Gwen-Stacys

He was going to have sex with Heather in episode 2 in season 3 B at the drop of a hat. IDK some people just aren't that hung up on their first time despite just...getting it over with. Stiles has always come off as an open sort of character to me, but....then again this isn't his thread. His comment was in reference to filming it in it's entirety, he never said that they didn't have sex just that he didn't want to film it.

Okay, not to pick on you or anything because I've seen a lot of people doing it, can we not say what Malia should or shouldn't be doing? One, she was cut off from human contact when she was 8 years old, not 1. That means that she had 8 previous years of human interaction, cues, and speech to fall back on. That means that her "rehabilitation" would not be as stunted as people keep saying it "should" be. Another important thing to note with human rehabilitation, the longer a child had social interaction before being thrust into solitude, the quicker/easier it is for them to re-learn how to be human/be around others. Malia's main problem right now is that she has very non-human instincts which they highlighted. Lastly, anyone who works in rehabilitation (I have a few friends who do or have family members that have had to go through it because of strokes and etc.) will tell you that time is all relative to the person. Meaning there is no such thing as "too fast" or "too slow". Everyone develops, or redevelops, at their own pace. And even though Kira has been out and about in the world her whole life and seen other people dance, it doesn't mean she knows how to dance. Or how to dance with other people. In the Rave episode in 3B, you never once see her dancing or looking comfortable in that surrounding. Maybe she's an awkward partier...I've got one friend like that irl and we all Malia her when we go out. On top of that, Malia is in more of I "I have to blend in" mind sight than Kira is as she's been trying to "blend in" with humans for a few months at this point. All in all, I liked this episode. There were some fun moments, some creepy moments, and a few that lagged. Oh! And I loved how Scott didn't want to leave without Stiles. But Imma need 25-50 year old Derek to come back soon, thank you very much. I'm not sure if we're allowed to talk about the "coming up this season" previews in her...so I'll just leave it at that.

I thought the actual quote said that he didn't want to film the scene (which awkward...seeing as how Shelley and Brit Robertson are friends) but that they did have sex. He didn't see the point in it having to be a full scene (a la Derek and Jennifer) and it just cut to them cuddling afterwards.

I agree with you on this point! Maybe it's because I know people who hook up on the regular (and sometimes in the strangest places), but I didn't really find her and Stiles' hookup that off the cuff. They already set the precedent for Stiles being more than okay with losing his virginity and it not having to be super special, and that's okay. He and Malia did share something in that basement. He opened up to her, not just about what was going on with him, but how he felt about. She offered no judgment. He probably felt safe with her in that moment and in that situation, and she wanted to do it. /kanye shrug And I'm not too nervous about her just being a LI. Her character already has more connections to established characters on the show (Peter, Derek, etc). She came in with her own storyline and will probably (as in should) help provide more insight into the Hale family/shape shifter lore as it pertains to this show. We still don't know why Talia took the memory of Malia from Peter. Was he a part of her life? What's the deal with her mother and how much did she know about the Hale family? Was she a Dany (someone who knew about the supernatural but chose to stay out of it)? Why did Malia shift into a coyote and not a wolf? Did that have to do with her mother as well? Why was she able to shift completely (Something we've only seen shifters in the Hale family do and were told that it is actually very rare? Peter wasn't really a full wolf, he was a monster. Malia was a full on coyote, same way Talia was a full on wolf). Now, do I think Jeff and co will handle her story in that capacity? Nah. But I'm just pointing out that the potential for her character is there

I think a lot of people automatically jump to the conclusion of shipper bias because 8 times out of 10 it is shipper bias when it comes to Malia (on tumblr, at least). From what I've seen and read so far, Malia's story isn't being written any worse than anyone else's so far. Watching Teen Wolf over the years, I've kind of accepted the fact that this isn't (really) "quality" television in that their won't be dropped plotlines, plotlines that make me side-eye my tv, or characters suddenly getting pushed to the forefront *cough*thetwins*cough. I'll take the rest of my thoughts on Malia and her storyline to her thread. Maybe Shelley's getting a lot of mention/media attention because Jeff and Co are happy to have her. Of the younger actors on the show, doesn't she have the most non-fan voted accolades? She is a pretty decent actress (her and JPK were the best things acting wise on TSC) and she has years of good will built up with me (my babysitter and my grandmother were huge Days of Our Lives fans). I'm more than willing to give her and Malia a chance.

It was a lame reference to her comment about running from cougars trying to eat her in the season 3B finale. I couldn't think of anything else to put :( But so far, I like what we've seen from the character. And everything they've released about her for season 4 leans more towards the

Peter's secret daughter's already got that Hale attitude. All she needs is a leather jacket.

Well, we don't really know if Shane/Liam ever talked after him spilling the beans about Karma/Amy faking it. And like another poster said somewhere upthread, why would he leave? He's at a wedding where there's free alcohol and nobody's carding him. When we see him later (after he chugged a bottle of champaigne/wine...which gives me a headache just thinking about it) he's chilling on a gate outside the wedding. Maybe he called a cab and was waiting? (How else would he and Amy get back to her room for hate sex?). Maybe Shane told him to wait for him there? Maybe Pablo was in charge of driving Lauren home (most Bride/Grooms...Groom/Groom....Bride/Bride leave weddings on their own) and LaLa and Shay-shay can't be in the same car right now because of the pills thing? They never explicitly say why he's still there, but they have shown that he's not an intentionally malicious person, contrary to fandom oppinion. Maybe he was waiting for Amy so he could appologize -one of the reasons he tried to break things off with Karma originally was because of Amy. He even asks repetedly if Amy knows about Karma and his relationship. It's not out of the realm of what the show set up that he feels guilty and remorsful as well as angry and incredibly hurt. But all of that went out of the window as soon as he saw her and how pissed off she was and it fed into the anger he already felt (misery loves company). One thing I have a problem with is....how far away is the reception hall from Amy's home? Like...is it in their Residential Community Hall thing? Or someone not that far of a drive? It confused me how fast people (Amy and Karma) went back and forth. You just made me choke/laugh on my pistacios

I may be in the minority, but I was fine with the last 15 seconds happening. It made sense in the context of both characters, Amy especially. The show has done a good job of establishing the fact that Amy is distructive when hurt or angry. She doesn't think her actions through she just...reacts. She lashes out to hurt the person who hurt her, and Liam....just happened to be there. And to the person wondering why he was still there at the end, well...he rode to the wedding with his best friend, Shane, who's still inside making out with his new boo-thang. Not the mention...he's just as drunk as Amy, if not drunker (I mean, at least she had cake with her champaigne!). All in all, I really enjoyed the first season of Faking it and I can't wait until season 2!

Thank you for the welcome! And thank you for having a discussion with me vs an argument (I mean it. I really really appreciate it). Oh I agree the writing has been a bit shoddy for characters all over the show. Diggle has a motive/life outside of Oliver, but with Felicity she's been demoted to Ollie's cheerleader?! Please do better show! I need more female characters who's stories and lives aren't male love interest focused like Thea's and Sara's. Both have issues and story lines that go outside their romantic prospects. I would love that for Laurel (she had it in season 1 when she was focused on fighting for people who didn't have the means to fight for themselves.) as well as Felicity. Now, to the person who said that Laurel doesn't know what Sara's been through (idk how to quote you.....), Laurel says much of the same. I think the writers could have done a better job with what she had to say about Sara's alias being The Canary. Canaries, in a sense, could be seen as protectors. From Wikepedia "Canaries were once regularly used in coal mining as an early warning system.[9] Toxic gases such as carbon monoxide, methane or carbon dioxide in the mine would kill the bird before affecting the miners. Signs of distress from the bird indicated to the miners that conditions were unsafe." It would've been more poignant if she'd said something to that effect instead of focusing on their beauty. But that's on the writers, not Laurel or KC.

Maybe pandering has become overused in recent years, but that's because it's become increasingly easier to pander to the more vocal portion of a viewing audience. Now, I say vocal because out of the 2 mil + (idk if Arrow still avg that many viewers PV, so I'm guestimating), I seriously doubt a majority of them are consistently active in online fandoms. But I'm careful to assume that just because I see majority of those online proclaiming one way means that they speak for the majority of viewers as a whole. Like Sterek in TW. Most viewers don't know what the f*ck a Sterek is, but if you peruse tumblr, you'd assume everyone who watched TW was all for Sterek. So to answer your question, yes putting two characters together just because a portion of your audience likes them together is pandering as defined. Pandering is the entertainment equivalent to people pleasing. Arrow had pretty good ratings (for a CW show) during it's first season, even when it was Felicity-light. So...

Oh I know! I see them on Tumblr too (and irl. All my brothers watch this show, and few of my friends. Mostly guys....and they're all in the "If Sara dies, I quit this bitch" camp. But they don't mind Laurel.) And thank you for the welcome!! I really appreciate it. Not intimidating at all. I stalked these forums for a bit before I decided to join and I've enjoyed most of your posts that I see. I've never really done the forum...thing. So, newbie in that regard as well. I apologize in advance if I make mistakes! I see pandering as having one character do something that could be done by another and still have the same basic effect because of the thought of it making a certain group of people happy. Kind of like when a white politician goes into a predominately Black/Hispanic/Asian community and harps on the issues they know most interest them while trying to give off the "I'm just one of you" vibe. Basically, pandering for votes. In TVD, the writers all but admitted that they put Damon and Elena together for the Delena fans, not to better/further the story. Or how in HP they gave a number of Ron Weasley's book lines to movie Hermione because the movie audience liked her more than they liked Ron. And so on and so on. So the same as your views, I guess? Because I agreed with most of your examples. The Oliver carrying Felicity was one of mine, as well. It made zero sense character or story wise. My other examples were the zoom ins on the little touches. None of those touches were romantic, IMHO. Oliver touches his sister the same way he touches Felicity. The zoom ins would only be pertinent if Ollie wasn't a the touchy-feely type (and that isn't the case) or if they were symbolic. For example, Smallville episode 9x03 when Lois goes in to punch Clark's arm (a playful "bro-punch" thing she's done to him since she first came on the screen) and Clark grabs her wrist before she could. That was meant to symbolize them moving from a friendship/partnership to a romance/partnership. Am I making sense? As a hetero-female, I'd like there to be more pandering to my love of Summer Glau's hair, thank you very much.

I didn't realize a leading lady was meant to act a certain way. You mean like quirky and bubbly? I disagree. Their are plenty of leading ladies -in books and TV- who aren't conventional or overly likable. I think that's very realistic. She's going through a lot (e.g. Tommy's death which she blames on herself; the man she wanted to spend her life with comes back after he swanned off with her sister -an act that ultimately cost her sister her life; said sister coming back from the dead and Joker-in-a-nurse's-uniforming her (i.e. Hi.....)) and she spent the season trying to find a way to deal. There were a lot of emotions and feelings that I don't think Laurel felt like she had a right to feel or were wrong of her to feel in light of everything (betrayal, anger, guilt, etc). In response, she buried them. When they came bubbling up to the surface, she used alcohol and pills to bury them even further. Her recovery as an addict had to do with her owning up to her feelings and working through them. Of course she'd be erratic! Most addicts (recovering or otherwise) are. They're unpredictable and they're frustrating (for the people that care about them). I thought her arch this season was very realistic (if not a bit rushed). She ended this season forgiving the two people who turned her world upside down -Oliver and Sara. Now, is Laurel my favorite character? No, not at all. Sara is. Followed by Thea, Oliver, and Diggle in that order. But I ptsd from all the Lois Lane hate from the early Smallville fandom, as well as a thing for defending characters who get so much hate....Laurel's thread is full of hate...and it has so many posts in it. It reminds me of the way people (who didn't read the books) hate Sans and blame her for a lot of the bad things that happened to her family. I guess I just. Don't. Get it. You'd be surprised how much a word from an older sister can do for a younger sister. Sara's been feeling guilty about a lot and to have Laurel basically end the episode being proud of her.....that probably meant more than anything Oliver, Dt. Lance, etc could have said to her. Now that Laurel has her back, Sara has her family back. She has their approval, their love, and their support. And the fact that it doesn't matter to her big sister what she's done..../shrugs

It might just be me (and my brothers who I watch this with), but that's all started to come off as pandering to me. And maybe because of other fandoms (e.g. Teen Wolf and TVD), I am very wary of fan pandering and assuming that the loudest/most vocal fans =the majority of the viewership. They don't. Please, for the love of cheesecake, stop with the zoom ins of Ollie touching Felicity! They did that 3 separate times in this episode alone. Not to say I'm majority viewership, but I like Laurel (I ship Ollie with familial happiness before I ship him with some chick. He has too many personal things to work on. Not a fan of Lauliver or Olicity.) and I like her story line this episode and the rest of the season. I agree it was very sped up, but this is a CW show, not network, cable, or premium TV a la Game of Thrones. I think OP asked about the Laurel hate because it is visceral and omni-oppressive. And it's a little...off putting. Especially for a newbie (my last post was my first. Hi everyone! =D ) Back to this episode, I thought Laurel was more like season 1 Laurel than she has in a while. She was off doing her own thing and worrying about her family while The Arrow crew was taking the scenic route through the city. I liked that. And I loved the way Sara lit up when she felt like she had both Laurel's and her father's approval. Add me to the list of people who doesn't think Thea shot Merlin but someone behind him. As well as the list of people who will be pissed if Sara dies next episode. There were anvils, but idk if it's about her dying or her staying on to be The Canary. I mean, Nyssa Raatko's SL is kind of different from her comic one...but then again, she is more Batman than Green Arrow, so who really knows.

I too don't understand the outright hatred for Laurel's character. I found her journey from season 1 to now to be the most interesting. It made sense that she gave the pep-talk to Sarah and Oliver since both, in a way, have wronged her. But even so SHE sees how much they've changed and how much good they have/will do. Didn't enjoy Felicity giving a speech almost as identical to the one that she gave last episode. I wish Diggle had said it. Between his two side kicks, Ollie is more open with Diggle so to be it would have made sense for him to give the "you're a hero and I believe in you" speech. All in all, I loved this episode. From Team Arrow, to Team Lance, to Thea and Merlin. Is it next Wednesday yet?!