Hecate7

Doubt that's how Dothraki society works, considering how uniformly misogynistic and violent all the men seem to be. It's a rape culture, it's a nomadic warlike culture, and very patriarchal, and so I think any influence Danaerys could have would be completely undermined from the very start. Drogo being "in love" doesn't make that much difference, honestly. Romantic love is not a formative influence on personality.

Considering that in this culture honor killings are still ok and sort of expected sometimes, the guards might have been absolutely against any male relatives coming in to see Lyanna or the baby, until everything could be sorted out and Lyanna's honor restored some way other than by someone having to die over it.

Never said he didn't treat her well, never said Drogo didn't feel differently after he impregnated her than he did when he first married her. But he "loved" her in the sense that she was a prize possession, a brood mare about to deliver his son. It is actually fortunate that Danaerys never got to experience what life would have been like for her after the birth of that son, who would have completely replaced her as the focus of Drogo's pride and joy and positive emotions. No child that came later could ever have mattered as much to Drogo, and neither would Danaerys anymore. Danaerys' forceful personality, which Drogo excused as being caused by the strong male son inside her, would have annoyed Drogo eventually. He still would have called her moon of his delight, but he would have stopped indulging her in ordering good treatment of prisoners, for instance. At no time did he ever truly love her in the sense of caring more about her feelings or welfare than his own. Danaerys and Cersei make interesting foils, though.

Actually, that made no difference at all in how Danaerys' personality developed. She'd have cared for the people whether Drogo loved her or not. Drogo wouldn't pine for anyone because his culture just doesn't have that. Dothraki men don't pine for women. They buy them, they abduct them, or they rape them. They don't pine and they don't really love, either. It's a charming fantasy that Drogo loved Danaerys, but I've always felt the need to put it in quotations marks. Cersei simply has no capacity for caring about others. She has absolutely no sadness or sympathy hearing about starving people or other women getting raped or any kind of hardship. Even Jaime losing a hand only disgusted her as opposed to arousing any sympathetic or sorrowful feelings. She wasn't the slightest bit concerned about Tommen being bullied by Joffrey. What she cared about, all she ever cared about, was what she considered her due. That's just the kind of person she is. Lovers are incidental and in no way create a person's character, which is more or less developed by age 5. Cersei was always this way. Robert wasn't pleasant, but there's really no "if only he'd loved her she'd have been like Danaerys." No, she wouldn't.

I don't see why Arya needs anyone by her side at all.

It's still a neat coincidence that the death of the sister and birth of the baby were so close together, and I can only think that others didn't connect the dots because they didn't care or because there were more urgent things before them at the time. Tywin was much more concerned with what Robert would do next, and with arranging his daughter's royal wedding, than anything going on in far-off Winterfell or Pentos. Robert was just coping with being suddenly King. Only Cat was intruded on by Jon Snow AND a corpse, and I maintain that regardless of the state of composition, the timing of the girl's death and the boy's birth ought to have at least aroused SOME curiosity on that point in childbirth-minded Cat's mind. This is a woman who views all other women in terms of breeding. She ruminates on the width of Jeyne's hips, the sagginess of her own sister's breasts compared with her own, and reflects that men ought to choose women more for their birthing abilities than their prettiness. So the timing should have made her wonder if something more than met the eye was going on. But I guess she's the sort of person who looks at a skeleton and can't imagine that it ever lived. You'd think when she got Ned's bones, that she'd remember Lyanna's, but I guess GRRM thought he'd given us enough broad hints. I'm sure Ned didn't mention anything about it, and if asked wouldn't have put it out there that his sister died in childbirth because then she couldn't be considered a virgin, but she can't be a virgin if she was raped, either.

The Kingsguard were sworn to protect Lyanna and her child, and so they would never have said a word about the baby being hers or Rhaegar's. They had nothing to gain and everything to lose by speaking up. Plus they're dead now except for Jaime, who wasn't there and who has always had bigger things on his mind, and Barristan, who wasn't there and has bigger things on his mind. This isn't proof of their stupidity. Tywin probably would have killed Jon Snow had he figured it out, so that's a great reason for Snow to take the black asap, and for Ned to discourage any conversations between himself and Jaime, Cersei, or Tyrion. A Targaryen in Westeros isn't a bargaining chip, it's a death warrant for whomever kept that Targ a secret. Why would Tywin know? He wasn't there and he was busy getting Robert on the throne and married to Cersei. Why would the Martells know? They're preoccupied with Elia's death. They might actually suspect that Lyanna had a child by Rhaegar, but they probably assume that child is dead. They hate the Lannisters and want to think the worst of them, and so it's not suprising that they never inquired. But it is surprising that Cat would simply want to think the worst of Ned, and not look twice at the fact that a corpse and an infant came into her home the same day. If she was away, it makes sense--the coincidence wouldn't strike her any more than it did Tywin. But if she were home, surely she'd wonder how Lyanna died...and the logical chain of thought would occur to her. I'm willing to bet it occurred to Maester Luwin, along with all the reasons to keep mum.

No. I get that you think that because of her speech about having Robert's son and that child dying of a fever, and Robert punching the wall. Assuming that Cersei isn't just flat-out lying to Cat as a way to try to bond, that baby died. Robert saw him die and punched the wall.

This is all very well until you consider that baby Jon and Lyanna's corpse came into her house at roughly the same time. Just think about that a minute. You'd have to be incredibly dense to keep thinking about Ashara after that. Unless Cat was off visiting her sister or her father at the time, she'd have had to notice the resemblance between Lyanna and Ned, Lyanna and Jon, during the laying-out. Was it just her bones, or was Lyanna's body brought home to be laid in the crypt? I know bones are cleaned if they have to be tranported overseas, or if the body has been decaying for quite some time, but Lyanna would have been transported to Winterfell as soon as she died. Wouldn't Cat have noticed that Jon Snow not only looked like Ned, but also like Lyanna and Benjen? Guess not. Nobody had a better motive or more opportunities to find out. Nobody else cared what Ned had done or with whom, and so the story satisfied them. Cat, on the other hand, not only cared very much, she also had Jon, Ned, and Lyanna's bones in her house. If Robert had had them before him for fifteen years I think even in spite of the drink and the self-absorption he'd have figured it out. Cat's lack of perceptiveness wouldn't matter if she didn't direct hate at Jon continually as he grew up, but she did, and that's what people don't like about her.

But that's not true. I think if you add up how many lines Daisy has, compared with other characters, you'll find that she's not centerstage most of the time. May, Coulson, Bobbie, Fitz/Simmons, and whoever the inhuman of the season is, get just as much focus. For a little while her backstory was the main plot, but it dovetailed with the backstories of May and Coulson, and it was a good story. I'm not sure I understand Phil's obsession with Daisy, but it seems to be a very important part of his character. The title seems to refer mainly to Phil, Daisy, Grant, and May, and to the evolution of the SHIELD organization as it copes with Hydra and various inhumans. I liked Agent Carter better, because the story was more compelling and Agent Carter herself was just so much fun to watch. The title, "Marvel Agents of SHIELD" is a tipoff that this is a superhero story based on a Marvel comic book, and Sky/Daisy/ is a central character in that series.

No, because her husband is best friends with the KING. It's understandable that a self-absorbed person like Robert didn't figure it out--he didn't WANT to know anyway--he enjoyed the idea that even honorable Ned had his peccadilloes. But Cat? She's really got no excuse. She lives in a castle. She knows people lie. She knows there are kings. Most importantly, she knows the baby appeared right when Ned's sister died. The idea that a mysterious baby whose mother is never discussed, comes into her house pretty much at the same time as the dead body of Lyanna arrives to be buried in the crypts, and the idea never crosses her mind in 15 years, is staggering to me. It was my first guess and I hadn't read the books. Ordinary words DO mean more than they appear to, in real life as well as fiction. People lie. They hide real identities behind computer names, bongs in their dorm rooms, affairs and incest and reasons they lost their last job or their last diet failed. Deception IS ordinary. There are secrets and lies in everyone's life, even if it's just who ate the last cookie or whether Bran is climbing the tower walls again. It occurs to me for the very first time that Bran's lie about climbing, is deliberately juxtaposed with Jaime and Cersei's lie--what's wrong with a lie? Depends on the lie. And the Stark family are living the biggest lie of all--an even bigger and more dangerous lie than the one Cersei's living. Cat can tell when Bran is lying--it's odd she can't tell when Ned is. I guess the assumption that honorable Ned Stark would never lie, is what the entire story rests on, but I think Cat is singularly lacking in curiosity not to have wondered, ever, in 15 freaking YEARS, when it took most of the audience about an hour to figure it out. It says much for Ned's honor, but even more for Cat's dull-mindedness.

It did. Agent Carter was cancelled. I can't think of a thing that's wrong with Daisy that isn't wrong with Superman, Spiderman, or Batman.

It's more likely that the living child she bears will be Jon Snow's. It is illegal to depict the baring of a living child unless there's a bath involved.

I thought he said he was five. That's awfully young. I don't think he'd have killed Jon--Jon was younger. Unless it could be established that Rhaegar's son came first, I think Viserys and Jon might have been brotherly. Viserys snapped under the pressure of being the lost heir, the "true king," after so much trauma.

While all this is very true, I think Rhaegar could have talked his way out of some of these situations. He'd have suffered some loss of reputation, but I think he assumed that the magic created by assembling all three heads of the dragon, would compensate him amply for that. He may have been going a little bit mad, because of the prophecy. Had people not murdered Elia, Rhaegar could have assured her family that Elia's son was the heir, and that she had lost no place at court. A grand gift to her and another to her family, would have appeased them. Perhaps some lands or a chest of rich jewels. The Starks would have been shocked at the polygamous marriage of Lyanna, but if they had not instantly declared war, I think Rhaegar would have settled things with them very differently, pointing out that their families were now joined and presenting them with some jointure fitting a princess. The Tourney at Harrenhal was his way of proposing and announcing the engagement. I won't be surprised if it turns out that Rhaegar and Lyanna DID leave a note explaining themselves, but Robert destroyed it. I think had the horrible execution of the Starks not happened, and the war not started, Rhaegar would probably have held a massive celebration for his wedding to Lyanna, in which gifts would have been presented and conciliatory gestures made to all of the offended parties, with the possible exception of Robert Baratheon, whom he would have defeated in fair combat. I don't think families all over Westeros would demand polygamous marriage, but if they did, I don't think Rhaegar would have opposed it at all. It had been accepted at one time as a kingly privilege, but the general thinking by polygamous parties is that if everyone's willing and the husband can afford it, great! The first wife's children still take precedence over the others. China, Japan, and ancient Israel had polygamous emperors or kings for centuries and nobody minded. Society did not collapse. Tywin is the real problem in the picture, and really needed to just take several seats, as did Robert Baratheon. Robert's marriage to Cersei would have been miserable no matter what the circumstances, because he was really in love with Lyanna, and couldn't believe she didn't return his feelings, and because Cersei is a sociopath in love with her brother. Robert would have rubbed her the wrong way soon enough, and she'd have retaliated, and they'd have been enemies. It was inevitable.

She fell in love with Lady Crane's performance as a bereaved mother. Lady Crane embodied The Mother for her, so much so that she actually wept for Cersei, the top name on her kill list. Seconds after she chuckled over Joffrey's death, Arya was moved to tears by "Cersei's" grief over him. It resonated so powerfully with her own feelings of loss, and her own longing for a mother, that she was unable to complete her assignment and kill Lady Crane, even though she understood that the actress and the character are separate things. Arya grew immeasurably just by watching a play. I would still not bet on her to be other than misogynistic about women and girls in general. She finds them useless and stupid, and derives most of her self-esteem from being "different from other girls."

It is a low bar, but once the war broke out that was a game changer. Rhaegar probably meant for there to be a maester. He undoubtedly did not mean to imprison Lyanna indefinitely, but rather kept her in the tower to keep her safe until the war's end. His victory would probably have meant that a maester was present at the birth, among other things.

Not necessarily. She might have assumed that he'd be accompanied by Robert, her jilted fiance, and that upon winning, Ned would try to force her to wed Robert, or that Robert would put a sword through Jon, or both. I don't think she or Rhaegar had any idea that she'd die in childbirth. They probably thought they'd have plenty of time to fix things and set the records straight, later.

She's a misogynist. She believes that MOST girls are stupid. It's not something she heard from other girls, it's what she actually feels about them, just like Cersei at her age. The misogyny is part of the darkness. It's funny: when she finally met a girl as tough as herself, and as "nonstupid," she hated her, too, and ended up killing her. And we are glad she did. Even misogynists love mothers who nurture them. Arya likes Catelyn, and she likes Lady Crane, because she needs a Mom. She lost hers far too soon. This is something she has in common with Cersei, who was about the same age as Arya when she lost her mother.

It's too late for a divorce. Sansa is Ramsey Bolton's widow, for good or for ill. Lady Mormont is ten. She's got a child's black and white way of thinking, and is most likely a female misogynist like Arya and Cersei. "Girls are stupid," seems to be the general consensus in the North, and not just Arya's childlike dismissal of her sister.

I'm hoping it's a flashback of some kind, and we're going to find out why there must always be a Stark in Winterfell.

He did have that power, but he didn't want to use up any good will he had with her, on that particular move when he could just as easily talk her into it. It's only when he can't talk her into it, that he will actually use force. Sansa consented to the marriage with Ramsey of her own free will, but that doesn't mean that no one can ever force her to marry anyone. She consented to the marriage with Tyrion, too, if it comes right down to it.

Sansa was willing to kill herself to avoid the rape, torture, and slow dismemberment that she knew would be her fate with Ramsey. It wasn't simply a matter of not wishing to marry against her will, but also that there were absolutely no compensations or comfort to life with Ramsey. That doesn't mean she's willing to kill herself to avoid any bridegroom at all. It meant she'd kill herself to avoid being flayed, fed to the dogs, or slowly dismembered and fed one tiny piece at a time to the dogs, while being raped daily. She knew that whatever awaited her on returning to Ramsey would be worse than anything that had happened previously. He would want to punish her for trying to escape.

Exactly. Lyssa was supposed to marry Jaime Lannister, except he went and joined the King's Guard and she got pregnant by Baelish. Jon Arryn, Lord of the Vale, was actually quite a catch, old as he was. He was still a dynastic marriage, with no heirs to take precedence over Lyssa's children.

^^^Exactly! Sansa had the Vale army for a minute, but it is really her cousin's, and under Littlefinger's command, and now all of the Northmen pledged themselves to Jon, so Sansa really has nothing. If Jon marries anyone other than Sansa, then Sansa is no longer the Lady of Winterfell. That's one reason I am NOT rooting for Jon to marry Lady Mormont. I think being her sister-in-law would be hell on earth, especially for a girl like Sansa. The reason Lyssa and Lady Mormont are free, is that they have no uncles left. Sansa has two: Edmure, and Littlefinger. Littlefinger will always try to use Sansa to improve his position, because he will use all of his resources. So even if Jon and Bran both died, Sansa would still have to deal with Littlefinger. The only think keeping Littlefinger from selling Sansa to another high bidder is that he wants her for himself, but if she gives him a final, definite no, she can expect to be sold to whichever ally can get Baelish to the Iron Throne fastest. If Littlefinger, Jon Snow, and Bran all died, Edmure could still marry Sansa to someone, and he's got troops and the law on his side. She'd have to do it. If Sansa's lucky (and what are the odds of that?) Littlefinger and Sweetrobin will croak, leaving her the Vale, and Edmure, Rosalin, and their baby will be eaten by a dragon or something, leaving Sansa also the Lady of Riverrun before Edmure realizes he's got a pawn he can play. Otherwise I'm afraid Sansa may opt for Littlefinger simply to keep him placated, only to discover too late that she's made a fatal error. I don't think he loves her so much that he wouldn't swap her out for Cersei in a heartbeat if it'd get him the throne.