S02.E05: The Hurt Man

[Snazzy Daisy]

Quote

During an emotional conversation with Leslie, Erik gives a harrowing account of the sexual abuse and torture he experienced throughout his childhood.

Air Date: Sep 19, 2024

 

 

Edited September 19 by Snazzy Daisy

[Snazzy Daisy]

This is another disturbing episode. Erik recounting the details of his abuse — the grooming, the torture and the mind games. He’s so desperate for his father to love him.

Where was Kitty in all of this? A tough question to ask. Surprisingly, Erik is still defending her.

Cooper Koch is the MVP of this episode. 👏🏻

 

[Demian]

On 9/20/2024 at 9:33 PM, Snazzy Daisy said:

Cooper Koch is the MVP of this episode. 👏🏻

I think, with this episode, he's likely the MVP of the entire series.  He was astonishing during that entire sequence, and the way he ended it with that one sidelong glance at the lawyer -- that glance that makes you wonder whether he's been bullshitting her (and thus us) the entire time?  Phenomenal.

It's too bad little else in this series comes anywhere close to matching those 33 minutes.  Overall, this show's been a mess, but I wouldn't be surprised if this episode ends up getting multiple Emmy nominations next year.

[hoodooznoodooz]

I am still watching episode two, but saw on reddit that this episode was one uninterrupted take. In addition to Koch’s phenomenal acting.
 

 

Edited September 22 by hoodooznoodooz

[iMonrey]

14 hours ago, Demian said:

It's too bad little else in this series comes anywhere close to matching those 33 minutes.  Overall, this show's been a mess, but I wouldn't be surprised if this episode ends up getting multiple Emmy nominations next year.

Yeah, this was one award-worthy episode. I wonder if there was a prompter or something, that's an awful lot of dialogue to memorize. Just one long take with Leslie's back the the camera, and the way it ever-so-slowly zoomed in on Erik. Just impressive from an acting and technical aspect. 

[sadie]

While I appreciate the technical and acting challenges of this, yes it was brilliant in that respect. I was just bored to death with it. I’m probably in the minority but after about 15 minutes I just wanted it over. 

[Sailorgirl26]

10 hours ago, sadie said:

While I appreciate the technical and acting challenges of this, yes it was brilliant in that respect. I was just bored to death with it. I’m probably in the minority but after about 15 minutes I just wanted it over. 

I lasted about 5 minutes longer than you. This just dragged on and on and on and on.....I ff-ed to the last minute to see if there was any wrapup. You are not alone. 

[AnnMarie17]

22 hours ago, sadie said:

While I appreciate the technical and acting challenges of this, yes it was brilliant in that respect. I was just bored to death with it. I’m probably in the minority but after about 15 minutes I just wanted it over. 

You and me both!  I ended up fast forwarding to see if there was anything else and then moved on to the next episode.  Wow, what waste of time. 

[shelley1234]

This episode was hauntingly impactful.   How the episode just stayed with Erik from beginning to end while he recounted a lifetime of abuse and neglect.   

The episode before Lyle recounted his story of abuse and it just didn't hit the same.  Is it because Koch was a better actor...maybe.  Or is it because Lyle was more psychopathic and methodical with his reaction to the abuse...also maybe.  

I do believe the abuse happened.  I don't think it was a story they made up trying to get away with murder.  

[sugarbaker design]

On 9/22/2024 at 12:22 PM, iMonrey said:

and the way it ever-so-slowly zoomed in on Erik. Just impressive from an acting and technical aspect. 

I was so impressed that I replayed it in the lowest speed of fast forward.  The camera incrementally inched closer and closer. While I was watching it initially it kind of snuck up on me where I noticed it was only Koch's face on the screen and not the whole room.

On 9/24/2024 at 6:47 PM, shelley1234 said:

I do believe the abuse happened. 

I do too.  I think two monsters created two more monsters.

Edited September 26 by sugarbaker design

[hoodooznoodooz]

7 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

I do, too.  I think two monsters created two more monsters.

I am listening to several podcasts. Please forgive me for not citing specific podcasts and their sources.

I am pretty sure that Kitty, in fact, told someone/a family member that she wished she had never had Lyle and Erik. That was not an exaggeration.

And Jose encouraged his sons to disrespect their mother, because she was a woman, and they were boys/men.

When Lyle and Erik were young, Kitty took them to a mall with one of her friends. The boys wandered off. Kitty made little to no effort to find them. Eventually someone over the loudspeaker said, “Could the mother of Lyle and Erik Menendez please come to the security office?” She said, “Okay, now that we know where they are, we can focus on shopping.”

 

[gesundheit]

8 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

I do too.  I think two monsters created two more monsters.

Yes, I think it's likely a combination of things -- they were horrible parents, the boys were sexually abused, some of the stories they claimed in court were exaggerated (things have come out in the years since that both supported and discredited their stories), and they did not develop into decent people. I've always found the whole "it was basically self-defense, they were clearing plotting to murder us" component deeply improbable.

 

This show is interesting in that almost every episode seems to be a completely different take on what really happened. I've heard a lot of people who bailed after 1 or 2 and I keep suggesting they go back and finish because the POV at the beginning gets both totally scrapped and revisited and back again as they go on. 

[gesundheit]

On 9/24/2024 at 6:47 PM, shelley1234 said:

 

The episode before Lyle recounted his story of abuse and it just didn't hit the same.  Is it because Koch was a better actor...maybe.  Or is it because Lyle was more psychopathic and methodical with his reaction to the abuse...also maybe.  

I think it's the latter. If both their accounts are true, the abuse had a fairly small window for Lyle and he turned his dysfunction into false machismo and narcissistic sense of entitlement, lashing out at the world. He was already a fully-developed (badly developed, but developed nonetheless) grown man when he recounted that story, a man with ugly defense mechanisms and a lifetime of constructed walls. The abuse went on for Erik for almost his whole life, he bore the brunt of most of it and it seemed to manifest more in fear and self-doubt. 

[Madding crowd]

It bothers me that Ryan Murphy showed this heartbreaking tale of sexual abuse from childhood but then still filmed these young men ( particularly Erik) half-naked and in close up shots meant to be titillating. 

[dubbel zout]

23 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

While I was watching it initially it kind of snuck up on me where I noticed it was only Koch's face on the screen and not the whole room.

Same. I thought this was a remarkable episode.

[Sweet-tea]

On 9/23/2024 at 11:12 PM, Sailorgirl26 said:

I lasted about 5 minutes longer than you. This just dragged on and on and on and on.....I ff-ed to the last minute to see if there was any wrapup. You are not alone. 

I also thought it was tedious. The one camera the whole time really made it drag for me. I kept wondering if they were really going to spend the entire episode just showing Erik and the back of Leslie's head. I understand the artistic decision but it didn't work for me. If anything, it made me feel detached from Erik's emotion.

Koch is a good actor but I couldn't wait for this episode to end. 

Edited September 27 by Sweet-tea

[Bluedog100]

I didn't want to watch this series due to its graphic nature but my love for Chloe Sevigny pulled me in. I have to ff through the graphic scenes but this episode was mesmerizing.  Like some of you, it went on a bit long for me but I couldn't turn away. I wondered if they shot that all as one scene and am wondrous to learn they did. Koch was absolutely amazing.  And such a beautiful young man!