed to keep an eye on Finn at the gas station, but he could have done that from down the road, basically out of sight. But no, he pulled up close enough to be noticed and identified by Finn.  That caused the gas station chaos fire.  I don’t remember if that particular fire spread,

Yes, that was the fire they were worried about merging with the main (Zebel Ridge?) fire!  So yeah, it was spreading.  And I was mentally screaming at Bode to get the heck outta Finn's line of sight, not stand there and stare at him!

[buckboard]

Another hard to take storyline:  There are two major fires in the vicinity of the senior residence home, but the manager will only evacuate when he hears from the fire department.  No one at the home is watching the TV, which is covering these big fires.  (Jake's gf is watching the coverage, even though she isn't as near the fires.)  No one is smelling the smoke at the home, although I know we could in Northern California when there were fires 50 miles away.  The manager says they have an evacuation plan, but that they can't get everyone out quickly.  Well, maybe that's why they should have started sooner.  If the fires didn't reach them, they could have turned around.  And what a great plan it is, where they don't keep track of all the residents, so Otto is left behind, necessitating all the Leones to risk their lives to find him.

[Dowel Jones]

8 hours ago, buckboard said:

Audrey confessing that she shot Finn and gets taken away by the sherrif is so stupid, without her explaining how it was so obviously self-defense of herself and Gabriela.

I could see that to a point.  She wasn't handcuffed, I don't think, and it's a good ploy by the Sheriff to separate the parties.  Otherwise, Bode and/or Mannie would be getting in their faces as they question Audrey.  A few minutes with each participant would establish self-defense in a hurry, unless other evidence proved contrary.

8 hours ago, possibilities said:

I mean Sharon and Vince running into the fire without any protection. They didn't bring anything for the people they were rescuing, either. 

And, as required for fire stories in this show, they both stop in the middle of a search in flashover conditions to argue out their personal issues.

[Danielg342]

The real thing about Billy Burke's impending exit is that the show already had a storyline ready for when it needed Burke to step aside.

Remember when Vince had heart issues? Heart issues that were so serious, it could have- and maybe should have- cost him his career as a firefighter?

Why wasn't the decision made then to make him a recurring character? Why wasn't that storyline used as a justification to bump down his status for S4?

What really stinks about this whole situation is that it's highly likely that Billy Burke is never coming back because the character is dead. That's just not something I can accept.

If there was a chance that Burke could come back, maybe there might a sliver of a reason to continue on with this show. Yeah, I wouldn't see him every week, but at least there's a chance I'd see him every few episodes.

(Honestly, that might have been a better use of Vince since the character is best to provide the well-timed zinger and/or the emotional grounding that the other characters sometimes need)

...but...

The showrunners made their choice. I am with you, @possibilities, that this show seems to minimize the things I like about it (I, too, liked the Three Rock/Black Creek (the female camp) dynamic) and maximize the stuff that I don't (like Bodiella).

Maybe I stick with it because I've been there since Day 1 and Minute 1. However, if there's nothing worth sticking around for, what's the point?

@buckboard, I thank you and appreciate your kind words. They mean a lot. I never sought to be someone people look to but I'm glad my words have that kind of effect. If I don't come back for next season, I still had a lot of fun dissecting this show with you and everyone else.

[possibilities]

When Grey's Anatomy first aired, I liked it. I liked that the cast was diverse and the women and people of color were not marginalized. I liked a lot of things about it. But they quickly started writing plots I considered boring, stupid, and absurd. They minimized the things I liked and maximized the things I didn't. The relationships, especially, became what I considered to be draining and irritating and diminishing of the characters. They leaned into what I considered to be the most annoying romantic tropes. And this week I realized the team making Fire Country has Grey's Anatomy on their resumes. 

But that show is a juggernaut! It's been on the air a long time and it's very popular. 

So I have accepted that what I like is not necessarily what tv is going to do.

Fire Country (and Tracker) have fabulous ratings. They have what I consider to be great bones. But as time goes on, they are moving in the direction of other shows that have great ratings and stay on the air for many seasons, so I can't really act surprised. But because my tastes differ, I'm disappointed.

Lately, even shows that have high ratings and long runs seem to be taking turns away from what I liked about them-- like 911-- and I don't know if it's all cost cutting, or if it's a genuine style preference, but I guess I'm just out of synch with the media mood du joir.

 

Edited April 27 by possibilities

[DanaK]

1 hour ago, possibilities said:

When Grey's Anatomy first aired, I liked it. I liked that the cast was diverse and the women and people of color were not marginalized. I liked a lot of things about it. But they quickly started writing plots I considered boring, stupid, and absurd. They minimized the things I liked and maximized the things I didn't. The relationships, especially, became what I considered to be draining and irritating and diminishing of the characters. They leaned into what I considered to be the most annoying romantic tropes. And this week I realized the team making Fire Country has Grey's Anatomy on their resumes. 

But that show is a juggernaut! It's been on the air a long time and it's very popular. 

So I have accepted that what I like is not necessarily what tv is going to do.

Fire Country (and Tracker) have fabulous ratings. They have what I consider to be great bones. But as time goes on, they are moving in the direction of other shows that have great ratings and stay on the air for many seasons, so I can't really act surprised. But because my tastes differ, I'm disappointed.

Lately, even shows that have high ratings and long runs seem to be taking turns away from what I liked about them-- like 911-- and I don't know if it's all cost cutting, or if it's a genuine style preference, but I guess I'm just out of synch with the media mood du joir.

 

I think a lot of it, though not all, is cost cutting, particularly given the upheaval of the pandemic and the twin strikes, and maybe the various streamers pulling back some. 9-1-1 moved networks and some fans feel the dynamics of the show changed as a result (less quirky and more dark) and besides that there's less major fire and other rescues on the various rescue shows, Fire Country included. Clearly for long running shows, producers want to shake things up, though FC has only been on for 3 seasons. Several cast members were asked to work less episodes but they apparently banded together and refused. So now they cut Billy Burke to "shake things up". Sure man

[possibilities]

Money is usually at the root of most creative problems. But this show is highly rated. If it was struggling, it would be one thing. But to cut costs just for greed? Or to "teach the cast a lesson" because of the strike? And none of that explains the idiocy of some of the writing choices, either, unless they just decided to not pay for decent writers.

Edited April 28 by possibilities

[tv echo]

Remember, Max Thieriot is one of the executive producers. So did he side with the cast or with the producers? (source)

Edited April 28 by tv echo

[Danielg342]

I find that Tia Napolitano (the showrunner) to be very wishy washy. She seems to fancy herself as some kind of visionary, when the reality is she's nothing more than an egotistical dreamer who is out of touch on just about everything.

Honestly, I can't think of a single arc or any kind of storyline that Fire Country has done that felt well-plotted, well-planned, well-paced and had a payoff that didn't just deliver, it was earned. The closest may be the Oxalta storyline that just passed but even that storyline was nonsensical and it was rushed.

Yeah, I'm not going to discount the issues that executive meddling presents, and I'm sure not happy that it may have been the suits who forced Billy Burke out.

However, plenty of shows can navigate handsy executives, and I doubt there's a TV show on air (especially one that has lasted more than a season) that hasn't dealt with executives having their imprint on the show.

So if FC goes off the rails next season or in the years afterward, I really don't know how the writers can do anything except look in the mirror. They're the ones who have consistently made a mess of the show, one that relies too much on shock value and one where the characters have no appreciable growth at all.

If Burke had been written out with a well-told story that honoured his character and his legacy to the show, I might be able to accept it. If the show had proven itself capable of developing storylines and characters properly instead of just relying on shoehorning and constant swerves, maybe the cliffhanger doesn't rankle me so much.

However, Burke was essentially written out at the last minute, with the character basically tossed away like garbage with the audience unable to anticipate it or given a narrative that respects his character at all.

All for a "shocking swerve" that means that Burke may not be able to come back at all.

That's not just disrespectful, that's reckless.

If Burke's treatment is any indicator, then I don't know if I want to be a character on this show.

Because the writers are so clueless and bereft of ideas that their characters are so cheap that they can be disposed of on a whim.

Meaning there's no point in getting invested- since the writers don't care about the characters, neither will I.