S05.E18: The XX XY Files

[1011101010001]

Sarper reveals a secret about his past; Kenny and Armando meet with a potential surrogate; Brandan's mom tells Mary and Brandan that she's worried about the couple's future; Holly reaches a breaking point.

Airdate: 11/6/23

[Chalby]

Holly is an odd duck, but I can't put my finger on what it is. The way she talks, walks, even some of her expressions remind me of my daughter when she was 11. Am I the only who wonders what her backstory is?

[surfgirl]

3 hours ago, Chalby said:

Holly is an odd duck, but I can't put my finger on what it is. The way she talks, walks, even some of her expressions remind me of my daughter when she was 11. Am I the only who wonders what her backstory is?

I feel like it's either:

A. She is on the spectrum and undiagnosed 

B. Her mother drank and/or smoked and she got damaged in utero

C. She is off her meds, whatever they may be

There is something very wrong with her. And while we're on the subject, WTF is wrong with her HAIR?!? It's always greasy, stringy, and looks like a bad combo of a really bad weave and very oil hair that doesn't get washed nearly enough. Cut that shit off and be done with it already. And maybe use a mirror when you apply that makeup because it looks like she put it on in the dark. And here's an idea Holly, get a fucking job somewhere doing something, anything! Be a receptionist, or find the local taro card-reading group or whatthefuckever. Just thinking aloud, yanno. She sits around that house whinging and doing nothing to assimilate into her new life. 

[Sir RaiderDuck OMS]

They say that hard drug users stop emotionally maturing at whatever age they begin using. We're seeing that with Holly. She acts like a whiny teenager who has to be told to take a bleeping shower. And after working a 12-hour day, the last thing Wayne wants is to come home to her moaning and groaning about how much she hates it there and how her street drugs were so much easier to score back in the US (she doesn't actually say that last part out loud, but we all know she's thinking it).

As always, Brandan's mom needs to STFU. She was a crappy excuse for a mother who had a choice of getting high and sleeping around to score drugs or raising her kids, and chose the former. She doesn't get to jet back in and play Mommy now. She's lucky Brandan even gives her the time of day.

How in the blue hell does Sarper stay with someone for a entire week-long boinkfest and never even learn her last name??? The only thing that makes sense is his renouncing his parental rights to get out of paying child support (or her leaving his name off the Birth Certificate), and her marrying someone else who eventually adopted the child. Even then, a good PI could probably track them both down.

And once again, people: DODGING THE CHILDREN QUESTION DOES NOT WORK. If Sarper's dead-set on having a biological child and Shekinah's dead-set on not having (another) one, that's an insurmountable hill to climb.

I love how the show had Kenny & Armando's potential surrogate talk about "giving a gift of love" when we all know she's doing this for the $$$. And there's absolutely NOTHING wrong with that, mind you, but the show should at least be honest about what's going on. (Disclosure: We know a gay couple who decided to start a family using an egg donor and separate surrogate mother. Each child cost  them upwards of $100K by the time they paid both the egg donor and surrogate.)

[Scarlett45]

53 minutes ago, Sir RaiderDuck OMS said:

I love how the show had Kenny & Armando's potential surrogate talk about "giving a gift of love" when we all know she's doing this for the $$$. And there's absolutely NOTHING wrong with that, mind you, but the show should at least be honest about what's going on. (Disclosure: We know a gay couple who decided to start a family using an egg donor and separate surrogate mother. Each child cost  them upwards of $100K by the time they paid both the egg donor and surrogate.)

I think everyone knows the surrogate is doing it for the money, but I think it does take a big heart to agree to be a surrogate, just because the physical and medical risks you put yourself in (when you already have children of your own depending on you). I don’t think they are mutually exclusive.
 

In the USA most surrogates are younger women who are stay at home moms, with a working partner but don’t have a lot of education or marketable skills-But they had very easy pregnancies and no medical issues, surrogacy is a way for them to make an income yet stay home with their kids. (You have to be raising biological kids of your own to be a commercial surrogate) I can imagine it’s even more of the same in Mexico. 
 

I also know two couples who used surrogates- it’s very expensive process. 

[Scarlett45]

9 hours ago, surfgirl said:

And here's an idea Holly, get a fucking job somewhere doing something, anything! Be a receptionist, or find the local taro card-reading group or whatthefuckever. Just thinking aloud, yanno. She sits around that house whinging and doing nothing to assimilate into her new life. 

To be fair to Holly, she likely can’t work yet, she has to wait for her authorization which may take several months. But she knew that when she agreed to move there. I can imagine it’s boring and lonely but it’s not FOREVER. Once she gets her authorization she can apply for jobs and expand her social circle. 

[surfgirl]

On 11/7/2023 at 9:15 AM, Scarlett45 said:

To be fair to Holly, she likely can’t work yet, she has to wait for her authorization which may take several months. But she knew that when she agreed to move there. I can imagine it’s boring and lonely but it’s not FOREVER. Once she gets her authorization she can apply for jobs and expand her social circle. 

There are tons of things she could be doing if this is the case. Volunteering in anything she's interested in. But she seems to have the mental capacity of a 10 year old child so I'm not sure what her actual options are. Plus...that hair...she presents as a hot buttered mess everytime we see her.

Edited November 10, 2023 by surfgirl

[Kid]

Wayne, do yourself a favor and put her on the first plane out of South Africa!

[IvySpice]

Mother Brandan was dead right about Brandan and Mary coming from dysfunctional pasts and having no model for a healthy family. Love isn't enough, and what they have looks more like codependence than love. She even presented her concerns in a respectful way. But even if they wanted to commit to changing (which is a tall order for people with a personality disorder, like Mary), how in the world would they pay for therapy? I doubt that there are Al-Anon meetings or other free support groups in the rural Philippines.

Kenny & Armando's scene was sweet and actually rang true to me. There seemed to be love around that table.

I can't with Holly. If you move to another country, you have to do the work to build a life there.

[gaPeach]

30 minutes ago, IvySpice said:

Mother Brandan was dead right about Brandan and Mary coming from dysfunctional pasts and having no model for a healthy family. Love isn't enough, and what they have looks more like codependence than love. She even presented her concerns in a respectful way. But even if they wanted to commit to changing (which is a tall order for people with a personality disorder, like Mary), how in the world would they pay for therapy? I doubt that there are Al-Anon meetings or other free support groups in the rural Philippines.

I was coming her to say the same thing.  His mom was a shitty mom and she actually owned it and acknowledged Brandon had a terrible childhood.  So yeah, she messed up when Brandon was young, but it sounds like the second chance she has been given, she is taking seriously and trying to make up for her failure as a mom.  That has to be the ONLY positive thing to come out Mary and Brandon's relationship.  

There might be help for them yet...........ok too much too soon.

[Red Bridey]

I can't with Holly. The way she clasped the mermaid's tale and scampered out to the pool like a ten- year old, then pouted and whined and missing mommy and..."I have to go back to America!" while stomping her little feet. Honestly, Wayne had no idea his wife is actually a grown child with no gumption. 

[libgirl2]

3 hours ago, Red Bridey said:

I can't with Holly. The way she clasped the mermaid's tale and scampered out to the pool like a ten- year old, then pouted and whined and missing mommy and..."I have to go back to America!" while stomping her little feet. Honestly, Wayne had no idea his wife is actually a grown child with no gumption. 

How could not see what type of a person he married? I just don't get it. He seems pretty sane and mature. 

[1011101010001]

On 11/7/2023 at 2:02 AM, surfgirl said:

Be a receptionist, or find the local taro card-reading group or whatthefuckever.

God forbid she reads a book.

On 11/7/2023 at 9:35 AM, Sir RaiderDuck OMS said:

or her leaving his name off the Birth Certificate

It sounds like he was listening to All I Wanna Do Is Make Love to You by Heart about the woman who picks up a young hitchhiker because her husband is infertile.

On 11/7/2023 at 9:35 AM, Sir RaiderDuck OMS said:

Each child cost  them upwards of $100K by the time they paid both the egg donor and surrogate

Is there a discount if the woman is both the egg donor and the surrogate?

[1011101010001]

On 11/7/2023 at 11:15 AM, Scarlett45 said:

To be fair to Holly, she likely can’t work yet, she has to wait for her authorization which may take several months. But she knew that when she agreed to move there. I can imagine it’s boring and lonely but it’s not FOREVER. Once she gets her authorization she can apply for jobs and expand her social circle. 

I thought she lived there for several months previously so her acting like she didn’t expect life to be like this is odd.  I’m betting there is a legal reason Wayne can’t move to the US and this will be Ronald and cold shoulders all over again.

On 11/7/2023 at 11:23 AM, surfgirl said:

But she seems to ha e the mental capacity of a 10 year old child

How many hours of play did she expect to get out of that mermaid tail?  And she’s never been in the pool once?  Maybe for the better I could see her drowning in a bathtub.

[Kid]

16 hours ago, Red Bridey said:

The way she clasped the mermaid's tale and scampered out to the pool like a ten- year old, then pouted and whined and missing mommy and..."I have to go back to America!" while stomping her little feet.

Not to mention the fact that he's working his ass off 12 hours a day and she spending his hard earned cash on mermaid tails!

[Stuckathome]

9 hours ago, MrBuhBye said:

this will be Ronald and cold shoulders all over again.

If it is, at least in this case I doubt young children will be caught in the middle and that, at least, is a blessing. I agree, Holly has some issue---either some sort of developmental delay or learning disability, or she is an addict. I assume with all their other restrictions, JW frown upon drug use. They probably also frown upon traditional rehab/detox methods. Perhaps they went into this marriage thinking this would FORCE her to clean up and stay that way. Now reality is hitting......when you don't have any hobbies, no personality and the maturity of a 13 year old girl, life would suck in SA. 

[IvySpice]

13 hours ago, MrBuhBye said:

Is there a discount if the woman is both the egg donor and the surrogate?

This setup is discouraged nowadays, because this is being a plain old biological mother, blurring the concept of a surrogate. The "Baby M" case pretty much killed this model in the U.S., though there are still would-be gay dads without a $100,000 budget who might arrange this informally with a friend. Artificial insemination at home is easy and cheap.

[Kid]

22 hours ago, IvySpice said:

This setup is discouraged nowadays, because this is being a plain old biological mother, blurring the concept of a surrogate. The "Baby M" case pretty much killed this model in the U.S., though there are still would-be gay dads without a $100,000 budget who might arrange this informally with a friend. Artificial insemination at home is easy and cheap.

Have to question why a 60 year old man gets involved with a young man who may want more children and why a 60 year old man agrees to have a baby. That is unfair to the child.  Al Pacino and Robert De Niro fall into the same category.

[1011101010001]

16 minutes ago, Kid said:

Have to question why a 60 year old man gets involved with a young man who may want more children and why a 60 year old man agrees to have a baby. That is unfair to the child.  Al Pacino and Robert De Niro fall into the same category.

A recent former president had a kid three months short of 60. 

[Raja]

It is a common thing in the K-1 community, so probably for folks going the other way also that grandpa thinks he had done his part already but the young wife wants to be a mother before she ages out as that might happen before grandpa dies and the widow can find someone else. 

Edited November 10, 2023 by Raja

[Stuckathome]

Oh, how could I forget Sarper and Shrek and the deep convo about having kids. I can see how each side feels...she has done the whole momma thing and is happy to have her daughter grown and gone while he has never had that experience....but, yet again another couple that really never talked about the serious issues that they should have when they were deciding to merge their lives. I LOL'd when she insisted that they had already discussed and settled this issue----the night they met. And he looks at her like ok, how fucking dumb are you? and finally spells out what we all (except Shrek) knew "you were a one night stand. I wanted to fuck you I would have said or agreed to whatever." LOL 

 

[libgirl2]

16 minutes ago, Stuckathome said:

Oh, how could I forget Sarper and Shrek and the deep convo about having kids. I can see how each side feels...she has done the whole momma thing and is happy to have her daughter grown and gone while he has never had that experience....but, yet again another couple that really never talked about the serious issues that they should have when they were deciding to merge their lives. I LOL'd when she insisted that they had already discussed and settled this issue----the night they met. And he looks at her like ok, how fucking dumb are you? and finally spells out what we all (except Shrek) knew "you were a one night stand. I wanted to fuck you I would have said or agreed to whatever." LOL 

 

At least he was honest about it. He did say though that he fell in love with her. 

[Stuckathome]

16 hours ago, libgirl2 said:

At least he was honest about it.

oh, absolutely. I feel like he has been upfront and honest, a straight shooter with her from the start. It's just that she is so dense she apparently thought it was a deep connection, love at first sight, when they hooked up. And he was shaking her back to reality, LOL. 

[Squishy Tomato]

On 11/7/2023 at 5:33 PM, Scarlett45 said:

I think everyone knows the surrogate is doing it for the money, but I think it does take a big heart to agree to be a surrogate, just because the physical and medical risks you put yourself in (when you already have children of your own depending on you). I don’t think they are mutually exclusive.
 

In the USA most surrogates are younger women who are stay at home moms, with a working partner but don’t have a lot of education or marketable skills-But they had very easy pregnancies and no medical issues, surrogacy is a way for them to make an income yet stay home with their kids. (You have to be raising biological kids of your own to be a commercial surrogate) I can imagine it’s even more of the same in Mexico. 
 

I also know two couples who used surrogates- it’s very expensive process. 

THANK YOU for this post. My gay best friends recently acquired a baby via surrogacy. The surrogate mum had to have an emergency C-section and spent 24 hours in the intensive care unit. Women who are willing to go through this and take these risks for someone else deserve to be suitably compensated. They said she was an angel. And yes, it is possible to be financially incentivised AND care about helping another couple. It also took my friends a long time to find a willing surrogate as many will only do it for straight couples.

I'm also a little surprised by the amount of judgment against Brandon's mum. I think she is beautiful (saying this as a straight woman) and has clearly been through therapy and done a lot of work on herself. I also respect her for being willing to be open about being an addict on (inter)national television. It is a tragedy to end up an addict but until you've walked in someone else's shoes you're not really in a position to judge.

[Scarlett45]

1 hour ago, Squishy Tomato said:

I'm also a little surprised by the amount of judgment against Brandon's mum. I think she is beautiful (saying this as a straight woman) and has clearly been through therapy and done a lot of work on herself. I also respect her for being willing to be open about being an addict on (inter)national television. It is a tragedy to end up an addict but until you've walked in someone else's shoes you're not really in a position to judge.

I think Brandon’s Mom loves her son and wants him to have a better life than she had. But I understand why he isn’t open to listening to her after the trauma her addiction put him through when he was very young. 
 

Of course I applaud her for being in recovery and trying to make amends, but that doesn’t undo the damage done to her kids/her relationship with them. I also think people forget that Brandon is very young- his Mom hasn’t been in recovery that long. He’s only 23. It’s not as if she’s been sober for 25yrs and he’s just refusing to listen to anything she says. Rebuilding that trust and authority with him is going to take time (which she seems to understand).