cereality

Honestly Zach and Jer need to live their own lives and not spend all of their time together -- competing on who got married firm; whose wife pushed out a kid first etc. At Jer's gender reveal, Zach seemed visibly "nervous" that Jer and Auj would also have a boy. I'm sure he was envisioning a lifetime of his son having to compete with Zach's son and never quite being good/fast/handsome enough esp. if he's an LP. And for once in his life, Zach has some attention bc he made the first grandchild and that grandchild happens to be a boy and you know his thunder would be stolen if Jer also had a son. Jer seemed disappointed to me, and Matt couldn't even hide it with his -- this is better, now YOUR son will be king of the farm -- comment to Zach. What grandpa comes out and basically says -- my grandson is more important/wanted than my granddaughter but that's nice for Jer and Auj that they're having a girl!?

Wasn't it one of the Bates -- one of the older ones -- who said something about not wanting to go to college bc they'd have to sit next to someone with green hair? I feel like I always attribute it to the Duggars, but it was a Bates girl? If that's right, they certainly have come a long way -- encouraging their kids to at least take 1 semester of college classes and then decide whether to continue to a degree or find something else. And while no one went to an ivy league -- Erin appears to have finished a college degree as well as Brandon; and it seems like Tori (I think - whoever is dating Bobby) is wanting to finish as well. More than we can say for the Duggars where I think Joseph was the only Duggar to even do 1 semester of college (in person - not sure if anyone is doing anything online).

Not saying Gil isn't a grifter bc he is -- but I do seem to recall that he was laid off (or about to be) from Nabisco and that's when he got into tree trimming. I feel like Zach talked about it in one of the early shows (maybe before UPTv). I think the question was about college or the like and he said something about preferring having a skill like tree trimming or being an EMT/cop bc you'll always have work, whereas what happened to his dad was he went to college and to a big company and then got laid off and realized he had no skills and had to learn tree trimming in his middle age. I specifically recalled it bc I remember thinking even then -- so they think a white collar professionals in finance or accounting or whatever have no skills?!

So they've been married 6 months with no pregnancy announcement? That's got to be some kind of record for fundies. Obviously they're not on TV right now so we don't know if it is an Anna or Erin Bates type of situation where they were tearfully taking tests month after month for the [gasp] 4 long months that it took (for Anna). Here's hoping they're not trying and are even doing some kind of rudimentary NFP so that they can enjoy their first 6 months-1 yr of marriage without pregnancy symptoms etc. They have been fairly "quiet" and removed from the Duggar world. Even their IG doesn't show them running back to the TTH every month, and wasn't there some kind of edict up front re no visitors for the first 6 (12?) months? Hopefully Jeremy is using that time to raise his wife the way that her parents should have but didn't. You know -- little things -- like it's not ok to directly ask people in front of a half dozen others if they're pregnant yet bc you are basically asking about a married couple's sex life.

Can someone fill me in -- where/how did this Jonathan Hartono rumor start? Also, does Jonathan live in Indonesia and would he come here to live if he were to marry Jana? Bc in that case Jana isn't get out from under JB's thumb -- with her husband just starting out in the US and with no job or property here, he's ripe to receive a job and house from JB and then they essentially live under JB's thumb like Bin and Jessa. Or would she go to Indonesia to live with Jonathan -- which would be one hell of a way to get away from JB and the TTM.

Good for Bobby for getting a college degree AND for Tori actually taking the next year to finish off her degree -- rather than just dropping out to get married (ahem - Alyssa). Bummer that Bobby's degree is in "bible and youth ministry." Hopefully it leads to a real job with benefits -- maybe something like Brandon. Hopefully it isn't like the Duggar sons in law, each of whom fancies himself in the "ministry" bc he posts YouTube videos of himself lecturing. I'm guessing it won't turn out like the Duggars simply bc the Bates cannot -- and have not made it a practice -- to support any of the married couples. If you're marrying a Bates girl, you better figure out how to get a house, pay for food, and the daughters appear to like to live relatively nicely -- not extravagant by any means but decent apartments/rental homes, date nights with their husbands, Starbucks runs, they wear nice clothes and even if they are just Old Navy or wherever, there is a cost, and even some driving vacations every so often. So fingers crossed, Bobby is like the Bates sons and sons in law that came before him and takes the next year to start a job and save a bit, so that they can go on an actual honeymoon next yr post marriage and then Tori moves down to Fl. to a decent apartment and they can start a decent married life together. Sierra is 27?? I usually am not very discerning re women's ages but she looks at least 10 yrs older than that -- but then 6 pregnancies and what looks to be 5 kids age 5 or under will do that to you. How do we know there's abuse in the background -- rather than just the fundie, as many as God gives us as we try every 9 months -- view of life?

Saw Lawson saying it on the preview for next season. Was he joking? Why would they give away such a big storyline? Any idea if it's been said anywhere else?? And if it's remotely true - omg is this a good idea for Erin??

What the heck is wrong with these people. We know lots/most men want boys, but how many times did Matt and Jer need to say -- I hope the first grandbaby is a boy, that's how it needs to be. Even after the reveal, Matt hugs Zach and goes "it's better this way." WTF!? You wanted a boy, we get it -- even though the DAD didn't seem obsessed with it. And Jer with his whole -- well Zach has started the clock running for us, he can't be 3 kids ahead of us. Uh - yeah dude he could - bc most adults don't see this as a contest. Most adults try to get jobs and some time of permanent home before procreating and it's fine if that takes you a yr or two longer than your twin -- even though you've always been the alpha in that relationship. And how much does Tori not want a little person. OMG. It's so obvious that she does NOT feel like either is fine and is dreading having an LP, health issues etc. Nothing wrong with that -- as she said NO parent wants to hear something is wrong. Obviously. BUT did she not consider this when marrying/procreating with a little person? It's not even like there's LP genes somewhere in the genetic line so there's some remote possibility of an LP child-- Zach is the LP, so it's a 50-50 chance.

Derick looks good in that Nepal pic -- meaning happy and at a healthy weight esp when you look at his arms/neck etc. Though I will say the recent IG pictures (from 6 weeks ago) look better than previous Central America pictures in terms of his weight/health.

Isn't there a limit on the number of c sections you can safely have in a lifetime - something like 4 or 5 max? I don't have kids but I feel like I have a few friends who have 3 kids - all via c sections - they want a 4th but bc they believe in doctors and science they are thinking hard about the risks of a 4th c section. If what was said above is right - that Arkansas hospitals don't let you VBAC generally, then there is NO way Jilly Muffin considers delivering in a hospital, even if she has appropriate insurance. I mean if she shows up at a hospital, given how birth went last time (I imagine they'd have the records), I imagine they don't let her labor for long at all; if that kid doesn't pop out in 2 hrs -- she may be "forced" to have a c section. While she has given birth once and 2nd kids are supposedly delivered quickly, bc she wasn't able to get Iz out the usual way -- who knows if her body has experienced dilation and would "remember" to do that quickly for kid #2. There's a huge chance her body views this as a first birth, takes its sweet time, and doctors freak out and say -- sorry, c section, we aren't going to risk your/baby's health. And then suddenly - BAM - you have a limit on your family size and that's not what God willed. Though I guess that limit only applies if you choose to listen to the doctors and limit yourself to another 2 kids and be done - and we all know how the Duggars feel about secular medical advice. Man - if Derick could convince Jilly that the Lord is telling him - hospital birth and that leads to a c section - that sucker is home free, as he'd likely only end up with 4 kids rather than 8 or 15 or whatever it'll be otherwise.

What kind of insurance do these fools have? I know Obamacare now "requires" everyone to carry some insurance or pay a penalty -- but the plans that provide actual services aren't all that cheap; what do you want to bet that these guys opted for some plan for a few $ a month which doesn't cover extensive care like maternity and is really meant for young people who go to the doctor once in 4 yrs. Point is - Jilly Muffin had the benefit of Walmart corporate benefits last time - the type that would have allowed a c section at a hospital and a 3-4 day hospital stay even if it wasn't an emergency situation bc Derick hadn't taken on the grifting lifestyle yet. And still she chose to birth at home for days until it was an emergency situation. So now with minimal health insurance, there's an even higher chance that she and her headship decide that the Lord is leading them to a home birth . . . . Frankly if cost is an issue, I think it may still be safer to birth at a big city hospital in central America; they could afford to pay cash in U.S. dollars and every country has hospitals that cater to the upper crust in that country -- with actual MDs who've seen complicated cases etc. I imagine the central American countries are no different (esp. in the capital cities or where ex-pats live -- not in the rural villages where they're hanging out).

They're idiots no doubt but thank goodness Derick is now an idiot without a gross man bun. And here's a question - why on earth does Jilly Muffin's bathroom have a picture of her parents getting cozy on the couch in their younger days? They really want to see their parents/inlaws faces while doing bathroom things??They really want a frame picture in their home of JB getting a hard on for his wife at age 25?

Not sure about this. I have definitely known women like this -- and Jill for all her negatives does not strike me that way. If nothing else she grew up in a huge fundie family with live in grandparents for a time and knows tons of other fundie families. I think she realizes that when a guy has 10 sisters, he's still "responsible" for them in making sure they get married even after he has already married, flown the coop and had his own kids. So I don't think she thinks a family just goes away once you get the man. Frankly the women I know that feel that way are from much smaller, not particularly close nuclear families - they are ok seeing their own families 1x a yr and talking to them 1x every few months -- so then they are driven nuts by the idea that their husband is talking to his mom bc they are supposed to be THE woman in his life. Frankly I think Jill (and her siblings) act the way they do bc they don't have the mental development of 20-somethings. They are so stunted and isolated that their development is of a 13 or 15 yr old. A 13 yr old -- not knowing what to do -- would think it was ok to bring cookies and giggle in a dire situation or would awkwardly stand there and not even offer a hug or a pat on the arm when someone wistfully speaks about a painful memory. They wouldn't necessarily do this bc they were rude -- they'd do it bc they have NO IDEA how to react bc they have no life experience so they awkwardly just stand there and hope the story goes fast bc they don't know what to say.

Any update on Jilly Muffin and Derick? Are they back from central America? I've totally lost touch since the show isn't on right now. But most importantly --did Derick CUT HIS HAIR?? The last pics on both of their instagrams are from 6 weeks ago -- and Derick looks somewhat human with a shave and short hair? Are they old pics or something?

Wow. Marjorie is in college. With roommates. Who are either Korean-American or Korean internationals in the U.S. Happy for her. As spunky as she was and as much as I wanted her and Josiah to get the hell out, we all know how the Duggar vortex works. They would have married. JB would have dangled a used car dealership and a house in front of Josiah and as much as he seems dissatisfied in that life, he would've jumped on it -- bc as unqualified as he is, you know he would start having concerns (and if he didn't - JB would plant the seeds) about how he could possibly afford to take care of a wife and family without daddy's help, so he wouldn't push daddy's help away and then live under his thumb. Good for Marjorie for NOT looking for another engagement ASAP and rather pursuing a normal 19 yr old's life. Trace certainly looks more handsome as he gets older -- I think it helps that his braces are gone and he's gained a bit of weight on his face. Doesn't he have a girlfriend now -- there was some girl he brought on the ski trip as a "friend" and we all know that's the Bates' get to know you period. So Tori is courting Bobby -- any idea what Bobby is studying/what he plans to do after PCC? How about that Evan Stewart kid -- can't remember which girl he belongs too but my recollection is he's from Nashville and somehow pursuing "ministry." Bummer -- bc until now the Bates have done an excellent job staying away from loser "ministry" sons in law and actually have attracted guys with some training/education who are gainfully employed.

While I realize these cults are set up so the potential husband has to go to his potential father in law to confess his sins and then FIL gets to decide whether or not the guy has repented enough to be marriable -- the reality is all of this is done in high level fundie speak so as to diminish what actually happens. I highly doubt Josh and JB went to Pa Keller and explained that for x months/years, Josh was touching 5 of his sisters and he was specifically putting his fingers in places A,B,C and the sisters were ages X,Y,Z. Nope I bet you it was all - I had sin in my heart and I blamed it on my youthful indiscretions and the devil, I confessed to my parents and they put in me in the prayer closet and I purposed to save all sexual thoughts until marriage. So Pa Keller walks away thinking - oh he was pining for another girl or [gasp] he jerked off -- but then it gets diminished bc what guy hasn't done those things!? Bet you it was the same with Tabitha's husband with a whole explanation of how the system was out to get him so Pa Paine should ignore any/all court papers - and what do you want to bet Pa Paine didn't even pull up the court papers!?

Oh I agree, they're all cut from the same cloth. Plus Erin and her husband now officially have to share a brain. It is impossible for her to think - this is a bad thing - when Chad obviously is looking at it as the biggest blessing for his sister. And I say obviously bc in this cult, if a brother steps up and says - no you are not courting or marrying this guy, the womenfolk can't. We've even hear JD say that Jana has come to him and asked him to check out potential guys for her and he's said "nah I don't think this'll work but I'll [half heartedly] see what I can find out." So a brother can put the kibosh on the deal just bc he feels like it. So clearly Prince Chad and all the other brothers in the family want their sister married off bad enough that they were willing to believe Tim's whole redemption BS and overlook his obvious criminality. If this ends up as screwed up as Anna Duggar's marriage, I hope they'll then blame themselves for not stepping up in their manly duty of protecting their dumb sister.

Where/to whom did Erin say she wouldn't discuss Tabitha/Tim? One would hope she'd say - I won't discuss it - while thinking she's disgusted by the whole thing but she knows that it is her father in law's decision and she can't do anything about it but she doesn't want to think about it for one more second. Reality is in this cult - I don't discuss it means - I think you all are mean for bashing my perfect husband's family; we are all so #blessed that his 31 yr old sister FINALLY found a man and will have some babies; this is a true blessing from God that she found a perfectly lovely fella and everything that's been said about him is false bc y'all are just mean.

Man - Joy locked it down too quick. Why not try to rub elbows with someone like Joe Paine at fundie weddings etc. -- they only live 1 state away. He's cute. He appears to be sociable. He's a true fundie - if his crazy fundie family is any indication. And being one of the younger of a long line of brothers, he has seen how courtships work and would likely have romanced her the way Chad romanced Erin - rather than describing her as reliable/can get stuff done and then sitting her on the side of a mountain and saying God said they should court - like Austin did. And if it didn't work out, Austin would still have been available 3-6 months later.

What's Joe Paine's deal? Given the IG handle, was he born in 98 -- which would make him 19? He's got the Paine guy looks - and from his IG appears to have some friends . . . . Hopefully he make a good catch for a fundie girl in the next 1-9 yrs. Any 19 yr old Duggar girls??

I too thought the Tabitha as nanny/tutor was a set up for her to live with the Duggars and for JD to decide that God was purposing for him to court her. He's younger than her but still the oldest eligible Duggar male. I kind of wonder why he didn't make a move? I mean where else is he meeting fundie girls? If one falls in your lap who is desperate to marry, don't you lock it up? He can't be holding out for someone with better looks, right - bc he isn't so hot himself? In prior seasons, he has seemed sad that he isn't married. There was some event where they went zip lining with Ben and Derrick - for them to prove that they were man enough to marry their sisters - and JD said something about how it doesn't matter if something happens to him bc he doesn't have a wife/kids waiting for him; and when he built that playground for his siblings, he made a comment about "lord willing I'll build something like this for my own kids one day." Yet last season when producers asked him if he was looking, he said "I'm too busy for that" -- which came across as -- I don't want to get married anyway . . . so he doesn't look like he's pining for something he can't/won't have. I kind of wonder if he wants a "regular" Christian (like Whitney) so he can go fundie lite. With an arranged marriage set up by the Paines and JB -he'd be locked into a fundie life of no birth control, a kid every year etc. Even though Tabitha is in her 30s, I bet she could still have 8-10 kids if they tried constantly. I feel like he'd do better in a more "regular" religious conservative life -- a stay home wife; he provides as a contractor/construction guy; and 2-3 kids attending Christian school.

Just goes to show how fundie perfect Prince Chad really is. I mean he's supposed to be the protector of his sisters bc he was born a man. And you know he said/did nothing to stop this wedding or talk his sister out of it or even express his concerns to her so she'd feel it was ok to walk away. Nope. You know he and Erin have likely be thinking it's so sad that his 30+ yr old sister is STILL single and has no babies -- at this point she just needs to marry anything that professes to be godly and has a d--k -- doesn't matter about his past or what he's done or that he's decades older than her. Such a prince . . . there's something about that guy's "perfection" and soft tones that has always irked me -- no matter how much he loves Erin and his kids.

Michaela isn't the one with the medical transcription certificate - that's Whitney. As for why she went to community college for a semester - Gil and Kelly encourage all of their kids to attend for at least 1-2 semesters and the parents pay for it. After that the young adult gets to decide whether they want to continue and finish a degree or whether they'd rather get a job; I assume if they want to continue, they sit down with their parents and come up with a plan for how many classes they'll take per semester and how they'll pay and what kind of job/profession that degree prepares them for -- bc I don't have the sense that with 19 kids, Gil & Kelly can pay for 19 degrees, even if 2 yrs each. I'm guessing Michaela did a semester at college, basically went to school and came home, and enjoyed other domestic things more like babysitting her siblings, cooking with her mom, and sewing; that likely led her to get a full time nanny job rather than continuing to pay for college. In contrast, Kelly has said that with Tori (and/or maybe Carlin) they love college so much, it's impossible to get them to come home after class bc they're hanging out; I am betting Michaela did NOT gravitate to the social life/making friends the same way and thus was not as excited to continue as her sisters. I tend to agree the fundie cult is uneducated and each generation will get worse as the uneducated home school their kids. BUT I don't view Gil and Kelly as uneducated -- both have 4 yr college degrees; Kelly seems to really enjoy and value learning, so I'm willing to bet that she took home schooling seriously for her kids and didn't just sit them in front of a computer. And her kids seem to all be surviving Crown College; I'm not suggesting it's the ivy league - but even an unaccredited school will require that you can read and write at the high school level and if you can't, you'll fail out. Unlike the Duggars, I would bet many of the Bates kids are probably as educated as the average American high school grad (not an honors or AP student - an average B student). I'm not a believer than everyone MUST go to college. How does a business admin degree help? Michaela wants to sew - she doesn't want to manage a bunch of seamstresses. And no college in the world gives you a sewing degree - it's a learning by doing trade. She can make goods to sell online. If she wants a bigger challenge and if the baby thing doesn't happen soon, she can always try to get together with a local seamstress/wedding dress place to do alterations, or do some advertising and start her own business making/altering dress pants; prom dresses; wedding dresses etc.

Evan has 4 sisters. I assume they are coaching him on how to romance a girl and one of them convinced him a yellow, you are my sunshine basket complete with Lays potato chips was the way to go. So is this family band a hobby for Sunday's or a full time ministry? Bc I kind of liked that thus far the Bates have no sons in law lounging with a fake ministry - it adds some depth to their family that all hold jobs.

So it looks like Carlin's boyfriend's a fundie. From Nashville though "only" a family of 6 kids. He's a few years older (they didn't specify) and sings in some family gospel band which functions as a ministry. I sincerely hope that is a hobby or weekend activity, and he like the other sons in law is in college or has a trade. I have to say, I kind of like that thus far the Bates have not married any uneducated losers loafing around and preaching on youtube calling it a "ministry." I like that they all work and consequently they all interact with the secular, non-fundie world -- bc I think that's what causes these couples to be a little more "open minded" and a little less like -- oohh he's the headship, whatever he wants is what the wife MUST do.