Churchhoney

I think he means "faithful" in the sense that God always stuck by him and was there in his hour of need and so on, the way you're supposed to be faithful to your spouse and so on. Since he, BG, has faith in God, God has always in return been faithful to him. That's how I read it, anyway.

Yeah, see, in my view, the television just worsened the dumb decisions. They wouldn't have educated any worse without it. They might even have been educated better, since Michelle might have had more time to be bored and spend on their schooling. And television certainly encouraged Boob to double down on his view that his family is a mission and to double down on hushing up and denying every potentially negative thing on the grounds that they needed good pr to get and keep the tv gig, in my opinion. The only clear disadvantage I can see to having no tv cameras is that there likely would have been more whippings. But the world is full of and always has been full of people who grew up with far worse whippings than I expect any of the Duggar kids experienced, and it's truly not the worst thing that can happen to a kid. (Not that it's good. But compared to lousy to no schooling; indoctrination into a complete fantasy world that's utterly unfit for life in current society; indoctrination into the idea that your family and parents are, just as is, perfect because they get high tv ratings; and a near-total foreclosing of all real opportunities, it's not nearly as significant for the future, in my view.) Plus, if the kids are being raised mainly by sister moms and there are just too many for the parents to chase after, that's going to limit the physical punishment. It might not, if the older boys had been put in charge, as happens in some families, because they can really knock you around. But I don't think Jana, Jill and even Jessa would have meted out anything worse than -- and quite possibly not even as bad as -- 90 percent of the population in every corner of the world was exposed to before 1900. In my opinion, the worst thing that can happen to a kid is that it gets a completely screwed-up idea of what the world is like and that its parents' screwed-up ideas are encouraged to worsen with time. And this is what I think that reality tv did to them all. Michelle and Boob went from very little grasp of reality to zero grasp of reality, and the kids grew up having no grasp of reality from the starting gun. And the tv cameras also much heightened Boob's and Michelle's insistence that everyone in the family completely deny virtually all of their real feelings, thoughts and inclinations and thus completely falsify their lives. Everything they are, know and believe ends up phony with those tv cameras there, in my opinion.

Jesus told them because he heard they intended to give 7 percent of the donuts to charity in his name. And post a photograph of it.

Wow, such a great example. But of course their way is their way for a reason. It's intended to totally discourage thought, questioning, deep observation, etc. etc. It's the way of those who want everyone in line with no trouble. The way of the Nazi Youth, actually. It's not an accident that control freaks very very carefully control vocabulary. Words have power because they unlock things, ideas, feelings. The Duggars (and Gothard, of course) know they only have control when the people they dominate are unable to unlock any things.

Amen. It also utterly robs you of your power to do oh so many things in your life. Freezes you into passivity, I guess because, among other things, emotions are what motivate you to act on your own behalf. Suppressing them for years on end makes that pretty difficult to do.

On the other hand, those who go too far with the "love is an emotion" definition are prone to fall head over heels in love with someone else after marriage, too, and then they often walk off, leaving a spouse to curse and struggle. A good friend of mine recently gave me the old "I have a right to be happy, don't I?" thing and, honestly, at this particular point in time, I don't really think she does. Or at least I don't think her right is nearly strong enough to outrank other current considerations, although she's pretty certain that it is, based solely on the strength of her love emotion. Anyway, it seems pretty clear to me that the definition of love that works best for general human happiness is somewhere in between a wholehearted "love is an emotion" and the Wallers' scary and equally absolutist view.

I think it tells you something when celebrity-tv stars from a long-running but recently canceled show do this to get donuts. Wonder what else they'll be getting the kids to perform to bring in some cash and edibles. You might know that the kids would be the ones out working for the money. I suppose JB and M were back at the manse still trying to figure out whose plumbing isn't working well enough to produce Duggar 20. (or 22) This is kind of the overall Duggar principle for living, isn't it? ... I mean, the same might be said for having 19 kids when you find that a) you can't really support them (Jim Bob) and b) you don't actually like kids (Michelle). I want to like this 1000 times.

On the other hand, after both a hot political career (ha) and a media-darling career fell through, maybe Jim Bob, Michelle and Jim Bob's mom (who I'm beginning to think is an equally guilty accomplice and enabler) might have been shocked into cleaning up their damn act and taking real steps to educate and support -- and maybe even limit the size of -- their family. ...... How long were the neighbors and fellow church members going to continue supporting the monstrous brood, anyway? Particularly knowing that JIm Bob had not only been a member of the state legislature but had been born into a business and some money? (I can dream, can't I?)

Wow, thanks for the information. And -- gross. Glad I'm butch then.

Oh, thanks. So he's actually Robin Hood the Pirate. Stole the booty from Krispy Kreme and gave it to the poor. How noble of him.I wouldn't want a photo of myself giving away free donuts as if it were charity, but hey. Clears things up for me about the pirate outfit, though. I thought he might be trying out his costume for another conversion skit.

Well, God gave him plenty of cash and a string of pretty young things to play footsie with, well into his creepy old age, and largely kept him from suffering any consequences at all for being such a dirty old manipulative dictator and hypocrite. And people give him special birthday cakes when he attends their weddings. Sounds like a pretty lucky life to me. I'm glad he was gracious enough to say "thank You."

Derick's a pirate now? A donut-distributing pirate? https://instagram.com/p/71CJh1I5kJ/ Huh?

Who said anything about it being homeschooling that marks Josh out as uneducated? You're saying that I'm the one who"said it originally" but I most certainly didn't. There are fabulously educated homeschooled people. There have been fabulously educated people who educated themselves. I said, specifically, that Josh Duggar is uneducated. I've said on this forum many times that much homeschooling is excellent. Josh, however, was "educated" by ignorant, stupid, lazy, careless, hater-of-learning, public-school-educated Michelle Duggar. And his assigned (and pretty much only allowed) reading material was the frigging "Wisdom Booklets" lazily, carelessly, falsifyingly written by that ass Bill Gothard and his buddies. Those stupid stupid "books" that that ass and his friends probably wrote in about an hour apiece, as they embroidered their stupid fantasies and things-they-wanted-to-brainwash-people-about into supposed "school" subjects. Pure garbage. And with the laziness and ignorance and stupidity of Josh's only "teacher," Michelle, and what looks to me like the general laziness of the Duggar family, he clearly went no farther. You can see that quite obviously in his little "speeches" on behalf of the Family Research Council and in the times when he tried to speak semi-off-the-cuff on the show, such as in one of the last episodes when he "discussed' the "meaning of courtship" with Josiah. He bumbles and blunders around talking like a fool. And it has nothing to do with not going to school. It has everything to do with being mis-educated and, in fact, deliberately un-educated by his horrifyingly stupid mother and father and the old brainwasher Bill Gothard, who deliberately tries to turn kids against learning so that they'll be easier to manipulate. That and, I'd guess, the Duggar laziness that apparently left him content with one of the worst educations on earth, since it got him a job in which he could spend his time preening himself and calling other people ugly names.

No offense taken. I don't think a god would want to do this either. In fact, I don't even think there is a god But I do think that which beliefs we base our lives and actions on may sometimes make things easier or harder to do. And if I were in an arranged marriage that I didn't want because the union was required to consolidate my family's farm holdings, I would find it a lot harder to take than if I were in the same marriage because I believed that that marriage was what my god wanted because it would ultimately do some good for someone or for the world. And I think that might be true for these two creatures. If so, they'll probably be a little happier than the the many centuries worth of arranged couples who were arranged for the purpose of consolidating their family's money and/or power. So ... happier than most of the crowned heads of Europe, perhaps. Since I know that I'd never get the KellerWallers to see anything my way, I might as well hope this for them -- that having a sense of deeper meaning attached to their marriage makes them happier than they otherwise might be in such a sad situation.

Well, you know, it's just the arranged marriage of old. And while those were generally undertaken to enhance families' finances, these guys believe that theirs is for a higher purpose -- God wants them to do it for some important reason. It obviously doesn't fit these times, but if they truly believe that God led them in this direction, and if they can stay clear of the contemporary influences that tell us that marriage is about our personal feelings more than anything else, maybe their beliefs can make it easier for them than it was for the many centuries when that's the way just about everybody did it in lots of places, if not everywhere. That's my hope, anyway. If they both can continue in the belief that they sacrificed their feelings to please the Lord maybe they can avoid disaster. It'd be great if they never had to do that, but I expect that they would both have had to leave their families if they wanted to follow their own bents in the relationship area, and they don't seem to be people who wanted to do that.

Plus, there actually is quite a bit of work involved. Among other things, you've got to hook up to a situation that'll let you assist in 20 births and be the primary midwife in 20 more, plus either assist at or be primary caregiver at 190 exams at various pre-, and post-birth stages. I would think that just the logistics of getting all that arranged would take a fair amount of time, let alone actually doing it. For one thing, when you attend at a birth, you don't just go over to somebody's house, spend an hour and a half and then drive back home. A lot of the time you probably end up there all night or longer. Babies don't arrive on schedule (especially when you're not administering drugs to the mother to make that happen.) Honestly, I remain surprised that she managed to get all that experience in, even now. And the written test is pretty comprehensive .... and I doubt that Jill's been much of a reader or had a lot of experience studying and remembering things. That's also work, and work that I would expect was pretty time consuming for her.

You make a darned good case. .... I suppose he could also just be somebody kind of dim who fell farther into religion than his parents because he was emotionally needy or whatever, and then stay-at-home momism (and the Duggars) came along with that. Whatever the explanation, his life path doesn't exactly scream out "thoughtful" or "successful" or "confident' or "reliable" or "going anywhere sensible." Despite a few higher points, his bio's kind of a mess, no matter how you slice it. And yet he thinks that he has the universal final answer to everything and that he should make it his life's work to get everybody in the world to see things his way. Don't see why anyone would listen to his preaching. I wonder what his mother actually thinks.

No, it just means she doesn't have training from an actual medical institution, such as a nursing school, and can't practice in a medical setting but practices in homes and such instead.

I'm not actually convinced that these clothes do meet the Duggar model a la Gothard, though. Look at all those bright colors, color combinations and prints! All evil eye-traps. I'll bet thousands of LDS men are being defrauded by this hussy wear as we speak. Tragic! Of course, they're all going to hell anyway, so who cares?

Wow, from Derick to Spike. There's a leagues-long leap. Spike > Derick by several million miles. Just remember my new Duggar-inspired motto: Enjoy yourself now, because later you're going to hell. (but apparently all the nicest people will be there)

Methinks the only real reason they wait is so that they can announce it. ..... Just sayin.

I definitely agree with this. ... It does show that Derick's at least a bit different from the guys we're used to seeing in this group. I have to say that I expect Ben would be proud of Jessa for things other than the usual Duggar-y stuff as well .... if she did any such things, that is. As much as Derick and Ben seem to have drunk the Duggar Kool Aid, they do show their differences from the fam in some ways, and that's a good thing. Still have no idea how she can possibly have completed all the clinical stuff, but if she did it, then good for her. Well, she was raised to be delusional, and they definitely made that lesson stick.

When in the world did she do all this, especially Phase 3 -- Document the fulfillment of these requirements on the appropriate NARM application forms. Phase 1: Births as an Observer 10 births in any setting, in any capacity (observer, doula, family member, friend, beginning apprentice). Phase 2: Clinicals as Assistant Under Supervision 20 births, 25 prenatals (including 3 initial exams), 20 newborn exams, 10 postpartum visits as an assistant under the supervision of a qualified preceptor. Phase 3: Clinicals as Primary Under Supervision 20 births, 75 prenatals (including 20 initial prenatals), 20 newborn exams, and 40 postpartum exams as a primary midwife under supervision. Continuity of Care births are required in this phase. I don't recall ever hearing about her being the primary caregiver at all, let alone for 20 births and 135 exams. And that's in addition to assisting in 20 more births and 55 exams. Baffling, to me. If she actually has done all this, then good for her. But I have to say it didn't seem to do much for her clinical judgment when it came to handling her own birth .... Maybe it's actually scarier if she has had ll this experience, because she didn't seem to learn much from it.

Well, they've sure got pretty many leghumpers online who say over and over that they want to be just like them and that they admire the heck out of them. And I guess those people have seen the same stuff that we have. I don't get it either, but I think all those testimonials from the fans probably have done quite a bit to solidify the Duggars' view that they're inspirational and that people find them worth emulating.

When in the hell did she get all that experience as a primary caregiver under supervision? Seems to me somebody's fudging Jilly Muffin's experience.