S20.E03: Zero Tolerance

[RollinsRollins]

I think something will happen and Amanda lose the baby,if she got pregnant on July 4th, she should be born in April , from the belly it would seem that kelli will give birth soon, when Kelli will give birth, in SVU the pregnancy will have to be interrupted

[wknt3]

17 hours ago, ChristiKRN said:

I still can't get over this episode.  I've been trying to figure out what bothered me the most about the episode but there are so many issues.

SVU has always done "ripped from the headline"-based storylines; that's not the problem.  The problem was that there technically wasn't a crime being committed by holding people illegally entering the country in these detention centers.  It may be morally wrong to separate the kids from their parents and being fenced in, but technically not a crime (that is just an opinion; I don't want to start a political debate), so why was SVU spending so much time on this issue?  If they had spun it off to the detained people being sexually assaulted, then they would have had a reason to be involved but not for the reason they were. 

As you said SVU, and the whole L&O franchise has always done "ripped from the headlines" stories, and they've also explored social issues. At times they've had to get creative in order to fit the format and turn a national issue into a local criminal  case. And the big problem here is that they didn't do the work here despite the fact that there are many ways they could have gone about it. We've come up with several here. And if they bothered to rip from the many headlines about all the problems and abuses they could have easily created a situation where there was not only an actual criminal case to be prosecuted, but one that would be enthusiastically supported by the NYC political establishment. It really infuriates me that they were more interested in "Benson v United States" than in giving us a believable story.

 

Quote

Jack McCoy better intervene with Stone ASAP.  He needs to use Barba as an example of what not to do. He's derailing at a significantly faster rate than Barba did.

And that was my second biggest problem. It took Stone about 5 seconds to go from the entirely sensible "this is totally illegal and I'm not letting it happen" to becoming Benson's lapdog. And again they simply didn't bother with basic storytelling. Even if you insisted on the basically flawed plot, you could still have competently executed it by giving Stone a motivation or a plan beyond simply supporting Benson despite his legal judgement and professional obligations. Just as with the story itself there are ways they could have gone that would maintain the integrity of the character and the suspension of disbelief. He could be aiming to make public what the  feds want to keep hidden or use the case to get a subpoena from a sympathetic judge to obtain some key piece of evidence. Just as with the case itself it's lazy writing and the first time since they changed showrunners that they sacrificed basic narrative coherence and establised characterization in order to make an ideological point.

[ForeverAlone]

I really wish someone from the network or someone somewhere would tell SVU to lay off the political episodes. They often do "ripped from the headlines" well when it comes to straightforward sex crimes, but they do terribly when it to politically motivated episodes. They are ridiculously preachy and fall well outside the purview of SVU's actual mission. This case ceased to be a SVU type case once Uncle Luke was arrested. 

I was so glad when Olivia got her ass smacked down in court, because she was completely out of line. But of course she must get some sort of "win" in the end, because her buddies pulled political strings for her. 

I don't get where the writers are going with Dominic and Amanda. I can only guess they are still going on what they laid down last season, with Dominic desiring Amanda and maybe him being jealous or whatever about her being pregnant. And if that is the case, that is just creepy and weird. The show did a pretty good job of writing in Kelli's first pregnancy, and the friendship between Dominic and Amanda was well handled, and he was super supportive and understanding. But I really do think it is a big mistake for the writers to write Kelli's second pregnancy into the show. Their only option is to have Amanda become pregnant by a second man, and their only real option (short of writing in a one night stand) is to develop the "relationship" with the creepy, escort loving cardiologist. Nothing about this "relationship" is believable in the slightest for me, but this is the road they chose to go down. 

This is definitely an episode I am going to want to forget and never watch again. 

[FireGhost]

On 8.10.2018 at 1:15 PM, RollinsRollins said:

I think something will happen and Amanda lose the baby,if she got pregnant on July 4th, she should be born in April , from the belly it would seem that kelli will give birth soon, when Kelli will give birth, in SVU the pregnancy will have to be interrupted

I don't think Amanda's and Kelli's actual pregnancy are supposed to follow the same timeline. Kelli's very visibly in her second trimester, but Amanda's co-workers are still guessing whether she's pregnant or not. 

[Tdoc72]

On 10/7/2018 at 3:29 PM, ChristiKRN said:

Too much time spent on Rollins' pregnancy already this season.  Per Dr. Al, if she got knocked up on July 4th, then that means she is only about 3 months along; she looks like she is about 6-7 months along.  It's going to be a long pregnancy.  Should she even be allowed out from the squad room if she's pregnant? I sincerely hope Dr. Al gets accused of something and she tries to cover something up, leading to her long-overdue suspension or firing. 

 

I’m feeling a ‘ripped from the headlines’ Dr Al spiked her drink w/an abortion drug. He seems very creeptastic.  

 

 

On 10/7/2018 at 7:29 PM, dttruman said:

I thought this was specifically written that way to create the controversy that they wanted to push their agenda . I think according to protocol, a female agent (or at most a male and female agents), who spoke Spanish would come to make it a lot less stressful for the child.

 

The child is still being ripped away from their parent and then put in a cage. I don’t think it matters if a male or female guard was there. It will still be stressful and traumatizing. 

[dttruman]

4 hours ago, Tdoc72 said:

The child is still being ripped away from their parent and then put in a cage. I don’t think it matters if a male or female guard was there. It will still be stressful and traumatizing. 

I don't want to get into a political argument here. All I am saying is, I believe the writers (by orders of Hargitay) are putting their skewed version of this scenario as they did for that courtroom scene.

[Kel Varnsen]

On 05/10/2018 at 1:07 AM, Xeliou66 said:

Yeah, that was about as bad as I expected. A ton of preachy political crap, and the St Olivia worship was in full force. She’s completely lost it, she has no objectivity, let’s her emotions dictate the way she does her job, and is completely unfit to run a squad, she uses her position to push a social agenda. Where the fuck is Dodds? He needs to remove her from command immediately and place Fin in charge!! Benson should’ve had her ass dragged out of court in handcuffs. 

 

They really did need a Dodds scene  because not only did Olivia arrest a federal agent for doing his job she also held a press conference in the precinct to brag about it. And speaking of Dodds wasn't he the deputy chief for public relations or something. I would imagine that in an organization as big as the NYPD a lieutenant holding a press conference about anything without clearing it with the PR department would be a pretty big issue.

[CrystalBlue]

Cold open:  What a twist!  Instead of Benoah, we got Rollins and baby Jesse!  Creepy Dapper Don Doctor shows up with sunflowers a la Vincent Van Gogh, and it's all good from there on.  The hooker hound doc really loves kids!

Last scene:  They used the whole soap box of soap to sell that scene.  I could almost see the suds rising from the bottom of my screen.

Middle:  Good stuff from Fin, as usual.  Carisi held his own.  Aww, how sweet.  Amanda is keeping the baby!  Thank God she gave Dr. Creepface notice; hopefully that's the last we'll see of him.  He was such a mensch for offering to pay for an abortion though, wasn't he?

I liked the Federal Judge, regardless of her smackdown of Benson; that was just hot fudge on the sundae for me.  Why they didn't haul Benson out of court in handcuffs or the judge find her in contempt, I don't know.  I guess Saint Olivia has friends in high places and can get away with soap opera theatrics whenever she wants, wherever.

What happened to what was supposed to be the core story of Uncle Luke and his harem of girls?  That's the story that should've been told; instead it was a nothing burger in this shit sandwich.

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎05‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 3:43 AM, MrsRafaelBarba said:

I'll find someone who will.

 

She actually said that to Stone?

Sit your ass down Benson!

Yes, that stuck in my craw too, rather than actually  enforce the law you shop around for a prosecutor who shares your views?

On ‎05‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 3:59 AM, statsgirl said:

While I appreciate an attempt to publicize the current state of affairs beyond the New England Journal of Medicine and Lancet editorials that I have been reading (and they're very anti- the current policy, as far as I've been told, crossing the border in order to seek asylum in the US is not illegal.

The last shot, with all the children behind the fence watching them walk away, was awesome.

I thought it was a cheap shot, comparing a sex trafficker to a government agent. 

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎05‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 4:41 AM, wknt3 said:

The Good:
Carl Weathers. Never saw Chicago Justice, but I've always liked him and he did a good job here.
They've continued to build on last year's improvement in involving the whole squad in cases by showing members of the squad besides Benson connecting with the victims on a deep emotional level.
It wasn't a two-parter
The Federal judge smacking down Benson's nonsense.

The Bad:
The script. This might be the worst writing since the depths of Season 18, being just as bad as far as preachiness, a complete disregard for any sort of realism, and Benson worship, and ranking ahead of that nadir only by virute of maintaining some sense of narrative coherence.
Rollins baby drama. I'm seriously wishing we could have Benoah instead.
Pod Stone has come much earlier than I feared. I can't believe that he would go to court to defend her after telling her that her actions were clearly illegal and wrong despite his agreeing with her on policy. And that he would let her get away with telling him that she would find someone else to prosecute if he didn't do what she wanted. WTF?
I know it's minor compared to the other complaints, but did moving to 10pm mean we're going to get gratuitous profanity every week? Or is it just that they can't be bothered to come up with an actual cutting insult for Fin instead of him calling the guy in interrogation an asshole, just like they couldn't come up with a better way of portraying toxic masculinity than having the characters tossing around the word pussy every few minutes?
Every moment Benson was on screen. It's like all of Mariska's worst impulses which had been largely contained lat year broke through and came flooding over the airwaves.

Overall this was a turd. A big stinky pile actually. And the thing is it wouldn't have been hard to do something good with the concept. Perhaps put the agent on trial for negligence, letting a little girl end up in that situation, instead of kidnapping so there is an actual colorable case? With an actual trial where you can lay out the depressing facts and explore why the defenses of the current policy are wrong? Or perhaps they can't make the case against the trafficker because NYC and the feds won't cooperate? I'm firmly of the belief that there aren't two equal sides here, but there is a difference between taking a clear stand (which SVU has always been more willing to do than the mothership) and condemning injustice, and contrived nonsense which fails as both entertainment and advocacy. This was a huge step backwards for the show. Hopefully next week will be better and we can just move forward agreeing to never speak of it again.

It wasn't the agent's 'negligence' that got her to the sex trafficker, he placed her in the foster home and she ran away.  

[Joe Hellandback]

1. I like the fact that Finn took charge for much of this, I always think it's great to see him in the leadership role.

2. When will the SVU ever learn to take proper descriptions? Also we don't walk past the suspect into the apartment so that our backs are turned on him or at very least he runs off slamming the door behind him. And we don't just walk in against the occupant's wishes, that's how judges declare whatever we find void. Also shouldn't we give the prisoner the caution?

3. Finn's a bit of an odd choice for the undercover role, do we really buy that he'd be the original suspect's friend? Wouldn't Carisi be more believable? And why does Fin just stand there whilst the suspect makes off, did they make it just so Liv could catch him?

4. Then the story takes a 90 degree left turn (literally!) and becomes absurd. She arrests a Federal officer for carrying out his lawful duty and then hosts a press conference to publicize it! My GOD! Exactly how many kids have the SVU ripped away from their parents against their will over the years? Reminded me of when Noah was injured and she was affronted by the social worker asking her the same questions she's done to people a million times.  Stone justifiably tells her he doesn't prosecute cases to make a point and she says she'll find a prosecutor who will? So much for fairness in the justice system! Where are 1PP? Why aren't the coming down on Benson like a ton of bricks? Where are the protesters outside the precinct outraged at her actions? Why doesn't the judge chuck her in jail for contempt of court? Plus after the poor ICE agent is released from jail he's the one they still send to take the girl? REALLY? 

5.  Nice for Fin to put the other side in his debate, wish we'd had more of that. Also nice to see Carl Weathers but they missed the obvious Predator joke, he should have made a remark about 'stalking through the jungle' to the MP.   

3/10, I think I partly watch this show these days just to see what outrageous stuff they come up with next.  

Edited January 28, 2019 by Joe Hellandback

[auntiemel]

Just catching up now. This episode was an illogical mess, but the one good thing I came away with was that little girl is an awesome actress! Every time she turned on the tears, it wasn't long until I was misting up, too.

[dttruman]

Just found out "Zero Tolerance" is on the USA channel right now. I going to watch it, just to make sure that it was one of the most politically bias and most unrealistic of all of the SVU episodes.

[atlantaloves]

Thanks for the heads up, I'm recording i right now, I'd forgotten this episode...this year has been so bad I forget most of them. Ha. 

[dttruman]

Just now, atlantaloves said:

Thanks for the heads up, I'm recording i right now, I'd forgotten this episode...this year has been so bad I forget most of them. Ha. 

Sorry to read that, because the realism is about to be shot to hell.

[dttruman]

Watching Zero Tolerance again on a special night on the USA Network and I can't believe how outrageous it is again. Benson just had the Federal officer arrested for abduction, which is totally nonsensical and she is convincing Stone to prosecute. Now she is disrupting the hearing that I almost forgot about and why she is not being reprimanded is a mystery to me.

[Xeliou66]

2 hours ago, dttruman said:

Watching Zero Tolerance again on a special night on the USA Network and I can't believe how outrageous it is again. Benson just had the Federal officer arrested for abduction, which is totally nonsensical and she is convincing Stone to prosecute. Now she is disrupting the hearing that I almost forgot about and why she is not being reprimanded is a mystery to me.

Yep it was once again St Olivia abusing her position to make a statement and behaving inappropriately, and she gets away scot-free for her behavior. And her losing it in court was laughable and shows how unfit she is to lead a squad. Dodds, who was chief at the time, should’ve reprimanded her, but they forgot there were higher ups for most of season 20.