Iris West

[Jenesis]

Sucks that Iris won't have a role in the crossover. Do the writers even like her?

[Oscirus]

I doubt it. I'm starting to think that the only reasons why her character exists is a) to fill a quota  b) because Flash has a wife in the comics named Iris. I hate to speak in hyperboles but in all my years of watching TV, I've never seen writers go out of there way to alienate a  character's fanbase like this.  It's a new thing every week with these people.

[Sakura12]

I doubt it. I'm starting to think that the only reasons why her character exists is a) to fill a quota  b) because Flash has a wife in the comics named Iris. I hate to speak in hyperboles but in all my years of watching TV, I've never seen writers go out of there way to alienate a  character's fanbase like this.  It's a new thing every week with these people.

 

I'll point you to Arrow for the it has been done before. These are same people responsible for Laurel Lance. She's ruining the comic character that shares her name. Iris is now going off of the likability of the actress (which Laurel doesn't have). Candice Patton is making Iris someone to root for despite not being given anything to do. 

[Jenesis]

I really have to start being more vocal on twitter. I know nothing will come about it, but at least it will feel like I'm doing something. This is ridiculous.

[venusnv80]

Between Lisa from Saved By the Bell to Lacey on Twisted to Bonnie Bennett on TVD to freaking Iris on The Flash, I am so battle weary that I can't even began to talk about how tired I am of Iris' storyline. I have to say that it closely resembles Lacey on Twisted, all she needs is a #poorJo...although I think she has a #poorBarry. 

 

What tipped me over the edge was 

the promo during that Supergirl show that I got a cavity from, that showed Barry and Patty kissing the EXACT SAME WAY Iris and Barry kissed.

. I was already on the cusp due to the whole cut scenes and then the one scene where Joe tells her the truth and then nothing. I don't know what their <i>plan</i> is, but I am not impressed with what they have done so far with Iris. The fact that there has been little to no reaction to Eddie dying (didn't like him but still...) to the fact that her mother comes back and they cut a scene where Barry could have been the friend to her that she's been to him.  It seems like we play the same game over and over again and we ask the same questions over and over again...I swear, I read some posts and I'm not sure if we are talking about Iris or Bonnie Bennett...do the writers like them? The writers say that this is a BIG season for them? Their scenes are cut...no POV...I'm tired now. 

 

I have watched Bonnie Bennett be sidelined for 6 seasons on CW, I thought the Iris character would be different--but I believe CW pulled the bait and switch with me and so many other and I am not interested. I will watch The Muppets. 

Edited October 27, 2015 by venusnv80

[phoenics]

Yeah. I definitely feel like we've been bait and switched.

[dirtypop90]

Ya know I've been thinking about this because I don't feel that this is a case where a black female character has been purposefully sidelined, for some one TPTB like better, as it often is. The writers, producers etc seem to love Candice and they went on a search for a minority woman to play iris west, knowing how important the character is to the flash. And they have expressed wanting to avoid another Laurel Lance situation, and I actually believe them.

So this situation reminds me of an article I read maybe a few years ago about how writers, for w/e reasons, simply don't know how to write black female characters or are uncomfortable with it, which ends up with them getting sidelined, unintentionally. Of course my first thought was, then why not hire black writers? There are many looking for a job. But there never seems to be any on mainstream shows even if they have black characters (the exception being shows created by minorities, of course).

It's just odd. I keep hearing, they don't know what to do with iris" But they know what to do with every other regular character? Hell, even the guest characters, superheroes and non? And I feel that I keep hearing that about black female characters in particular.

[phoenics]

Well then they need to consult with Shonda Rhymes. She writes some of the most complex black female characters around and they lead ratings hits.

There are plenty of black female writers and black writers out there who could do Iris Justice.

And odd - they can write JOE but not Iris? Or Cast two candidates who are black for Firestorm so Caitlin doesn't look racist but they can't show Iris investigating? They give Iris' meta human research stuff to Perfect Patty who gets praise for her interest rather than excoriated? They let Barry date Patty (Joe's partner) with a pat on the back while JOE didn't talk to his own daughter for weeks due to Eddie? Barry finds out all about the West family drama but we never see him talk to Iris about it? Are they best friends or are they?! That spoiler where we'd see Barry be there for Iris?! They cut the d@mn scene?!

This isn't about them fearing to write for Iris. This is about them not caring. They cut scenes that could help and leave in what they want. Half the goofy flirt Batty scenes could have been left out to show Barry being there for Iris. Or Iris investigating. Why is that ALWays offscreen if it happens?

I'm so sick of this nonsense. They'd never treat Lois Lane like this.

I honestly believe they cast CP as a token so they just don't care - even if she's the superior actress on this show. That DP (who can't act and just knows one of the producers) gets more screen time is a travesty and exactly why affirmative action came about. They are wasting CP's talent.

We really do need a CandicePatton deserves better hashtag.

Apparently in the upcoming crossover she has one line of dialogue. One line. Wow. They treat her worse than Laurel now.

We shouldn't have to beg to see her utilized as her billing says she should be.

I hate this show right now.

[Sakura12]

I've seen some pics of 2x05

with Iris protecting Linda and herself from I'm assuming Dr. Light.

Hopefully that is the start of her getting more to do.

[dirtypop90]

Well then they need to consult with Shonda Rhymes. She writes some of the most complex black female characters around and they lead ratings hits.

There are plenty of black female writers and black writers out there who could do Iris Justice.

And odd - they can write JOE but not Iris? Or Cast two candidates who are black for Firestorm so Caitlin doesn't look racist but they can't show Iris investigating? y?! That spoiler where we'd see Barry be there for Iris?! They cut the d@mn scene?!

This isn't about them fearing to write for Iris. This i. Why is that ALWays offscreen if it happens? .

Joe, jax, and Wally are black men. I said I've only heard of this issue when it comes to writing black women, specifically.

[phoenics]

Joe, jax, and Wally are black men. I said I've only heard of this issue when it comes to writing black women, specifically.

My comment about casting the two black men was in reference to them caring enough to do that FOR Caitlin so she couldn't be branded a racist - since one of them HAD to be black. But that fits in with your logic about them not knowing how to write black women. Because we're apparently an alien species.

Now I'm madder.

[venusnv80]

LOL! I'm sorry, I have to laugh at 'we're an alien species'. All I know is where there is smoke...

[XtremeOne1]

To be fair it isn't that they don't  know how to write black women, it's they don't know how to write women at all.

[zannej]

I've found that a lot of writers can't seem to write well for women. The bit with Caitlin being oh so distracted by Jay's body and becoming instantly obsessed with him was just so odd. Even Cisco didn't get quite that bad when he was crushing on Plastique. The way they have these women behave is just so ridiculous sometimes-- do women even act like that? (I honestly don't know)

 

I'm glad I'm not alone in seeing that the writing for Iris is pretty bad-- the only reason I like her is because I really loved the comic book character AND because of the actress. How sad is it when the actress comes across as more intelligent than a character who is supposed to be smart?

 

I was glad she actually got to fire a gun and do something useful last episode. I really want to see the friendship with Barry come back and see them working together more. As it is, I really don't see much grounds for this love/friendship they've supposedly had all these years.

 

Maybe somehow they can bring in E2 Eddie and he can distract Patty.

[dirtypop90]

I'm not a fan of caitlin/jax but the character still gets more material than Iris. My issue is they simply don't write much for Iris, when Candice is billed second after Grant and is a very capable actress. I don't have an issue with the way the character is written, like I do with Patty and sometimes Caitlin. I just want more, and think we should be seeing more Iris since Iris is the female lead and more important to the flash's story than every other character on this show. 

[phoenics]

The writers aren't supposed to be writing for a WOC, they are supposed to be writing for a fictional character who is portrayed by a WOC. Freaking idiots. Bonnie Bennett's world begins again.

Tell that to the writers - they seem to be more distracted by the fact that Iris is portrayed by a black woman because they seem incapable of writing her properly and write for her LESS than they do their "white female" characters.

Misogynoir all over that writing room. I hope they rot in hell.

[dirtypop90]

^ Iris is black and that shouldn't have to be ignored in order to write for her character, if that is what you are getting at. To explain, as an AA woman, I would have no issue if we saw Iris experience certain situations in life and love that the other female characters didn't because she's black (same for Linda as an asian woman), i.e. discrimination in her career field. I would have no issue with iris being treated differently in that way. But that needs to be done on purpose lol She needs to be written for and not ignored, pushed to the back. 

Edited November 11, 2015 by dirtypop90

[phoenics]

^ Iris is black and that shouldn't have to be ignored in order to write for her character, if that is what you are getting at. To explain, as an AA woman, I would have no issue if we saw Iris experience certain situations in life and love that the other female characters didn't because she's black (same for Linda as an asian woman), i.e. discrimination in her career field. I would have no issue with iris being treated differently in that way. But that needs to be done on purpose lol She needs to be written for and not ignored, pushed to the back.

I'm AA as well - what I meant was that instead of writing for her, they seem to see "AA" and back away in fear and marginalize her instead. They could AT LEAST just write for her like they do the other characters, but they aren't.

Level 2 would be to actually write her fully as an AA woman - but with these writers that would be wishful thinking. They don't even acknowledge that she and Joe are black on the show. It's "colorblind" writing and that sucks.

I know exactly what you mean though - that's why I mentioned further up that these writers need help from Shonda Rhymes. Her AA characters are complex but fully realized human beings.

Right now though I would just settle for Iris getting the screen time her leading lady status should guarantee her. Not getting that smacks of marginalization to me.

[dirtypop90]

^ you posted before I did. I was actually referring to the post above yours. IA with you that ideally Iris would be written fully as an AA woman, but it ain't happening. I just think "colorblind" writing, as you put it, sucks and is the reason why so many AA characters get sidelines. On the screen, no one sees race, but its clear the people behind the scenes do but pretend they don't by never acknowledging the character's race on screen.

 

As I said above, CP's case is so odd to me, because they actually looked for a minority woman to play her. And now I'm struggling to understand why if they were going to treat her this way. Obviously, they were probably attempting to get a more diverse audience, but if minorities tune in thinking, "yayy! people who look like me are on a super hero show!" and then that character gets put on the back burner, they tune out. duh

Edited November 11, 2015 by dirtypop90

[phoenics]

It's called being a token. And it's been happening for decades, as I'm sure you're familiar. I was just hoping that it wouldn't be like that this time.

My disappointment is really deep and it's affecting my ability to enjoy the show. It's making me bitter and angry.

[dirtypop90]

But Iris isn't even a token. They made the West family black, and if they follow the comics, that's a big deal because a black superhero is coming. A token to me is that minority friend on the side that the audience really knows nothing about. Her family is super important to the lead and the story but she doesn't feel like she is. I don't know why it's so odd to me because I've obviously seen minorities characters sidelined, but I really wasn't expecting this since her character is so important to the story.

Edited November 11, 2015 by dirtypop90

[phoenics]

But Iris isn't even a token. They made the West family black, and if they follow the comics, that's a big deal because a black superhero is coming. A token to me is that minority friend on the side that the audience really knows nothing about. Her family is super important to the lead and the story but she doesn't feel like she is. I don't know why it's so odd to me because I've obviously seen minorities characters sidelined, but I really wasn't expecting this since her character is so important to the story.

No, the character of Iris is not a token - what I mean is that on this show, with Iris being portrayed by a black woman, they have essentially "tokenized" Iris. She's there, but not in enough depth and certainly not as she's billed. Worse, we're getting SBW tropes and a whiff of Magical Negro tropes with her - and in other times, she's just invisible or not there.

I sometimes wonder if the writers are so afraid that the fans will hate her as much as they did Laurel that they're overreacting instead. But when most of the fandom can see how she's being marginalized and comments on it a lot, that's an even bigger problem because now you're in danger of scaring off the "diverse" fanbase you used Iris to lure in.

I got extra excited about this show when Iris was cast. I'd never seen a black super hero love interest like that - not at the Iris West/Lois Lane level. That was super huge. And now she's like wallpaper. It's extremely frustrating and the ONLY reason I can think of to explain it is misogynoir.

[Ruby25]

No, the character of Iris is not a token - what I mean is that on this show, with Iris being portrayed by a black woman, they have essentially "tokenized" Iris. She's there, but not in enough depth and certainly not as she's billed. Worse, we're getting SBW tropes and a whiff of Magical Negro tropes with her - and in other times, she's just invisible or not there.

I sometimes wonder if the writers are so afraid that the fans will hate her as much as they did Laurel that they're overreacting instead. But when most of the fandom can see how she's being marginalized and comments on it a lot, that's an even bigger problem because now you're in danger of scaring off the "diverse" fanbase you used Iris to lure in.

I got extra excited about this show when Iris was cast. I'd never seen a black super hero love interest like that - not at the Iris West/Lois Lane level. That was super huge. And now she's like wallpaper. It's extremely frustrating and the ONLY reason I can think of to explain it is misogynoir.I w

I wonder about this too. It could well be possible, but I also think having Patty Spivot on and apparently wanting her to have the role of love interest (temporarily) cuts into Iris's part for now.

 

I still think that Iris will play a major part in the second half with the Wally stuff, and I also think Patty will be on her way out by then too, so things will get better in 2016, at least in terms of screentime.

[phoenics]

Maybe - it just frustrates me. Eddie didn't get this much focus and that's making me angry. Iris' role almost looks more like Eddie's this season in terms of screen time. Not right. She's Iris West - and 2nd billed!

[dirtypop90]

With the way they've treated Iris I wouldn't be surprised if they just have her introduce wally, then back to back burner she goes, and all of wally's meaty scenes are with Joe and Barry. 

 

 

 

What does it mean to be "written fully as an AA woman"? I'm not being facetious, I really want to know.

 

Not ignore that she is black. I'm pretty sure race has never been addressed on this show, in any way. And none of the characters s/ls are affected by their race in any way. Take Linda, she's an Asian woman covering sports, when it would be very very difficult for her to get a job at a major newspaper covering sports, and even if she got it, there's no way she wouldn't deal with a lot of b/s at work in RL. And as for Iris, both of her love interests were white, even though statistically speaking AA women are less likely to date outside their race. Plus, with Barry being taken in by a black family, that's an opening right there to address race, but that hasn't happened.  Nobody sees race on this show and no one is affected by it.

Edited November 11, 2015 by dirtypop90

[phoenics]

What does it mean to be "written fully as an AA woman"? I'm not being facetious, I really want to know.

Well for starters, acknowledging that she is one, lol. For example, in Scandal, they don't ignore Olivia's race. It comes up in very realistic ways on the show. From Papa Pope's "you have to be 10 times as good" speech to other areas on the show, it's not ignored. It's used - very cleverly. I don't think The Flash writers are capable of that - so at this point, I just want her written exactly as you said - a smart, beautiful, capable, successful, intrepid reporter character who also happens to be the love of Barry Allen's life.

[Trini]

I still think that Iris will play a major part in the second half with the Wally stuff, and I also think Patty will be on her way out by then too, so things will get better in 2016, at least in terms of screentime.

 

I'm glad you have some optimism left, because mine is just about depleted. With Iris in the know, and her mother being introduced I had some high hopes -- that were dashed. Things are slightly better than last season, but last season was pretty bad for Iris as a character.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Trini

[Ruby25]

Well, here's the thing. In terms of pure screentime, the easiest thing for them to do is have the Barry/Iris love story upfront. With this stupid Patty character though, they're sidelining it (I really think the only real reason for that is because they want the audience to know Barry has some experience).

 

But as soon as that's over with, they could bring it back and Iris will be important simply as Barry's true love, if nothing else. And I realize it sucks that they seem incapable of doing things with her aside from that, but with Linda as a character now, it would be easy for them to also have the two of them as reporters together, and future in-laws, etc.

 

I don't know what they're doing right now though, because Barry and Iris are supposed to still be best friends, and they don't even seem to be that. But I think once they can get rid of Patty, Iris will become more prominent again.

[dirtypop90]

I think Patty is real and they will start to have problems because of Barry's injury. I haven't read spoilers so I have no clue how long Barry will be unable to feel his legs but I'm sure he'll be grumpy, plus, he will have to lie to her about how it happened. 

[Ruby25]

Is Patty for real? She is a bit too stalkerish to be for real. She has to be a plant.

I don't know- I think she's just there to get Barry laid and make sure people know he's not a virgin before Iris happens. She seems so uneccessary to the show right now though. They could have accomplished that goal by giving him a one night stand and gotten it over with (I know he's not that kind of guy, but everybody can have a slip, right? It'd have been better than wasting this much screentime on a terrible and pointless character).

[zannej]

I think a big part of the problem is the way they created Iris in the first place. Unlike some of the other characters, she isn't a scientist and they didn't give her any overly useful skills (or at least not ones that they seem to use). I think they don't know what to do with her. Whether or not it is a race issue-- I don't know. I tend to think that regardless of her race-- with her profession and status as basically just the love interest from the comics, they didn't have a lot of ideas for her and only put her in out of some obligation-- sort of like they did with Laurel Lance.

[Ruby25]

Yeah, but Laurel had becoming the Black Canary up her sleeve at least. Iris doesn't have that- she HAS to stay Barry's true love or they really won't have another role for her.

[phoenics]

Yeah, but Laurel had becoming the Black Canary up her sleeve at least. Iris doesn't have that- she HAS to stay Barry's true love or they really won't have another role for her.

There is one more thing they could do with Iris -

they could do the Iris from the future storyline

- but still, without Iris as the matriarch of the flash family, Barry has no other speedsters beyond the other 2 this season without them twisting Flash family mythos beyond belief. And that would just be really - suspicious - to do (dumping all of that) given that they made Iris black.

[dirtypop90]

I think a big part of the problem is the way they created Iris in the first place. Unlike some of the other characters, she isn't a scientist and they didn't give her any overly useful skills (or at least not ones that they seem to use). I think they don't know what to do with her. Whether or not it is a race issue-- I don't know. I tend to think that regardless of her race-- with her profession and status as basically just the love interest from the comics, they didn't have a lot of ideas for her and only put her in out of some obligation-- sort of like they did with Laurel Lance.

 

All they had to do was read the comics.

 

And the way AK (the executive producer) spoke about Iris's importance in the flash's story certainly didn't indicate she was added as an obligation. 

 

I honestly think there's no reason Barry and Iris shouldn't have began the show married. This stupid back and forth, will they/won't they, wasn't needed for this type of love story where there is time travel and different time lines to make the love story unique and interesting.

Edited November 11, 2015 by dirtypop90

[Ruby25]

There is one more thing they could do with Iris -

they could do the Iris from the future storyline

- but still, without Iris as the matriarch of the flash family, Barry has no other speedsters beyond the other 2 this season without them twisting Flash family mythos beyond belief. And that would just be really - suspicious - to do (dumping all of that) given that they made Iris black.

I completely agree with you. I can't imagine them not wanting to do Bart Allen at some point, the Tornado Twins, XS, all of that. Which is why it's really hard for me to see how they don't go back to Barry/Iris as soon as this Patty BS is over with.

 

I'm just really surprised that they aren't wanting to at least still hint at it while this other stuff is going on, still place value on the Barry/Iris relationship if they intend to come back to it. Leaving it completely on ice like this is odd and a glaring error, imo.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Ruby25

[phoenics]

I completely agree with you. I can't imagine them not wanting to do Bart Allen at some point, the Tornado Twins, XS, all of that. Which is why it's really hard for me to see how they don't go back to Barry/Iris as soon as this Patty BS is over with.

Kinda like how they dropped the whole "Iris West-Allen" byline into the show right when Eddie wanted to propose and Joe was theorizing that Iris would say yes, my guess is that they might introduce Bart Allen right when Barry looks like he's about to do something stupid and propose to Patty or something like that.

[Ruby25]

Yeah, but when that happened they had been pushing the Barry/Iris thing all season long. They're not doing that at all right now, which is weird to me. Are they planning to just bring it back out of nowhere? If Iris doesn't even care that he has another girlfriend, what could possibly wake her feelings up at this point? It still needs build-up.

[dirtypop90]

But how do we know Iris doesn't care? We don't know how Iris feels about anything. They will just have her tell Barry she just wanted him to be happy  and be done with it.

[SevenStars]

I think a big part of the problem is the way they created Iris in the first place. Unlike some of the other characters, she isn't a scientist and they didn't give her any overly useful skills (or at least not ones that they seem to use). I think they don't know what to do with her. Whether or not it is a race issue-- I don't know. I tend to think that regardless of her race-- with her profession and status as basically just the love interest from the comics, they didn't have a lot of ideas for her and only put her in out of some obligation-- sort of like they did with Laurel Lance.

I would agree with this if Iris hadn't enter the journalism world through her interest in metahumans. The very thing that Barry and the other characters deal with in every episodes. So Iris could be part of the main story as someone who investigate and help them find dangerous methumans. As well as the one working with the team to report on them. There are several ways they can make Iris be part of the team.

Also, the writers are not only keeping Iris out of the main story but they are also ignoring her friendship with Barry. Even scenes and situations that make sense for her to be in, they don't put her.

When almost every week there is a storyline/scene /situation that Iris should be part off but isn't. It shows that it is less about Iris' career path and more like the writers are intentionally isolating her and ignoring her.

I hate this. If the season continues this way for Iris, I won't be watching Flash next season cause I don't like the it makes me feel to see the writers do this to Iris. I want to enjoy the show, not be bitter at the way they are treating Iris.

[phoenics]

Iris was busy last season, but now she seems to be just standing around like an extra with lines.

She doesn't have to be one of the scientist. She can still be a reporter or blogger, and still be a part of the main story.

She should be driving some of the main stories - given that SHE is the reporter. She'd be the one tracking down metahumans and seeing what's happening in Central City and passing on intel to Team Flash. With the fact that one of the producers (Gabrielle Stanton) actually invoked Lois and Clark (the tv show) and compared Iris and Barry to that, but yet we've seen NONE of that on the show really irks me. Especially since in the comics, Iris and Barry work on cases TOGETHER. Team Flash really stole most of Iris West's storyline in this - but the writers could EASILY fix that by just letting Iris feed the team cases from her job.

They could have done that in season one with Iris and her blog but chose not to, and lo and behold, Patty Spivot gets to yammer on about metahumans in S2 and even kinda direct story a bit. The differences in how the writers are treating Patty vs Iris are GLARING.

I'm just so sick and tired of this BS. Twisted, Sleepy Hollow... TVD.. SAME stupid pattern.

[SevenStars]

But how do we know Iris doesn't care? We don't know how Iris feels about anything. They will just have her tell Barry she just wanted him to be happy and be done with it.

Not knowing how Iris feel, not having Iris pov damages the Barry/Iris relationship. It gives us no reason to root for the relationship because the last time we saw any hint of romance coming from Iris it was for Eddie. And this season she is giving Barry dating advice, while seeming not to care that he's interested in another woman.

This is why I'm not even rooting for them because the writers are giving me no reason to root for them. I'm not even mad or sad about Patty/Barry. I'm indifferent to them. I should feel some type of way about them since they are happening and Iris/Barry not, but I'm not because the writers have made it seems like the characters have move on and are okay with the statues of their relationship. They no desire or longing to be with each other.

[dirtypop90]

She should be driving some of the main stories - given that SHE is the reporter. She'd be the one tracking down metahumans and seeing what's happening in Central City and passing on intel to Team Flash. With the fact that one of the producers (Gabrielle Stanton) actually invoked Lois and Clark (the tv show) and compared Iris and Barry to that, but yet we've seen NONE of that on the show really irks me. Especially since in the comics, Iris and Barry work on cases TOGETHER. Team Flash really stole most of Iris West's storyline in this - but the writers could EASILY fix that by just letting Iris feed the team cases from her job.

They could have done that in season one with Iris and her blog but chose not to, and lo and behold, Patty Spivot gets to yammer on about metahumans in S2 and even kinda direct story a bit. The differences in how the writers are treating Patty vs Iris are GLARING.

I'm just so sick and tired of this BS. Twisted, Sleepy Hollow... TVD.. SAME stupid pattern.

 

yes to all of this, and re twisted, I don't think I've ever dropped a show so fast 

[Marie F.]

Pardon the length of this essay but if I were writing/producing this show, I probably wouldn't want to go anywhere near Iris anymore for fear of upsetting people. Someone is always upset about something w/ her and it’s hard to separate legitimate criticism from the criticisms of 1) biased haters or 2) biased fans. Iris fans are very vocal and her fan base seems huge, but it can get a little sticky when most of the comments about her character often resolve into conversations about her race, relevant though it is much of the time. Maybe that’s where part of the problem lays?

 

The people making this show decided on their own to make the West family black but I do wonder if they’re starting to regret that decision? It has come with a lot of baggage they’re clearly not used to managing. I don't think they understand the Iris hate in S1--because it was an unreasonable, illogical type of hatred they’ve never experienced before.  People are uncomfortable dealing w/ race or being anywhere near it if they don’t have to be.

 

I think most of the problems with the character wouldn’t exist if the character were played by someone else. I think she would be easier to write for and to display prominently in promos, for instance. I also don’t think there’d be a Patty. There’s a theory here that Patty only exists to get Barry laid, but why couldn’t Linda do that or a random one-nighter? I think they didn’t just want to show him as being able to pull hot blonde white chicks, but also wanted to show that he’s super into hot blond white chicks, too. I mean, there was the pilot where he kissed Felicity, but his last gf was an Asian woman and he’s in love with a black woman. Allegedly. Maybe they don’t want the fangirls to think he doesn’t find them attractive so they had to shoe-horn this relationship in? Because God forbid!

 

I wonder if they’re starting to resent the character because she’s the source of a huge chunk of the criticism of S 2. There are huge problems with other characters, too, especially the women, but Caitlin and Patty don’t seem to have huge fan bases that speak up on their behalf. Maybe they think the best thing to do is push her aside, leave her there as window dressing, at least for now? When you think about it, they don’t know who any of the women are outside of romantic pairings—Caitlin is plot-driven and gets a personality transplant every few episodes (w/ Ronnie, Jay, Hewitt/Jax storylines being the catalysts) while paper-thin Patty doesn’t even get one personality of her very own.

 

I think/hope that the other part of the issue is the fact that they have way too much to do right now w/ too many characters, trying to launch a new show. A lot of the characters are suffering from this, but it looks funny because she is bearing the brunt of the suffering and it looks like they’re trying to replace her and have in several senses (Patty has assumed her position as LI , taken over Iris's metahuman investigations, and eaten up a lot of screen time especially for a new character, screen time that could be used to show Barry/Iris being friends or Iris/Linda's friendship or something). I really hope she is a huge factor in Wally's story, but wish there was an Iris-centered story.

 

Not knowing how Iris feel, not having Iris pov damages the Barry/Iris relationship. It gives us no reason to root for the relationship because the last time we saw any hint of romance coming from Iris it was for Eddie.

This is why I'm not even rooting for them because the writers are giving me no reason to root for them.

This is my problem with Barry and Iris now. I've lost interest, but maybe that was the reason for isolating Iris from everything and keeping them apart? They want us to forget and kill off interest. I was indifferent to Barry and Patty before, but now they've made me resent the Patty character. I also like Barry a little less but for other reasons.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Marie F.

[Oscirus]

I do think that make Iris black and then doing nothing with the race change from the comics counts as race baiting. And now it's getting to the point where Iris fans and haters are accusing each other  or being racist. Which is tragic because I do think if written correctly, Iris could be a standout character. As of now, she's basically just a talking point.

 

To say that Iris has a similar problem to Laurel is a falsehood. By this point, Laurel had her own father, her own storylines, her own career independent of Oliver. Iris has none of these things.  The only time when the writers even pay attention to Iris is at Comic con when they have Candace front and center overpromising all the "awesome things" that Iris is going to do in the upcoming episodes.

 

The thing is that I don't think that Iris is underwritten because of the writer's lack of knowledge about black women or even the fact that they're misogynists. I think it just basically comes down to  the fact that since Iris isn't a meta-human in the present or the future or a father figure that the writers really don't care about her.

[SevenStars]

Marie F

I would agree with you if the writers had really write for Iris in S1 and the fans reacted badly, both haters and fans. Then I would say the writers tried but the fans reaction have givin them pause and they are stuck not knowing how to write Iris to please the fans. But the truth of the matter is that the lack of Iris pov last season from the start was so bad that I don't know if the majority of fans reaction is because of her race or because they had no idea why she was doing the things the writers had her doing.

Basically fans were mad because Iris wasn't being written for. Those who already hated her for whatever reason had no reason to start liking her because the writers made her do questionable things while not giving her any pov to make the fans understand why she was doing these things. So fans had to guess and those who already disliked her pick the worst reasons and those who already liked her gave her the benefit of the doubt.

So to me, the writers are the problem, not fans reaction.

[SevenStars]

To say that Iris has a similar problem to Laurel is a falsehood. By this point, Laurel had her own father, her own storylines, her own career independent of Oliver. Iris has none of these things. The only time when the writers even pay attention to Iris is at Comic con when they have Candace front and center overpromising all the "awesome things" that Iris is going to do in the upcoming episodes.

The thing is that I don't think that Iris is underwritten because of the writer's lack of knowledge about black women or even the fact that they're misogynists. I think it just basically comes down to the fact that since Iris isn't a meta-human in the present or the future or a father figure that the writers really don't care about her.

I don't watch Arrow but from what you're saying, it seems that they at least tried with Laurel. They have not even really try with Iris so far.

As for your point about them not knowing how to write for Iris because she is not metahuman or father figure, I would agree if they didn't already have the blueprint on how to write for someone like Iris in the Flash world. The comics are a perfect blueprint for them to use for Iris since they can't come up with anything original to do with her. So them not doing that is stupid from every level.

Edited November 11, 2015 by SevenStars

[Sakura12]

The comparisons to Laurel are because like Laurel, Iris is an afterthought in the main plot. Laurel misses all the big plot revelations and resolutions. She's never there when anything important happens. Just like Iris was missing at her best friend Barry's bedside after he got demolished by Zoom. She was there for part of Linda plot but again as a background player. She didn't get to hear any of the Well's story. She's there but doesn't get to do much. 

 

I'm happy they are not treating Iris like Laurel in other aspects because I have no idea what they are doing with her. She's being written as if she was a villain but we're being told she's a pure hearted hero. 

 

Iris is still being written as nice, caring individual that gets forgotten about.  As I said in the episode thread. If Barry's no longer her BFF, lets keep Linda so she can have a new BFF. I would much rather see Iris and Linda run around town reporting on stories, taking Cross Fit Classes or helping the Flash then seeing Patty being earnest, peppy and awkward with Barry or Joe. 

[Marie F.]

Marie F

I would agree with you if the writers had really write for Iris in S1 and the fans reacted badly, both haters and fans. Then I would say the writers tried but the fans reaction have givin them pause and they are stuck not knowing how to write Iris to please the fans. But the truth of the matter is that the lack of Iris pov last season from the start was so bad that I don't know if the majority of fans reaction is because of her race or because they had no idea why she was doing the things the writers had her doing.

So to me, the writers are the problem, not fans reaction.

I think they tried to write her as the typical love interest/romantic object for Barry to daydream about and prize for him to win, but it just fell flat and looked like they weren't trying. At least, in my humble opinion. I don't think they know who she is outside of that relationship.  I still have to wonder, though, if they're scared of the criticism from S1 and the heat they're getting now.

 

And you're right, Iris never gets pov. The only time Iris got a little pov (just a little) was when she confronted people for lying to her and the character got hated on for being "angry" "whiny" and "bitchy."  I think a lot of the hate she got from some viewers stemmed form her being black, being a woman confronting the men in her life, and not just the way she was written--she's not allowed to defend herself from people who hurt her because if she does she's angry and combative.  She can't demand that people respect her or treat her like an equal because then she's whiny.  And she can't have a conflicting opinion with a guy because then she's bitchy.  I wonder if the writers understand why people react like that and if they know what to do about it because, as mentioned in the post above, they have actually been writing her as likeable, nice, and warm.

 

I do think that make Iris black and then doing nothing with the race change from the comics counts as race baiting. And now it's getting to the point where Iris fans and haters are accusing each other  or being racist. Which is tragic because I do think if written correctly, Iris could be a standout character. As of now, she's basically just a talking point.

Yes, it's frustrating to see this.  It's always tricky having conversations about race but I understand how exhausting the race-bait-and-switch is. They pull you in with one thing and try to sell you something else--Sleepy Hollow, for instance.  Iris is what attracted to me to the show and though I like it, I'm not really interested if they're not going to do her right.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Marie F.

[Ann Mack]

Well I just dropped a particular After show because of all the gushing they were doing about Patty and Barry's chemistry. I'm like are we watching the same damn show. Everyone is quick to give so much to Patty but never ever Iris. I think this is a disservice created by the writers. They gave Iris very little importance in Barry's life this year and sidelined her fairly much in S1. Hell if her last name wasn't West you wouldn't even know that she was related to Joe. For now I just watch the show later so I can FF pass all things Barry and her related.

[Jenesis]

Seriously, fire your discontentment to the show/show-runners on Twitter. Iris' treatment is inexcusable. People literally are just introduced and get more screentime or POV than her but she's one of the most important people in the Flash mythos.