Dani-Ellie

The Sandy Duncan version of this production is the Peter Pan I grew up with. It'll be a neat bit of nostalgia, anyway!

Yeah, I think it's a little different sharing pictures of a celebrity couple at events and such and being all, "Aww!" (I fully admit that I was totally like that with Felicity Huffman and William H. Macy in the Sports Night/early Desperate Housewives era. Still kind of am, actually.) Making stuff up about the celebrities' significant others to fulfill some fantasy of "they're playing a couple on TV/in the movies, they must really be one!" is squicky to me. (As is real-person fic/shipping. For me, it's one thing to play around with and make up stories about fictional characters. It's another thing entirely to make up stories about real people who actually exist in the time they exist (because I totally get that most of the stories about historical figures stories are more legend than truth) and have them like, hooking up with each other. I just ... why can't they do that with the characters? Or, in the case of the One Direction guys, make up a story about a boy band and hook up the two One-Direction-guy analogues?)

Maybe I'm just being dense, but ... so? (The complaint, not your point.) The list isn't "the ship with the most reblogged unique content." It's "the most reblogged ship." Reblogs of previously reblogged content is still a reblog, yes?

Because Operation Mongoose. *rolls eyes*

For like, four seconds at the beginning of the episode after Regina inexplicably decided Henry was safer with her than with the parent who is immune to the coming curse. Oh, and Regina hurried them along, too. Not that I'm bitter or anything.

Eh, I give them a pass on that. Calling out for help when one is trapped is kind of a natural thing to do, regardless of whether or not it's feasible for people to hear you.

Right, but even that wasn't addressed onscreen. It was just information dump, let's move on. They found time in the next episode to have Snow angry at Charming over his secret, but there wasn't even an exchange between Snow and Emma about the Echo Cave afterward, even if was something as simple as, "Are you okay?" "Yeah." At least give us some insight as to whether they're both actually okay or if they're both just putting up fronts. Because like you said, Emma hides her feelings. Completely agree. That's one of my biggest complaints: if they're placing all the blame at Emma's feet -- Snow couldn't connect with her because she wouldn't allow her to -- I need to see Snow stepping up to the plate now that the "roadblock" is gone.

For me, "emotional pay-off" is delving into the issues the story creates. I'll use the Echo Cave to illustrate my point, because for me, it's one of the most egregious. We have a situation where the characters have to reveal their darkest secrets. The point of the Echo Cave was to tear the group apart ... let their secrets destroy their relationships. Snow admits in front of her daughter that her relationship with her is, essentially, not fulfilling her desire to be a mother. The camera pans to Emma's heartbroken face. And that's the last we hear of it. What would have been emotional pay-off for was for the characters to get into the consequences of that revelation. How does that affect how Emma sees her mother? How does that affect how Snow sees Emma? What does Charming think about what his wife said? What does Hook think about it? Do Emma and Snow talk about it, how it made each of them feel? Do they discuss it at all or do they both just bury it again? If they both just bury it again, is their relationship the same as it was before the revelation? Can it ever be? I felt like it was treated as more of a plot checkmark than a plot point. It just feels like it was brought up to introduce the idea of baby Snowflake but the emotional consequences of the secret and how it was revealed and what it all would mean going forward were never addressed. Which is especially annoying, considering the fact that these secrets were supposed to mess up the groups' relationships was the whole point of this particular plot contrivance.

I think this is one of those situations where everyone's right. Of course as a viewer, using a curse every eleven or episodes is boring. It's like, there are other storytelling tactics, guys, let's change things up a bit. But Jen has a point, too, especially when it's taken in concert with one of Emma's recent through-lines: learning how to live your life despite the challenges. Fairy tales are allegories because stories are allegories, using Fantasy Situation X to stand in for Life Situation Y. People's lives obviously don't include witches and curses, but they do include things that happen that are beyond our control, and we have to figure out how to deal with those things and still live our lives in the meantime. That was the sentiment behind Charming's "moments" speech: learning to hold onto what you have when everything around you is trying to take it from you. Finding the strength to not give up even when the obstacles seem insurmountable. Learning how to appreciate and enjoy and cherish the good even when the bad seems to outweigh it. It's a sentiment I've seen more than a few times in fantasy shows. Early Edition did it when Gary found a trunk belonging to the man who had the newspaper before him. Gary was expecting the trunk to give him answers, and all that was inside it was a slip of paper saying, "Live your life." Disappointing, obviously, for Gary in the immediate sense, but the sentiment was that he still needed to find a way to be Gary Hobson and not just Chicago's savior. Medium did it when Allison had a dream that their youngest daughter was going to end up with cancer like, 20 years down the road. She was freaking out, and Joe was trying to convince her that even if it was going to happen, there was nothing they could do about it then and they couldn't spend the next 20 years worrying about it: "Otherwise there is no life. There's just waiting to die." I happened to rewatch that Medium episode when my previous job was having financial trouble and we were afraid of losing our jobs. That quote was a comfort to me, even if the situations weren't similar, because the sentiment still applied. I couldn't spend my days and nights freaking out. I could have a plan in place in case the worst happened, of course, but what was going to happen was going to happen, and there was nothing I could do about it. So, yeah, as storytellers, it would help if the higher-ups changed things up from time to time and used a different storytelling device, but at the same, in life there is always another "curse" waiting around the bend.

Urgh, this is hard because I want to stay on topic, but I also don't want to drag this into another thread for fear of spoiling you. It's precisely Emma's real-world problems that have garnered my sympathy. In other threads, I've mentioned that my nephew was well on his way to becoming wee Emma before my brother and sister-in-law took custody of him. Kids know when they're not wanted, and they know from a very young age. It's heart-breaking to have a two-year-old say to you, "I don't want to go back to Mommy's house" because he thought we were bringing him home and he didn't want to give up the attention we gave him. It's heartbreaking to hear of a four-year-old whose Mom hung up on him with the promise of calling him back and never did, and the four-year-old turning to my brother and sister-in-law and saying, "I guess she doesn't want me." Emma spent 28 years believing her parents cared so little about her that they tossed her little newborn self along the side of the road like a piece of garbage instead of leaving her somewhere safe. All those little-kid things that make kids feel safe and secure, things like crawling into bed with someone after having a nightmare or having someone sit with you when you're sick or having someone take you out or make a special dinner to celebrate a good report card? She got none of it. If she'd shown any affinity for the arts, who would have sent her to music lessons or dance classes or art classes to nurture her talent? Who would have enrolled her in extra-curricular sports if she'd been athletic? All those things cost money, money foster homes already strapped for cash wouldn't have to spend on every child. If she'd shown book smarts, who would have helped her and encouraged her to challenge herself? If she was bounced around a lot, it's not even like she'd necessarily have a special teacher or school official looking out for her, because she might not have been in the same school from one year to the next. She was very much a little girl lost, falling through the cracks of an overburdened system. Jennifer Morrison has said that she plays Emma as if there was abuse in her past, so there's that to consider as well. And like Mari said, the fact that the show hasn't shown us any of this is such a disservice to the character. If Emma can pick herself up by her bootstraps and make something of her life and not turn out to be an evil murderer, there's no reason for me why any of the other characters couldn't, either. I frankly don't care how rough Regina had it. It doesn't excuse what she's done. It doesn't excuse trying to kidnap a little boy. It doesn't excuse separating that little boy from his father. It doesn't excuse her control and murder of Graham. Those are all choices she made because she was hurt. She's very much like a toddler who lashes out at the world to make everyone else as miserable as she is, because if she can't be happy, then no one can. She needs to find a healthier way to handle life's disappointments and challenges because they're always going to be there, and the answer can't be "kill challenger, problem solved."

This. For me, no one on this show has had a sadder upbringing than Emma (even if it's in implication only ... having no support system whatsoever and no place to belong is absolutely brutal on a child), and she's proof to me that evil isn't inevitable. Emma's walked the same path as these villains and has not chosen darkness. So for me, it's like, get over yourselves, villains. I'm not averse to seeing Regina achieve her happily ever after, but I would at least like to see some recognition from her that her path was wrong and actual attempts at atonement that don't get overturned the second things don't go her way. Without that atonement and recognition, I feel like Regina achieving her happily ever after is rewarding villainy. Because yes, you can steamroll over anyone you want because your life sucks and that'll make it better.

I'm going with 4A, because all the Emma screentime and Captain Swan development is making me giddy. Plus, I'm really surprised by how much I adore the Frozen gang, considering hadn't seen it at all when the season started and I've still yet to see it in its entirety. The Outlaw Queen/Operation Mongoose stuff is, of course, rage-inducing, but it's being sidelined so much by the A-plots that I can easily ignore it. Which means I am fearing 4B, where I'm betting it's going to be front and center. ;)

Once for me is frustrating because this show could be so. damn. good if it had a better writing team. Or perhaps not necessarily a better writing team, because I do think the individual scripts are good ... the one-liners are funny, the emotional gut-punches work, etc ... but a better (or perhaps more experienced?) set of showrunners. Because it's the overarching stuff where it all falls apart for me. If the show would just slow down for five damn seconds and allow the characters to actually react to what's going on around them. If it wasn't so much about getting from Point A to Point B to Point C as quickly as possible. If the natural consequences of the story were given their due instead of swept under the rug. There is so much potential in this show. The idea is fantastic, the cast is -- pardon the pun -- magical together, the plots are interesting. It's just the execution leaves so much to be desired. The setup of this show came ready-made with all these little emotional gold mines to explore, the Chaming Family being the biggest one for me. How these three people learn to be parents and adult child when they're the same age, how they learn to heal the wounds of the past enough to move forward in the present and future. Or Henry/Regina ... how does Henry feel about his mother really being the Evil Queen? How does a reforming Regina feel about how her actions affected her son? How does Henry feel about his mother trying to kill his entire family? Or even Emma/Henry ... does Henry really understand Emma's giving him up? Does he resent her the tiniest little bit? Let's get into all of this, show, because that's where the real drama is. I don't need a new threat every eleven episodes to keep me interested. Emotional payoff of previous plot points is just as important as driving the story forward.

As I was going back and forth in my discussion email with my friend (while I'm supposed to be working ... shh ;)), I suddenly remembered how much I loved Anna finding out Emma is Snow's and Charming's daughter. I'm assuming Emma explained it to Elsa off-camera (maybe in the ice cave?) because she didn't seem to question this young guy being Emma's father, but Anna's reaction was priceless. ETA: Hans was frozen, too, though. I don't remember if his brothers were frozen with him.

Okay, seriously, show, you can stop f-ing with my emotions at any time now. Going from Anna's still delightfully amusing dialogue to the tearful goodbyes at the end is not okay. (By which I mean it is totally okay, but holy crap, show.) Pretty much, a surefire way to get me to cry is for Emma to start with the waterworks. Once she starts, I'm there sniffling along with her. "I'm not a tearful goodbye person ... okay, maybe just this once" killed me. And she totally knows something's up. Although, Emma, pumpkin, you might want to start checking the pouches when you're trying to convince someone to give you something they don't want to give up. ;) I loved the flash sideways just as much here as when they've done it before. And Regina? Want to tell me again why Henry is safer with you than with someone who is immune to the coming curse that is going to bring out your worst selves, which means you know you're going to totally go all Evil Queen again? Also, on a shallow note: I have an issue with eye effects. Anything that makes a human eye look less than normal freaks me the hell out. (Which, yes, means I have a ton of fun as a Supernatural fan.) Once has been really, really good with not doing a lot of eye effects, but the shattered sight curse cracking people's eyes? Gah!

I thought "If I'd known [who you were], I wouldn't have gone near you" was cruel. Maybe not necessarily in and of itself, but when you consider that Emma grew up as a child who was always used but never wanted and this guy was promising her everything she'd never had, to have him say to her, basically, he wouldn't have touched her with a ten-foot pole if he'd known from the jump she was from the Enchanted Forest? Once again, there's Emma, never wanted, only this time, it was coming from someone she actually cared about and even loved, at one point in time. That's gotta hurt.

Exactly. I could have possibly turned my feelings around on him, too, if he'd owned his mistake instead of couching it in all this "I had to do it for your own good" nonsense. Because I'm sorry, but I can in no way see getting a 17-year-old girl sent to prison and never contacting her again as good for her.

Honestly, I pretty much hated Neal by the end of "Tallahassee" (because to me Neal is just as culpable in the plot to send Emma to prison as August was, so no, I'm not forgiving him for that) but I just could not with him after "If I'd known who you were, I never would have gone near you." Dude, that was cold, and it was cruel. Maybe I'm holding him to a high standard, but this is a show about fairy tales and true love, so yeah, I'm going to be judging what I see based on that. And what Neal did? Is not true love. I understand he has issues with his father, I really do, but that's not enough of an excuse for what he did for me. If he was afraid Emma was going to lead him to his father, there were easier, better, less hurtful options than dumping her in jail. Because let's look at this from Emma's perspective for a second. Here's this guy who's promising to make a home with her -- her first one ever. Here's this guy who's promising to be her family -- her first one ever. He lets her keep one of the stolen watches, seemingly out of graciousness. He's the only one who knows where they're supposed to meet after he fences the watches. Then he's late, she tries to call him and his phone's disconnected, and out of nowhere, a cop shows up. The cop tells her that her boyfriend turned her in. So, here's 17-year-old Emma assuming Neal completely played her. And for eleven years, she believed that Neal never loved her, he just needed a patsy. And then for Emma to find out that he essentially took the word of some dude he'd just met five minutes before to send her to jail? That's just adding insult to injury. "If I'd known who you were, I never would have gone near you" is salt in the wound. All that added up to me as Emma herself wasn't enough for him, and I'm sorry, but no. This is where I think it would have helped to have just thrown August completely under the bus. Have him lie right to Neal's face and tell him that Emma's life is in danger if he doesn't leave her. Neal takes off, August finds Emma and turns her in to the police. That way, they still get pregnant Emma in jail but 1) Neal isn't complicit at all, and 2) Neal's reason for leaving and never contacting her is more noble, because he believes he's saving her life by staying away.

So, every year after I put up my Christmas tree and decorate, I throw cheesy Christmas movies into my DVD player. Imagine my surprise when I threw in Samantha: An American Girl Holiday with AnnaSophia Robb (hush, Samantha was the best Americal Girl ;)) and discovered that Rebecca Mader is Aunt Cornelia! Now I totally need the crossover fic where Zelena's time portal works and sends her not to the Enchanted Forest of the past but to 1904 New York, where she meets and marries Frankie Rizzoli and they end up adopting four little girls. *nods*

Happy Thanksgiving! Just got home from my aunt's, where my spinach dip was once again a massive hit and I won a round of Left Center Right and got $39 out of the deal. (We play with dollar bills rather than the little chips the game comes with ... makes it more fun ;)). And then we also played Taboo and like, I really needed to be playing with you guys because I could have done SO MANY THINGS with Once clues but no one in my family would have gotten them. It was hard, haha.

Oh, absolutely. This goes back to the discussion we had a couple months back regarding differences of opinion. The actresses have their own opinions based on what they believe is best for their characters, and just as the fans may want to wave their SQ/OQ/CS/XYZ flag in the air, the actresses should be able to as well without the fans jumping down their throats. Fans can still ship Ship X even if the actors involved don't because frankly, the actors' opinions are just that ... opinions. Even still, I simply do not understand why these fans continually harp about being "ignored" in interviews about canon material. I don't understand what is so hard to grasp about Emma and Regina not being a couple on the actual show, especially now that both of them are in relationships with other people on the actual show. I mean, I'm all for crack ships and subtext ships but by their very nature, they do not trump what is being shown every Sunday night. Interviews for outfits like TV Guide and Entertainment Weekly and TV Line or even the talk shows are not going to address non-canon material because interviews are, by and large, advertisements for the show. So yeah, they're going to talk about what's actually happening onscreen.

I still don't understand what's so hard to grasp about canon vs. non-canon. Of course Lana is going to be promoting Outlaw Queen in interviews. That's the storyline her character is involved in. I mean, what, do they think she can say, "Oh, I don't know, maybe Robin's just a stepping stone in Regina's development"? Like that wouldn't get her into all kinds of trouble. Much like when people were slamming Jen re: Captain Swan, I have zero idea what the hell these fans expect the actresses to do when it comes to questions about their canon material.

I've long said that Emma's death would be the dealbreaker for me (as in, "That's it, I can't with this show without her") but I'm getting there with Hook, too. Not for Hook himself, I don't think, but for Emma. Killing another one of Emma's love interests after building them up like this (because I honestly believe "Tallahassee" was a chemistry test, and the writing was on the wall there ... so we're talking two full seasons' worth of teasing and buildup, here) and getting her to the point where she's this happy would just be entirely too cruel for me. This is a little fairy tale show. It's not Game of Thrones. I don't want bleakness, I want "And They All Lived Happily Ever After." By all means, throw as much fairy tale danger at them as you want, but they better come through the other side intact. Basically, if they're giving me this much Captain Swan, it better not end with one of their deaths, because I will just be done.

I'm the same way, but with Emma! I adore seeing Emma happy, and if Hook's the one who makes her happy, I'm all for it. :)

Happy birthday, Medival Girl!