HalcyonDays

I haven't read the comics, but read some screen shots and some synopsis and they sound really good. Like, they sound like exactly what I wanted to see on the show, which makes me sad. This is never a knock at comics, because they can present rich fully developed stories, but when the comics are slamming it out of the park, and the show isn't...I don't know man. Can the comic writers write for the show??

Yeah, I agree with that summary. The stuff mentioned would have been awesome. The comics are what the show should have been, plus some good Crane stories (I like his character a lot). Hell, apparently they've portrayed a lot of good Ichabbie downtime and shippy moments too in the series and even did justice to K-wife. Go figure. I find it weird because the comics are official to the series, so it's like that stuff that happened in them, happened on the show (behind the scenes). So strange. I'll say it again. Season 2 was ruined by Goffman's obsession with She-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named, and his inability to world build and understand continuity. I'm gonna give Campbell and his new writers a chance to see if they have developed their SH world and what they will do with it.

Here you go, kiddos. Told you more casting announcements coming up. This is just one for a stand-in but it's not for Orlando. Note the height required. Anyone recognize the actor by chance? In a few weeks, we'll get the casting announcement for whoever this character will be.

That is exactly what I thought too. And weren't they in Clearwater, FL at the time? Someone on the writing staff obviously hates Scientology (good person) because that speech and the sheep cheering about it was totally creepy but amusing at the same time. Younger brother with the short fuse is going to lose it again and Older brother is gonna take him. Ned is too easy to snap and Sean isn't going to hesitate to take him out. Still don't know how these two "took over" Europe. If Ned returns, I am sure there are going to be other factions who want the power, and will take him and his people out. Still, fun episode.

Really? Man, this show is messing me up more than I thought! Honestly, I'm just trying to come at this with a logical outlook. Also, I am actually really curious how season 3 is going to unfold and what they think will "fix" it. If I truly felt done, I wouldn't even be posting here. Most other TV shows I gave up on, it was just a sudden decision. I just stopped watching. It's okay hun! *crushinghug* For most of us, this show means/has meant something very special to us. This is why we are all here losing out minds over a bloody TV show and getting angry and passionate about the situation. We actually care, it means something to us. I am excited about the next seasons of Walking Dead, X-Files, Gotham, HTGAWM and TURN, and I post in those threads, but I am very passionate and most focused on SH, as you can all see. The rest, I'll watch the promos and previews and will read the spoilers (from here), but it's one here I'm debating and analyzing everything about this show. Oh, forgot to say thanks to you and cynic for the clarification about the cross-over. I thought it would only be one show, not both. Honestly, if they do it right, I can see a good comedic episode (thinks X-Files). I'm cool with it. Just wondering how they will do it. Someone said that on Bones, SH was referenced by a character DVRing the TV show, so not sure how they will do this. I think it took place, but it didn't have the benefits of pages and pages of forum and twitter and tumblr comments. The writers and actors are in their own little writing room /filming vacuum. When they checked social media, they got inundated with thousands of tweets and probably were like, "the hell happene?". They are going to read a few, give up, mention it the the rest of the vacuum occupants and that's it. Even if they asked Orlando, he may not have been 100% blunt with them. Remember it took a while for them to respond, get a sense of what was happening. Sorry to burst your bubble, but he's just going to appear in the first episode. They need closure for Irving, tell the audience he moved somewhere. It would be absolutely cruel for them to mess with us on something like this. Because the news-worthy stuff designed to grab you is always released closer to premiere. There is still 2.5 months to go. Lots of time.

Nothing I say is ever complete and utter BS. *arrogant smirk* Kidding!! (sort of). You're killing me, jhlipton.... Well, IF this scenario actually happened, then said tweets would not have happened, because let's face it, most people want to keep their jobs. He may work on a TV show, but he is still subject to typical business operations and occurances. It's obvious this conversation didn't happen, because he's been engaging people for three days now. IF he was told to shut the hell up or else you're fired, he would have. Even if he was told to shut the hell up because job expectation, he would have. Most people would. He has no dog in the "fight" for SH because like most people, he wants to remain employed. However, my original point really is not BS, because we just don't know. He doesn't know all of the intricate details because dude hasn't read the zillions of comments of posts in the multitude of threads out there. A briefing, fine, but that briefing misses details, and again he tried. Also, again, we are not in the writers room to know how skewed said briefing was. Think of it like this - you get a job position after the previous dude was fired for whatever reason. When you start your job, you hear some mention of why dude was fired, but you don't get the precise details. For LDJ, the same applies. He probably heard "Well, the second season was not well received. No one liked K-wife, they all thought Abbie was side-lined and CFD sucked." How much detail would they go into? You will never, ever know the full details of why person failed in a job, because confidentiality and human nature. Which is why I said - unless dude read every single post here on PTV - he does not know the full details and full reasoning ad nauseum as to why season 2 failed. You guys are killing me, man. Literally killing me. I am the most bitter, cynical MoFo in the business, yet you guys are beating me at my game here. The fact that I feel like the optimist is messing with my head.... The only reason we "think" that the show was saved due to social media was because of a tweet that Aaron Baiers made. But the reality is this - everything is a business decision. A petition of 100,000 people clamoring to save SH wouldn't be enough, if the networks didn't think they could make money on season 3 or at least profit somehow from it. Countless popular shows have been cancelled because they are not profitable. (Laments ABC's Forever) It's nice that the masses think their little social media campaign worked. The only thing it did was to garner attention to the show. If the show crunched the numbers and decided that production and airing would lose the network significant money or was not worth the monetary risk - SH would have been cancelled. Profit is a cold hard business fact, but it is a reality. As much as I hate to say it, this is truth.

I'm not missing the point. I think that people are jumping to conclusions about stuff, tainted by the past, of which Jackson nor Campbell are a part of. Let me try to clarify. Do you think Leigh Dana Jackson has read all of the twitters and tumblrs and facebooks that we all read on a daily basis? You don't, just like you don't know any of the behind the scenes stuff going on. You assume so, because you possess the information from reading other people's post. But he most likely hasn't. Nor has he read this board, or all of the threads on this board to get a FULL understanding of our complaints. He's trying though. And how do you know they won't. There is still 2.5 months until the premiere. People here are being completely impatient, and the natural word to use is "be patient." Here is a tweet from him today: Exactly. He knows. We do not. Abbie's storyline is coming closer to premiere, to grab the attention of everyone closer to the first episode. This is just how mdia functions. Which brings me to something else I just realized. Everyone's freaking out over the Bones/SH crossover without asking the most important question.... Which show will the cross-over air on? Once again, everyone is jumping to conclusions and thinking it will be on SH, but I don't think so. This is Bones' final season. A good idea would be to try to grab some Bones viewers and get them interested in SH. I predict the cross-over will be aired on Bones, NOT Sleepy Hollow. For some reason, Abbie and Crane will appear on BONES, not the other way.

Good point, so I reread through the Betsy Ross announcements again, and just wanted to point out three things: #1) It is never mentioned in any of the announcements that Betsy Ross is Crane's ex, or former girlfriend or that they ever dated. #2) They used those character descriptions (Jolie, not Martha) to basically indicate that she's not going to be a dowdy frumpy homemaker type person (duh, it's Hollywood and yes I know, Martha isn't a frump) #3). The Mr/Mrs Smith reference. I haven't seen the movie but know the premise. The movie isn't about two people (who happened to be married) spying together and banging each other while doing it. It's about two people who don't know the other works as a hired assassin (for SH, replace assassin with spy). The movie consists of the two characters hired to try to KILL each other. When you combine it with the whole honeypot comment, it tells me that Betsy Ross going to be portrayed leading a double life (as will Crane). Sweet demure flag-sewer by day, deadly cunning spy at night. In flashbacks, Betsy Ross could be working for the opposite side as Crane, or working against each other. So you are right re: the bolded part. Who says they will stick with the "Crane dated Betsy Ross" quip from season 1. They may just know each, or associate in public, but I would bank on ulterior motives for their interactions for undercover spying reasons. So my Unpopular Opinion is that I will wait and see how this character fits into the SH world and give Cliff and company a chance in October. Because right now, I just don't know.

Yeah, you are correct in the fact that PR is lacking with SH. That I totally agree with. I'll mention this, just as a comparison. Over at the X-Files revival thread, people are losing their minds over spoilers or bits of information about the show (similar to here, just not as angry). The show airs January 2016, but they've already released a teaser clip (that tells you nothing at all, by the way), but it's still something. Both are FOX. That has been a constant since day 1 - total lack of PR for this show. Shit, you are right. My bad and apologies. I wrote it late at night and should know better - especially me. I've edited my post, in case it comes off badly or is misread. Again, apologies (and good one the way you called me out on it - *grin* - I deserved that!)

Timing is important to how spoilers are released. The further away from a premiere, the less important. The closer to premier, the more important. People are notorious for having short memories, therefore releasing information "first" will be forgotten quickly by the masses. The good stuff (and more detailed stuff) is always released closer to the actual airing of movie or TV show, in order to entice people before they can change their minds or before they forget. This is why you get "teasers" for a movie, but when it get close to the actual movie release, you get full on trailers. Less important information is always released first. More important information (aka grab that audience NOW!) is always released closer to actual air time.

God, I love this post, Criminey. Nicely done. I completely agree too. It's all going to be fine. Yeah, I remembered but people forgot that he hid from her - so why was she chasing him (I am sure it wasn't because she was in love. It will be a completely different reason I bet) . Same with the cross-over. I loved Forever, thought is was an amazing show and a cross-over would have been gold. Forever or X-Files. That would have been amazing. Don't know Bones, but it's been on a while, so it could be good. All depends on how its handled.

That footage looks awesome! Already getting excited!!

I'm sad that people are going to give up on the show, tbh. Too bad but you gotta go what you gotta do. No one can ever say that this fandom isn't a passionate group, I tell you. Anyone, have you guys seen this. I am sure most of you have, but it you haven't, it's worth a read. LDJ's response on tumblr and I think it deserves to be read. Everything he says is dead on and correct, IMO. And he's taking the time to respond to fans (he didn't have to). And make sure the browse the comments also.

Yeah, that's how I saw it. Time Jump, and Crane and Abbie contemplate. Of course Abbie will contemplate Quanitco, and I can (hope?) honestly see her debating on it, if some evil Witness required situation hits. Not because she's devoted to Witness, but because she is struggling with what she lost. I mean, she could have had a stable (?? Hello Scully) career as an amazing FBI agent, but this whole apocalyse BS happened. And anyone in her position would have regrets. Major regrets. This is something I really hope they explore, because I think it's fascinating.

That's why I said earlier that they cannot win. They comment, shit hits the fan. They don't say anything, people bitch and whine. And you expect them to want to communicate with you? Hell no. Okay, here is the thing. Yes, he has a brief tenure, a limited resume (it's really not), and so called status. Okay. Anyone in a new job has a brief tenure. But guess what - when some individuals are on a new job, they get briefed by the experienced ones. They get background information and briefs and knowledge of the past events and past situations. However, it's also a learning experience. On-the-job learning, which this twitter mess will surely educate him. If you think that he doesn't know about the clusterfuck of SH season 2, you are mistaken. This so-called status is quite earned. Because he writes for the bloody show. He has written for many TV shows. He interacts with the actors and network and producers, etc. of the show. He has experience of how network television operates. He KNOWS what's going on with the show that none of us will know. He knows more as a newbie than any of us will ever know. He also has the inside knowledge of where the show is heading. And he knows the past mistakes. He is not the fan police at all. He was just trying to respond, but fact was, he got slammed and attacked and it was not deserved. He may have fumbled on his responses (and obviously got pissed off over the tweets) but he's not in the wrong. Honestly, I think people are wrong to react this way right now. Remember, I'm one of the people who slammed Metzner for this exact same thing. The difference was, Goffman and Metzner has already been recorded stating their love for a particular redhead. The season had already aired several episodes and the writing was clearly degenerating at the time. Leigh D. Jackson has not been accorded any opportunity to demonstrate that he and his boss, CC, and the other new writers have diligently worked to prove that season 3 will be awesome. Let's at least give them a chance.

i didn't even notice that!! *swoon*

You make a very good point and are correct in some way, but now I am not sure about your original point!! To use your analogy, as a moderator, we are supposed to be a representative of the PTV enterprise. However, as a moderator, we also have more inside knowledge than the regular posters here on this board have about many aspects of PTV. However, we also have a leader, and we have to abide by his directives. When you see something occur (say a warning or note posted or a post disappear or a board set up a certain way) there is a lot of behind the scenes discussion that had occurred that you will not know about. Also, we don't discuss this with the members of this board. To apply this to SH, Jackson has the same kind of inside knowledge. He knows what goes on behind the scenes, and he knows the upcoming storylines, but as a writer and therefore a representative of SH, he also has to abide by his showrunner, and also FOX network themselves. He cannot reveal certain information because he is not allowed to at this point, due to FOX directives and Campbell's directives. In terms of the questions asked, in your scenario of a sale, I would not be able to divulge any information about the sale of PTV (if I knew), because I have been directed not to say anything about it. All I can do is deflect and try to appease (which is what Jackson did). But the problem now is that he's getting slammed for his non-answers, but as in a sale, one cannot divulge information that can influence or colour a transaction like this. And in fact, to give an analogy in conversational form and using some recent news ala Reddit... PTV: We hired a new programmer. Welcome Programmer! Public: We heard he worked on Reddit. Reddit was racist crap. He sucks. PTV: He's just a programmer. I assure you, he is quite talented and not a racist. Public: Yeah but the last programmer was racist. This guy must be too. PTV: No, really he's not. We've vetted him. We're watching him. Very closely. Public: Prove it? He worked for Reddit, so obviously he's racist. PTV:??? Uh, we can't for legal and business reasons. But really, he's not. Public: Yes He IS! We've Decided. Nothing you can say will sway us. *stomps feet* Racist Racist Racist!! PTV: .... (Sorry for the terribly made up analogy 'conversation'....) However, if I understood your original post, I thought you were saying that Jackson isn't a representative of SH and I disagree - he is. Maybe I read that wrong! I hope this makes sense!! To add a wearying comment - I don't think I've ever had such strong feelings / made such decisive comments about a TV show ever in my life. Sleepy Hollow, oh how you tax me so. *sigh*

I'm so sad, as my PVR decided to malfunction last night and I lost the episode (along with tons of other stuff I was keeping, dammit). *cries* I'm living through your eyes, people.

Then not a single person here or elsewhere should complain about the lack of information or news or twitter interactions from the writers or actors and showrunner of Sleepy Hollow ever again. Another analogy. You may have had a bad boyfriend/girlfriend in the past. But if you keep expecting your current significant other to behave like that bad relationship, those demons will taint and ruin your current relationship. You will never give your current mate the opportunity to prove his/her worth and you will never find out if this person will be the one to provide true love and happiness. (by "you", I mean general you, not you specifically Julia!)

Damn, I had to look up what WADR meant! Okay, so he's a lucky guy. If he were white, then he would be triply slammed. He's a black guy who has some privilage. Isn't that a good thing? It should be. I'm jealous but this is good. And by life, I mean from when he was born. Do you know what he does in his spare time? Do you know what elementary school he went to? The clubs he attended, the sports he played? What political group he supports, what charities he supports or what causes he cares about? Did he get picked on for his skin colour? Was he beaten up because of it? Did the cops harrass him? Did he lose out on opportunities because of his skin colour. None of us know. So now we had everyone upset for weeks that no one tweeted about Sleepy Hollow, then we get this one guy tweeting, and that's a problem too? So what if he just got hired for the show - he's done other stuff and he is an experienced writer. I assure you he's qualified. Again, regardless of the mess on the show, I think it was completely disrespectful for a white swedish woman to try to school a black american man about the horrors of fighting racism and whatnot all because of a TV show, when he has directly encountered racism in his everyday life. No wonder he was appalled. Guess what would happen in any other circumstance? The girl would be dismissed as a privileged entitled white girl. "Who the hell are you to tell me - a black person - anything. You have privilege. I do not." And I seem to remember many people being happy that two black people were added as writers for this season. Last season, it was complaints that there were no POC in the writers room. Now we have two (three maybe? two new ones, one from last year I think). And now he's dismissed as privilaged because he didn't tweet these words "The entire show will be about Abbie." Because at this point, that's all I am hearing. For the record, the show is about Abbie and Crane. Both will be featured. I hate to break the bad news, because I know many people here hate Crane, but it is a show with two people. Lyndie Greenwood and Orlando Jones were series regulars. They didn't have much screen time. Neither did KW in season 1 who was also a series regular, along with John Noble. How do we know that Nikki Reed's agent didn't demand that she get series regular if the show were to sign her, and the show agree because they wanted her. Why does everyone think she'll be in every episode? And what happens in a month when they cast a POC? Is all forgiven? What if they cast two? Does the Betsy Ross fallout get brushed to the side now? Will you guys apologize to Jackson? Will no one care about the cross-over anymore? Because you know what this is starting to sound like. It's starting to sound a lot like the sandra's out there, counting how many white people are on the show. Here, we are counting the number of black. What on earth is this person supposed to tweet when he's being attacked on all sides. He should have remained silent, tbh, but he tried. Metzner should have warned him, but then everyone would still be in a tizzy getting worked up over nothing and complaining that no one on the show communicates. Well, no wonder they are not communicating, considering when they do, this happens. I probably sound like I've done a flip-flop since my posts yesterday, but I haven't. I've just thought about it and reasoned it out in my head. But I will wait and see. I may side-eye the announcements, I may complain about the announcements, but there is still two months to go. And until I see it on screen, I reserve judgement. I swear, this is like a person who has a slight cough, and the knee-jerk response of the doctor is to immediate euthanize them before getting any more facts. I'm not trying to be harsh - I'm trying to be logical and reasonable about a show that I love. But I feel for this guy, man. He was skewered and I don't think he deserved it. He will deserve it if he ends up being responsible for another Deliverance. But he hasn't shown us what he - and the other writers and showrunner - are capable of.

I read this person's tumblr and know they are very passionate and devoted and into the fandom. She has had a lot of insightful posts and ideas in the past, but for the most part, I am on Jackson's side. I'm sorry, I'm on his side with this. We don't know anything about him and his life. And yes, he spent the last 12 hours tweeting but uh, the NEWS was fucking released 12 + hours ago. What is he supposed to do? Travel into the future in his DeLorean to anticipate this, and start tweeting on day 1 of his job. He's working. He has a life outside SH. Fighting the racism a white person only enounters on the internet due to a television show is NOT the same as a person who has to live it everyday. This guy doesn't deserve this backlash and neither does the show or showrunner at this point. Because we don't know anything about season 3 at all. Nothing but two casting notices. That's it. Considering the events of the past few months, with the racial tensions in the US, in any other circumstance - any other - she would be slammed for being a entitled white person. I have the same apprehensions most others do about season 3, but this is starting to go too far, to be honest. This is getting ridiculous.

They'll praise the "brilliant" FOX executives who came up with the idea and the top level management who got the show to continue, and probably even Cliffy. Fact of life. Then they will pat themselves on the back for being so progressive and forward-thinking and casting diverse. Those who actually deserve the praise probably won't get any of it. But as I said - what they won't be is as gunshy in the future about picking a POC when they cast for a lead role.

It was released a couple of months or so ago - basically it was a one-page generic write up about how season 3 was going to open. Very vague, for the most part, but what it did say was that season 3 opened, now that there is no more evil to fight, Crane is exploring (travelling??) the area and Abbie was contemplating going to Quantico. The impression was that the first one or two episodes is Abbie deciding yes I am going to go, and boom, evil happens, or evil happens, and she is really is torn between once again fighting evil, or just saying screw it, I'm going to the FBI. If I can find the link, I'll edit this link. (I think it was a one-pager presented at the Upfronts, but I can't find it....Ugh)