S01.E01: REWATCH: Sex and the City

[Bella]

 

 

"It's like the riddle of the Sphinx... Why are there so many great unmarried women, and no great unmarried men?" - Carrie

At a birthday party for thirtysomething Miranda, Carrie and her friends vow to stop worrying about findng the perfect male and start having sex like men. Carrie experiments with an old flame and meets Mr. Big; Miranda warms up to Skipper; Samantha has a one night stand with a man Charlotte wouldn't sleep with on the first date.

 

(This may also have been the pilot.) Topic opens 6 a.m. EDT on June 9, 2014.

[Bella]

Okay, so ... did anyone else rewatch? I did, but I'll hold my comments to see what others thought.

[MadRat]

I'm waiting for my husband to go to work. And then hoping my DVD works because there is a single tooth mark at the very edge of the disc. My beagle is bad.

[Mik]

I really hate Carrie's hair and makeup in this episode... she looks worse than at any other point in the series. I also hate the talking to the camera, especially in the scene where Carrie is talking to Charlotte on the phone. It's not a terrible episode, but it's definitely not great. Much better episodes to come in S1.

[Bella]

I thought her hair was dreadful, but were her clothes ever again this "normal"?

 

I liked the way Big came into the picture, though if he were as wealthy as he was supposed to be, Carrie (and Samantha) wouldn't have been able to get near him - he'd be way out of their league.

 

Did this come across like a pilot to anyone else? It was as if the producers took a bunch of concepts, threw them on the wall, and wrote the remaining episodes after seeing what stuck.

[Princess Sparkle]

I also hate the talking to the camera, especially in the scene where Carrie is talking to Charlotte on the phone.

I had completely forgot they had talking to the camera segments unt I rewatched. So glad they dropped that.

On rewatch, I actually see the initial appeal of Big- I never got it the first time around, but I do now. I think when I originally watched, I still thought of him as Mike Logan, and I couldn't get rid of that thought.

And because it can't be said enough - Carrie's hair was horrible! However, season 1 through most of season 3 is where I really like Carrie, so I'm going to enjoy a run of episodes where I don't have to scream SHUT UP CARRIE!

I'm actually really not looking forward to the next episode - it makes Samantha look so desperate. In the first few episodes, they made her look extra pathetic.

[MadRat]

On rewatch, I actually see the initial appeal of Big- I never got it the first time around, but I do now. I think when I originally watched, I still thought of him as Mike Logan, and I couldn't get rid of that thought.

 

I'm the opposite - I kinda liked Big the first time around (at first) but on rewatching the first episode I find him pretty unappealing. Too arrogant, maybe?

 

Is it ever brought up again that Big rejected Samantha?

 

I found a comment by Charlotte interesting.  She said something to the effect that the older we get the more we start self-selecting down to a smaller and smaller group.  I’ve heard it said numerous times that the dating pool gets smaller as we get older.  Given her comment, is that due to our being more selective and not necessarily because there aren’t decent men available?  Are we being too judgmental?  Maybe it’s something to consider.  After all, we’ve made our own mistakes and experienced our own failings.

 

I think it's definitely that we're more selective. I don't even think it applies only to relationships. When I was in my teens and early twenties, I made friends more easily and was better at taking people with a grain of salt. Now I'm in my thirties and I'm pickier about who I hang out with. If I was dating, I'm sure I'd be pickier about men, too.

 

I see the actor playing Skipper in so many commercials lately. And every time I go, "Hey, it's Skipper!"

 

I really dislike his “but I’m a nice guuuuuuuy” routine. I understand his frustration, but you don’t get a cookie for not objectifying women. And I don't understand, if Carrie knew Miranda would hate Skipper, why’d she bother setting them up? That seems mean. Especially since she was spot on and Miranda was awful to him at the bar.

 

[27bored]

I rewatched the first episode in honor of this thread. Wanna hear my thoughts?

 

Couple things. First, it's cool that the story of the beautiful English journalist and the wealthy I-banker featured the dad from the short-lived WB show Popular. Was that show on concurrent with SaTC? It might've been.

 

The first episode seemed to move really fast, almost like NYC. Just one shot to the next, quick dialogue, VOs, the "toxic bachelors" vs the "single women". I wonder why they never mentioned it again that Samantha tried hitting on Big before he and Carrie got together. Or, that Sam wound up being Capote Duncan's chippy for the evening after Charlotte didn't give him any. I'd almost forgotten how bitchy Miranda used to be. The dude's name was "Skipper"...to keep calling him out of his name was just disrespectful. Even still, he wanted to make out with her at the end of the evening, and so did she. Not entirely sure how that happened, but: OK.

 

I loved how dark this episode is, and really how dark the whole show was back then. The writing was wry, satirical, tawdry...with just enough of a humanizing element to make it engaging. In parts it seemed like a spin-off of those street interviews on Real Sex on HBO (I think actually filmed those in NYC) and Taxicab Confessionals, the saxophone toodling all over the place gave the show an added...something.

 

They never did establish where "Big" got his name, but Carrie just started calling him that. And why was her whole understanding fucked up off of Big accusing her of having never been in love? It was true to an extent, maybe, but it seemed kind of weird for a person who calls herself a "sexual anthropologist" to be keenly unaware of the fact that she's never really been in love.

Edited June 10, 2014 by 27bored

[Princess Sparkle]

They never did establish where "Big" got his name, but Carrie just started calling him that.

 

 

They do say that in the first episode - Samantha calls him Mr. Big at the party when she's describing him to Carrie, and after that, Carrie just calls him "Big."

[clady]

I liked the talking to the screen. I think it helped highlight the observation of behavior that Carrie's columns seemed to be about rather than thirty minutes in the life of Carrie that the show turned into.

I like how normal her clothes seemed! In fact Carrie seemed like an average woman and much more relatable in this episode. I really enjoyed it.

Also I found Big more attractive physically but the character still did nothing for me. There's nothing appealing about him to me. He's just there for Carrie to obsess over.

[27bored]

 

They do say that in the first episode - Samantha calls him Mr. Big at the party when she's describing him to Carrie, and after that, Carrie just calls him "Big."

Did she? I must've missed that. I just remember the comparison to Donald Trump.

 

I understand people not thinking much of Big -- I made it through the series and two movies still feeling nothing for him -- but I will say, at least in this episode. he just seemed to be a normal guy. A bit sly and smilrkingly frank, but he wasn't the smarmy guarded emotional vampire douche the show made him out to be later on.

[ShellSeeker]

Did she? I must've missed that. I just remember the comparison to Donald Trump.

 

Wasn't the first time we heard the name "Mr. Big" in a Carrie VO, after Samantha tried to hit on him? I thought Carrie said something like, "And off she went to put the moves on Mr. Big."

 

The superficial: really hated Carrie's hair in the pilot, but it didn't look bad when she was hanging out at home and had it up. I also thought the dress Charlotte wore on her date with Capote Duncan was pretty ugly. And when they were getting into the cab to go back to his apartment, there was some major side-boobage happening. I thought the ex Carrie hooked up with was pretty smarmy - though that was probably intentional.

 

There was a much cooler, edgier vibe to the pilot than what it evolved into later. I can't see S4-S6 Carrie describing herself as a "sexual anthropologist." Maybe with this rewatch we'll be able to pinpoint when she got to be kind up uptight.

 

Samantha did not come across very well in this episode. Carrie said she had "the kind of deluded self-confidence that made men like Ross Perot run for President" but to me her behavior made her seem very insecure. What she was projecting was not self-confidence, but instead the idea that she could only find validation by throwing herself at men. At the very end, when she hooked up with Charlotte's date and he said she couldn't stay the night, the whole moment for me was tinged with desperation and self-loathing.

Edited June 13, 2014 by Queasy-bo

[Inquisitionist]

I loved how dark this episode is, and really how dark the whole show was back then. The writing was wry, satirical, tawdry...with just enough of a humanizing element to make it engaging.

 

I haven't seen Ep. 1-1 for a while, but this is my recollection as well.

[Hanahope]

Couple thoughts. 

 

I hated Miranda's hair early on.  Just too short and makes her look even more uptight.

 

I had forgotten they were all "thirty-something" (which to me implies 34-38) which gives off a vibe of desperation if they ever wanted children, since there's always talk about how difficult it is for women after 35.  For some reason I always thought they were younger, well except for Samantha.  Yeah, Sam definitely looked more desperate and insecure back then. 

 

Boy the phones were chunky back then, haha.

 

I wonder who was paying for that expensive lunch Carrie had with Sanford when she met up with Kurt again.  Agree with how bad her hair was then too.

[Inquisitionist]

I had forgotten they were all "thirty-something" (which to me implies 34-38)

 

I think I had assumed that Carrie, Miranda, and Charlotte were all in their early 30s, like 31-33.  That's still a lot of post-college (even post-law school) dating years. 

[LemonSoda]

Did we ever learn their actual ages when the series began? The characters that is.

I had forgotten how dark and fast moving this episode was. I didn't get the appeal of Big the first time around but I get it now.

Skipper is even more annoying than I remember him being.

Carrie is more well spoken, witty than I remember. What happened?

[andromeda331]

I forgot how much I actually liked the first episode Carrie it surprised me given how much I hate her but right now she seemed normal and  I liked that it showed Carrie actually doing work for her column with the random people talking to camera. I liked Miranda and Charlotte but I always liked that they each one with different views on love and men, I really didn't like Samantha hooking up with Charlotte's date. Its just wrong to me. 

[ShellSeeker]

 I really didn't like Samantha hooking up with Charlotte's date. Its just wrong to me. 

 

Yeah, that was pretty tacky. I've always wondered though, if the 4 women being BFF's was something that was planned from the start, or that evolved later. As promiscuous as Samantha always was, I can't see her swooping in like that and hooking up with her good friend's date. So either she didn't know that was Charlotte's date (which is possible), or in this iteration of the show, she and Charlotte were not close friends.

 

In the first few episodes, it's clear that they're all friends, but I didn't get the sense that they were very close friends who talk on the phone every day, have lunch all the time, go out together every weekend, lean on each other for emotional support, and so on. The BFF angle seemed to be more apparent in the later parts of S1 and onward --- I think. I guess we'll see!

[Jillybean]

Just finished my re-watch.  Great idea!  I've been looking for a reason to break out the DVDs since I'm sick of the heavily censored syndicated episodes.

 

I've always thought Carrie looked really awful in this episode.  Obviously once the show was picked up they decided she should have long blonde hair instead of short brown hair.  Her wardrobe was definitely more understated, so maybe Patricia Field wasn't on board yet for the pilot.  The Charlotte we came to know probably wouldn't have worn that dress with Capote Duncan - she was much too conservative most of the time.

 

I have always thought it was interesting that Charlotte called Carrie and said "Hey, it's Charlotte."  This didn't telegraph the tight friendships they had as the series continued.

 

I didn't like the severity of Miranda's look or personality in S1 but it wasn't nearly as severe in this episode.  Why did Carrie set her up with Skipper?

 

I don't think Samantha knew she was going home with Char's date. The girls didn't seem to know every bit of minutiae about one another in this ep as they did as the series progressed.  I really don't think a guy like Capote Duncan would have told Charlotte he needed to get laid and shared a cab.

 

I wonder if Carrie ever found out Samatha hit on Mr. Big?  I don't believe for one second that Carrie had never been in love by her early 30s.  What about Kurt, the guy from this episode?  Apparently she had been a big mess over him 3 times in the past.

 

I love Stanford but he wasn't as flamboyant in this episode as he came to be.  I missed it!

 

I think I had more observations but I can't remember them all!

[Inquisitionist]

I hadn't noticed this before, but the first 5 episodes of the series were directed by women.  Susan Seidelman (Desperately Seeking Susan, She-Devil) helmed this one, along with two others later in S1.

[Mozelle]

I just started my rewatch with this episode. I'll watch episode two tomorrow. That said, let me dive in!
 

Did we ever learn their actual ages when the series began? The characters that is.

I think Carrie was 32 when the show started. I base it on two things: 1) When she sees Kurt in the restaurant, she says that he was a mistake that she made at 26, 29, and 31. That would imply she's no longer 31, so I've put her at 32. 2) When Carrie dated Aleks in the final season and the topic of children came up, Carrie said that she was 38. Six years had passed since the start of the series, and while episode to episode wasn't always in one week's time (sometimes weeks would pass within one episode), I always got the sense that each season took place over a year.

Moving on to the question of hairstyle: Including Miranda's bad hair, I couldn't get over Samantha's hair, particularly in the birthday dinner scene. It looked like uneven extensions, even though extensions weren't a big thing among white women at the time.

Something I also noticed about style and times is all the men with hair on their chests. It's so not the same these days with men on TV; they're all clean shaven nowadays.
 

There was a much cooler, edgier vibe to the pilot than what it evolved into later. I can't see S4-S6 Carrie describing herself as a "sexual anthropologist." Maybe with this rewatch we'll be able to pinpoint when she got to be kind up uptight.

I sometimes wonder if they did some sort of test market or looked at ratings, and based on whatever feedback and numbers, higher ups in the production company or at HBO told them that they needed to make changes to the show once it was underway. Because it was edgier, but then it got fluffier as time went on.

Edited June 19, 2014 by Mozelle

[NutMeg]

Just started my own watch/rewatch now (having missec the first seasonb). Funny how tropes like talking to the camera were later (like recently) picked up by other shows (Modern Family for instance) but soon disappeared here. The focus on Carie as a writer was also diluted later on. The weirdest thing is that this pilot looks nothing like the rest of the serie, but I weirdly love it.

[Gothish520]

I've seen random edited episodes here and there and the last hour of the first movie, so I'm pretty much a newb. I'm diving in - been reading the threads so I've been spoiled on most plot points but that's ok. I agree with those that said this episode flew by. I also liked the camera talk. But as long as the voiceovers continue, I'm good.

I liked Carrie a lot in this episode. The ex she hooked up with was too pretty-boy as well as being a tool. Samantha, way too desperate, Miranda a complete bitch. Charlotte was pleasant enough. Her situation was a great example of how women are damned if they do and damned if they don't when it comes to hooking up with men. At least Capote admitted that he understood where she was coming from, not that it did her any good.

I didn't realize that Big was there from episode one. Looking forward to seeing how that relationship progressed.

The smoking, wow. I forgot how prevalent it was prior to smoking bans becoming the norm. New York did not enact their ban until 2003, a good five years after the show premiered.

[LemonSoda]

1 hour ago, Gothish520 said:

I've seen random edited episodes here and there and the last hour of the first movie, so I'm pretty much a newb. I'm diving in - been reading the threads so I've been spoiled on most plot points but that's ok. I agree with those that said this episode flew by. I also liked the camera talk. But as long as the voiceovers continue, I'm good.

I liked Carrie a lot in this episode. The ex she hooked up with was too pretty-boy as well as being a tool. Samantha, way too desperate, Miranda a complete bitch. Charlotte was pleasant enough. Her situation was a great example of how women are damned if they do and damned if they don't when it comes to hooking up with men. At least Capote admitted that he understood where she was coming from, not that it did her any good.

I didn't realize that Big was there from episode one. Looking forward to seeing how that relationship progressed.

The smoking, wow. I forgot how prevalent it was prior to smoking bans becoming the norm. New York did not enact their ban until 2003, a good five years after the show premiered.

I really liked Carrie in the early episodes. Somewhere along the way they all became caricatures yet I still watched. I started watching during Season 3. So when I went back and saw the earlier episodes it was surprising to see how they began. 

Yes with the smoking! It surprises me when I see it now too. And I smoked during that era. 

[andromeda331]

12 hours ago, Gothish520 said:

I've seen random edited episodes here and there and the last hour of the first movie, so I'm pretty much a newb. I'm diving in - been reading the threads so I've been spoiled on most plot points but that's ok. I agree with those that said this episode flew by. I also liked the camera talk. But as long as the voiceovers continue, I'm good.

I liked Carrie a lot in this episode. The ex she hooked up with was too pretty-boy as well as being a tool. Samantha, way too desperate, Miranda a complete bitch. Charlotte was pleasant enough. Her situation was a great example of how women are damned if they do and damned if they don't when it comes to hooking up with men. At least Capote admitted that he understood where she was coming from, not that it did her any good.

I didn't realize that Big was there from episode one. Looking forward to seeing how that relationship progressed.

The smoking, wow. I forgot how prevalent it was prior to smoking bans becoming the norm. New York did not enact their ban until 2003, a good five years after the show premiered.

Samantha was weirdly desperate early into the series. She didn't have the confidence she later had. I kind of wish she did. You kind of think she would have at this point. Maybe they hadn't figured out her role completely. But I'm not sure the later Samantha would have been as desperate as she was. She had a successful career and busy and active sex life.  

[LemonSoda]

11 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Samantha was weirdly desperate early into the series. She didn't have the confidence she later had. I kind of wish she did. You kind of think she would have at this point. Maybe they hadn't figured out her role completely. But I'm not sure the later Samantha would have been as desperate as she was. She had a successful career and busy and active sex life.  

This really bothered me. She had a sad desperation that was never really explained. Even later when she had the confidence there was a dash of vulnerability that Kim pulled off beautifully. Facial expressions, little movements. Upon rewatching the series I notice little things like that. But I'll never understand her early series desperation. I'm guessing like you, the characters hadn't been defined yet. Same with Miranda. She was over the top bitchy. 

[NutMeg]

16 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Samantha was weirdly desperate early into the series. She didn't have the confidence she later had. I kind of wish she did. You kind of think she would have at this point. Maybe they hadn't figured out her role completely. But I'm not sure the later Samantha would have been as desperate as she was. She had a successful career and busy and active sex life.  

I agree, but having read the book the series was based on later on, I think she was a more faithful version to some characters in the book - which was rather depressing, as I remember. However, I really like how the Samantha character evolved during the course of the series (but not in the last movie!). 

[LemonSoda]

1 hour ago, NutMeg said:

I agree, but having read the book the series was based on later on, I think she was a more faithful version to some characters in the book - which was rather depressing, as I remember. However, I really like how the Samantha character evolved during the course of the series (but not in the last movie!). 

Yes! They gave Samantha some of Amalita's desperation. I wish Amalita had been in the show more then once. Her episode showed her fun spend someone else's money side but those of us who have read the book know her life was sad. 

[Melancholy]

Miranda, Samantha, and Charlotte carry the burden of being cliches of different types of Hated Women. The Ball Busting Career Bitch, The Loud Slut, The Prude Gold Digger. Part of starting with the burden of those nasty cliches is Samantha’s sexuality coming off as desperate or Miranda coming off like a mannish bitch. Carrie doesn’t carry that burden of being an archetype- she’s just a woman. IMO, the best part of the series was how it dealt with Carrie’s friends having these archetypes to make a point that they were not just pure cliches and they all had nuances and even more, there’s intrinsic value in being very sexual like Samantha or intense/blunt like Miranda or laser focused on a fairy tale life like Charlotte.

However while Carrie benefited from how she was a question-er (“I couldn’t help but wonder”) untethered to any POV in the beginning, it hurt her pretty quickly into S2, if not late S1. She wasn’t part of the deconstruction of sexist stereotypes. Instead, she got storylines by having OTT drama in her relationships. 

In some ways, the movies are a bit of a return to S1. Samantha’s sluttiness is cheap and desperate and overcompensating for how she’ll die alone. Miranda is a careerist bitch who drives men away and doesn’t deserve fidelity. Charlotte is a dizzy bimbo who got her happily ever after and is now starting her “And now what? Just sit and smoke and let it go until you’re in a box?” (Betty Draper). There’s an active campaign, by contrast, to paint Carrie as the best because she isn’t a cliche and thus, didn’t have to make compromises in her life to land her in her middle age life. 

[Gothish520]

17 hours ago, NutMeg said:

I agree, but having read the book the series was based on later on, I think she was a more faithful version to some characters in the book - which was rather depressing, as I remember. However, I really like how the Samantha character evolved during the course of the series (but not in the last movie!). 

I have to admit, after hearing about how godawful the last movie was, I'm so looking forward to it! Any chance that since I know it's supposed to be terrible, that I will actually like it?

[NutMeg]

6 hours ago, Melancholy said:

Miranda, Samantha, and Charlotte carry the burden of being cliches of different types of Hated Women. The Ball Busting Career Bitch, The Loud Slut, The Prude Gold Digger. Part of starting with the burden of those nasty cliches is Samantha’s sexuality coming off as desperate or Miranda coming off like a mannish bitch. Carrie doesn’t carry that burden of being an archetype- she’s just a woman. IMO, the best part of the series was how it dealt with Carrie’s friends having these archetypes to make a point that they were not just pure cliches and they all had nuances and even more, there’s intrinsic value in being very sexual like Samantha or intense/blunt like Miranda or laser focused on a fairy tale life like Charlotte.

However while Carrie benefited from how she was a question-er (“I couldn’t help but wonder”) untethered to any POV in the beginning, it hurt her pretty quickly into S2, if not late S1. She wasn’t part of the deconstruction of sexist stereotypes. Instead, she got storylines by having OTT drama in her relationships. 

In some ways, the movies are a bit of a return to S1. Samantha’s sluttiness is cheap and desperate and overcompensating for how she’ll die alone. Miranda is a careerist bitch who drives men away and doesn’t deserve fidelity. Charlotte is a dizzy bimbo who got her happily ever after and is now starting her “And now what? Just sit and smoke and let it go until you’re in a box?” (Betty Draper). There’s an active campaign, by contrast, to paint Carrie as the best because she isn’t a cliche and thus, didn’t have to make compromises in her life to land her in her middle age life. 

Wonderful analysis, I think you just nailed it. All of the dynamics from origins to finish, including the movies, you've beautifully covered. Very impressive!

4 hours ago, Gothish520 said:

I have to admit, after hearing about how godawful the last movie was, I'm so looking forward to it! Any chance that since I know it's supposed to be terrible, that I will actually like it?

Very, very, slim chance. I waited until it was on TV, still got ready with some rosé to enjoy, because really, how bad could it be? But it was very, very bad. And cringeworthy. More than slightly desperate, but as @melancholy wrote above, a bit of return to S1, episode 1, or to the book that started it all.

The problem for me was that over the course of the series we had seen the characters evolve whereas the movies, especially the last one, are very much nope, that never happened, they're all still the same sad sacks they started being. So it's depressing, and doesn't gel with the series.

Another thing that was missing in the last movie was New York, because I feel like it should be one of the main characters too! 

When you watch it, please report back!  

[Gothish520]

15 minutes ago, NutMeg said:

Very, very, slim chance. I waited until it was on TV, still got ready with some rosé to enjoy, because really, how bad could it be? But it was very, very bad. And cringeworthy. More than slightly desperate, but as @melancholy wrote above, a bit of return to S1, episode 1, or to the book that started it all.

The problem for me was that over the course of the series we had seen the characters evolve whereas the movies, especially the last one, are very much nope, that never happened, they're all still the same sad sacks they started being. So it's depressing, and doesn't gel with the series.

Another thing that was missing in the last movie was New York, because I feel like it should be one of the main characters too! 

When you watch it, please report back!  

Oh I will! And I will be sure to have a big ol' glass of wine ready when I watch, lol. I'm glad there is some activity on this board as I really enjoy talking about the show. 

[andromeda331]

On ‎3‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 3:52 PM, Gothish520 said:

Oh I will! And I will be sure to have a big ol' glass of wine ready when I watch, lol. I'm glad there is some activity on this board as I really enjoy talking about the show. 

So do I. 

[voiceover]

S1/ep1 is lifted from the first several pages of Candace Bushnell's book (originally her columns), down to the English journalist getting dumped & the "toxic bachelor" phrase.  The THs were a thing (along with Carrie breaking the 4th wall) until they proved too gimmicky; by that point it was obvious that the friendships, as opposed to the sexual antics, were driving the series' success -- as different from the source material.

Almost every TV pilot has a different look from even their second episodes.  Note SJP's hair, Carrie's apartment, etc.  There can be up to a year between pilot & series pick-up/filming, so the actors, esp the women, look different.

The Pilot-ep Miranda, Samantha, & Charlotte were pretty peel-n-stick archetypes.  It's a credit to Cynthia, Kim, & Kristin that by the end of Season One, that was no longer the case.