CeeBeeGee

This is absolutely wild. I'm reading Kato's testimony and he mentions one of the married couples that my ex told me about (that was at the dinner party ex attended with OJ and Nicole. Mind = blown.

How can you tell which depositions he attended? And this is awesome (from Fred Goldman's civil testimony):

Seriously?! I can't even imagine how her family dealt with that. They must have superhuman levels of self-control.

I have a hard time believing that someone who ran 9 miles every morning (per the autopsy special) was using. I have never done hard drugs but that seems to indicate a level of personal discipline that would preclude regular drug use, no? I'm going to ask the ex if he knew anything about that. Yes, the narration for the Scandal special was awful. His actions that night are enough to characterize him as a vicious POS. Don't bring his upbringing into it--the projects had nothing to do with this. If anything his previous incredible success proved he had overcome whatever disadvantages he'd had growing up. And who knows if he was "bad" all along? What do we know about his marriage to his first wife--did he beat her? Four words--If I Did It. In a way I was so relieved when that came out--finally we can stop pretending he's "not guilty." He just admitted he did it. And whoever said what a terrible thing to put his kids through (again)--yes! If you were innocent, why would you drag all that up again? I can't imagine how messed up those poor kids must be, under it all. I know they're adults now but it's heartbreaking. They lost both parents. And then he took them away from their mother's family as well,

I spent a lot of time in airports as a kid (Dad was an airline pilot) and I mainly knew OJ through the Hertz ads in the terminals. (Also somewhat from The Towering Inferno--I remember my brother and I mocking his wooden performance in that watching it on TV late night.) But yes, he was an innocuous household name. ETA: Sorry mod! For some reason I didn't see your post until after I posted this.

You make some good points and they even occurred to me as I was writing my post, that outrage has a way of sidestepping logic and fairness. I was so upset by the acquittal in Simi Valley that when I first heard of the riots, I was cheering them on, until I saw the footage and realized hey, this is much, much worse than a few broken windows. But it's just heart-breaking to me that this case is always, always seen as a referendum on race and nothing else. The fact that OJ got a slap on the wrists for his abuse of Nicole, and that she openly predicted her murder by him, is sickening. OMG I so agree with this. Bugliosi is a genius for securing Manson's conviction--just trying to explain that mess of a motive alone would be daunting. ("They wanted to start a race war? And...wait it out in the desert? And they thought the Beatles were onboard with this? Are you kidding me?") it probably helped that Ron Hughes "disappeared" (one of the saddest aspects of the case--Hughes was very sympathetic to hippies and the alternative lifestyle and genuinely wanted to help the Family, which decency got him murdered). And Linda Kasabian agreeing to testify and being the only decent person along those two nights was a huge stroke of luck. Still though. Bugliosi was a fantastic prosecutor. Did anyone see the specials last night about OJ and the murders? There were two--one was about OJ, the case, and his subsequent "career" of crime. The second was an analysis of the autopsy, which also included a re-enactment of the murders. I had no idea that Ron Goldman charged in trying to save Nicole--I thought he just stumbled onto the scene and was immediately dispatched. Incredibly brave of him.

Well, one thing he said was that he and his then-wife, plus another couple, plus Nicole and OJ, plus a fourth couple (Sandy Duncan and her husband--ex worked with the guy) all had a dinner party one evening. Apparently a LOT of vodka was drunk by OJ (and others). Afterward they played charades and my ex bonded quite a bit with him. (Vomit) OJ, as everyone has said, was huge ("his hand could crush my head with one squeeze") and very charismatic. And he bragged to ex about Nicole's breast job, said that he made her get them. (VOMIT) X saw Nicole every Sunday, and his kids knew Sydney and Justin. Said she was "CRAZY beautiful." When the news was heard on the radio that two bodies were found on South Bundy, X knew it was Nicole, and 10 minutes later SD's husband called X and said "did you hear? OJ killed Nicole."

yes, it's a terrible story and the main reason Dunne starting covering so many notorious trials. I remember reading that after his daughter's murderer was given the not-guilty murderer, he made his way over to Dunne's side of the courtroom and reached out his hand to shake it, in a 'no hard feelings" kind of gesture. Can you imagine?!?! Your daughter is strangled by her boyfriend, gets away with it, and he's acting as though you're on the opposing football team and we're all going to go out for a soda afterward?! Exactly. What social justice was served by decapitating that poor woman (after of course beating the crap out of her for years) and murdering some kid who stumbled on the scene? How are they to blame? How does letting the killer get away with their deaths dismantle systemic racism?

Oh my God! All those sycophants anxiously saying "Juice!" and "The Juice" every other second and kowtowing to this brooding psychopath. I can't even imagine being in that room. I would've started cackling hysterically at these hamsters and shown myself out. Schwimmer's doing a great job though (all the performances are great, except for Travolta's, sadly). Hunh, not how I remember it--maybe it's a regional thing? Everyone I knew at the time was pretty convinced he did it--DNA, plus his prior record, plus all the physical evidence. It seemed clear to me the verdict was a fuck you for the acquittal of the Rodney King cops (also a terrible verdict). He's riveting. I'm very impressed. Don't they always? Nicole who? Sure, obviously race is an important factor--but so is domestic abuse. He beat the shit out of her and got away with it. And then he murdered her, and some poor guy with terrible luck, and got away with that. i can't even imagine how I would've reacted if I'd been Nicole's sister and had to watch that POS looming over her coffin, staring into the beautiful face he mutilated, playing the grieving ex-husband for his audience. Just sickening. My ex-BF was casual friends with OJ, and knew Nicole rather well. I texted him last night and got an earful of insight--I'm still hoping he might show up in the series (so is he, I think ;)

Utterly fucking ludicrous. Yes, she could've done the petty local stuff like getting her tee-times revoked. (Although I question whether any high-end business would actually say in front of other guests that her account was in arrears.) But Stanford is on the other end of the country. There is no way in hell they would freeze out a legacy like the novelist's son--a double legacy whose grandfather funded the tennis court, or whatever she said? All on the say-so of not even the billionaire but the billionaire's wife? Utterly ridiculous. As you say Stanford would not want to get involved. Like, I got mad just watching it--please, please give that wife something to do besides play Lady Macbeth manque. Carmela Soprano did it better. I did like the subplot with the psychologist and the woman manager. I was rooting for that woman to move on--you don't need that sausagefest!

Yeah, I don't get afraid at all. He adores her. I think they're very sweet together. Her father is the chiefton of Clan Leslie.

Can you imagine having to ask your boss if you can walk into the village? See a movie? It's incredible how stifling and patriarchal life in service was. And this version of the system was an improvement--I remember in The Secret Garden Martha, the housemaid who occasionally waits on Mary Lennox, talking about how she gets one day off a month (!!!!). (And that one day she walks 12 miles to her mother's house where she cleans and bakes for her.) Agreed, he is very talented and his Thomas is beautifully layered. I would hate Thomas a lot more if a different actor portrayed him!

Lovely episode. Two episodes in a row we get great scenes from Thomas, this time with his conversation with Baxter. He is such an intriguing, infuriating character--in some way a Loki who is, as Baxter says, "his own worst enemy," but capable of self-insight. Time and again he has been the beneficiary of grace--from the Bates, from the family--and he chooses to hold onto that towering sense of resentment and aggrievement. Interesting that when he was railing against Gwen belowstairs, he held himself up as someone who has "given his life to service." A few years ago Thomas would've leapt at the opportunity for a life outside of service. Bates called it correctly--he's pissed that someone else did what he was unable to do. And with all that--he still has a shot. As many have said with his looks and his training he could easily find another house, or a hotel, that would welcome his skills. I truly, truly hope Thomas does not end badly, I want to see him learn from his mistakes. LOVED the Gwen scene. And I'm not at all surprised she didn't immediately identify who she was--that's awkward business, and that's for Gwen to decide to share. I liked seeing Edith call out the awkwardness--"you worked for us for two years and we didn't know your name?" And watching the family react to her story of how Sybil helped her (and I've been rewatching S1 lately, the scene where Sybil deflects Lord G from the library is hilarious) is lovely. What an object lesson is the privilege these people had, and still have, and the difference they can make in people's lives (which Edith pointed out--"we talk about making a difference..."). I loved seeing Mary really learn from this--we see that when she's talking to Anna afterward ("why was I so pettish?"). Speaking of which--Mary handled the Potential Anna Miscarriage beautifully. Someone in the thread for the last episode said that Mary was very decisive which could ruffle feathers but which was good for her in business. Boy, did this demonstrate that--I was very impressed with how well Mary kept her head. She told Anna not to panic, she came up with a plan and how to cover it, she lied convincingly, she didn't let butter melt in her mouth. Mary really is a latter-day Scarlett O'Hara. And finally loved the Bates' conversation. Bates's look of realization--"Oh God!"--was just lovely.

Not in Hollywood...which was my point actually.......

For the most part I liked it--I find myself drawn to any attempt to dramatize the byzantine world of high finance (I loved Too Big to Fail as well, and the book was fantastic. I even liked this dismal musical flop thereof). Loved seeing Maggie Siff again and I'll watch Paul Giamatti in anything. However I disliked Bobby's wife--not so much the character as what they did with her. Maggie Siff was active, had agency and a separate identity. All Bobby's wife can do is coo over the children and bristle protectively on behalf of her husband? Ugh. HATED the scene where she threatened the disgruntled woman, it make me curl up in disgust over her. Honey, your husband is a billionaire, he can stand a little pushback (as indeed he did, very gracefully). Don't be so thin-skinned. And show-runners, that shouldn't be our introduction to what should be a major female character. Also--well, this is going to sound shallow but whenever I see actors like Damian Lewis I marvel at how, frankly, unattractive a man can be and still be considered a viable male lead, still chosen to headline a series. Benedict Cumberbatch and James Gandalfino are other examples. Women just are not offered those opportunities in the industry. (I guess Paul Giamatti falls into that category as well--I'm letting him off the hook somewhat because I've seen him in a lot and he is truly a great actor with a lot of range. All I know of Lewis and Cumberbatch is what they look like--I don't know as much about their careers.) It angers me, frankly.

Easiest solution and most obvious (for JF if not for the actual characters)--have Mr. Mason and the Drewes swap tenant farms. It will mean someone will have to change their specialty (pigs to dairy or whatever) but it's better than nothing. I loved that dance! The Dowager Countess can draw out anyone (remember when she got Daisy to open up whilst stoking the fires in the library?), I bet she could make Thomas see that a great many of his problems (obviously not all) are from his own surliness and suspicious nature.

Good God, seriously? If anyone's earned a rest, it's Maggie Smith! I can't believe how much she works. I believe English aristocrats typically use children for bridesmaids--you might have an adult MOH but the rest of the bridal party is all little girls. See: Diana's wedding (Lady Sarah Chatto was the token adult/child wrangler, the rest were all kids) and Kate's (her sister Pippa was the MOH, the rest were all girls with connections to William and Kate). So those "flower girls" were likely Edith's bridesmaids. Someone who knows more than me feel free to correct me.

Tom!!!! I literally cheered out loud when I saw him and Sybbie again. Yay! And Edith totally stepped up to the task! AND fired that misogynistic shit screaming at her. Bye, jerk! Daisy, Daisy, DAISY. STAHP. Stop talking about Mr. Mason taking over the Yew Tree tenancy, you're going to eff it up. How adorbs were the cousins (Sybbie, George and Marigold) hugging each other. The interlude of Thomas at that estate--that was haunting. Absolutely stunning set piece, a look at a time of glamor and elegance gone, gone. I was aching for that poor man.

William Moseley, damn son. From the Narnia franchise to this? How the mighty have fallen.

IIRC it was actually Edith who reached to Mary after Sybil's death. and Mary was the one who said probably not.

George would be the heir no matter what--his claim is through Matthew, not through Mary. Nobles titles go through the male line, not the female. If Matthew had married Lavinia and sired George, he would still be the heir to Downton.

Prince William or Prince Harry? William has been pretty strait-laced, it's Harry who get caught in Vegas with his trousers down.

Yeah, the seeds were laid last season for Mrs. Drewe's kidnapping of Marigold--she has always been a little weird and obsessive about Marigold. I didn't see this as clunky writing at all--this was forecast all last year. I don't know if they're trying to rehabilitate him but I do like it when they add shades of grey to Thomas, like when they use him to remind us how difficult it would've been to be a gay man at that time. Surely, that humiliating interview was part of that? Usually I detest Thomas, since he seems to go out of his way to be so pointlessly shitty to the Bateses, but during that interview I wanted to leap into the TV and slap that smug jerk's face. Yeah, I've had to supervise enough misogynistic men who resented a woman outranking them for that not to be my default assumption. Also what we could hear of that phone conversation--he was so, so nasty--that definitely sounds like a certain kind of dinosaur. And yes, he should be fired for foolishness and insubordination, if for nothing else.

I loved Edith and Mary's shared look of mortification when Lord G offered to decorate the Servants' Hall. I love it whenever they have a moment together and aren't sniping. It's official--Anna and Lady Mary are my heterosexual OTP. LOVE them together! Mary was awesome to help her out. They really have such a great mutual respect. I could see that the Drewes weren't long for this world as soon as they entered the stage while Daisy and Cora were talking about trying to find a solution. Obviously Mr. Mason will be taking over that tenancy.

"You know very well Grandma Robillard painted her face..." ;)