S24.E16: The Presence of Absence

[WendyCR72]

Airing March 23, 2023:

Quote

An internet dating site becomes the source of terror for a young widow. Muncy struggles with Velasco's absence.

 

[Xeliou66]

The case sounds interesting, but I dread the Muncy stuff, they’ve done a terrible job with her and I dread seeing her “struggle” even more than she’s struggled already. Muncy is making me miss Rollins.

[Ms Blue Jay]

One of the craziest episodes of SVU.  It was entertaining.  Twist after twist after twist, whiplash after whiplash.  So nuts.  30 minutes in, I was like how the hell are there 30 minutes left?  Kinda like "Lifetime".

However,

Let's think about the logic:

1)  How the hell would Jenna get her hands on Cooper's sperm?
2)  Why would Jenna meet up with (the victim, sorry not sure of her name) knowing the police were already onto her?  

Let me narrow it down, because I've figured it out.  I simply prefer Churlish over Muncy because the actor who plays Churlish is so much better.

Carisi is so hot.  

[The Wild Sow]

11 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

1)  How the hell would Jenna get her hands on Cooper's sperm?

He's a sperm donor.  Just go to the sperm bank, say you want to conceive, and pick his!  Pay the usual fee and go on home with it! They said she used her finger -- I would have assumed an insemination syringe if she was actually trying to get Zoe pregnant.

We did call Jenna as the perp as soon as Zoe mentioned "Klaus" being "not very big."

[Ms Blue Jay]

I understand that he is a sperm donor.  But what do you mean "Pick his"?  Aren't sperm donors anonymous?  It's not the phone book?

Going further, how would Jenna even know Cooper donated his sperm, and how would she know what bank to go to?  Do you really think Cooper would meet up with his aunt regularly and tell her that he was doing that, at what bank he was doing it, and going even further, the aunt would tell her roommate about it?  There are so many implausible steps here to make this plot happen.

Edited March 24, 2023 by Ms Blue Jay

[Xeliou66]

This was one crazy episode - I’m really not sure what to make of it. I never saw it coming that Jenna was the perp because it was just so bizarre - I was puzzled as to how the victim didn’t know she was being penetrated by a foreign object and not a penis, and that she didn’t know the person she was meeting was a woman, that was just so weird. Jenna was batfuck crazy, and I couldn’t really get a read on Zoe, she was rather all over the map, she needed serious counseling after all of this. One of the craziest SVU episodes ever and that’s saying something.

Carisi was really good, it was nice seeing him in charge of the legal side with no interference from SVU or his bosses - they’ve gotten a pretty good handle on the legal stuff now - no trashing of the DA’s office or mentions of the “8th floor” and no Benson bossing Carisi around. The legal stuff was solid, although I didn’t get why Efron didn’t ask for a dismissal, I guess Jenna wanted to take the stand.

I hate Muncy, she acts like an immature teenager, and she was terrible again tonight. And why can Benson dictate whether she does or doesn’t talk to Velasco? St Olivia can’t control what Muncy does in her free time, and Velasco isn’t suspended or under investigation? And Churlish just isn’t likable, I can’t get past how she secretly recorded Velasco and now is being welcomed at SVU - how the fuck will her and Velasco ever work together? Given this soapy shitshow though they’ll probably sleep together by season’s end! I really missed Bruno, he’s become a favorite, please get him back on screen soon! Fin was stellar as always, and is the anchor of the show.

So I really don’t know what to think of this episode other than it was one crazy case. It didn’t have the awfulness of a lot of modern day SVU episodes and there were parts I liked, but it wasn’t great by any means. It was just bizarre. 

[wknt3]

The Good:
The story. Yeah the springs on my suspension of disbelief are shot, and at times it felt like a later Baer years episode, but without the cast budget to not have viable alternative perps, witnesses, and experts, but at least they were trying to do something different and keep things fresh.
Carisi. In many ways this was his episode as it was heavy on the trial portion and he was the one with the big hero moment at the end. It is nice to see Carisi clearly in charge and able to disagree with Benson and the squad at times without being painted as the bad guy. Or even as the only good guy in the DA's office.

the Bad:
The opener. While I appreciate that there was no in your face music or smash cut editing designed to disguise a lack of production values it was just too long and repetitive. You can only sustain one note for so long. They could have trimmed 25% or so and used the time for something more interesting later on.
The whole soapy Amaro mess is still bubbling on the back burner. It's pointless except as a way for them to gin up some interpersonal drama and try to make us think that maybe they are going to actually do something with the new characters at some point.
Muncy. We get it show. Mariska doesn't like that they brought in a younger woman and nobody is left in the writers room who cam actually create and develop compelling new characters. And Dick Wolf/NBC want to keep their options open at all times. So we are either crapping over Muncy and Velasco or bringing over detectives from the Bronx and making them Fin and Benson's new BFFs. It's annoying and unnecessary even if I prefer it to having only 4 people who have been there for years.
Benson. For all the usual reasons even if she wasn't in our face as much as usual.

Overall this was a C- execution of a B+ idea. I like that they tried to do something with the COTW to keep it fresh and they were doiing the "shocking twist" without going OTT with it, and I really liked the trial, but there was just too much weighing it down. They need to actually commit to some new additions and if they want to mix in recurring characters that is fine - for instance a shrink, or CSU tech would have really made this better. It's hard to get excited about potential when all signs are that they don't have any clear since of direction or priorities and are just spinning their wheels.

[The Wild Sow]

6 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Going further, how would Jenna even know Cooper donated his sperm, and how would she know what bank to go to?  Do you really think Cooper would meet up with his aunt regularly and tell her that he was doing that, at what bank he was doing it, and going even further, the aunt would tell her roommate about it?  There are so many implausible steps here to make this plot happen.

Yes!  He told his aunt how he was making his extra money, and she and Jenna had a good laugh about it.  His donor profile may have included enough information to identify him to someone who knew him.  And it would have included at least a childhood photo (that's pretty standard) and possibly a current photo.

[Ms Blue Jay]

3 hours ago, The Wild Sow said:

  He told his aunt how he was making his extra money, and she and Jenna had a good laugh about it. 

This is speculation on your part right?  Because this wasn't mentioned in the episode, was it?

Edited March 24, 2023 by Ms Blue Jay

[TakomaSnark]

11 hours ago, The Wild Sow said:

He's a sperm donor.  Just go to the sperm bank, say you want to conceive, and pick his!  Pay the usual fee and go on home with it! They said she used her finger -- I would have assumed an insemination syringe if she was actually trying to get Zoe pregnant.

We did call Jenna as the perp as soon as Zoe mentioned "Klaus" being "not very big."

Admittedly, I'm not familiar with the process of getting donated sperm but... They don't seriously just let you come in and take out a deposit, do they? I would think they would need to have a chain of custody from donation to insemination (clinic to clinic, if necessary). 

Walking into a sperm bank and walking out with a handful of sperm seems quite unrealistic but what do I know.

Ridiculous episode, especially the ending with Benson giving Zoe a 'you'll get back out there on the dating seen soon!' ra-ra speech. 

One of these days I'll understand why someone with a desk job is knee deep in every investigation ahead of the actual detectives on the squad.

Edited March 24, 2023 by TakomaSnark

[StaceyNotStacie]

Did they say if Zoe  ended up pregnant? I remember Plan B was mentioned, but I don’t remember if she took it. 
 

Also, what was the timespan between the original crime and the trial? If it was more than a month or two, she would have known by then. 

[Hedgehog2022]

This was one of the worst episodes ever in this franchise. What a waste of an hour...the cast is just not working. There is zero chemistry with these people and the Muncey (sp?) character is just awful...I would have liked to see the addition of that other guy that worked a case with them recently. This show has seen better days and it may be time to call it day and end it once for and all. 

[illdoc]

8 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

This is speculation on your part right?  Because this wasn't mentioned in the episode, was it?

It was indeed mentioned in the episode.

[Xeliou66]

24 minutes ago, Hedgehog2022 said:

This was one of the worst episodes ever in this franchise. What a waste of an hour...the cast is just not working. There is zero chemistry with these people and the Muncey (sp?) character is just awful...I would have liked to see the addition of that other guy that worked a case with them recently. This show has seen better days and it may be time to call it day and end it once for and all. 

Agreed about Muncy, she’s so horrible she makes me miss Rollins, and if you are talking about Bruno I’m hoping he gets added into the main cast as well, he’s really good. 
I agree the show has seen better days and it’s a shame because the show could still be good but the writers just seem clueless a lot of the time as to what to do, with decent writers the show could be good. I didn’t think this episode was horrible, it was just strange. Next week may be a disaster though, it sounds like it’s heavy on both Muncy and Churlish. Blah.

[WendyCR72]

Could be because spring is here and people now want to do other things besides watch TV, but the ratings for this episode - and the rest of the franchise last night - were abysmal.

Makes me curious about there still being no word of a renewal yet. The last 3-year renewal dropped in February 2020.

[Xeliou66]

15 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

Could be because spring is here and people now want to do other things besides watch TV, but the ratings for this episode - and the rest of the franchise last night - were abysmal.

Makes me curious about there still being no word of a renewal yet. The last 3-year renewal dropped in February 2020.

I’m hearing that it’s very likely all 3 L&O shows are renewed - they still have some of the highest ratings on NBC. I definitely want the Mothership renewed. SVU does seem like it’s running on fumes at times and the current writers have no idea what to do it seems. But I’m pretty certain all 3 L&O shows will be renewed. The ratings may have been lower last night due to March Madness basketball being on - I didn’t watch the episodes until late, after the basketball was off.

[WendyCR72]

Just now, Xeliou66 said:

I’m hearing that it’s very likely all 3 L&O shows are renewed - they still have some of the highest ratings on NBC. I definitely want the Mothership renewed. SVU does seem like it’s running on fumes at times and the current writers have no idea what to do it seems. But I’m pretty certain all 3 L&O shows will be renewed. The ratings may have been lower last night due to March Madness basketball being on - I didn’t watch the episodes until late, after the basketball was off.

I can buy this. The only thing that gives me pause is how the Mothership originally had the rug pulled from underneath them, which had to lead to fancy editing to make the final episode of S20 the then-series finale.

I can see that happening again, but I would hope the network wouldn't be that short-sighted again.

JMO, but I do think SVU should end sooner than later, but what will be, will be.

[Ms Blue Jay]

3 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Could be because spring is here and people now want to do other things besides watch TV, but the ratings for this episode - and the rest of the franchise last night - were abysmal.

Makes me curious about there still being no word of a renewal yet. The last 3-year renewal dropped in February 2020.

I think people didn't know it was back after the break?  I certainly didn't but my DVR catches any new episodes.

[Diana Berry]

3 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

I’m hearing that it’s very likely all 3 L&O shows are renewed - they still have some of the highest ratings on NBC. I definitely want the Mothership renewed. SVU does seem like it’s running on fumes at times and the current writers have no idea what to do it seems. But I’m pretty certain all 3 L&O shows will be renewed. The ratings may have been lower last night due to March Madness basketball being on - I didn’t watch the episodes until late, after the basketball was off.

They were going up against March madness NCAA bb tournament.  I was surprised they even did new shows last nite.

i liked the episode very twisty. Kept my attention .

[The Wild Sow]

On 3/24/2023 at 9:35 AM, Ms Blue Jay said:

On 3/24/2023 at 6:31 AM, The Wild Sow said:

He told his aunt how he was making his extra money, and she and Jenna had a good laugh about it. 

This is speculation on your part right?  Because this wasn't mentioned in the episode, was it?

Sure it was - during Jenna's interrogation.  Right around the 35-minute mark.

[The Wild Sow]

On 3/24/2023 at 10:43 AM, TakomaSnark said:

Admittedly, I'm not familiar with the process of getting donated sperm but... They don't seriously just let you come in and take out a deposit, do they? I would think they would need to have a chain of custody from donation to insemination (clinic to clinic, if necessary). 

Walking into a sperm bank and walking out with a handful of sperm seems quite unrealistic but what do I know.

"Home insemination is an easy procedure that can be done in the comfort of your own home. The donor sperm straws you select are shipped directly to you in a nitrogen tank container. An insemination kit, with a needle-less syringe, an adaptor and a step-by-step instruction document is included in the shipment."

 

Source: Home Insemination with Donor Sperm - Cryos International

 

https://www.cryosinternational.com › ... › Donor sperm

And, donor profiles (with childhood photos):
https://cryobankamerica.com/donor-search/

Edited March 25, 2023 by The Wild Sow

[Ms Blue Jay]

21 minutes ago, The Wild Sow said:

Sure it was - during Jenna's interrogation.  Right around the 35-minute mark.

I see.

[TVMovieBuff]

This kind of made ma say "Really?" There have been cases that were far-fetched, but they were fun anyway. This was just lazy.

[wknt3]

On 3/24/2023 at 7:28 PM, Xeliou66 said:

I’m hearing that it’s very likely all 3 L&O shows are renewed - they still have some of the highest ratings on NBC. I definitely want the Mothership renewed. SVU does seem like it’s running on fumes at times and the current writers have no idea what to do it seems. But I’m pretty certain all 3 L&O shows will be renewed. The ratings may have been lower last night due to March Madness basketball being on - I didn’t watch the episodes until late, after the basketball was off.

 

On 3/24/2023 at 7:31 PM, WendyCR72 said:

I can buy this. The only thing that gives me pause is how the Mothership originally had the rug pulled from underneath them, which had to lead to fancy editing to make the final episode of S20 the then-series finale.

I can see that happening again, but I would hope the network wouldn't be that short-sighted again.

JMO, but I do think SVU should end sooner than later, but what will be, will be.

Yes they screwed over the mothership, but they have learned their lessons from that fiasco. It cost Universal a lot of money in the end - L&O: LA failed and they gave up what most likely would have been a few more seasons in syndication sales on the mothership. Plus it damaged their relationship with thier biggest supplier of scripted shows. I could see them deciding that OC is not worth the hassle, but given that NBC has much bigger problems they probably keep it going and use it to fill less desirable slots on USA and dgitial subchannels as long as the ratings don't totally tank. And I think everyone here knows I think that they should announce a final season and have a big sendoff with returning characters from the past as well as going back to basics. A bonus is that they would not have to worry about Mariska's feelings and holding out at contract time so they could actually write a new character as a competent detective who is new to SVU instead of as some caricature of the kids these days. If I had to bet though I would put my money on them keeping it going until the wheels totally come off and the ratings are worse then the options, Mariska is unable/unwilling to continue, or NBC decides to adapt the Fox model and only have a few hours a week of scripted programming. Or maybe they are just waiting for CBS to end NCIS so that they know the record for longest run is safe?

[illdoc]

1 hour ago, wknt3 said:

Or maybe they are just waiting for CBS to end NCIS so that they know the record for longest run is safe?

20 for NCIS, 19 for Grey's Anatomy, (officially) 22 for mothership L&O. GA has been renewed for #20, don't know about NCIS.

wiki's list of longest-running scripted shows: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest-running_scripted_American_primetime_television_series

[WendyCR72]

12 minutes ago, illdoc said:

20 for NCIS, 19 for Grey's Anatomy, (officially) 22 for mothership L&O. GA has been renewed for #20, don't know about NCIS.

wiki's list of longest-running scripted shows: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest-running_scripted_American_primetime_television_series

NCIS has already been renewed. In the same linked article, Dick Wolf's FBI franchise was also renewed. This article is from February, so they were renewed early again.

[tennisgurl]

You know its a wild case when even the characters seem to be getting whiplash from how many crazy twists are happening. I don't know if it was a good episode, but it certainly wasn't boring, if nothing else. Poor Zoey, what an absolute mindfuck, every time they cut to her she was reaction with baffled horror at the new totally crazy thing that had been revealed. I don't really know where you go from "my best friend pretended to be my anonymous Christian Grey to rape and impregnate me with my nephews sperm so that I can have a baby that looks like my deceased husband." but hopefully it involves a lot more therapy and some better friends. Jenna was absolutely off her rocker, hopefully Zoey stays very far away from her from now on. 

There was also some really awkward dialogue, like Olivia giving Zoey this awkward "get back out there" speech at the end and then her "yeah this was a weird one but what can you do" speech, and when she was talking to Muncey about Velasco, which continues to be the shows stupidest current subplot. Why is Olivia in charge of whether or not Muncey can talk to Velasco in her off time? Why she is so obsessed with this incident in his past that it seems like was more of the fault of the gangsters than him or his friend? Why is this plot happening and why is it so awkward? 

I feel like this could have been a great episode if it was a bit sharper, had gotten more into the bizarre dynamics between the characters, but they were at least going for something different. I always enjoy cases that are twisty but still more or less plausible and the guest cast was all good, so they did make this episode a bit higher in quality. The other thing that really dragged the case down were the new characters, who are boring and unpleasant. Especially Muncey, who I have really come to dislike, she even makes me miss Rollins! If Muncey has some stupid family that shows up to create drama I swear I might finally quit the show, she's so annoying and unprofessional, she comes off like a bratty teenager more than a detective, she's constantly pissy with everyone and seems like she has the detective skills of a cactus, they seem to be going out of their way to make her as unlikable as possible. 

[The Wild Sow]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

Especially Muncey, who I have really come to dislike, she even makes me miss Rollins! If Muncey has some stupid family that shows up to create drama I swear I might finally quit the show, she's so annoying and unprofessional, she comes off like a bratty teenager more than a detective, she's constantly pissy with everyone and seems like she has the detective skills of a cactus, they seem to be going out of their way to make her as unlikable as possible. 

Ha, "Muncy" is the name of the town where my state's women's prison is located!  So every time I hear that name, that's all I can think about.

[Irate Panda]

This was the dumbest shit I’ve ever seen.  The case was so ridiculous on so many fronts I don’t even know where to start.  Muncy is awful and Churlish (including name) is awful.  They are making me miss Rollins 😡 Also, St. Olivia forgets the approximately 3 million laws she’s broken the past 20 years and tells Muncy she can’t even speak to Velasco who’s not under investigation or anything on Muncy’s own free time?
 

I’ve never been to sperm bank, (never thought I’d start off a sentence on a tv message board this way) but are we suppose to believe Zoe just walks in, ask for sample 101, and they give her a Dixie cup and turkey baster? Who wrote this nonsense? I don’t know how these actors even got through this episode.

[webruce]

On 3/25/2023 at 4:03 PM, The Wild Sow said:

"Home insemination is an easy procedure that can be done in the comfort of your own home. The donor sperm straws you select are shipped directly to you in a nitrogen tank container. An insemination kit, with a needle-less syringe, an adaptor and a step-by-step instruction document is included in the shipment."

 

Source: Home Insemination with Donor Sperm - Cryos International

 

https://www.cryosinternational.com › ... › Donor sperm

And, donor profiles (with childhood photos):
https://cryobankamerica.com/donor-search/

So it might not have been Jenna Scotts finger that deposited the sperm, but the syringe? Zoe Greene said the penis was um kinda small. But it would have been stiff,  and not bendy or knuckley like a finger, also she probably had longer nails then like a mans.