Wayward Son

I would assume not, at least in the case of Misha and Mark, for the simple fact I'd imagine Misha and Mark have negotiated multiple pay rises as they've renewed their contracts. I'm not so sure about Mark Pellegrino because he was only promoted this year.

One of my complaints, as someone who wasn't the biggest fan of Benny throughout season, 8 is this. With the exception of allowing Dean to kill him so Sam could be saved (which happened after Dean's speech about Benny not letting him down); what exactly has Benny done to help Dean that didn't also serve to help Benny? The biggest thing Benny did for Dean IMO was get him out of purgatory, but that also served to get Benny out of purgatory. It wasn't an entirely selfless act. So IMO Benny hadn't had a chance to let Dean down yet. He'd known him give or take a year. Sam has known Dean his whole life. When Benny has known Dean for thirty odd years and never let him down then Dean can talk about a comparison between Benny and Sam being fair IMO.

Taking my reply to the all episodes thread! @auntvi I'm about to edit my post over there with a reply to your post too :)

This is from the Twigs and Twines and Tasha Banes thread in regards to potential complaints about the cast consisting of five white males. I'm not entirely convinced this is still the case with Mark Pellegrino / Lucifer anymore. Back in season 5 he was definitely very popular and well received! However, from what I've seen of fans on here, on Twitter and tumblr, and in comments to articles about the show, most fans now seem to be tired of the character and want him written out. I wouldn't be surprised if his promotion was to keep him tied to the show until they're finished with Lucifer due to Pellegrino's steady stream of work outside the show. IMO if they wanted to promote someone Ruth Connell (Rowena) or Samantha Smith (Mary) would have been smarter choices. Ruth / Rowena seems to be popular with the fans and she has been a pretty regular recurring character for the past three seasons. While they've been using Samantha as a regular in all but name this season so far. For instance she has appeared in more episodes than Misha and the same number as Mark Shepherd. So a promotion for her would have been very natural. @auntvi I'd agree that she has been a regular in all but name this season. Funnily enough I actual mention that in my reply to @Idahoforspn above! However, she is still officially credited as a guest star and not as one of the main cast. At the moment the main cast consists of Jensen Ackles (Lead) Jared Padalecki (Lead) Misha Collins (Series Regular) Mark Shepherd (Series Regular) Mark Pellegrino (Series Regular) That is why if you watch the credits at the start of the episode they will say Starring Jared Padalecki, Jensen Ackles, Mark Shepherd, Mark Pellegrino and Misha Collins.* Then there's a pause before they add Special Guest Star Samantha Smith. * As series regulars rather than leads Misha, Mark P and Mark S' names only appear at the beginning of the episodes they actually appear in.

Yeah Id have to agree that this show is pretty equal opportunity in its killing. Male, female, straight, bi, gay, white, black etc you're gonna die! The only legit complaint I think fans can use is the fact that as of this season the main cast now consists of five white males.

Oh I completely agree that denying Sam and Dean the right to be individuals should not be considered a requirement to them getting along. However, IMO a lot of the issues you mentioned are influenced by Dabb who I feel took over things at some point during season 11. While my post was meant to be an analysis of what Carver had in mind when he wrote several seasons of them being in conflict with one another. I think this season and last would have been very different had Carver stayed full time. Although I do think he'd have moved on from the brother angst now he'd finished exploring their co-dependency. He just may have done a better job of maintaining their individual characterisations than Dabb has :)

I am going to post this in here as a precaution since the events discussed often lead to "bitch vs jerk" discussions. However, while I have strong feelings on said actions, this particular post is intended to be an analysis of the themes intended by the writers rather than a discussion of which brother is in the right. Personally, I'm not the biggest fan of said themes as a I perceive them, but this makes the most sense to me. In several interviews Jeremy Carver makes references to a three year plan and IMO this plan involved deconstructing the Winchester co-dependence to examine the good and the ugly before ultimately concluding for all its faults it's the right thing to do. At the beginning of season eight we are presented with an attempt to move away from said co-dependence on Sam's part. From Sam's perspective Dean has just died and he chooses to try and move on with his life. Ultimately, he is proven to be in the wrong as Dean was not dead but simply stuck in another dimension. He should not have given up on Dean and when Dean learns of said abandonment he is inevitably hurt and this leads to a season long conflict / tension between the brothers. This is temporarily resolved when Sam admits he considers his greatest sin letting Dean down and Dean declares there is nothing he'd put before Sam. Then we get to season 9 and the roles are reversed. This time it is Dean who is faced with the choice of whether to let his brother go or do something to save him! Dean chooses the latter even with the knowledge that Sam won't like the means he used to achieve said goal. The show admittedly is not shy about showing that Dean's actions have negative consequences. The most notable of which was the fact that Kevin was killed by a Gadreel possessed Sam. This is to explore the fact that there is an ugliness to the lengths they will go to save each other. Then when Sam finds out the brothers come into conflict once more. While in season 8 the conflict was about one brother failing to save the other this time it is about the methods a brother used to do said saving. Sam is shown to declare he would not have saved Dean under the same conditions. However, ultimately, it is decided that for all the ugliness involved continued co-dependence and the need to save each other at all costs is the right thing to do. This is shown when Sam admits "I lied" and realises he would do anything to save his brother. Affer this we move on to season 10. This time the roles are reversed and it is once more Sam faced with the choice of whether he should save Dean or not. This time Sam who has learnt his lesson as a result of the events of seasons 8 and 9 redeems himself for his earlier failure and does all he can to save Dean. The season concludes with him doing just that. There is ugliness involved, namely the Darkness is unleashed, just like there was with Dean's decision in season 9. However, the narrative presents this as being worth it because the season ends with the brothers united. Their bond is strong and this leaves them ready to face whatever may come together. This is why in season 11 the brothers are back to working together and with less conflict than they've had since before Dean went to purgatory.

@DittyDotDot is correct! She sums it up pretty well, but The exact dialogue is as follows Source: Superwiki

Well a half agreement is better than no agreement. ;) But yeah we will have to agree to disagree on Jensen. I often find his attempts at comedy to be way over the top, too slapstick and not at all convincing. They'd be better suited to some cheesy pantomime or something ;)

The reason I think they're wrapping up the British Man of Letters storyline this season is the focus they seem to be giving it in the closing act. For instance this weeks episode was a mixture of Monster of the Week (the Banes stuff) and advancing the British Man of Letters storyline (the Mary and Ketch scenes). In addition to this, the synopsis and spoilers for the next two episodes seem to suggest that they will both be focused heavily on the British Man of Letters. This intense focus on them along with the fact there is no mention of them in the final Lucifer drama focused episodes seems to suggest that plot will be over and done with by then. The fact that they're happy enough to neglect the Lucifer and nepihilm stuff for most of the closing act of the season suggests to me they plan to move it into next year. One episode to completely wrap the whole thing up seems far too little to me. Considering Jensen's constant reiterance at cons and so on that "this is a show about two brothers" I'm actually half expecting them to return to just Sam and Dean for the final season especially if said season is a shortened one. But I really don't see season 13 being a good one for Cas fans. IMO he is either going to be written out completely, or they'll make him the bad guy for a while. Making him the villain seems to be their go to when the writers are feeling bored of focusing on Castiel's character arc. I found your overall speculation really interesting Catrox! And funnily enough the first time I watched The Future I was half expecting Kelly to do just that! I was expecting we'd find out that it was the Angel that allowed her to survive the trip.

This isn't always the case though. Per canon you do get to spend eternity with your soul mate. This soul mate bond can be forged from romantic, familal or friendship link. That is why the brothers shared a heaven in this episode and why Jimmy and Amelia were reunited after her death in Angel Heart.

+ Pilot -- Scarecrow + Faith 81 - Faith 22 - Scarecrow 20 - Pilot 05 - Devil's Trap They went on a hunting trip. And they haven't been home in a few days. 22. Bugs 21. Route 666 20. Dead Man's Blood 19. Nightmare 18. Hook Man 17. Wendigo 16. Hell House 15. Shadow 14. Home 13. Salvation 12. Skin 11. Provenance 10. Bloody Mary 9. Asylum 8. Phantom Traveler 7. Dead in the Water 6. The Benders 5. Something Wicked

Unpopular Opinion Time I was rewatching Bad Day at Black Rock last night and it reminded me of the fact I really don't consider Jared or Jensen good comedy actors. I think they're amazing actors when it comes to day to day scenes and emotional ones, but the comedy scenes not so much. I think it's partly down to the writing (the shows sense of humour and mine rarely match) and it's partly down to the fact their performances often feel a little too forced and try hard IMO.

My predictions for the rest of the season. - Episode 22 will mark the end of the British Man of Letter's storyline! Ketch, Haas and all the other figures we were introduced to will be wiped out. On Team Winchester we will lose Garth, probably Eileen along with some hunters we were introduced to in 12x21 or 12x22. The show will forget about the BMoL back in Britain in the same way they forgot about the rest of the Stein's spread throughout the world. Episode 23 - I have two predictions depending on whether my speculation that Cas / Misha is leaving the show is correct. If Cas is leaving the show then I expect him to be right about the nepilihm's potential for goodness. His exit storyline will be him and Kelly (who will die during birth only to be resurrected by baby powered Cas moments later) will leave the show to raise the nephilim in parts unknown. Before this can happen Lucifer manages to escape Crowley and the demon is left dying and the Crowley related cliffhanger will be whether he is found and therefore survives or not. There will be a confrontation and to the amazement of all nephilim kills or at least badly damages daddy dearest. Meanwhile there will be scenes which will be used to introduce the main antagonist of season 13 (similar to Lady BitchNeedsToDie's scenes from last year). I think the final set of scenes will then be the brothers being cast in to the empty by this new villain. They've survived heaven, hell and purgatory so this is assumed to be the only sure fire way to get rid of them. So to sum the season will end with Brothers cliffhanger - They are trapped in the empty! How will they get out? Castiel - No cliffhanger as he has gotten his ending and a purpose. Crowely - Will he or won't he survive the damage wrought by Lucifer during the Angels escape. Big Bad for s13: Some new threat introduced in the finale. If Misha / Cas is staying with the show then I expect for the nephilim to be evil and either manipulating Cas through the use of false visions, or out and out controlling him like a sock puppet. Kelly will die giving birth to him and in this scenario she'll stay dead as in the eyes of an evil being she has served her purpose. I could even see the nephilim's essence somehow transferring to Castiel, so he can act as his host rather than a new born baby. Lucifer will still escape leaving Crowley's life in peril. However, this time he and possessed Cas will team up to work against the Winchester and it is possessed Cas who casts them into the empty. Brothers Cliffhanger - The same as above. How do we escape the empty? Castiel cliffhanger - What is he and the nephilim controlling him going to do now? How much of a danger is he to the Winchesterless world. Crowely - Same as above. Will he or won't he die as a result of a beat down from Lucifer? Big Bad for S13: A nephilim possessed Castiel.

I'm not dismissing the Lucifer is controlling the visions speculation. I've learnt not to dismiss anything when it comes to this show after being wrong in the past. However, I do have to ask, what benefit would allowing the baby to go off with Castiel be to him? He seemed genuinely upset when Dagon told him that not only had Kelly escaped, but he was in Castiel's custody of all angels. Plus wouldn't a Lucifer supporting Knight of Hell be a better guardian to his child than a Lucifer hating angel?

Those complaining might be glad to know that the CW have balanced the Sam centric promo tweet with a Dean centric tweet. https://mobile.twitter.com/cw_spn/status/860947284481257472

I can't understand a word being said and yet I've listened three times haha

Double posts, but it's been over a day since I cast my last vote? + Faith + Pilot -- Scarecrow 79 - Faith 23 - Scarecrow 23 - Pilot 07 - Devil's Trap They went on a hunting trip. And they haven't been home in a few days. 22. Bugs 21. Route 666 20. Dead Man's Blood 19. Nightmare 18. Hook Man 17. Wendigo 16. Hell House 15. Shadow 14. Home 13. Salvation 12. Skin 11. Provenance 10. Bloody Mary 9. Asylum 8. Phantom Traveler 7. Dead in the Water 6. The Benders 5. Something Wicked

Dean fans rejoice! Jensen has said Dean gets to use the grenade launcher soon!

Finals are out! We kept the 0.5 and viewers down only slightly to 1.506. So it is still a good improvement on last weeks viewers :)

I don't blame them! Last weeks episode was awful!

I think the idea behind it is that there is one storyline for the Winchesters and one for the regulars. IMO the BMoL stuff is the Winchester's storyline, and I include Mary in that! While the Lucifer and Crowley storyline is primarily for Castiel and Crowley. I'm not saying the brothers are completely uninvolved, but the plots been more driven by Crowley and Cas. For instance it was them hunting Lucifer on and off screen for the first half of the season. It is now Crowley with Lucifer and Castiel with the nephilim. I think it's something similar to S9. The Mark of Cain stuff was primarily about the brothers in particular Dean. While the Metatron stuff was mainly Castiel's. Of course the brothers are brought back into it when Metatron stabs Dean, but prior to that it was very much Cas' storyline IMO. @Dobian sorry if you saw this post before I added my comment. I accidentally clicked the post button haha

The half hours for this week were 0.503 and 0.516, which suggests that the viewers who were watching liked what they saw :) . I'll see if I can find the half hours for last weeks finals, but we may have to compromise and use last weeks prelim ratings for comparison.

I'm actually a believer that it's to do with the promotion for this weeks episode :) However, we had a debate in here previously about which episode had more influence the promo for the current one, or the one before receiving a good reception and thus encouraging more viewers to watch the following one live. So I was basically covering both viewpoints :)

In addition to a much higher viewer count we also had an improvement in the unrounded demo this week. It was 0.51 while last weeks episode got a 0.46. I doubt it's close enough for an adjustment to occur, but at least the show seems to be heading in the right direction :)