S02.E04: I Want You More Than Anything in the World

[Mr. Sparkle]

June 2, 2024

The coven questions Louis and Armand's special relationship; Claudia finds a new friend.

[magdalene]

That seems to be it for Lestat then. Bleh, I can't stand Armand.  Right now I am wondering if I should finish out this season.  I know what's going to happen and I am not looking forward to it.

If they get to adapt Lestat's story I will of course watch it.  I have no interest in Louis and Armand.

[dwmarch]

I liked this episode even though I feel like not much happened.

I wonder why Daniel hasn't asked about where Claudia is now. The show might not follow the books in terms of her ultimate fate but it seems weird that they have been talking about her since mid last season and it hasn't come up yet.

They are hanging a bit of a lampshade on the coven's rules being flexible. Santiago notes that he has broken rule 4 a bunch of times. Claudia could be in trouble for killing Lestat (although the show has already established that Lestat might not be dead) but this happened before she joined the coven. They didn't ask her if she had ever broken these rules and she represents a broken rule herself (no kids) so rather than screening her out they are going to invite her in and then retroactively punish her? I guess lying to the coven on an ongoing basis would be what they can get her on.

Speaking of lying, how do Armand and Louis not know Daniel is lying to them about his source for the fire? They can read minds and they have clearly been messing with his so how is he keeping his new Talamasca source a secret? We also get to see vampires being able to read so fast you can't even see them doing it (Santiago reading Claudia's diary) but I guess maybe they don't know how to work a laptop?

[Mari]

1 hour ago, dwmarch said:

I wonder why Daniel hasn't asked about where Claudia is now.

I 'm guessing he already knows she's dead--he might not remember all the details, but Lestat's "death" and Claudia's death probably stuck out.

Armand's mind manipulation has definitely gotten more obvious.  Of both Louis and Daniel. The payoff for that could be interesting and ugly.  And if Armand had realized how real phantom Lestat was and how much this would bring Lestat back to the front of Louis' mind, I don't think he'd have allowed Louis and Daniel to come back together for this book.  Armand wants to be the center as much as Lestat does but is sneakier about it.

Armand's story is tragic, but he's not just a blood vampire.  He's a personality vampire; very little is HIS.  He just assimilates bits of other people.  It might be why he is so drawn to both Lestat and Louis; they both are willing to create themselves.

What I want to know is why the Baby Lu windows act was a hit.  How little taste do you have to have to find that amazing? 

"Manipulative Gremlin"  Made me laugh.  So, since Phantom Lestat is really Louis' subconscious, is that what Louis truly thinks of Armand?

Edited June 2 by Mari

[magdalene]

Ben Daniels is excellent as Santiago, a very entertaining character. I wish Santiago was strong enough to get rid off that pathetic needy troll Armand.

I wonder why Claudia's story and fate is upsetting me so much more here than in the movie?

[Ohiopirate02]

2 minutes ago, magdalene said:

I wonder why Claudia's story and fate is upsetting me so much more here than in the movie?

I think it's because the character is more developed and we see more of her.  

[Mr. Sparkle]

44 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I think it's because the character is more developed and we see more of her.  

Also, I think the actress is killing it. She does sad really well. 

[peridot]

So the vampires aren't supposed to be friendly with humans at all?  How very lonely.

Was that seriously period blood running down the store owner's legs??

I'm really enjoying Santiago's bitterness towards Louis, most of it is well earned.  Uh-oh, at Louis and Claudia leaving the diaries in plain sight.

It's interesting to see more cracks form between Armand and Louis.  Armand's face when he realized how present Lestat was during their relationship was kind of sad, but then it looks like he tried to plagiarize someone else's work to make Louis feel better about his talents.

The ads during this show are terrible.  They kept cutting in during crucial scenes, and they cut off the recording at the end.

Edited June 3 by peridot

[patty1h]

1 hour ago, peridot said:

The ads during this show are terrible.  They kept cutting in during crucial scenes, and they cut off the recording at the end.

I just came here to ask if the episode end abruptly for anyone else.  I'm watching the scene of Daniel looking at his laptop and having a flashback of meeting Louis in the 70's and in the middle of a sentence BOOM... the voiceover talking about next weeks episode.  That was jarring.  I turned the channel thinking it was the end of the episode... was there more after the AMC preview?   

[dwmarch]

Same here, at 51:33 and in the middle of a sentence the episode cuts off. I think we the audience are meant to be as confused as Daniel is here. Messing with the audience seems to be a bit of a theme this season.

[nodorothyparker]

I'm just glad it seems like the stories in both timelines are finally reaching their tipping points because we're already at the halfway point of the season and I am bored bored bored watching Louis and Armand make puppy dog eyes at each other while this version of Armand mindfucks him every bit as badly as Lestat ever did, if not more so. The snarky apparitions of Lestat loitering about have been about the only saving grace in this, so while the effect of him fading away with Louis attempting to fully move on was beautifully done, I'm hoping this means we're about to see Lestat return to do more to do than just haunt the place. Because again, I find long stretches of the show as draggy as hell without him. 

I don't love this version of Claudia as much as some do, but the actress is doing a lot with what she's been given to work with. Her little Lulu number was like a super demented version of cartoon skits from the late '40s, so I can see how it would have caught on. I also love that they're treating the Theater of the Vampires like a live action Rocky Horror with weird mortal groupies.

"Fucked an occupying Nazi" seems as good a reason as any to be hated and isolated to the point that you unwittingly latch so hard onto an eternal sulky vampire teenager.

Edited June 3 by nodorothyparker

[tennisgurl]

Entertainment in post war Paris must have been sparse if Baby Lu is the smash hit taking Paris by storm, including having cosplayers. I suppose its hard to judge by modern standards, those sorts of cartoony bits were certainly popular in the late 40s/early 50s, but I am right there with Claudia finding them to be super lame. 

Never being able to really interact with any human ever sounds terrible, no wonder these Rocky Horror Rejects feel like such a cult, they're forbidden to have even a casually friendly relationship with anyone who isn't them unless they happen to know any other vampires. 

Santiago is so bitter towards Louis, its sort of hilarious. Louis is certainly strung tight in the Paris timeline, I feel like he's really going to mess up soon. 

Armond's story is terribly tragic, it must have been awful growing up being used and abused by one person after the next, it certainly explains his intense need for control and his apparent tendency to latch onto his partners and become more like them. 

Armond is also very manipulative, both with his powers and in general, I'm surprised he hasn't read more of Daniel and that he let the fire slip up go. 

[Ohiopirate02]

7 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

Entertainment in post war Paris must have been sparse if Baby Lu is the smash hit taking Paris by storm, including having cosplayers. I suppose its hard to judge by modern standards, those sorts of cartoony bits were certainly popular in the late 40s/early 50s, but I am right there with Claudia finding them to be super lame. 

Never being able to really interact with any human ever sounds terrible, no wonder these Rocky Horror Rejects feel like such a cult, they're forbidden to have even a casually friendly relationship with anyone who isn't them unless they happen to know any other vampires. 

After hearing about how much the French loved Jerry Lewis, I can buy them eating up Claudia's performance.  Though, the coven was doing English only shows when Louis and Claudia arrived.  The French were over the Theatre du Vampires before Claudia's Lulu.  

One thing that I picked up on is how the coven skirts the rule about interacting with humans.  Interacting with humans is alright when it comes to running a theatre, they go out to find their next victim for their shows, and apparently a night out at some restaurant is also okay.  That rule appears to be one that can be bent.

[magdalene]

I don't know how much Lestat really manipulated Louis during their relationship and how much was Louis projecting, imagining things, etc. but they were entertaining and gripping throughout.  Armand and Louis are not only annoying but tedious as hell.  Louis comes across like a fool falling for his spiel. You can understand people falling for Lestat because of the charisma but falling for Armand or deluding yourself to fall for him Louis must be utterly broken. Maybe that's the point.

I am hanging on because of the Lestat scenes and the Claudia story.

And yes, amc+ cut my episode abruptly off too.  They really are the worst streaming channel.

[Irlandesa]

7 minutes ago, magdalene said:

And yes, amc+ cut my episode abruptly off too.  They really are the worst streaming channel.

This happened on the cable broadcast as well.  I guess it was maybe intentional but was very weird, abrupt and I don't see what artistic point it served.

19 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

After hearing about how much the French loved Jerry Lewis, I can buy them eating up Claudia's performance. 

It wasn't just the French who liked Lewis.  And Shirley Temple was a pretty big success in general.  There's always room for high brow, low brow and all brows in between. 

And after living in France, trust me they consume a lot of low brow. 

[Mari]

2 hours ago, magdalene said:

I don't know how much Lestat really manipulated Louis during their relationship and how much was Louis projecting, imagining things, etc. but they were entertaining and gripping throughout.  Armand and Louis are not only annoying but tedious as hell.  Louis comes across like a fool falling for his spiel. You can understand people falling for Lestat because of the charisma but falling for Armand or deluding yourself to fall for him Louis must be utterly broken. Maybe that's the point.

 

I think Armand being so different from Lestat is the point.  I think he's meant to foil Lestat.

Lestat didn't seem to be particularly manipulative, to me.  He was very much in charge of their lives--a mix of his personality, his greater knowledge and far greater strength, his willingness to be violent, and, yes, his charisma.  Did he arrange things to get Louis to react?  Some.  Example: the Antoinette version of his "Come to Me" song.  But it seemed like he would be more likely to just say what he wanted and try to make sure it would happen that way.

But I think what set their relationship into a toxic fire was a combination of things.  Louis was filled with self-loathing and depression for a long time, and the "Just get over it." isn't something that works for serious depression.  Louis shuts down, which aggravates Lestat, who acts out trying to pull Louis out of it.  Add in the attitude of Louis family--he had to feel like they threw him away.  Then add in Claudia, who decides that Lestat is what she has to fight against?  No wonder it was fascinating to watch but would be horrific to live through.

Armand is dark.  Lestat is pale.   Armand is calm and steady.  Lestat is mercurial and volatile.  Armand has other vampires around and shares information.  Lestat would not talk or look for other vampires. Armand let Louis decide if they were casual or serious.  Lestat very loudly demanded serious.  Armand is understated.  Lestat is flamboyant.  You could go on.

It's too many opposites to be accidental.  It's like the biggest rebound-opposite relationship ever.  And I think as the season goes on, we're going to see more and more cracks in the facade of perfect relationship.

[babyrambo]

Claudia lasting for 500 performances is admirable because by the third ‘cheep cheep cheep 🐦’ I was already rolling my eyes. The opening song is as catchy as it is annoying so I get why it became a hit, but it really does grate on the nerves.   

And I’m still a bit iffy on Claudia’s characterization this season. The second she met the coven, all her perceptiveness & cunning seemingly disappeared because of ‘acceptance’ and ’vampire pride’. Those tacky thespians don’t even like her and it’s not a secret. I know she’s somewhat stuck now but even at the beginning it all seemed a bit forced.

As is their flimsy cover story. Claudia thinking it would hold water (in a coven full of mind readers of all things) is silly. The writing keeps playing up the immature aspects of her personality to contrast against the childish tragedy of her existence but it isn’t landing. Seeing Claudia have some bite and a backbone with that seamstress felt like a glimpse of the sharp & self assured Claudia of old and I much prefer that side of her personality to the go-along-to-get-along version of her. Also, that seamstress is strange. Brushing off her involvement with the nazi officer & regarding the community’s disdain for her as unfair is amazingly ignorant but she’s clearly self involved & offputting; I can see why Claudia is drawn to her.

I also liked Claudia’s confrontation with Louis. I thought their fight could’ve had a tad more bite but it was still revealing. IMO Louis’ argument that she chose the coven over him was weak because that really wasn’t the crux of the issue; Claudia wasn’t complaining about the coven, she was upset that Armand threatened her with their secret, one he’s known for years. Unbeknownst to her. Louis waved that aside to try and flip things on her but it didn’t work because Claudia’s right. Louis is weak and blind and willfully ignorant when it comes to love. He might think he can coast on Armand’s ever possessive affections forever but I think he’s in for rude awakening. 

[Glade]

There's an interesting parallel between Armand's childhood of being sold and trafficked and the way he's repeating the legacy of chattel slavery by locking Claudia in indentured servitude, forcing her to perform a routine that openly mocks and humiliates her, presumably not only because his covens are needlessly shitty cults (like, couldn't you compromise and lean into the artistic collaboration, make people want to stay in your troupe/coven, it's not like you actually NEED commercial success...) but because he knows this will inflame the situation, hopefully leading to an end of her existing as his competition for Louis.

Jacob Anderson continues to be absolutely brilliant and moving in this show. 

[Jodithgrace]

So, I guess the guy who wrote Claudia’s little ditty was literally a one hit wonder. He couldn’t write another skit for her? Nobody, vampire or not, likes to do the same thing over and over. Yes, Broadway actors do the same show for months on end, but even they get bored and leave the show after a year or so. The chorus people last longer because a hit show is a steady paycheck, and they can have a life besides appearing on stage. These pitiful vamps seem to do nothing but perform the same skits and kill people. 
Armand made Claudia wear her idiotic dress all the time as the world’s stupidest punishment . Didn’t it get a bit messy while she’s murdering people on a nightly basis and cleaning up corpses? They must have one heck of a laundry service.

[Ohiopirate02]

11 hours ago, Jodithgrace said:

So, I guess the guy who wrote Claudia’s little ditty was literally a one hit wonder. He couldn’t write another skit for her? Nobody, vampire or not, likes to do the same thing over and over. Yes, Broadway actors do the same show for months on end, but even they get bored and leave the show after a year or so. The chorus people last longer because a hit show is a steady paycheck, and they can have a life besides appearing on stage. These pitiful vamps seem to do nothing but perform the same skits and kill people. 
Armand made Claudia wear her idiotic dress all the time as the world’s stupidest punishment . Didn’t it get a bit messy while she’s murdering people on a nightly basis and cleaning up corpses? They must have one heck of a laundry service.

Claudia's skit plus costume were designed by Armand to break her.  He would have done something similar to Santiago since Santiago was made recently and not originally part of the coven.  The coven has rules and a dynamic where Armand is the leader and everyone else obeys him.  He would tear down the individual in order to build back up a member of the coven.  Similar to what happens in boot camp when one joins any branch of the military just a much longer process since they are vampires and have all the time in the world.  Though, Armand is riding Claudia harder than any ordinary vampire for his own reasons pertaining to Louis and what Louis and Claudia did to Lestat and the fact that technically Claudia is an abomination in vampire eyes being a child.

[ruby24]

Deleted, moved to the right thread

Edited June 10 by ruby24
Wrong thread