S25: Shelley & Nici

[Donny Ketchum]

Hi.  We're mother and daughter.

 

I'm happy to have another mother/daughter team after eight seasons.  But then again, the only really good one that wasn't cannon fodder was Nancy & Emily from TAR1.  The other three we've had have either gone quickly due to their own mistakes (TAR2's Deidre & Hillary and TAR9's Wanda & Desiree), or from someone else's (TAR17's Andie & Jenna).

 

Hard to believe they'll only be our fifth mother/daughter team due to the show's love for father/son and father/daughter teams.  Only mother/son teams have a lower count, with three (TAR7's Susan & Patrick, TAR13's Toni & Dallas, and TAR14's Margie & Luke).  Also, I'm glad we have our first black parent/child team since TAR6's Gus & Hera.

[gibasi]

Whoops.  Your link doesn't go to Shelley and Nici but to Misti and Jim.

[Donny Ketchum]

Oops!  And the editing feature is no longer available on that post.  I don't know why it expires after some time.

 

So here it is instead!

[gibasi]

Thanks, Donny Ketchum!

[Donny Ketchum]

I find it heavily awful that Robbie piggy-backed off Shelley's help.  Though then again, this'll teach her not to help others when you might be at or near the back of the pack.  Hope they survive next week's preview.

Edited September 27, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[MyAimIsTrue]

I can't tell which is the mother and which is the daughter because both women look amazing.  One of them was mugging a bit too much for the camera, at least in my opinion, but it may have been adrenaline or sheer excitement so I'm willing to give her a pass for now.

[Donny Ketchum]

MyAimIsTrue, Shelley is the mother with the short, blonde-ish hair and the higher-sounding voice.  Nici is the daughter with the long, black hair and the lower-sounding voice.

Edited September 27, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[MyAimIsTrue]

Thanks, that helps!  It's nice seeing another mother/daughter team for the first time in quite some time so I'm instantly putting Shelley and Nici at the top of my like list. 

[TudorQueen]

I love them and agree that they look more like sisters than mother/daughter. But when Shelley gets in her Mother mode - whether with Nici or someone else - it's unmistakable, and actually kind of entertaining.

[aradia22]

I agree. It's going to take me a while to remember who is the mother and who is the daughter. They're both very pretty. I think they have the possibility of being a fun team with good energy but I also get the sense that they could be very negative. Race fatigue could hit them hard. But I'm hoping they're the bubbly, friendly kind of flight attendants and not the ones who have clearly been working for too long.

[Donny Ketchum]

I'd say next week's preview shows that fatigue is already hitting Shelley.  Based on Nici's crying or near-crying, it might've already hit her, too.

[MyAimIsTrue]

I never watch the previews so damn, that's disappointing to hear.

[ByaNose]

Oddly enough, I saw the previews for next week & can't remember a thing about them. I think I have a short attention span.

[Chyna]

I hope the previews are a misdirect. The mom won me over in the premiere with "It's not a rock!"

[Donny Ketchum]

They did a good job using their military experience at About-Face.  But like most others, they lost me (or came close to it) with all of their crying near the end of the leg.  Especially Nici's.  I sympathize.  I do.  Had to be hard knowing they were almost out of a race they'd prepared so hard for.  But really, they didn't know if they were out yet, so they should've stayed calm until they knew for sure.

 

I still like them, though, and hope they can be calmer on the next leg.

Edited October 4, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[TudorQueen]

At first, during the tear-stained cab ride, I said Nici "needs to grow up a little", but then I realized I couldn't guarantee I wouldn't be weeping at that point myself.

 

Shelley cracks me up. The bear joke, done with enthusiasm if not total accuracy, the peeing off the side of the punt... and something about her in general. 

 

I was sorry to lose Dennis and Isabelle, but I'd have been sorrier to lose these two.

[aradia22]

I cannot believe Shelley peed off the side of the boat in episode 2. I sympathize with their struggles because it seems like they were spending a lot of time at both tasks. But they should know that it's way too early for them to be struggling this much. It doesn't bode well for them that they're fighting this much already and so quickly giving in to their frustrations.

[Donny Ketchum]

I cannot believe Shelley peed off the side of the boat in episode 2. I sympathize with their struggles because it seems like they were spending a lot of time at both tasks. But they should know that it's way too early for them to be struggling this much. It doesn't bode well for them that they're fighting this much already and so quickly giving in to their frustrations.

Especially since both were in the military before.  (Shelley was in the Army, Nici was in the Air Force.)  Both branches pretty much teach you not to give in to frustration.

Edited October 5, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[Camera One]

I did find it interesting they were both in the military.  I was cheering for them in Episode 1, but the daughter got too hysterical, which lost me a little.  

[Donny Ketchum]

Nice recovery, ladies!  No whining or crying from Nici, either!  They did well with the Shetland pony and seemed to do okay with the sheep once they figured out how to corral them.  Their joy at fourth place was adorable.

 

But I wonder what Nici is getting upset with Shelley about at the Pit Stop next week?  Shelley had better not be quitting, or refusing a save if it's an NEL!  I'm hoping it's just exasperation at having to go back and complete something they didn't previously finish or do correctly.

Edited October 11, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[aradia22]

This team is amusing without trying too hard. I'm worried about them next week though. So dramatic!

[Donny Ketchum]

This team did a good job to recover, especially after arriving in last after getting a delayed flight.  I was surprised they saved their fuel despite the tension of being in last.  I admire how they stayed calm enough to pay attention to detail at the Detour, and good on Nici for clearing that Roadblock in one try (and apparently being the only one to do so!).

 

But then . . . Nici proceeds to lose me, likely for good, right on the mat.  Seriously.  Shelley's not just your teammate, lady.  She's your mother.  Respect your mother.  She was right in what she said.  I feel for Shelley and agree that the sooner they lose, the better it might be for Nici.  Though at the same time, Shelley shouldn't have nearly screwed them over by not telling Nici about seeing Phil on the mat just because Nici smarted off to her or whatever.

 

Both are right and both are wrong, and if they don't shape up, they'll be gone sooner rather than later.

[hincandenza]

Respectfully, I couldn't disagree with you more; from watching this leg, I had no real fault in Nici's behavior.  She was panicky, as people will be nearing possible elimination... but Shelley doesn't get a pass for being her mom.  Respect is earned or lost on how you behave, not how many laps around the sun you've made.  If anything, Shelley should have more of a burden of being mature, calm, and well-adjusted, since she's the mother of a woman in her 20's.

 

So what do we get from Shelley instead?  Self-destructive behavior, insufferable smugness without merit, and a punchable smirking face when she proudly admitted she didn't even tell her own partner they'd just blown past the Pit Stop.

 

Can anyone think of a single other time in twenty-five seasons of TAR that a player has knowingly, happily sabotaged their team like that?  I'm not talking "pee break 100 yards from the Pit Stop" sabotage, but watching Phil go by in the rear view mirror and saying nothing?

[TudorQueen]

Neither behaved particularly well. Shelley is sometimes like Claire Huxtable in one of her "I'm the mother and you're too dumb to realize that I know best" moods, while Nici, with the crying and the pouting and the meltdowns, doesn't seem like the grown woman she is supposed to be.

 

I wonder about their mother-daughter dynamic off the show. They clearly love each other, and Nici chose (I assume the choice was hers) to follow her mother's line of work. I don't know if they fly the same routes at all, but if this is their dynamic, they probably shouldn't. Or maybe Killer Fatigue is getting the better of them.

 

I do like them, but they can be wearying. When Phil tells you to be a grownup (after you've stomped off the mat to sulk) maybe you should listen?

[Donny Ketchum]

Respectfully, I couldn't disagree with you more; from watching this leg, I had no real fault in Nici's behavior.  She was panicky, as people will be nearing possible elimination... but Shelley doesn't get a pass for being her mom.  Respect is earned or lost on how you behave, not how many laps around the sun you've made.  If anything, Shelley should have more of a burden of being mature, calm, and well-adjusted, since she's the mother of a woman in her 20's.

 

So what do we get from Shelley instead?  Self-destructive behavior, insufferable smugness without merit, and a punchable smirking face when she proudly admitted she didn't even tell her own partner they'd just blown past the Pit Stop.

Not to defend Shelley's behavior, per se, but I can see why she finally shut down and did that.  She was trying to make sure they did everything carefully (but still quickly) so they could catch back up, and Nici spent the whole leg smarting off, talking back to her, and practically getting in her face about things as early as when they were looking for their car at the airport.  It's a bit understandable to me that it could possibly have worn her down.

 

I do think she shouldn't have damn near sabotaged them by not telling Nici about the Pit Stop, though.

Edited October 19, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[hincandenza]

Agreed; Nici wasn't calm or reasonable either, but the near-sabotage from Shelley was beyond the pale. Never seen anyone do that, and since most of us are big fans of the show and would love to do a race like this, we can understand being emotional or frustrated, but self-sabotage or outright quitting is to me the one "sin" a racer can commit.

[backformore]

This team is my mother and me if we were on the race.  I am a calm person, with an advanced degree and a professional career, independent, self-reliant.  Except when my mother stresses me out, by pushing buttons only she can push.  I turn into a defiant, pouty teenager.

[hincandenza]

I'm not a race scholar like some so I could be off-base, but haven't parent/child teams historically struggled for that reason, that the dynamics of their relationship- especially when the child is in their early 20s- haven't fully transitioned to that of two adults?

We see the same in those couples where one is clearly the "decision maker" or more invested in and hung-ho about the race, and when Killer Fatigue kicks in you get one person pretty much crying non-stop while the other gets frustrated and angry, dragging them around the globe. Or the "newly dating" mactor couples we used to get all the time, each one surprised to discover that a worldwide non-stop race isn't a good place to find out if you're compatible, or if your partner handles stress and conflict well.

[Camera One]

There have been many parent/child teams where that hasn't been an issue.  Mallory and her dad for example.  Even some teams where there is a "father/mother knows best" attitude like Ron and Christina have had a different dynamic than these two.  

 

I could see how the mother could get annoyed when the daughter constantly freaks out like at the beginning at the airport parking lot where she questioned her mother's decision.  The mom was indeed right, but it seems like she expected a full apology from the daughter, which might not be too realistic.  And then the mom got unreasonably angry at the navigation... it seemed to me the daughter made an honest mistake and wasn't that great with navigation?  I don't remember anything else the daughter said/did which made the mom angry.  Then the mom stewed in the back seat and weirdly didn't tell the daughter they had passed the Pit Stop.   They did have a stressful day and that's usually takes teams who already clash to the breaking point.  I do like the team but they need to each take an honest look at their own behavior and make an effort to change them to be a better teammate to the other.  

Edited October 18, 2014 by Camera One

[merylinkid]

Actually it's the same dynamic as Ron and Christina, it just manifested differently.   In both cases, the parent is always right and the kid is always wrong.   The kid must always defer to the parent or be punished.   Ron did it by constantly belittling his child when she had a thought different from his own.   Here, Mom decided to "teach her a lesson" by not pointing out the pitstop.   See what happens when you don't navigate well?   How do you like it?    

 

The child here even mentioned, "oops we should have gone left instead of right there, sorry."   Made an honest mistake, admitted it, and got punished because kid is wrong, mom is right and that must be amply demonstrated.

[Camera One]

With Ron and Christina, though, it seemed like Christina didn't fight back or at least wasn't as emotional as in this case.  

[Donny Ketchum]

I'm not a race scholar like some so I could be off-base, but haven't parent/child teams historically struggled for that reason, that the dynamics of their relationship- especially when the child is in their early 20s- haven't fully transitioned to that of two adults?

No.  Not historically, per se, but at least five parent/child teams have had this issue, whether slightly, moderately, or majorly: Nancy & Emily from TAR1, Gus & Hera from TAR6, Ronald & Christina from TAR12, Michael & Kevin from TAR17, and Laurence & Zac from TAR19.  I'd throw a "maybe" to a sixth team, Hoskote & Naina from TAR23, but they were gone first and thus not around long enough to see for sure.

Edited October 18, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[ByaNose]

Donny didn't you forget the annoying Luke and his mother, Margie? LOL!! I can't believe the mother withheld the pit stop. I wonder how far she would have taken that information to prove her point?

[Donny Ketchum]

Donny didn't you forget the annoying Luke and his mother, Margie? LOL!!

Luke was annoying, for sure, but he and Margie had a solid dynamic.  Their only real blowup came at that Detour in TAR24, when he broke some glasses out of frustration and Margie made him pick them up.

 

I was only going by parent/child teams who difficult dynamics with each other, not with other teams.  Shelley & Nici look like they're going to approach that territory.

[Camera One]

I just watched the bonus clip extended mat chat with this team, and I must say Phil really gave it his all in trying to counsel the two of them and help them to meet in the middle.  Not sure how successful that actually was, though...

[aradia22]

Well, this team is getting increasingly painful to watch. That was a fast turnaround. I'm on Nici's side. Maybe it's because I'm closer to her age and I would never go on the race with my own mom but it seems like Shelley knows her daughter's triggers and was passive-aggressively pushing them so she'd appear worse in front of the cameras and so she could reprimand her. That wasn't helpful, supportive behavior. As much as Nici's behavior might irritate her in the moment, I think she likes putting her back in that child role.

 

Now, of course we didn't see a ton of them except for the most dramatic parts since they spent a lot of the episode at the back of the pack. So it's totally possible that Nici had been bothering her mom all day and she'd finally had enough. Or maybe Shelley had spent the whole day undermining her daughter and by the end of the day Nici was ready to have a meltdown at this final act.

[Jersey Guy 87]

I'm slightly on the side of the daughter in this,although I find the two of them unpleasant after this episode.  Shelley seemed determined to teach Nici a lesson, which is great and all, but two things.  First, Nici is an adult - yes, you're her mother but she's an adult now allowed to make her own choices.  Second, you're on the Amazing Race, competing for $1M.  There are other times you can teach life lessons that won't cost you a race for a million dollars.

 

Shelley was way too smug about "you have to change your attitude" and "I decided not to tell you where the pit stop is because I don't like the way you're behaving."  Grow up Shelly and act like an adult.

 

That said, at the mat hug it out or whatever, don't continue to hold your grudge against you mom, Nici.  You two still have to continue racing together.  I'm sure Nici knows what her mom is like, she shouldn't be surprised when she acts that way on the race.

[elychari]

Watching Shelley makes me appreciate and love my Mom.

[backformore]

I'm slightly on the side of the daughter in this,although I find the two of them unpleasant after this episode.  Shelley seemed determined to teach Nici a lesson, which is great and all, but two things.  First, Nici is an adult - yes, you're her mother but she's an adult now allowed to make her own choices.  Second, you're on the Amazing Race, competing for $1M.  There are other times you can teach life lessons that won't cost you a race for a million dollars.

Shelley was way too smug about "you have to change your attitude" and "I decided not to tell you where the pit stop is because I don't like the way you're behaving."  Grow up Shelly and act like an adult.

 

Agreed.  A parent/child team are still both adults, and the parent has to accept  their son or daughter  as an equal for the purpose of the race.   Shelley was doing the "I'm your mom you need to listen to me and don't talk back"  thing that drives young adults (and older ones)  CRAZY.  

I felt for the daughter, because even at my advanced age (I have adult sons)  my mom will speak to me in that same  condescending  way, pout, and insist that I am the one with "attitude".

[Chyna]

After watching the bonus clips on the CBS site, I'm firmly on Team Nici (and I say that as the mother of two daughters). Shelley is SO damn patronizing, even with Phil attempting to mediate. She keeps accusing her daughter of having "attitude" but I don't know how she expects Nici to react with anything but frustration when her only mode is "I'm Always Right and You're Always Wrong."

[Donny Ketchum]

Moving back up, and Nici did a great job with the Roadblock, despite taking a bit long so that Misti could pass her.  They did well at the Detour, at least after Nici pointed out to Shelley what she was doing wrong, and if not for the matter of their cab fare, they'd have finished in a solid third place.  But they should've U-Turned Misti & Jim to get them to burn their Save, not Keith & Whitney over a spat that was partly their fault as well as theirs.

 

Still, good job at the tasks, if not at basic strategy.

Edited October 25, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[Camera One]

This probably gave a heads-up to everyone never to get on Shelley's bad side.  

[TudorQueen]

I like them so much better when they're getting along. When Shelley told Nici how to handle their Detour, she was calm and helpful. Nici was understandably frustrated till then, but didn't completely melt down and was, as far as I could see, the only one who had the (good) idea to tie the hat down. I agree that it was a strategic error not to U-turn Misti and Jim, but, well, nobody's perfect.

 

And they improved their finish by quite a bit. Imagine that! Getting along and teaming up constructively works!

[Donny Ketchum]

I like them so much better when they're getting along. When Shelley told Nici how to handle their Detour, she was calm and helpful. Nici was understandably frustrated till then, but didn't completely melt down and was, as far as I could see, the only one who had the (good) idea to tie the hat down.

Nici actually told Shelley about that.

Edited October 25, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[TudorQueen]

Donny Ketchum, you are one of the most delightfully observant TAR fans I've ever encountered!

 

Thanks for the clarification. I still sometimes have trouble telling them apart, especially when they're costumed and especially, especially when hats or other head coverings are involved.

[auntlada]

I always have a hard time with same-sex teams telling which is which (or learning which is which, really). Usually with mom-daughter or dad-son teams, I can tell because of the obvious age difference, but the mom (Shelley?) does not look that much older than the daughter in this team.

[wineaux]

Well, not so fast with saying that  Shelley and Nici should have U-turned Jim and Misti.  Remember, Jim and Misti were doing a different detour so S&N didn't know where they were (behind them or already heading for the pit top).  Plus, Jim and Misti would have to come in last for that strategy to work and that was a 1 in 6 probability. However, they DID know that Whitney and whats-his-face (can't recall his name as I type…sorry) were still working on the detour, though.  That was the one thing they definitely had insight and a little control over as they thought about what to do.  And, from the edits, it appears that they all make the U-turn decisions rather quickly.

 

So, IMO, it wasn't that bad an idea to U-turn them instead since doing so would likely buy them more time to get to the pit stop, and perhaps, not be eliminated.

 

Now, that's what's going on in MY head, but I'm sure it was a double pleasure for them to spite the folks they just had a falling out with AND to gain a little extra time to get to the mat.

 

 

[Camera One]

They also needed to buy some time to go back to their taxi.  I wonder if all the other teams did that as well since they didn't know they would spend all day there.

[Donny Ketchum]

I do find it incredibly weird that they spent the entire leg at a market.  Has that ever happened before?

[Chyna]

I do find it incredibly weird that they spent the entire leg at a market.  Has that ever happened before?

 

 

I was kind of disappointed that Shelley and Nici's decision to hire the cab by the hour didn't come into play. I thought it was good strategy when they first mentioned it. Although I guess there was some value in not carrying their heavy packs around all day...