PhilMarlowe2

Because I am a nerd, I always pay attention to what the women are wearing in the different clips during the preview so I knew that 1) Vicki and Tamra would fight at this event and 2) Lydia and Shannon would fight at this event. They're all wearing the same outfits they're wearing during the volleyball match and the setting is clearly Kelly's house.

Oh, that is interesting - I've caught myself thinking that her implants are way too big in the past few episodes, but it's probably a result of what you're describing. Sorry for judging, Meghan!

Hmm, so are they dragging this party out over two episodes? I noticed from the previews that a lot of fighting goes down at this event, but it's not mentioned in the episode description...

How does Brandi earn money these days?

I am pretty much the same age as you, and yes I text a lot too, but I still wouldn't send someone an out-of-the-blue text like, "Hey girl, you fucking around?" And I would definitely be like wtf? if someone texted me something like that. But I often find Meghan to be a very odd duck (for example, not telling Shannon all of their cast members were in a terrible car accident until after playing a few rounds of golf), so MMV!

I don't know, we have seen Shannon literally point to her stomach and say, "This is stress - and stress is Vicki Gunvalson!" That sounds a lot like blaming Vicki for her weight gain to me. If Shannon had, at any point, said something like, "I let Vicki's comments get to me and it became an excuse to eat too much," or "I didn't know how to healthily cope with my anger towards Vicki," then I could give her a pass because those statements show some sort of awareness that she is ultimately responsible for her weight gain. Shannon's anger is her anger. Shannon's response to her anger is her response to her anger. As David pointed out, Vicki's "allegation" (ugh, when can we retire that word?) didn't bother him and didn't stop him from working out. Shannon can point fingers at Vicki all she wants, but none of us can control the world around us - the only thing we can "control" is how we choose to interface with what the world throws at us. I have not seen Shannon really take full responsibility for her choices. She seems to live under the pretense of, "If Vicki hadn't made the allegation, none of this would have happened," and that's not self-responsibility, IMO, it's blame. But why would you ever broach such a sensitive issue in a casual text? I mean, if I really felt the need to ask my good friend about whether or not they were cheating, I wouldn't just lob them a text like, "Hey you, heard on twitter you're stepping out on your husband - yes or no?" And a lot of this speaks to Meghan's intention behind asking the question - was she legit concerned for Kelly? Or was she just being messy? It sounds like she was being messy. Kelly's stated marital difficulties only make it all the more the reason why Meghan may have wanted to be a bit more delicate or respectful. I mean, we all saw Kelly openly crying about her marriage at the spa day last season. Does it really make sense to ping someone, "Hey, you fucking around? Just curious! LOL!"

In the Season 8 finale, when Ryan raged at Lydia's mom, Billy made some telling comments. I forget the exact words, but something like, "I am so sick of this" or "You always do this" - something that made it clear that this was not an isolated incident in the Gunvalson household.

This is not new behavior from Shannon. According to Heather, Shannon spent the whole plane trip back from Bali in Season 9 urging Vicki not to make up with Tamra. And she was also seen urgently whispering in Lizzie's ear at the start of Season 10 about how Vicki and Tamra were holding hands and on the road to mending fences. Shannon holds a grudge and colludes like nobodys business. It's part of why I can't take her fury at Vicki seriously. She has had a target every season she has been on the show - the target simply moves. Yesterday's target becomes tomorrow's new best friend.

I don't even like Tamra, but this show is suddenly so much more fun when Vicki and Tamra are on speaking terms... http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-orange-county/season-12/episode-10/videos/vicki-asks-tamra-to-meet-with-her

I was curious to see if Shannon was going to use this heart-to-heart as occasion to continue blaming her marital woes on Vicki... Then answer? Yep! "You're making it seem like I was obsessed." Maybe because you are obsessed?

Forgive me for going off topic, but I have been dying to ask this question, and have no idea where to post it, and since we're discussing different online forums, does anyone what happened to Stoopid Housewives and why it went offline? Speaking of LVP, I'm surprised how different she looks in that video. I would never have recognized her if I didn't already know it was her.

Heather makes me really sad. My sense of her is a deeply insecure woman who has made some pretty steep compromises for the sake of a life that looks very pretty on the outside but has a lot of hollowness on the inside. And, on top of it all, I think she is smart enough to have a sense of the gilded cage that she has created for herself.

Brooks did say her best feature was her vagina....

I wouldn't go so far as to say that I really liked her, but I did find her relatively harmless. And she was someone who could be genuinely kind. Both those things are more than I can say for a lot of the other Housewives. "Vicki no pulley the woody."

Meghan is unbearable. I am still trying to understand how or why it was okay for Meghan to poke Kelly about rumors of her infidelity but somehow it is this huge offense when Kelly then asks her about rumors of Jim's infidelity? Somehow, because Meghan was 7 months pregnant, she is exempt from being held responsible for her initial behavior? And then, months later, Meghan tries to present it as Kelly simply being rude out of the blue? Meghan is just messy. This is why I never liked her in the first place. There are times when she sees things calmly and can be the voice of reason, but there are other times when she is so full of (self-righteous) hot air, it's unbelievable. And then there is Shannon so ready to jump on Kelly's back once again. I don't like Kelly! I don't want to defend her! But this felt like a less toxic version of what happened in Ireland. The flipping texts were right there. Everyone could see that Meghan had a hand in the conflict that went down. But there is defensive, reactive Shannon doing what she always does - knee-jerk defending her alliances - I mean, friends - and jumping on the back of anyone she doesn't like regardless of whether it is aligned with the deeper truth. Why doesn't Shannon apply the same moral fortitude to Meghan? Why doesn't Shannon wag her finger in Meghan's face and say, "Meghan, you don't bring up rumors of infidelity - that hurts too much!" What is so annoying about this is that Shannon experienced Meghan's messiness first hand in Season 10 - she was gas-lit by Meghan over the charity stuff, she was excluded from Meghan's party, she was willing to see how invasive/over-the-line Meghan was in the initial phases of the conflict with Vicki - but, again, because alliances have shifted, Shannon will now defend Meghan as a protective, good friend. I honestly have to say that I think Shannon is the worst. Her self-righteous anger toward anyone she doesn't like, masquerading as moral virtue, is really unattractive. And Meghan was a shit-stirrer this episode. Look, I don't think anyone is going to argue that Vicki has been in the right these past few seasons or that she is in any way "the victim." I think we all know this. But Meghan was not at that lunch to try to understand Vicki's side, and for her to say so was disingenuous. Meghan repeatedly cut Vicki off, immediately refuted everything she said and was basically there as a mouthpiece for Shannon and Tamra. Which would be fine if Meghan owned it. If she had said, "I wanted to have lunch with Vicki to stick up for my friends and make her see the truth," then I'd have no problem with it. But don't pretend to be getting together to better understand someone when you have no intention of even hearing them out. So, then she totally encourages Vicki to talk about the rumors, and even suggests she bring the evidence out, and then runs to tell Shannon about it? Kelly was right when she called Meghan thirsty. Anyhow, if drag bingo is what we can look forward to in a version of this show without Vicki, I am doubling down on my stance that this show needs Vicki. These women have no chemistry together.

Tamra described Heather as "so sensitive" in one recent interview, and continued that none of the women have heard much from her, implying that Heather was hurt over not being asked back and subsequently withdrew from the group. She did seem hopeful they would reconnect soon, but I don't know if that was for show.

Actually, Tamra reconciling with Vicki might be the thing that drives a wedge between Shannon and Tamra, which the petty part of me would love to see!

Shannon, last season, after the accident in Glamis: "If I'm injured, you're not going to find me taking selfies of myself!" Ahem.

Tamra has implied that Heather was sore over not being part of the show this year and retreated from all of them.

The Mirror Has Two Resting Bitch Faces.

For both of their sake, I hope it's earlier. Their marriage really seems dead. Armchair analysis - it's probably time to be grateful for the family they created together, cut their losses and start over as singles.

The waters of RH taglines do not run deep...

Land of Buttermilk Chicken and Honey

Didn't Carole also have a tagline about her own ass?

I was replying to a poster saying she is simply not interesting - obviously, I disagree. I guess it all depends how you define anchor. Personally, I find Vicki to be an anchor of this show because I find her personality to be dynamic, I think she has reality TV screen presence, I think she many different layers, and I think the show would take a hit without her. It's kind of like how many people are now missing Heather in her absence (myself included) - I may not have liked her when she was on the show, but I feel now how crucial she was to the ensemble. Similarly, I don't like Tamra, but I acknowledge that she has certainly been a major engine for the show's interpersonal drama. I think Vicki has that certain je ne sais quoi that is needed for the show to work. I think people like Jill, Ramona, Nene have it - and people like Lizzie, Gretchen and Carole Radziwill don't have it. There are reality stars and reality supporting players. To me, Vicki is one of the stars. Much more so than the other women. The remaining cast feel like all supporting players, with the possible exception of Shannon. So, to me, that is an anchor. I understand others will see it differently. And you have encapsulated so much about what I love about Vicki! I love that she runs this insurance pyramid scheme. I love that she is so clueless about her endorsement deals. Look, I know I am in the minority, but I find her so fascinating because there are so few people like her on TV! Anyhow, being a Vicki apologist is dangerous business, so I think I've said all I have say on the topic...(for now!)