S02.E08: Mercy

[MarkHB]

Quote

Dev and Jayna help Seg and Nyssa target General Zod's fleet when they make a shocking discovery.

[SimoneS]

So Lyta wasn't dead. I figured when the show didn't make an announcement about the actress' departure.

[AnimeMania]

Not really the show's fault, but a funny thing happened when I was watching with the Closed Captions on (not a big deal, since I watch all my shows with the CC on).

Dev:  I am sorry I doubted you. After all that happened, I didn't want to get my hopes up, not until I knew it was true.

Lyta:  It's alright Dev, I would have done the same.

Here is what the Closed Captions wrote:

Lyta:  It's alright Dad, I would have done the same.

With all the time travel shenanigans already, we don't need the Closed Captions making things worse. I can imagine all the deaf viewers going: Whaaaat!

Seg-El kisses Lyta-Zod and says "Your kisses taste like cabbage juice and vomit".

[MarkHB]

I'm pretty much a total non-shipper, but I have to say that I'm totally #TeamNyssa. She was loyal to Seg back when there was really no reason to be, and he just keeps rubbing the Lyta thing in her face.

OTOH, if that's what Kryptonopolis is really like on this show, that was pretty damn cool!

[Chick2Chic]

It's not really rubbing it in Nyssa's face when Seg is in love with Lyta, has been very open about it since forever, and hasn't expressed an interest in returning Nyssa's romantic feelings, mostly just focusing on them co-parenting. He's not going to restrain himself thinking of her feelings when the woman he loves that he thought he saw murdered turns out to be alive. Nyssa trying to immediately move from co-parenting with Seg to an unreciprocated romance with him built on Lyta's corpse was a choice she made. 

Anywho, I am glad Lyta is back, got herself out of the Black Mercy when the toxins lessened, fought off the guard trying to restrain her and killed the guards who were about to shoot Jayna & Dev. Also, that fight with Dru restraining her so he could violate her with Black Mercy was chilling. Jayna seeing Lyta again and being so happy made me smile. I'm also happy Lyta apologized for her past actions. That was needed. 

Lyta's made some bad choices, though she's far from alone in making poor choices on this show, as well having been violated and brutalized for months. She's been a victim too of her son and I'm not going to dismiss her victimization. 

[AnimeMania]

6 hours ago, MarkHB said:

OTOH, if that's what Kryptonopolis is really like on this show, that was pretty damn cool!

Provided you have Rank, we already saw how the Rankless live. I wonder what the Rank vs Rankless ratio is like, maybe 1%?

[MarkHB]

16 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

Provided you have Rank, we already saw how the Rankless live. I wonder what the Rank vs Rankless ratio is like, maybe 1%?

But I wonder if the Rank vs Rankless thing (or the dominance of the Voice of Rao) is (was) common from one city-state to the next, or if they each had their own distinct societal organization prior to being conquered by Zod.

I'm not dismissing Lyta's victimization, but I also recognize that 1) arranged or not, Seg and Nyssa already underwent the Binding and it seems from Lyta's fantasy that that's a Pretty Big Deal, 2) Lyta was engaged to Dev, and 3) my own personal belief that star-crossed lovers should just accept that they're star-crossed and move the hell on.

[scarynikki12]

2 hours ago, MarkHB said:

star-crossed lovers should just accept that they're star-crossed and move the hell on.

After tonight's episode I'm completely convinced that this will happen. They'll bask in the glow of their reunion for now but eventually they'll break up for good. Right now my theory is that it's a combination of Lyta trying to prevent the current Zod by merging her DNA with someone else (and it will turn out that Zod's bio-father ultimately doesn't matter while Lyta being his mother does) and her and Seg deciding not to break up the family he has with Nyssa and Jor. The tragedy of their relationship has to be the point.

[tennisgurl]

Lyta is alive! I feel really terrible for her, she made some pretty big mistakes but she did realize the error of her ways apparently and tried to stop her son, but then he locked her in the creepy happy place death plant that shows up in the Superman mythos semi-frequently. Then she had to fight against it to get back to a world where, as far as she knew, she had murdered her mother and the man she loves is gone forever. I am really glad that she reunited with Jayna and that they made up, and that she and Seg found each other, after alternately thinking the other was dead or trapped in the space between spaces for ages now. Also that she got to save herself from the Black Mercy, fight off the guard, and even saved Dev and Jayna.

The love triangle is pretty complicated and I generally think the show does a pretty goods job with it. Seg is in love with Lyta and vice versa, but Nyssa clearly has feelings for Seg, despite her knowing very well that he loves Lyta. Thats also complicated by Nyssa and Lyta being arranged married with a child (that isn't currently trying to conquer the universe) and Seg does clearly care about her deeply, if not romantically. I do think that he will end up with Nyssa so that the whole El line is all neat and tidy together, but its hard to tell at this point. 

I love that in Lytas happy place it looks like she put Nyssa and Dev together as a couple! Its like at the end of a romcom where the exs of the main characters hook up with each other at the end so that everyone is paired off and happy!

I kind of missed the over the top Ra religious outfits. 

[rove4]

18 hours ago, MarkHB said:

star-crossed lovers should just accept that they're star-crossed and move the hell on.

My thinking too!  Even in high school when we had to read Romeo and Juliet I thought they were both idiots.

I've always been meh! on Lyta since the beginning.  And here's the thing...if writers want me to feel invested in a romance then I have to be there for the journey. Seg and Lyta were already in an established relationship when the show started so there was no journey from first meeting to flirting to first date/first kiss/first everything so I don't really care.  And it doesn't help matters that, to me, there is zero chemistry there whereas there is some nice chemistry between Seg and Nyssa.  But if the show insists on making him and Lyta the main pairing then it's a good thing I dvr the show and watch it later.  I'll just keep FFing through their scenes together.  She's the least interesting character to me on the whole show. 

[Chick2Chic]

22 hours ago, MarkHB said:

I'm not dismissing Lyta's victimization, but I also recognize that 1) arranged or not, Seg and Nyssa already underwent the Binding and it seems from Lyta's fantasy that that's a Pretty Big Deal, 2) Lyta was engaged to Dev, and 3) my own personal belief that star-crossed lovers should just accept that they're star-crossed and move the hell on.

I disagree because nothing listed actually acknowledges her actual victimization or brutalization, instead it seems like reasons why she should just go away even though it's not just her feelings involved nor are they one-sided. This is putting all the onus on Lyta like she's a gnat that needs to be swatted away so Nyssa can thrive instead plus it ignores that Seg is just as in love with Lyta as she is with him and unwilling to let her go (and is an aside from the trauma done to Lyta that is IMO being dismissed). 

Dev let go cause he has some pride about wanting someone who wants someone else more as well as spoke to Lyta about his feelings on the matter & let her know he still cares for her and wants her to be happy. But we'll have to agree to disagree on this topic cause what I'm seeing on the topic of Lyta, her feelings, and the abuses done to her  - or rather the lack of it - are disturbing to me [as a Black woman] and I'd rather not get upset about it. 

13 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Lyta is alive! I feel really terrible for her, she made some pretty big mistakes but she did realize the error of her ways apparently and tried to stop her son, but then he locked her in the creepy happy place death plant that shows up in the Superman mythos semi-frequently. Then she had to fight against it to get back to a world where, as far as she knew, she had murdered her mother and the man she loves is gone forever. I am really glad that she reunited with Jayna and that they made up, and that she and Seg found each other, after alternately thinking the other was dead or trapped in the space between spaces for ages now. Also that she got to save herself from the Black Mercy, fight off the guard, and even saved Dev and Jayna.

Yes! All this!

[SimoneS]

3 hours ago, Chick2Chic said:

I disagree because nothing listed actually acknowledges her actual victimization or brutalization, instead it seems like reasons why she should just go away even though it's not just her feelings involved nor are they one-sided. This is putting all the onus on Lyta like she's a gnat that needs to be swatted away so Nyssa can thrive instead plus it ignores that Seg is just as in love with Lyta as she is with him and unwilling to let her go (and is an aside from the trauma done to Lyta that is IMO being dismissed). 

Dev let go cause he has some pride about wanting someone who wants someone else more as well as spoke to Lyta about his feelings on the matter & let her know he still cares for her and wants her to be happy. But we'll have to agree to disagree on this topic cause what I'm seeing on the topic of Lyta, her feelings, and the abuses done to her  - or rather the lack of it - are disturbing to me [as a Black woman] and I'd rather not get upset about it. 

Yes! All this!

Agreed. I roll my eyes as at the demands that Lyta either step aside or be tossed aside so Nyssa can have Seg. I suggest that like Dev, Nyssa get some freaking pride and find someone who loves her. Since Superman isn't Black, it is obvious that Lyta isn't his biological grandmother, but who knows what that means for Seg and Lyta's relationship. It is very possible that Seg's son with Nyssa gets a new name and becomes Jor-El.

Edited August 2, 2019 by SimoneS

[Grace19]

I'm glad Lyta is back. I never watched an extra episode after they killed her till now. Even though I like her and Seg, I've made my peace with the both of them maybe not ending up together. The only thing that would make me stop watching is if they kill Lyta or start writing any of the Zods poorly. They are my favourite part of the show along with brainiac.

I found it funny the way people were acting all nice when she died. "Oh not Lyta, I liked her. I want Nyssa with Seg but please don't kill Lyta." But immediately she was brought back it became "she should have stayed dead. What about Nyssa?", I'm glad people have stopped pretending they cared about her. 

This show is an okay show. The best part of it is the Zod family and the villains. The best acting comes from the people playing them. And I'm glad the tptb recognises that and is keeping the Zod family as central to the story as the ELs. 

I also want to say that since Jor el is already born, Seg could end up with either or neither of both women and the future will still be intact. Hell Seg could be killed off and nothing would change at this point. So Seg don't have to be with Nyssa to ensure kal el's future. They could both raise the child and still not end up together. I glad tptb are not being predictable.

[Latverian Diplomat]

I'm finding the latter half of this season much better than the initial half.

Season one had the same pattern. I think 10 episodes is just too much for the amount of story they have. Maybe just 8 would be better?

Also the Black Mercy never got its own book, but it's a much more interesting "villain" than Lobo in my book.

[Jacks-Son]

On 8/1/2019 at 10:42 AM, Chick2Chic said:

It's not really rubbing it in Nyssa's face when Seg is in love with Lyta, has been very open about it since forever, and hasn't expressed an interest in returning Nyssa's romantic feelings, mostly just focusing on them co-parenting. He's not going to restrain himself thinking of her feelings when the woman he loves that he thought he saw murdered turns out to be alive. Nyssa trying to immediately move from co-parenting with Seg to an unreciprocated romance with him built on Lyta's corpse was a choice she made. 

While I agree that Seg never hid how he felt about Lyta, Nyssa chose Seg to Bind with in the first place.  She went above and beyond to convince her father to bind her with Seg, so she was already longing to be with Seg from the beginning.  She had a child by that very same man that she wanted. So, it wasn't a case of her moving in over Lyta's corpse, as even before Lyta was killed, Nyssa was already yearning for Seg.

[Chick2Chic]

[MarkHB]

One other thing that jumped out at me this week: Seg rattling off the sectors he was scanning.  Those are the sectors used by the Green Lantern Corps, and it's established that Krypton was, in fact, in Sector 2813 which Seg called the "home sector."

[SimoneS]

On 8/3/2019 at 9:03 PM, Jacks-Son said:

While I agree that Seg never hid how he felt about Lyta, Nyssa chose Seg to Bind with in the first place.  She went above and beyond to convince her father to bind her with Seg, so she was already longing to be with Seg from the beginning.  She had a child by that very same man that she wanted. So, it wasn't a case of her moving in over Lyta's corpse, as even before Lyta was killed, Nyssa was already yearning for Seg.

Seg is not responsible for Nyssa's yearnings. Lyta is the woman that Seg loves. If Nyssa can't manage some pride and move on, she should focus on the child she is supposed to be raising. 

[clyo22]

I was really proud of Lyta in this episode. It must have taken so much strength to get out of that dream and come to a reality where her mother and Seg were supposedly gone. She was really brave.

The show surprised me with Lyta. First her death and then her reappearance. very good!

I disliked Lyta and Seg in season one. First because I prefer to see my characters fall in love and not just hear that they are made for each other. Second I found the whole Zod/El forbidden love story so cliché. And third because Seg kept lying to her and saying "trust me" all the time while putting her in danger. And she would always do whatever he said! I wanted her to dump him.

At the end of season one when she chose Dru Zod, I was slightly happy that she finally did something that wasn't about pleasing Seg but mostly sad that she let her son manipulate her into shooting her own mother. All in all I am happy that she beat the black mercy and I can't wait to see her face to face with Dru.

Seg may not be responsible for Nyssa's yearnings but it doesn't make her feelings invalid or wrong. In show timeline it hasn't been all that long, so even if Seg is never going to love her back, she shouldn't be expected to just move on that quickly. She has the right to yearn, to be sad and I empathize with her.

My favorite characters remain Jayna Zod and Nyssa Vex. As long as those two have good story lines, I am happy.

[Chick2Chic]

15 minutes ago, clyo22 said:

Seg may not be responsible for Nyssa's yearnings but it doesn't make her feelings invalid or wrong. In show timeline it hasn't been all that long, so even if Seg is never going to love her back, she shouldn't be expected to just move on that quickly. She has the right to yearn, to be sad and I empathize with her.

I don't think anyone has stated Nyssa's feelings are wrong or invalid. IMO she should maybe take a page from Dev's book when the person you love is in love with someone else, but not everyone else has pride or the ability to bounce back like that. 

If Nyssa is her own woman, and a badass woman at that, then she herself is responsible for her own feelings. I can empathize with her unrequited love and still side-eye how she handles herself around Seg and/or what is expected of him because Nyssa feels the way she does about him. 

Seg is not responsible for Nyssa's feelings and he isn't in the wrong for not putting her feelings before his own (nor before Lyta's or anyone else's feelings). The desire to dismiss or blame Lyta as if she is wrong for being in love with Seg or Seg being in love with Lyta because Nyssa's feelings should matter more that their own feelings, when Nyssa's feelings do not matter more than anyone else's feelings is baffling to me. Why should Nyssa's feelings for Seg matter more than Seg and Lyta's feelings for each other? 

Seg & Lyta were reunited after Seg thought he saw Lyta murdered that even Jayna was soft about that reunion between them & that moment of joy should be about them enjoying their mutual love & happiness that Lyta was alive... not about Nyssa. It's also confounding to me that Lyta can be assaulted, brutalized, and a victim of her crazy ass son, free herself, save her mother & ex, and reunite with the man she loves who also loves her and the takeaway is about how Seg is wrong for not putting Nyssa's feelings first. Obviously mileage varies but it's a bit disturbing IMO to see the invalidation of Lyta as a character, as if her pain matters less for reasons, even though Lyta's just as badass as some other characters on the show and especially having been raised a fierce warrior by an equally fierce woman. 

4 hours ago, SimoneS said:

Seg is not responsible for Nyssa's yearnings. Lyta is the woman that Seg loves. If Nyssa can't manage some pride and move on, she should focus on the child she is supposed to be raising. 

I agree with this wholeheartedly. 

[MarkHB]

Personally, I am largely disinterested in who loves whom. Seg and Nyssa are Bound, which from the context the show has given me I can only interpret as meaning "married".  I'm not holding Lyta responsible at this point; she doesn't really owe Nyssa anything. But Seg should have more respect for the fact that he and Nyssa are, whether it's what he wants or not, bound with one another; he should also respect that 30 seconds before he had told Nyssa that he would stand by her forever. I felt the same way last season, before Dru even entered the picture, the first time the show went out of its way to show us Nyssa's reaction to Seg and Lyta's lovey-dovey reunion, staged almost exactly as it was in this episode.

[Mikita]

59 minutes ago, MarkHB said:

Personally, I am largely disinterested in who loves whom. Seg and Nyssa are Bound, which from the context the show has given me I can only interpret as meaning "married".  I'm not holding Lyta responsible at this point; she doesn't really owe Nyssa anything. But Seg should have more respect for the fact that he and Nyssa are, whether it's what he wants or not, bound with one another; he should also respect that 30 seconds before he had told Nyssa that he would stand by her forever. I felt the same way last season, before Dru even entered the picture, the first time the show went out of its way to show us Nyssa's reaction to Seg and Lyta's lovey-dovey reunion, staged almost exactly as it was in this episode.

What he actually said to Nyssa, was that he didn't know how they were going to find their son, but he would be with her every step of the way. It was not a pledge to love her for the rest of their lives or stand by her side for the rest of their lives. He is still going to help her find their son. Doesn't mean he doesn't love Lyta. Everyone, including Nyssa knows this. She knew before they were bound. Not sure what they Krypton laws are regarding being bound to another. Is it for life? Either way, Seg lost the love of his life, I'm sure that he doesn't want to be seperated from Lyta again.

[rove4]

19 hours ago, Chick2Chic said:

It's also confounding to me that Lyta can be assaulted, brutalized, and a victim of her crazy ass son, free herself, save her mother & ex, and reunite with the man she loves who also loves her and the takeaway is about how Seg is wrong for not putting Nyssa's feelings first. Obviously mileage varies but it's a bit disturbing IMO to see the invalidation of Lyta as a character, as if her pain matters less for reasons, even though Lyta's just as badass as some other characters on the show and especially having been raised a fierce warrior by an equally fierce woman. 

I don't care about who romances who but, for me, the issue is that Lyta's character comes across as flat.  I'm not familiar with the actress, have never seen her in anything else, but I find her to be without any charisma or screen presence in this role.   She may be awesome in something else but I can only go by what I see of her in this show.  I agree that her character has had some horrible stuff happen to her and that should make for a dramatic storyline but the actress is just so bland that I don't feel anything for her.  My brain just sort of skims right over her because there's nothing in the actress' delivery that compels my attention or my emotional investment.  If the show were a painting, she'd be this blank spot in an otherwise vivid canvas.  Obviously this is just my perception and perception is totally subjective but that's just my 2 cents on why I'm so "meh" about her. 

Edited August 7, 2019 by rove4

[phoenics]

On 8/6/2019 at 5:32 PM, Chick2Chic said:

It's also confounding to me that Lyta can be assaulted, brutalized, and a victim of her crazy ass son, free herself, save her mother & ex, and reunite with the man she loves who also loves her and the takeaway is about how Seg is wrong for not putting Nyssa's feelings first. Obviously mileage varies but it's a bit disturbing IMO to see the invalidation of Lyta as a character, as if her pain matters less for reasons, even though Lyta's just as badass as some other characters on the show and especially having been raised a fierce warrior by an equally fierce woman. 

I couldn't agree more with this.  I think the writers have bent over backwards to show how in love Lyta/Seg are and how badass Lyta has been and continues to be.  They've shown she was victimized and brutalized. 

I'm so glad she's not dead.  I was worried the show caved in to the BS for a moment.  But it was enlightening to uncover people's true feelings about Lyta - such a sharp turn from the "Oh I loved Lyta" platitudes when she was thought to be dead to the "she should just go away" admonishments now that she's not dead.

Good for the producers not killing off their female lead.

Edited August 10, 2019 by phoenics