S04.E03: The Bear Hug

[paulvdb]

Quote

Miles tries to make ends meet. Margo finds herself pulled into a dangerous situation.

This week's episode premiered on Wednesday instead of Friday.

[marinw]

6 hours ago, paulvdb said:

This week's episode premiered on Wednesday instead of Friday.

Wow. I know what I'm doing tonight! Is this a regular thing for the rest of this season? Or is it because of American Thanksgiving? The other Apple show I’m watching right now is Lessons in Chemistry and a new episode of that show dropped early too.

Edited November 22, 2023 by marinw

[paulvdb]

2 hours ago, marinw said:

Wow. I know what I'm doing tonight! Is this a regular thing for the rest of this season? Or is it because of American Thanksgiving? The other Apple show I’m watching right now is Lessons in Chemistry and a new episode of that show dropped early too.

I'm assuming it's because of Thanksgiving. All listing sites I checked show next week and later upcoming episodes on Fridays.

[Slider]

I enjoyed Ed's Wayne shout out.  That's about it.  They aged them too much.  No one would ever send an overaged Ed or Danielle to space.  I'm not interested in the Russian coupe or the Helios power plays.  I miss the Apollo days.    

[marinw]

Not the greatest episode, the only part I found compelling was Margo's ordeal. I was terrified for her. Wrenn Schmidt really brought it.

Isn't Kelly's prototype the intellectual property of NASA? Then how could Kelly and Aleida  shop it around? I wanted those two to go to Canada for some reason.

Edited November 23, 2023 by marinw

[Mr. R0b0t]

I actually liked this episode.  The show does demand suspension of belief on several fronts, but I'm all in to see where this is going. 

[marinw]

I think that random woman with the surfboard will show up later. Do people surf at night?

[TimWil]

I’m wondering if the new Star City head will “out” Margo as a way to taunt the US. It would seem a logical thing for the new hardliner Soviet government to do. And could this lead to the US to attempt to “extract” Margo?

Edited November 23, 2023 by TimWil

[greycoupon]

On 11/22/2023 at 6:59 PM, marinw said:

Not the greatest episode, the only part I found compelling was Margo's ordeal. I was terrified for her. Wrenn Schmidt really brought it.

Isn't Kelly's prototype the intellectual property of NASA? Then how could Kelly and Aleida  shop it around? I wanted those two to go to Canada for some reason.

I was thinking the same about Kelly's robot.  I know she's well connected and all but this  was developed at NASA usingf their funding.  Hard to imagine they just handed her the rights.

For some readson I feel like Kelly and Aleida  will go to Russia.  If only so we get the Margo and Aleida reunion, which I don't imagine will be joyous.

[PurpleTentacle]

I have a hard time believing that they have physical money on Mars. Even in the FAM-universe that must cost a fortune to lug up there and for what? So they can have a black market? Yeah, that seems totally in the interest of Helios, NASA and Star City.

Also you don't even smuggel that money back, but deposit it there? Yeah that isn't easily tracked or anything... They even talked about the tax evasion problems this episode...

It probably would have been more realistic if they had some form of Bitcoin and were making their transactions that way. For 2003 in the FAM-universe that doesn't seem unrealistic. In our world it came out in 2009, so that isn't even a stretch with the more advanced technology. The only problem would be that you need internet for it to work, but you need so little, you could say they carved out a little bandwidth on the satelite. Maybe taking over a channel that usually sends background telemetry or something and occasionally sending their own packets.

The woman contacting Margot before the revolution sure seems superfluous and only there to somehow generate the drama this episode. I mean why? If the revolution had been months or years away? Sure. Margot was making noise that could have gotten her in trouble. But this was basically a week later. It's not even spring yet, still the deepest winter. What kind of trouble could Margot have gotten herself in in that time? Even if Margot speedran getting into trouble, worst case she would have been thrown in prison and once you own the government, you can just get her out. All this did was put her life in danger, which doesn't seem to be your goal here...

[zapper]

8 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

I have a hard time believing that they have physical money on Mars. ... It probably would have been more realistic if they had some form of Bitcoin and were making their transactions that way....

doesn't even have to be Bitcoin or some other form of cyber-money. I have none of that and outside of a coin I keep for shopping carts, I cannot remember the last time I touched money. Everything is tap or transfer. I think I found a fiver folded in my card wallet a while back, but I can't remember when or what I did with it.

So yeah, the ATM like machines up there seem odd, but I put it down to a generation of military scrip we have today. I think they may have even referred to it as scrip. 

[marinw]

5 hours ago, zapper said:

. I have none of that and outside of a coin I keep for shopping carts, I cannot remember the last time I touched money. Everything is tap or transfer. I think I found a fiver folded in my card wallet a while back, but I can't remember when or what I did with it.

I use cash at a Farmer's Market, but many of the vendors there have tap. I can see how cash is useful in a black-market situation, as it can't be traced.

[hurrrz]

That Mars black market doesn't make any sense at all. Are we lead to believe that crates of contraband cargo are just skating by on interplanetary travel, where space and weight is a premium? Also - the windows to send stuff to Mars from Earth are pretty small, as in - every 2ish years small (unless you are fine with the extra energy you'd need to get to Mars - but then you'd need different ships to do that). 

[marinw]

1 hour ago, hurrrz said:

Also - the windows to send stuff to Mars from Earth are pretty small, as in - every 2ish years small (unless you are fine with the extra energy you'd need to get to Mars - but then you'd need different ships to do that). 

With the new plasma drives Earth can now send a ship to Mars in 30 days whenever they want. IIRC it was mentioned that there are people on the “Inside” who may be fudging the ships manifest. I can see this all going sideways when an overweighted ship gets into trouble, depending on if the plasma ships launch from Earth or the Moon. Also a lot of the stuff being smuggled seems pretty light (tampons, cigars). Smuggling a whole person, even a small person (Lee’s wife for example) could prove more problematic.

Edited November 25, 2023 by marinw

[FishyJoe]

2 hours ago, marinw said:

With the new plasma drives Earth can now send a ship to Mars in 30 days whenever they want. IIRC it was mentioned that there are people on the “Inside” who may be fudging the ships manifest. I can see this all going sideways when an overweighted ship gets into trouble, depending on if the plasma ships launch from Earth or the Moon. Also a lot of the stuff being smuggled seems pretty light (tampons, cigars). Smuggling a whole person, even a small person (Lee’s wife for example) could prove more problematic.

I'm thinking he just wanted her smuggled out of North Korea. Not shipped all the way to Mars. Once she is free I'm guessing he would defect because that's how they have his loyalty. 

Although this plotline seems identical to Margot-Sergei relationship. 

Edited November 25, 2023 by FishyJoe

[Joimiaroxeu]

Guess Margo is nearsighted.

Was Miles watching the same old videos of his family on repeat?

Ed is starting to look like he's going to a reenactment of the shootout at the OK Corral.

Dev had all the swagger, retaking Helios and GTFOing everybody--by name.

Looks like Miles has a burgeoning new career as a fixer.

Margo went through some hell and ended up entering her Valhalla. But why did they have to park so far away? That'd be a rough walk even for someone who wasn't dealing with a bad leg or hip.

[txhorns79]

26 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

 

Margo went through some hell and ended up entering her Valhalla. But why did they have to park so far away? That'd be a rough walk even for someone who wasn't dealing with a bad leg or hip.

I know!  When they pulled back on the scene and you saw how far Margo was going to have to walk, that must have just been brutal for her.  Get the poor woman a scooter! 

[PurpleTentacle]

On 11/24/2023 at 4:02 PM, zapper said:

doesn't even have to be Bitcoin or some other form of cyber-money. I have none of that and outside of a coin I keep for shopping carts, I cannot remember the last time I touched money. Everything is tap or transfer. I think I found a fiver folded in my card wallet a while back, but I can't remember when or what I did with it.

Mars should certainly have electronic money. You'd need trusted servers on Mars, that sync with earth a few times a day, since real-time isn't a thing, but overall that would be the sensible solution.

I suggested Bitcoin specifically for the black market, since all transactions with official electronic money would be easily traceable (as is depositing the cash on Mars, so both are kinda dumb). While bitcoin is traceable, if you are carefull it can be anonymous at least.

On 11/25/2023 at 8:27 PM, hurrrz said:

That Mars black market doesn't make any sense at all. Are we lead to believe that crates of contraband cargo are just skating by on interplanetary travel, where space and weight is a premium?

That is stretching it a bit. It would be more believeable on the moon, as they ship a ton of helium 3 down to earth and presumably the shuttles come up empty most of the time. Although I think it would be more realistic if they just shot containers with Helium 3 at the oceans and they got picked up there, but I think we saw in previous seasons that it's actually shuttles going back and forth.

On 11/25/2023 at 8:27 PM, hurrrz said:

Also - the windows to send stuff to Mars from Earth are pretty small, as in - every 2ish years small (unless you are fine with the extra energy you'd need to get to Mars - but then you'd need different ships to do that). 

That at least they explained in the news compilation at the beginning of the season. New rocket tech means no more launch windows. You can go whenever.

6 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Margo went through some hell and ended up entering her Valhalla. But why did they have to park so far away? That'd be a rough walk even for someone who wasn't dealing with a bad leg or hip.

Especially since it seemed iced over. Really have to be carefull not to break a leg before you get to the front door.

Of course it was so we could first think Margot was in the woods somewhere about to be executed and then get a good view of the statue, but it made no sense in universe, you are right.

[marinw]

6 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

It would be more believeable on the moon, as they ship a ton of helium 3 down to earth and presumably the shuttles come up empty most of the time.

I'm sure the Black Market on the Moon is thriving.

[PurpleTentacle]

33 minutes ago, marinw said:

I'm sure the Black Market on the Moon is thriving.

Well the dude running the black market on Mars said, the guy doing it on the moon was busted and went to prison for tax evasion. So maybe not. Unless somebody else took over.

[txhorns79]

19 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

(as is depositing the cash on Mars, so both are kinda dumb).

Yes!  Surely they have a system that would notice if people were suddenly depositing large amounts of cash in their accounts, well beyond their means. 

 

On 11/23/2023 at 7:58 PM, greycoupon said:

I was thinking the same about Kelly's robot.  I know she's well connected and all but this  was developed at NASA using their funding.  Hard to imagine they just handed her the rights.

This was odd to me as well.  And is Aleida now all cured from the shell shocked, seriously depressed woman who would stay up all night taking apart and fixing electronics just an episode or so ago? 

[Haleth]

On 11/22/2023 at 6:59 PM, marinw said:

Isn't Kelly's prototype the intellectual property of NASA?

You'd think, right?  They can't market the plans outside of NASA.

On 11/24/2023 at 1:01 AM, PurpleTentacle said:

Also you don't even smuggel that money back, but deposit it there? Yeah that isn't easily tracked or anything... They even talked about the tax evasion problems this episode...

Surely someone will notice that Miles is depositing hundreds or thousands of extra dollars (?) every week.  He's not too bright.

On 11/24/2023 at 1:01 AM, PurpleTentacle said:

But this was basically a week later. It's not even spring yet, still the deepest winter.

Is it ever not the deepest winter in Russia?  😄

On 11/25/2023 at 3:53 PM, marinw said:

the new plasma drives

Everything about the scenes on Mars makes me think of The Expanse.  How long before the Martians declare themselves a sovereign nation?

Poor Margot.

Edited December 2, 2023 by Haleth

[marinw]

4 hours ago, Haleth said:

Everything about the scenes on Mars makes me think of The Expanse.  How long before the Martians declare themselves a sovereign nation?

When Mars can make more stuff themselves. The Black Market is bound to implode eventually, Mars and Earth would have to set up legal trade agreements.

Edited December 2, 2023 by marinw

[Mrs. Stanwyck]

On 11/27/2023 at 10:24 PM, txhorns79 said:

And is Aleida now all cured from the shell shocked, seriously depressed woman who would stay up all night taking apart and fixing electronics just an episode or so ago? 

Obviously, TV recovery but I saw her as unable to to back to NASA due to the trauma.  That fact caused her stress and depression because apparently her family needed her to have that job.  Now, she has a new focus and purpose that doesn't involve working at NASA.  She can be useful and work on something she finds interesting.  It doesn't cure her PTSD but it probably helps her depression.  Or at least masks it for the time being.

Edited January 16 by Mrs. Stanwyck

[ahpny]

On 11/22/2023 at 6:59 PM, marinw said:

Isn't Kelly's prototype the intellectual property of NASA?

Maybe, but there's really no way to know, or presume that it must be. While employers commonly require employees to agree that inventions developed as part of their employment belong to the employer (here NASA), this is not always the case. But employees can cut their own deals too, and Kelly is as far from a typical NASA employee as you can get - she's kind of "space royalty," and may have gotten some custom deal that gave her certain rights not normally shared with "ordinary" employees. Moreover, maybe NASA just didn't care. "Not caring" is more common than many might think. The very foundation of Microsoft is essentially due to a single fact: IBM didn't care about the rights to the operating system that Microsoft wrote for them because IBM was about hardware, not software. So when Microsort asked for those rights, IBM give that to them with little to no thought.

On 11/23/2023 at 11:51 AM, TimWil said:

I’m wondering if the new Star City head will “out” Margo as a way to taunt the US.

While the Margo plot was tense and compelling, I found it confusing. Why does Margo need to keep her true identity and reason for being in Russia secret from the Russians themselves? Why didn't she just explain who she was? Maybe the thugs would have ignored that, but who was she protecting and why? If her "deal" with the KGB or whomever spirited her out of the US required her to keep her identity secret, we were never informed about that, nor why such a provision would need to adhered to under these circumstances. It just didn't make sense. It's not like she's in a witness protection program. She's in the foreign country for which she spied. In other words, she's on their side, and has no position with respect to the coup plotters or coup resistors. How and why would she take sides in that anyway?

On 11/27/2023 at 10:24 PM, txhorns79 said:

Surely they have a system that would notice if people were suddenly depositing large amounts of cash in their accounts, well beyond their means

They can do that on Earth too. That's what the IRS does. Maybe the amounts shown so far (several thousand dollars) aren't high enough to trigger some inquiry, but there's no indication that he's mindful of this concern, and he should be. Compare his carefree attitude with that of say Carmela Soprano, who after secretly sealing some cash, was quite careful to open up multiple bank deposits so that no single deposit would exceed $10,000 because she knew that that's the deposit level that sets off IRS concerns.

Edited March 12 by ahpny