S04.E08: No One's Gone

[Iguessnot]

23 hours ago, Miles said:

 

 

I think she's dead, but I gotta say, they pulled that exact same shit with Glenn and the dumpster.

 

Are you sure? Seems like a lifetime, but I thought he didn't get the memorial send off after falling in the walker mosh pit.

[Donder]

She is dead. The actress was fired. Alicia and Morgan are the new leads now.

[ICantDoThatDave]

On 6/11/2018 at 3:59 PM, OoohMaggie said:

Charlie shot Nick because Nick killed Ennis in the storage unit using the deer antlers. Ennis and Mel rescued and looked after Charlie after her parents died, so she thought of Ennis and Mel as family. Obviously she’s looking through a kids eyes as regards to who started what and why.

How did she know Nick had killed him, though?  Wasn't he still inside impaled on the antlers at the time?

[Philip]

On 6/14/2018 at 12:16 PM, Donder said:

She is dead. The actress was fired. Alicia and Morgan are the new leads now.

So the guy who believes in "All life is precious." and the girl who shot an innocent man. Wow, great role models!

 

What the hell is going on behind FearTWD...

Edited June 15, 2018 by Philip

[Giselle]

On 6/11/2018 at 12:00 PM, zobot81 said:

Oh gawd no. I can't handle an entire show of morgalizing.  NO. no. absolutely not.

But then we will have the joy of chewing on his hypocrisy as we have Madison's and Rick's. 

If we get Daniel back it will be interesting to see the two butt heads.

On 6/13/2018 at 4:28 AM, Philip said:

If Morgan is the new leader of the group then oh god, it's only going to get even worse than it already is. I remember watching Morgan's special episode on TWD which was like 1hr long and the most entertaining thing about it was the animal on the land (it was either a chicken or a sheep).

 

And don't get me started with Morgan's "all life is precious" because if so, then why does he allow everyone and even himself to kill the innocent zombies who did nothing wrong? lol

It was Tabitha the goat who inspired more fan love than Lori ever could.

[zobot81]

32 minutes ago, Giselle said:

It was Tabitha the goat who inspired more fan love than Lori ever could.

Accurate.

[ByTor]

On 6/12/2018 at 11:23 PM, Miles said:

I guess I'm one of the few people who liked Madisson.

The 1st couple episodes I couldn't stand her, then she started to grow on me & eventually became my favorite character (hey, I liked Lori on TWD!), so I am bummed.  However, I don't think she's finished, there's obviously lots that wasn't discussed between the dam incident and her finding her family at the motel prior to settling in the stadium, so I think (at least hope) she'll be seen in more flashbacks (yep, I like how they're doing flashbacks, rather than "time jump, screw everything in between!")

Edited June 18, 2018 by ByTor

[1 who Knocks-Nuihc]

On 6/15/2018 at 6:41 AM, Philip said:

So the guy who believes in "All life is precious." and the girl who shot an innocent man. Wow, great role models!

 

What the hell is going on behind FearTWD...

Easy, they moved Gimple into a position over FTWD.

[WalkerTalker]

Charlie girl will leave a stench on Morgan, lol. I'm sorry, I couldn't help myself. 

[DrNowsWeightScale]

I'm neutral on the character of Madison.

She just struck me as a very stoic, capable character who would stop at nothing to defend her family. 

I figured out early on that the show was going to use Al's interview tapes, in conjunction with the time jumps, to fool us into thinking a certain character was still alive but was in reality dead - I just didn't figure it would be Madison.  I suspected it might be Alicia but was obviously wrong about that.

As to the time jumps: some of them I was able to follow, while at other times I found them confusing.

I like the Morgan character, but.

As someone who's watched both TWD and FTWD since day one (for both shows), I've already sat through Morgan (and Carol and Rick Grimes) going through arcs where they go crazy or suffer extreme guilt and/or PTSD from the non-stop killing they have to do.

I do not want or need to see Morgan go to Crazy Town yet again, for the billionth time, then bounce back, then go nuts again, etc.

Also. As I've expressed on the "Laura" episode thread, I love the John Dorie character, and I am hoping he keeps his affable, altruistic nature and sense of humor.

I don't want or need to see character arcs for Dorie where he becomes jaded, cynical, etc, a la Morgan / Rick Grimes / Carol have done 549 times over.

I note they already set the Dorie character up with guilt and reluctance to use his firearms, since he told Laura / Naomi / June about the time pre-apocalypse he shot a robber in a store but didn't mean to kill the guy. But he's already been using his firearms when necessary to defend his friends.

But I hope Dorie stays a sweet guy and isn't turned into a bitter, paranoid, grumpy guy like so many other TWD characters.

I'm not sure I understand the motive behind Alicia wanting to kill Laura / June. I think they briefly explained it on the episode (I don't remember now what it was, but at the time I heard Alicia's reason, it didn't seem like a solid reason to me to want to kill someone).

Am I the only one who was reminded of the scene from the Jurassic World movie where the lady uses a flare to direct the T-Rex to the other dino, when Madison was waving her flare around to get the attention of the zombies in the stadium?

Edited June 23, 2018 by DrNowsWeightScale

[WalkerTalker]

I followed the time jumps pretty good until the very last episode. It got a little crazy on the last show. I agree with you on the crazy town stuff. Sure there are going to be multiple ups, and downs in life, especially a za. But, going over the same issues persistently can get boring. I think of the time when Rick prolonged hallucinations of Lori. I can't help but think the dude who taught Morgan to live in peace would have another view if he had left the woods himself. I sure hope they don't Morganize Dorie. I like his optimistic attitude despite the despair all around him. Some peeps just accept their reality better and move on. Alicia wanting to kill Laura made sense the entire time, until we finally found out why she felt betrayed. Then it was like WTHeck! Even after Alicia knew the truth and kept trying to kill her, it was like WTHeck are they doing. That is what got confusing to me on the last episode. Yes, I thought of the beloved JG waving that flare around to save the kids. I'm so glad they have him in the new JP show. He is such a good actor. He really brightens up a dark show. 

[DrNowsWeightScale]

10 hours ago, WalkerTalker said:

... I sure hope they don't Morganize Dorie. I like his optimistic attitude despite the despair all around him. Some peeps just accept their reality better and move on. Alicia wanting to kill Laura made sense the entire time, until we finally found out why she felt betrayed. Then it was like WTHeck! Even after Alicia knew the truth and kept trying to kill her, it was like WTHeck are they doing. That is what got confusing to me on the last episode. Yes, I thought of the beloved JG waving that flare around to save the kids. I'm so glad they have him in the new JP show. He is such a good actor. He really brightens up a dark show. 

I know, I so do not want the show writers to Morganize Dorie, as you put it. I like Dorie the way he is. He's a nice change of pace from the usual Doom and Gloom mentality from all the other characters on both shows.

From what I can remember of the show, (please correct me if I'm wrong), didn't Alicia say she was upset with June (aka Naomi / Laura) because she assumed her mother (Madison) ran back into the stadium to go after June, so she was blaming June for her mom's death? It was some kind of explanation like that.

It didn't make any sense to me to blame June for Madison's death. Madison chose to run back into that stadium waving a flare to draw the zombies away from her kids and Strand.

The only thing I can think of is that when a person is in deep grief - as I'm sure Alicia is, just right after losing her Mom - a person can become irrational and lash out, wanting anyone to blame for the loss. 

[WalkerTalker]

We all determined as we watched that something bad had happened to Madison. As we neared the end of the season we found out it was Naomi. But, on the last episode, unless I missed some things, and that is possible with watch-n-chat, it didn't make sense why Alicia was  gunning for her like she was. If you take into account the emotional need to blame someone angle then they needed Alicia to give Naomi an apology of some sorts.Maybe in the new season that will happen. Maybe they could have shown Alicia, Strand, etc. having that emotional outpouring of grief,sorrow, and acknowledgement that they had blamed the wrong person. You know, when you are the cause of someone's death, it is mentally easier/safer to blame someone else. The self can not take in the pain of what it has done. Looking back I can see that in Nick's character even more so. Remember how he went after them with such hate in his heart. His personal pain was so immense. Good point you brought up on their emotional pain. 

[Gobi]

As best as I can figure, when Naomi showed up at the Vultures rendezvous Alicia decided she was in cahoots with them and had betrayed the Stadium people.

[ByTor]

On 6/23/2018 at 6:57 AM, WalkerTalker said:

Even after Alicia knew the truth and kept trying to kill her, it was like WTHeck are they doing. That is what got confusing to me on the last episode.

You know what confused me even more?  Why was Alicia gunning for Althea the way she was?  She tried to shove her out of her tank into a crowd of hungry walkers, so she wanted her not only to die but to die horribly.  I mean, "tell me your story" is annoying, but not that annoying :)

[WalkerTalker]

lol, Althea is annoying, but your right, not that annoying,lol. 

After they figured out Naomi was not in cahoots with the Vultures Alicia still tried with wild abandon to kill her, and Althea. That is why it got confusing with the time lapse at the very end with me. Up until that point I followed it and didn't mind.

[DrNowsWeightScale]

On 6/24/2018 at 8:44 PM, WalkerTalker said:

After they figured out Naomi was not in cahoots with the Vultures Alicia still tried with wild abandon to kill her, and Althea. That is why it got confusing with the time lapse at the very end with me. Up until that point I followed it and didn't mind.

Very good point, about Alicia trying to kill Al, and in a most inhumane way possible (feeding her face to a group of zombies!)

I generally watch each episode of Fear (and the original series) a few times, but even though I watched this one 2 or more times, the motives (to me at least) of Alicia were vague and muddled (including why she was so hell bent on killing Laura/ Naomi/ June and Al, the SWAT van lady). 

On another topic about this show:

There was a camp fire scene at the end where Laura (aka June / Naomi) was explaining her actions to the rest of the group, about why she ran back into the stadium, or whatever.

There was a similar scene in a previous episode where she broke down in that FEMA (or whatever it was) center where her daughter had died, as she was explaining to Madison what had happened to her daughter, after Madison and Strand rescued her from the horde of undead inside.

I'm not a TV writer, but can I say as a TV viewer, I found both sets of dialogue rather unconvincing and awkward - and I don't blame the actress for that, but how her scenes were written.

The amount of exposition necessary to fill in the audience in on what happened in those two scenes was just so... I don't know the word, maybe unnecessary or awkward? Tedious? Not sure what the right word is.

Isn't there a maxim, or axiom, among people who make TV shows and movies that it's better to "show" the audience what happened, rather than have a character do a long monologue telling us what happened?

I think I'd personally rather see a flash back scene indicating what happened to her kid than watch a five minute speech where she explains it all to Madison.

Or, maybe that would've come across as a "filler" episode/ scene and would have been boring. I don't know.

I just found the long, talky scenes where the lady describes a bunch of stuff to the other characters to be so awkward.

Edited June 26, 2018 by DrNowsWeightScale

[Earlwoode]

God that had to be one of the most boring episodes of the whole series.  And jeez, stop with the confusing time lines - whoever dreamed this up needs to be struck off the writer’s roster.  So Madison is dead....yawn!  Are they killing off Alicia too?  Who is left? And please don’t tell me we are going to get another whole season od Morgan saying: this has to stop somewhere?  

[DrNowsWeightScale]

On 6/27/2018 at 7:31 PM, Earlwoode said:

God that had to be one of the most boring episodes of the whole series.  And jeez, stop with the confusing time lines - whoever dreamed this up needs to be struck off the writer’s roster.  So Madison is dead....yawn!  Are they killing off Alicia too?  Who is left? And please don’t tell me we are going to get another whole season od Morgan saying: this has to stop somewhere?  

I was able to follow a lot of the time jumps, like around 90% of it, but man did I ever have to stop and give full, undivided attention to each show as it was on to grasp what was going on. In spite of that, there was the 10% or so I found confusing.

I think Alicia is the sole surviving member of the Clark family (or whatever their surname was). Show began with the Mom (Madison), the Dad (Travis), Chris (Travis' son), Nick (Madison's son), and Alicia. 

Strand and Alicia have both been around since the earliest seasons.

I am a big fan of the John Dorie character.

Assuming they keep Dorie a decent guy, and don't turn him into another tortured soul who develops P.T.S.D. or severe guilt and rage (such as Rick Grimes, Morgan, or Carol), I am a happy camper.

The previews for the upcoming FTWD show there will be a hurricane hitting.  

I wonder if we'll see zombies tossed to and fro as the hurricane hits, like the sharks on Sy Fy channel's "Sharknado" show? That would be fun.

Edited June 30, 2018 by DrNowsWeightScale

[Earlwoode]

3 hours ago, DrNowsWeightScale said:

I wonder if we'll see zombies tossed to and fro as the hurricane hits, like the sharks on Sy Fy channel's "Sharknado" show? That would be fun.

Lol, I once read a zombie story posted on the Internet where this sort of gated town perched on a hill (thus safe from zombies) get hits by a tornado which slings dozens of zombies into the town center.  Very ingenious it was.

Did anyone else notice the zombe extras were wearing suits to simulate being burnt?

My favorite character was the crazy Troy. I was sorry when they killed him off. He was great fun.

Edited July 1, 2018 by Earlwoode

[Haleth]

So it seems I never watched this epi before now. Sheesh the canonization of Madison was ridiculous. 

I still hate Alicia. Get rid of her and the kid next and they’ll have a pretty good cast. 

[Iguessnot]

Oops. Wrong episode

Edited August 20, 2018 by Iguessnot

[rmontro]

Okay, I just now watched this.  Maybe I'm missing something, but what was the point of torching the stadium and all those walkers?  The fire didn't "kill" them, because as we see now in the "present day" scenes they're all just walking around scorched.  The only possible reason I could see is that Madison burned the place so her kids would know she was dead and not come in looking for her.  So I guess she's walking around as one of the burned zombies in there?  Unless she shot herself in the head.

I've had this season on my DVR for about two years now.  I gave up on watching it but then I heard that they had killed off Nick and Madison.  Which is what I had said before, they need to kill off the original characters except Strand and Alicia because they just weren't likable.  I like Morgan, but it wasn't enough to keep me around.  So I went back to see how Nick and Madison were killed.  She got the heroic death, so good for her, but as I said I'm not sure how much sense it made the way it went down.  Now I can get it off my DVR.