HalcyonDays

Thinking more about this, I just wanted to add another thing. And this is a harsh reality / plea for people to watch the show. If you want to change the tide, if you want to see more POC (especially woman of colour) headlining a show, you had damn well better watch THIS show. Why? Because if this show fails, the only - only - lesson the executives in the FOX boardroom will understand, is that a genre/cop procedural show headed by a person of colour will fail. They will not bother taking the time to learn why the show failed. All they know is that it was unsuccessful. They will think twice about taking any future chances on POC-lead shows, and they will second guess taking the risk trying another duo-lead show with a POC. To them, Empire will be a lucky fluke, but white-led casts are the way to go, because they have been successful and have been historically successful. Other duo-lead shows ---> Bones (two white leads, in it's 11th season). Castle (2 white leads - 8th season). X-Files (2 white leads - 9 seasons with a current 10th). Elementary (2 leads but one WOC but not black - 4th season). It is not fair (life isn't fair) but it is a reality and a harsh one at that. If you want to support Nicole Beharie and Lyndie Greenwood, if you want to show that POC in lead roles can be successful, then do not abandon this show. If you do, the networks will just have this mindset reinforced in their minds by this fact --> POC lead shows will most likely fail. So watch the show. If it sucks half way through, then yes, let's abandon it. We will have actual evidential reason to do so. But as I said above. Give it a chance to succeed. ................. As for the current promotion - shows always wait till later to reveal the stuff that will pull in others. It's summer - people are on vacation and not paying attention. September is when they want to remind you to come back to a show. That is when the good stuff will be released. People have short memories - networks want the good stuff released closer to premiere dates to keep it fresh in your minds. That's why we haven't gotten any Abbie/Jenny stuff yet. It's not time.

Hell yeah. I would buy that the moment it was released, like when I used to snatch up the Harry Potter books the morning they were released! It could be a TV movie, for god's sake. Well, I'm going to be the typical voice of dissention, in the sense of providing a different view from everyone else. I am going to give them a chance. I am going to wait and see what other casting news comes out before October. I am going to watch and see how they establish this character and what her point is. And here is why: First - remember at the end of last season, when it was released that Abbie was going back into the 18th century?? Everyone lost their motherfucking minds. And I distinctly remember the exact same comments that are currently on this page. "That's it, I'm done. I'm done with this show. I won't watch." Scroll back in this thread to around February and see. Everyone freaked out and said they were done watching. And then what happened? Everyone watched. The episode was amazing. Critics raved about it. Most of us LOVED the episode and almost everyone proclamined that Sleepy Hollow is back. Second - sidelining Abbie. We don't know if that will happen yet. I am 100% sure that it won't. However, I won't know if it will happen UNTIL the season starts. If this new character starts to become a K-wife, then yes, I am out. But we just don't know. To be honest, I have a feeling she might be the new "Big Bad." Not the incompetance of the red head, but someone very cunning. If not the big bad, as I said in the other thread - she will be part of the storyline that tells us why those two are the witnesses. Third - If during the season, there is one episode that Abbie is not featured heavily, but otherwise she is, I am not going to worry about it. You know why? Because every actor has it in their contract that they need a break. Season 2, Mama was Tom Mison's break (Crane was sick, mostly off). Pittura Infamante was Nicole Beharie's time off and break. Unfortunately, in this case, red heads were taking over and that episode just compounded the situation. Otherwise, it is normal for an episode or two. Four - There is almost 2.5 months until the season starts. There is going to be more information released. There will be filming behind the scenes shots. More casting information will be released. We will get episode synposes. Right now, we don't know anything. I understand the knee-jerk reaction - we've been through this before so it's easy to apply the same mentality. BUT there is a new showrunner. There is three (four?) new writers. They know they are under scrutiny. We don't know what's going behind the scenes. We know nothing. All I can be sure of is that there will be a flashback and yes, Ross will be wearing a corset because guess what? That's what ladies wore. Also, I get the hate for the sexy term. But understand it's Hollywood. Woman are judged as that. Agent Carter would have those words. Beckett from Castle had those words. Most would. And I guarantee you that when the initial casting description for Abbie Archer (it was Archer, before they changed it to Mills) was released, the words "Sexy" were in there. We've just never seen it. And look who they cast. So I'm in. I will watch and see if it grabs me again, and if the show does, then I am happy. I mean, in this case, think of it from their end. They just got pounced on big time - to them out of the blue - about something that we have again, no clue about. Before anyone makes any snap judgements, I think we should all wait for the episode synopses to come out. The promo clips, the previews, the articles and everything that WILL come out, before October 2015. That's my plea to everyone. That's my thoughts right now.

Shall we have a little chuckle to make us all feel better in light of today's news?? Tweeted from Orlando Jones: OH. MY. GOD. */deadonfloor/* Don't hold back, dude. Never ever hold back! Bawahahaha!

No, never seen the show - just read some of the book series, so I don't know. Also, never watched Buffy and it's spinoff Angel, so don't know anything about Borenaz. I would rather have an Elementary/SH X-over, or the ultimate wish - X-Files/SH. That's what should have been done, dammit! I mean, come on. It's like the perfect match. It's a hellava news day in Sleepy Hollow land, I tell you.

Geeks - the lot of ya! *grin* Love it. Considering the bevy of news today...(remember, spoiler free thread) What should happen - a engaging, fun, exciting show that features lots of the amazing trio of Jenny, Crane and Abbie.

The fuck? That's the cross over?? I knew the blind item, but didn't think Sleepy and Bones. Okay...I like the books and writer but have never watched Bones... Well, if they give me a really good murder case with twists and turns and lots of awesome forensic science, then I'm good. And you never know guys - Bones and the other guy working together solving cases = Eventual Romance. Crane and Abbie working together solving cases = hint hint...

Okay, thinking over this a little and what could happen...what would you guys think about this scenario: First, we've had some information from Cliff Campbell and the writers hinting that this season, we will finally find WHY Crane and Abbie were chosen as Witnesses. Storyarc #1: In order to do this, for Crane we need flashbacks. The flashbacks are sure as hell not going to have the red-headed wonder included. So who else? Betsy Ross, who we know was "dating" or somehow involved with Crane. Second, how many times have we speculated that K-wife deliberately set the path for Crane to become a witness. But again, KW will not be back. So why not put that same plot idea onto Betsy Ross. She is someone who manipulated Crane a little toward a certain path and his inevitable future, and we find out WHY he is a witness. Parallel Storyarc #2: - At the same time, we have to find out WHY Abbie was chosen Witness. So maybe another character is introduced, or maybe Betsy Ross has some manipulations on Grace Dixon to postion her to be the ancestor to Abbie. Also, if Betsy Ross ends up in the 21st century, she can also influence Abbie. Remember, we are going to have Abbie struggle with going to Quantico, so finding out why she was chosen can once again change things. So this character is needed to be around a bit, to set into motion a story arc that runs through multiple episodes (while the main storyline - fight evil - occurs each episode) that eventually tells us WHY Crane and Abbie and WHY Crane and Abbie together. What do you guys think?

Dude can't win, man. He can't win whatsoever. Metzner should have warned him. But this old saying holds too true for SH ---> Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. I think that's what we are trying not to do - be fooled. Thought right now, this is so me:

Holy fuck! Anyone read Leigh Dana Jackson's twitter in the last hour?? (he was hired this year as a writer) A) This reminds me of last year. B) This reminds me of Metzner C) Sometimes the drama behind Sleepy Hollow is better than the show D) I feel bad for him E) I feel bad for the fans F) No one can ever win G) This fucking show, man. This fucking show...

WOOHOO! Some good news today! Yes, very happy about that. TURN renewed for Season 3!

They did cast another male - season 2 with Matt Barr as NIck Hawley. Remember how that went?? He's got a valid point. We had a really hard time with the storylines last season, but I do remember that massive backlash and freakout over Abbie going back to the 18th century. Turns out the final episode was the best ever for the series. I think we've just been burned so many times, we naturally expect the worst, when you never know, it could be really good. Though the word "Patience" was used ad nauseum in season 2, so Leigh Dana needs to be a bit careful throwing that word around. I'll be positive and give these guys the benefit of the doubt. Remember all of the fixes at the end of last season. They knew exactly what to fix and I guarentee you, FOX will have final veto on the stories/plotlines. There is no WAY that they will repeat the same mistakes as before. There is probably a checklist they follow of what to do, not to do. This comment I've seen repeated so many times, but to be honest, it worries me. Because I think that everyone is going to go into season 3 with the expectation that Ichabbie will happen by episode 3, and if it doesn't, they are going to bail on the show. It's just the impression I am getting from many comments on twitter, tumblr and other forums for the last few months. What worries me about this is it isn't going to happen quickly at all, and I don't think many viewers have the patience to enjoy the journey. I'm not talking about a seven year long game, a la The X-Files. But I think that a lot of people won't have the patience for the relationship to develop and mature what so ever. Everyone is expecting Ichabbie to happen pronto, and any delays will be completely untolerated and the show is only about Ichabbie (it is, but there is more). And this is an unpopular opinion I am sure, but there was another ship that a small group of people focused on solely, to the point of not caring about anything or anyone else on the show no matter how bad it became. You know which ship I'm talking about. I just don't want the awesome fans who fought hard for the show to turn into that....I hope I don't offend anyone, but I've been thinking this may happen for a long time. ETA: Nikki Reed looks a lot like Stana Katic (Beckett from Castle). Coincidence?

LOL! Seriously?? That gave me a good laugh (which I needed). But OnceSane, you really have to fail in life to Struggle-Witch, let me tell you. Like, complete absolute failure coupled by a faint at the end! Hee.

I flip flop between both, but I cannot help feel like when one is dating a guy who lies to you time and time again. You keep giving them a chance, hoping they will redeem themselves or change, that maybe they are not that bad, but then once you forgive them and trust them again, they lie to you, and the cycle starts over. SH is like a bad boyfriend, sucking you in with false promises and sweet words of love and devotion and then *boom*, they thoroughly disappoint you again.

Oh yeah, that's right, I do remember that, but I figured that the writers would have learned their lesson after the backlash and not went ahead with that. *lesigh*. Still love Mison to death and still think both Mison and Beharie have been terribly hard done by. No wonder there seems to be no enthusiam on their ends. At least the season will end soon and they can move onto other projects. But what I don't get is WHY they bothered to renew the show in the first place, if this was the result. I mean, if they FOX really wanted to not focus on Abbie or Jenny, then they should have let it die, instead of introducing Red-Head part II and most likely making me eventual hate the name Betsy with 1000 suns, just like I hate any utterance of that other name now. I'm going to need two cases of wine ready for when the season starts......

What I don't understand is why? Did they not learn from the red-headed mess? I mean, if this person is a series regular, then they somehow have to end up in the 21st century, right? It can't be all flashbacks. Okay, so they end up in modern times. Then what? And what's the point of this new character (besides eye candy). Guest star fine, but regular??? Well, at least the fandom have lots of talk about in the meantime. Too bad not one bit is positive stuff. I really need a tell-all book. Desperately. And wonder what brand of glue the writers are apparently repeatedly sniffing when they are coming up with plotlines. Genevieve Valentine - who wrote the awesome SH episode recaps on i09.com, just tweeted up a storm, slamming this latest news.

To rip off (and slightly change) some lyrics from a REM song: "It's the end of the show as we know it... And I don't feel fine.... http://www.spoilertv.com/2015/07/sleepy-hollow-season-3-nikki-reed-cast.html Yeah...I don't know man...this news disappoints and saddens me. And I expect a large number of people are going to be pissed, while a select *ahem* few will be thrilled. So sad.

Here is a link to that thread: Poldark Now, Then and Before - The Books, the Original Series and the Remake

I don't think even the men could truly marry down, which is why the episode had many of those men and woman saying that this would ruin Ross. That's why some of the investors didn't want to give anymore money to Ross. The people were supposed to marry within their own classes, to maintain their reputations, keep the family name strong and ensure wealth stayed within the same classes and family. At least that's how I understand it. The man however could take a 'lower-class' person as a mistress. That isn't a problem, of course. Also, women were of course not subject to the same rules as the men, even in their own 'class'. That's why we had that scene in the previous episode were Elizabeth told Ross that Francis thought it was unladylike to take interest in the mine. Women's minds were 'weak' and 'prone to illogical emotion',and therefore could not understand the 'intricasies' of running a business. *rollseyes* I know this didn't apply to 100% of all relationships/families, etc, but a fair amount had this attitude from what I know, at the time (hell, even now). Again, that's at least how I know it. This really is a great show. The characters are really engaging and I find the story very entertaining. Oh, and shallow comment of the day - a naked Ross/Aidan Turner is a wonderful thing.

This is a reminder to everyone to be a bit more considerate and respectful in the posts you make. Every once in a while, we get judgemental body shaming and life shaming posts popping up in these threads. It's understandable that the viewer can get angry over seeing the contestants refuse to help themselves at all, or people who are just plain manipulative and sometimes evil, but to dismiss them as simply being “lazy” and "gross" is disrespectful and unhelpful. You would not tell an anorexic to “just eat something”, a bulimic “to just quit throwing up” or a depressive to “just cheer up and stop being so sad.” It doesn’t work that way. There are serious psychological and medical issues that these individuals are suffering with, that no one here on the board knows the full extent of. You know the old saying - People in glass houses should not throw stones....yadda yadda. I'm sure some of us are not model thin. I am sure some of us are lazy (raises hand). I am sure some of us eat crap food (me!!) and I am sure some of us are very stubborn and very entitled at times. Any concerns, don't hesitate to PM me. Thank you.

I can kinda see why, considering the trend these last couple of years. A lot of "big name" actors/actresses that are known (and were successful) in film are making a stab at the small screen and being successful with that attempt. I know that GA and DD are recently more TV show actors, but I just think of Penny Dreadful (Eva Greene and Josh Hartnet), Matthew McConaughey, Woody Harrelson and now Colin Farrell and Rachel McAdams in True Detective, and I swear I saw a clip of a new show with Bradley Cooper in it. Tea Leone in Madam Secretary. Halle Berry and Jeffery Dean Morgan in Extant (and he's in another show too). There are more, I just can't think of them. It seems a lot more movie actors are transitioning to TV. Point being, is that movies nowadays seems to be these comic book special affect movies or animated films, and something like an X-Files seems to be more suited on TV than big screen. Just my thoughts. Hidebehind - that podcast sounds good. I'm laughing about him mentioning him now rewriting any scripts. Obviously this was a problem in the past. Ha!

And completely improvised too, by Tom Mison, which is awesome. Sometimes you get a talented actor who throws in something (action, dialogue or response) of their own making and it totally makes the show/episode/whatever 100+ better. UO (I think this is one): I get a kick out of seeing an actor break character or address the fourth wall. Seen in comedies usually. I know many have complained about Horatio Sanz and Jimmy Fallon always giggling on SNL, for example, but I think it's hilarious. It makes me laugh more. Especially when they are trying to deliberately cover it up or are pretty creative in quickly finding a way to incorporate it into a scene or make the transistion smoohter. You tend to see it more in live-taping shows (The Big Bang Theory is one that comes to mind, that I've seen this occur several times) but there have been some shows that kept the take of the actor losing it, because to me, it really makes the scene hilarious.

Totally agree with all of your points and I'll add to the end. No more Henry or wife whining. I never want to hear their names again. Seriously.

Here here! This is where I want that typical trope of a snotty arrogant person getting their comeuppance. Just terrible people. Snob snob snob. And the worst part to me - is that woman in this time are considered second-class citizens, yet it is the women in these cases that are treating other women like crap and ensuring she remains a "lower class" person. The men do it here on this show terribly also, but come on ladies... Of course, nothing has changed - same crap happens today but it's just disappointing. That why I loved Verity saying "I don't care where you came from." and Elizabeth finally being nice to Demelza and treating her respectfully. Yes, it could be seen as her wanting to get close to Ross, but honestly. I think she was just being nice and accepting of Demelza.

Oooohhh....I like it. I like this idea a lot. If they get a third season, I can totally see this happening. Nice one, Lonesome Rhodes.

For some reason, I speculated that because the mine (and Ross) was running out money, he sold the horse to get some more capital to survive through Christmas. Just my speculation. I don't remember seeing the horse after the Christmas part. The ladies looking out the water. Again, I thought it was something like they checked at low tide (would it be low tide) everyone day to wait for the boats to come in, and it was to show the constant desperation and hope these people had. They weren't there all day every day, was how I viewed it. Only say for a half an hour while walking home or after chores were done, they went out to the cliffs. Demelza singing totally brought me to tears and I have no idea why. Such a lovely scene. The look on that miserable bitchy woman (I forget her name) was priceless. I wished Demelza would have slapped her for all of the mean comments at dinner, or at least got in a few more good zingers. The uncut version of the episode, that woman is worse and just mean. I felt for Demelza though - to have to deal the the other "uppercrust" at Christmas, all while knowing they are judging you and looking down their noses at you. She is a wonderful character and her and Verity are so much fun together. Verity needs someone lively to hang with, as she herself is lively. Francis, Francis, Francis. I know you are jealous and insecure, but sleeping with prostitutes isn't going to make you wife any more loyal. Though I hate storylines with babies, this one didn't grate. The way Demelza told Verity the news, then Ross, then his reaction. I loved it. And him telling her why they married. He was completely truthful then romantic at the same time. Love this show.