Versailles - General Discussion

[iMonrey]

Agreed - I think the show is trying to give story to all of the main characters, but Palatine is getting short shrift, as is the Chevalier, frankly. 

I wonder why she is called "Palatine" anyway. I don't recall hearing other characters call her that. Her name is (was) Elizabeth Charlotte, and her title (before marrying Philippe) was "the Princess Palatine," i.e. a princess of the Palatine, a region in the Holy Roman Empire. It seems odd that anyone would call her Palatine as though it were her name, especially after her marriage to Philippe. 

Not really sure where they're going with the Man in the Iron Mask either and it seems like an odd plot point. 

[Macbeth]

Oh Fabien. It' only took 3 episodes for you to get kidnapped once again. 

I like that the head of security has a duel role of playing the damsel in distress as well.  Never change Fabien. Never change. 

Edited October 25, 2018 by Macbeth

[pasdetrois]

Quote

I would rather watch scenes of Phillipe with Palatine and Chevalier than conducting the man in the mask story.  If there was another season it would be fine but as a last season this just isn’t doing it for me.

Phillippe and Chevalier together, trading quips in courtly language, was the best thing about the series for me. I'm barely paying attention at this point because there's too much going on.

[andromeda331]

7 hours ago, pasdetrois said:

Phillippe and Chevalier together, trading quips in courtly language, was the best thing about the series for me. I'm barely paying attention at this point because there's too much going on.

I do miss seeing them together although I do like Chevalier and Lisolette  are friends. I really want to see the two together hanging out they were so much fun. Plus really loved each other. We still don't know why Philippe isn't spending any time with him or what happened to make him bring the shoemaker to court. I hate how Louis is acting and treating everyone like crap and I don't buy its because his girlfriend left. He's been getting worse and even more harsh against his people. I do wonder if Marchal's been effected by it given his reaction to what they did to the one man. The one who effected the Queen she's sure grown up and more bolder since season one.

[ch1]

Louis is full on tyrant this season.  He had his unlikeable moments in previous seasons but there is nothing rootable about him this year.

I think the only reasons Guillome is around is Phillipe wanted him rewarded for saving his life and it gives a reason for the king to interact with the peasants.  

I would have rather not seen Sophie come back at all than be used the way she is.  I just can’t with the bug in the Queen’s ear.

[iMonrey]

I think it was a misstep to spend so much show time on Madame Maintenon. The character just isn't all that interesting, and frankly the actress playing her isn't terribly compelling either. You combine that with Louis himself doubling down on his inherent unlikablilty and it makes the show much less fun to watch. 

[ch1]

This show is completely not fun to watch.  It’s just so dark this year.  It doesn’t help that Phillipe is cut off from everything and you don’t really get to see his humor.   That is one of the best things about the character.  Chevalier and Palatine being BFFs is great but something is missing without Phillipe.

[andromeda331]

4 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I think it was a misstep to spend so much show time on Madame Maintenon. The character just isn't all that interesting, and frankly the actress playing her isn't terribly compelling either. You combine that with Louis himself doubling down on his inherent unlikablilty and it makes the show much less fun to watch. 

 

3 hours ago, ch1 said:

This show is completely not fun to watch.  It’s just so dark this year.  It doesn’t help that Phillipe is cut off from everything and you don’t really get to see his humor.   That is one of the best things about the character.  Chevalier and Palatine being BFFs is great but something is missing without Phillipe.

Both of these. Maintenon isn't interesting. She's a bore who's thinks she's better then others because she sprouts religious crap and the actress isn't playing her interesting either. Just boring. I don't see what Louis sees in her. She's boring, sprouts crap and is a hypocrite. I don't see any sparks or love. When his servant suggested Louis wanting the woman it sounded more like Louis wanted the one woman who wouldn't sleep with him. Its not fun and with Louis becoming worse and worse in each episode its not fun to watch. Everything's so dark. Chavalier really is the only bright spot. He's the only one having any fun even thought he clearly misses Philippe. I miss seeing the two together. Sophie came back but she's clearly changed and for the good. I wish she hadn't come back and we could think she's off having a good life somewhere else.

[qtpye]

21 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

 

Both of these. Maintenon isn't interesting. She's a bore who's thinks she's better then others because she sprouts religious crap and the actress isn't playing her interesting either. Just boring. I don't see what Louis sees in her. She's boring, sprouts crap and is a hypocrite. I don't see any sparks or love. When his servant suggested Louis wanting the woman it sounded more like Louis wanted the one woman who wouldn't sleep with him. Its not fun and with Louis becoming worse and worse in each episode its not fun to watch. Everything's so dark. Chavalier really is the only bright spot. He's the only one having any fun even thought he clearly misses Philippe. I miss seeing the two together. Sophie came back but she's clearly changed and for the good. I wish she hadn't come back and we could think she's off having a good life somewhere else.

I have heard this was true of the real woman. She was supposedly religious and tiresome and it affected the whole court.

[andromeda331]

10 hours ago, qtpye said:

I have heard this was true of the real woman. She was supposedly religious and tiresome and it affected the whole court.

Really? That stinks. 

[qtpye]

5 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Really? That stinks. 

Yeah, her rise was considered when Louis and Versailles started to wane, but there were financial and personal reasons for this as well that I do not think the show will go into. France was supposedly in great financial trouble due to wars and Louis also experienced some devastating family loses.

[andromeda331]

27 minutes ago, qtpye said:

Yeah, her rise was considered when Louis and Versailles started to wane, but there were financial and personal reasons for this as well that I do not think the show will go into. France was supposedly in great financial trouble due to wars and Louis also experienced some devastating family loses.

I really didn't know much about her except was I think nanny or governess or something to some of Louis's children and friend or former friend of Montespan and

Spoiler

became Louis's second wife after the Queen died. I don't know if this is considered spoiler or not. But it was never officially announced.

On the show she's definitely boring and I really don't see what Louis sees in her. 

[ch1]

I also think Maintenon is boring and listening to someone go on and on about religion makes me tune out - especially with a character that’s a hypocrite (she’s all about God but uses Palatine’s son to punish her?) but the biggest problem is the actors don’t have that kind of chemistry.  I just don’t buy into their love story and as I said she just seems like a mother figure for him.

Who knows that might be why the real Louis fell for her.

[IntrovertRed]

6 hours ago, ch1 said:

I also think Maintenon is boring and listening to someone go on and on about religion makes me tune out - especially with a character that’s a hypocrite (she’s all about God but uses Palatine’s son to punish her?) but the biggest problem is the actors don’t have that kind of chemistry.  I just don’t buy into their love story and as I said she just seems like a mother figure for him.

Who knows that might be why the real Louis fell for her.

Could be if Louis was a momma's boy.  But definitely the actors have no chemistry.

Phillipe - so smart (and handsome, sigh).  He knows Bontemps is not to be trusted.  Also wonder if he had been the king how things would have been instead of Louis.

This season definitely isn't as captivating.

And we all know that Marshal will figure out who kidnapped him.  As soon as the woman comes to the castle with the shoes.  She better keep her mouth shut.

[andromeda331]

I hated this episode. I hated Maintenon and Louis so much in this episode. Both were so awful I actually wondered many times during the episode if the plan was to make the show so bad no one will miss that its not coming back. Forget the Queen I kept hoping Maintenon would end up murdered instead. Chevalier called her right in the salon as a she-wolf. I can't believe she fired him. I honestly wouldn't have been that upset if Louis had been poisoned instead. The only highlight was Philippe finding Lisolette and Chevalier waiting for him in his bed, the friendship between the three, and Philippe's fight and killing the minister. The rest was just bad, dark, and depressing. I miss the fun. I miss seeing Philippe and Chevalier together.        

[ch1]

I had a similar thought that by making Louis so awful you won’t miss the show.  

Maintenon makes Montespan look like a Girl Scout.  I just need someone to explain to me why Bontemps was against her influence and nothing is said about Maintenon’s.  Montespan didn’t feed into Louis’s god complex and sure didn’t tell him to persecute his people in the name of God.

The queen deserved so much better.  The real queen died from some kind of infection in her arm.  What happened on the show was done to just beat the fans over the head with Louis believing he was chosen by God.

I liked the scene with Phillipe and Chevalier but I’m not here to see them talking about Chevy being in love with a character he’s known for 5 minutes.  All I’ve seen is a character eyeing a potential way of keeping his place in Versailles and getting his hands on some money since he lost his place with Phillipe.  That doesn’t mean he doesn’t care about her but I don’t see love - on either part.

[iMonrey]

Yeah, seems like we all share the sentiment that this season just isn't cutting it. Philippe should be in the thick of things instead of off on his own chasing after the Man in the Iron Mask. That story is just dragging and doesn't seem to go anywhere. Another misstep. 

One thing I wonder is whether Louis is knows the truth about the Man in the Iron Mask and is hiding it from Philippe, or if he truly doesn't know of his existence. My bet is on the former.

I do think Elisa Lasowski (Marie-Thérèse) did some exceptional acting in this episode. But I didn't understand what they were trying to imply when she was screaming about betrayal and the sound went all wonky like an echo chamber and the camera fixed on a close-up of Louis. Was he just sort of zoning out, or was he imagining it? I didn't get what they were going for there.

[andromeda331]

Well progress on the Man in the Iron Mask I guess not that surprising after all. I still hate Maintenon and Louis in this episode. The poor people of Court to go from one dangerous powerful mistress Montespan to another. I liked what Chevalier said to her. I hope Sophie and Eleanor got away. Yes, let's show Louis being even worse in plotting the death of an innocent girl. No worries right Maintenon everything you both do is for God right? I hated Philippe slapping his daughter. Poor girl, how much it had to suck to go through that. I thought it was sad when Philippe was told that was his daughter. Hadn't seen her in so long he didn't even recognize her.  I'm assuming Marchel went to Sophie because he knew she'd figure out Eleanor was marked for death and to get her out of the palace. He seemed disturb at the idea of killing her. Really this season hasn't been good at all. This episode wasn't fun. It was another episode of an out of control Louis and his righteous hypocrite mistress.  

[ch1]

I wonder the thought process of the writers to portray Phillipe as a completely disinterested father.  It’s like when they remembered the real Phillipe actually had children they could only play it for laughs.  I get the idea that someone else raises royal children but not knowing what they look like is too much.  I also read that when it came to his children the real Marie Louise was known to be Phillipe’s favorite.  This is a long winded way of saying the writers really missed the boat here.  We’ve spent the last season watching Phillipe in a story that really is just not necessary and having him be completely indifferent to characters he has any kind of connection with. 

Regarding the slap, I can’t completely hate on Phillipe here since she did have a knife to a man’s throat.  Also this is a man who raped his first wife so if I can ignore that and still be a fan of Phillipe...

[iMonrey]

I thought this one was pretty good. The season has been lackluster as a whole but it felt like we were finally getting somewhere with the Man in the Iron Mask storyline, which has been going around in circles. Also, Louis' rush to claim Spain by marrying his niece off to the king is heating up. I really enjoyed the arrival of Philippe's daughter (and yes, gasped at the slap in the face, realistic for the time as it would have been). Actually ordering Fabien to assassinate the other girl was unexpected - even Fabien seemed to have doubts. I'm eager to know how that will go (although, historically, I know who ends up marrying the king of Spain). 

Ovation moved Inside Versailles all the way back to 4:00 in the morning. That shows how much the are over this show already. Although to be fair, the after show is a real waste of time and talent. They've got Tygh Runyan (Fabien) and Evan Williams (Chevalier) every week as guests but the host, Chelsea Cannell, is so vapid and uneducated we never get any real info about the show. She spent the last five minutes of the last episode playing a game asking the guests whether certain books had ever been banned or not and had no idea why certain ones had been banned. There was no point to it whatsoever.

[ch1]

The only thing I enjoyed about the last Inside Versailles was hearing Evan Williams thoughts on Chevalier and Delphine.  I’ve wanted to hear his take since the whole thing began.  

[andromeda331]

Saturday's episode was a mixture for me I liked Marchel letting Sophie and Eleanor go, Philippe and Louis going to see the midwife, I liked seeing the two together especially when they were talking that one night and Chevalier helping the man leave the grounds. Learning who the man in the iron mask in was actually a surprise! That should make things interesting. I'm curious how that went down. I didn't like the Louis and Cardinal or Louis and the Emperor their all horrible I'm not sure who I want to win and I know the peasants are probably building to something but I wish it would get there. Now Louis going after more land. Of course he. I think I liked the episode the most this season.

Edited November 18, 2018 by andromeda331

[iMonrey]

I'm not sure how I feel about the reveal of the man in the iron mask. Am I to understand this means Louis XIV was a bastard? Was the man in the iron mask also Philippes's father? That might be taking artistic liberty with history a bit too far. Also, the blind lady just got finished telling Louis he sounded just like his father. I'm assuming she meant Louis XIII, not the man in the iron mask. 

So now they're only showing Inside Versailles on Facebook, LOL. And it's only 10 minutes long.

[ch1]

Yes at most Louis was a bastard.  I’m fine with fiction but the writers making one of the most famous rulers in Europe a bastard is a little too much for me.

Honestly though if you are going to do it than make Louis the iron mask guy’s son and Phillipe the son of Louis XIII.  That would make for interesting drama.

I was annoyed by the scenes of Chevy with Palatine and Marie-Louise.  It’s like they were trying to put him in Phillipe’s place and I’m sorry I don’t buy Chevy giving a damn about his daughters.  I was also annoyed that they had Phillipe send his daughter away never to be seen again without a backwards glance.

[meep.meep]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

So now they're only showing Inside Versailles on Facebook, LOL. And it's only 10 minutes long.

How much more could Williams and Runyan possibly have to say?  Are there no other North Americans in the cast?  

The further they get away from actual history, the worse the show gets.  

[iMonrey]

Quote

How much more could Williams and Runyan possibly have to say?

Yeah it would be nice to have some of the other actors from the show, but that inane host isn't helping matters. Somehow Ovation must have figured out that nobody, but nobody, is watching this thing.

[ch1]

Williams and Runyan are the only actors in the US which is why we’re only seeing them.  The other main actors live in Britain.

[ch1]

Oh  I know about the legend, I just don’t like that the writers went with it.  

[andromeda331]

4 hours ago, ch1 said:

Oh  I know about the legend, I just don’t like that the writers went with it.  

Especially since no one actually knows who the man was. They really could have done anything with it.   

[iMonrey]

Wasn't the man in the iron mask entirely a work of fiction? I'm not aware that it has any historical basis.

[andromeda331]

38 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Wasn't the man in the iron mask entirely a work of fiction? I'm not aware that it has any historical basis.

Yes, it was. No one actually knows who the man in the iron mask was. There have been attempts to find out but never found anything.  

[ch1]

Can anyone make heads or tails of a Phillipe?  He couldn’t care less for his daughter but is completely kind to a man he just met.  They were nice scenes but...

Regarding the Chevalier and Delphine, I just can’t with the Chevalier being legitimately attracted to a woman.  Not the guy I have watched the past 2 years.

Its also the most explicit sex scene he had and all it took was putting him with a female.  Does that bug anyone else?

[iMonrey]

ch1 I think the unedited scenes are a bit more explicit - Ovation shops them up pretty good. I re-watched Season 1 on Netflix and it was unedited there. 

[andromeda331]

On ‎11‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 5:36 AM, ch1 said:

Can anyone make heads or tails of a Phillipe?  He couldn’t care less for his daughter but is completely kind to a man he just met.  They were nice scenes but...

Regarding the Chevalier and Delphine, I just can’t with the Chevalier being legitimately attracted to a woman.  Not the guy I have watched the past 2 years.

Its also the most explicit sex scene he had and all it took was putting him with a female.  Does that bug anyone else?

No, the scenes between Philippe and his father is nice but I don't understand either why he doesn't care about his daughter. It would be nice if he showed some sign of caring. I really have a hard time seeing and believing that Chevalier is in love with Delphine. A friend maybe. I assumed he was trying to find a way to stay at Versailles after loosing his job and/or just looking for something to do since Philippe suddenly dropped him. I do like him helping the Protestants leave. I also liked the scene with Lisolette winning her conversation with Maintenon.   

[bluestocking]

I haven't been able to figure out Louis at all--until this episode.  Now I think I see what the writers are going for--basically Godfather I, the Michael Corleone story.  You like Michael at first, but by the end he's killing everyone--he's been thoroughly corrupted as he finally assumes control of his family "business."

It took me a while to stop seeing Louis as the much loved Athelstan from "Vikings."  Not sure whether it was Blagden's acting, the inconsistent writing, or the fact that in the US some scenes were edited out, but the motivation for many of Louis' actions were opaque to me.   Where did the vicious anti-Huguenot campaign come from?  It doesn't seem to be a move to please the Church, since we see Louis plotting against the Vatican in other areas.  And why the strange, deep commitment to Maintenon?  The actors didn't sell that relationship at all.   Or maybe it was just underwritten.  

Maybe Blagden was miscast from the beginning.  Al Pacino sold me on Michael Corleone's descent from decent man to moral perfidy.  

We'll see what the finale has in store.  

[ch1]

Everything on the show was underwritten.  They should have had the show go at least 5 seasons.  They squeezed too much in 30 episodes and what we have is very shallow storytelling and characters acting in ways that make no sense to you. 

[andromeda331]

Michael Corleone? That would at least make some sense. So far each episode this season has made no sense. Why is he suddenly so anti-Protestant? Especially since they haven't done anything to cause problems. Especially at court. Its odd the last season Louis wouldn't have given a crap about it. I don't understand how Louis's move to become head of his church changes anything or stops the Vatican. Your either a part of the church or part of your own. The latter doesn't stop the Pope from excommunication. Same with his devotion to Maintenon there's nothing about her or their relationship that makes any sense as to why Louis is so fixed on her and the actors really aren't selling it. Chevalier isn't selling it either with his new love. I've liked most of his comments all season long but still don't understand why he's in love with Delphine. Friends sure I can see that. In love? Or what has been going on Philippe the entire season. Why does he care so much about a father he never knew about then his daughter or Chevalier? Why does the Shoemaker care so much to get into Versailles? Nothing anyone is doing is making any sense.

Edited December 4, 2018 by andromeda331

[ch1]

The writing on Versailles reminds me of the writing in American soaps.  The writers put the characters where they want when they want them.  Most of the time there is no build up and you can watch an episode feeling like you missed some episodes.  I felt like that while watching Versailles this season.  Especially with Phillipe and his breakup with Chevalier. They never gave us a why.  It’s up to the viewer to make some kind of sense out of it - and that is just poor writing and storytelling.

[Conotocarious]

The show really isn’t good this last season. I’m only watching to finish up the series at this point. I’ve already put the time into watching this much, may as well. 

[iMonrey]

I agree this season has been the weakest of the three. It makes me wonder if the writers knew it would be the last when they wrote it, because there seems to be an awful lot of world-building going on that I can't imagine getting resolved in one more episode.

I really can't understand why the writers decided to add this side story about the peasants and their financial struggles paying taxes. It adds nothing to the show. This is supposed to be a story about Versailles, not France in general. There is plenty going on within the walls of Versailles itself. It's just a big fat waste of time every time they cut to these characters in their dreary little shops. 

Initially I thought this shoe-maker guy would turn out to be Philippe's new lover - that at least would have given us a reason to care about him and his family and friends and the struggles they face. As it stands, though, he and the rest of them remain tertiary characters I couldn't care less about and are about as far removed from Versailles as they can be. What's more the story has morphed from their protests against high taxes to their ordered conversion to Catholicism. Even the show doesn't seem to know what to do with them. I guess they are just supposed to serve as the face of the commoners who are the most affected by Louis' decisions, but isn't it enough that the show concern itself with the nobles living within Versailles? It certainly was the first two seasons.

Meanwhile Philippe has been given next to nothing to do all season except chase some phantom around and who cares? When I think of the dynamic between him and Louis back in Season 1 and how pivotal their relationship was, it makes me realize how badly the story has gone off the rails in terms of this character.

It always cracks me up how nobody on this show ever has to open a door for themselves. Louis stamps his little foot and the guards open the door for him. There was a scene in this episode where he got in a fight with either Philippe or Maintenon and they stormed out of the room, and then Louis slammed his fists down on the desk. I thought it would have been hilarious if the guards had opened the doors, mistaking the sound for his usual foot-stomping, door-opening command. 

[ch1]

I also wonder if the writers were writing this season with a 4th in mind and were told while filming they weren’t coming back and had to change things last minute.  

[andromeda331]

5 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I agree this season has been the weakest of the three. It makes me wonder if the writers knew it would be the last when they wrote it, because there seems to be an awful lot of world-building going on that I can't imagine getting resolved in one more episode.

I really can't understand why the writers decided to add this side story about the peasants and their financial struggles paying taxes. It adds nothing to the show. This is supposed to be a story about Versailles, not France in general. There is plenty going on within the walls of Versailles itself. It's just a big fat waste of time every time they cut to these characters in their dreary little shops. 

Initially I thought this shoe-maker guy would turn out to be Philippe's new lover - that at least would have given us a reason to care about him and his family and friends and the struggles they face. As it stands, though, he and the rest of them remain tertiary characters I couldn't care less about and are about as far removed from Versailles as they can be. What's more the story has morphed from their protests against high taxes to their ordered conversion to Catholicism. Even the show doesn't seem to know what to do with them. I guess they are just supposed to serve as the face of the commoners who are the most affected by Louis' decisions, but isn't it enough that the show concern itself with the nobles living within Versailles? It certainly was the first two seasons.

Meanwhile Philippe has been given next to nothing to do all season except chase some phantom around and who cares? When I think of the dynamic between him and Louis back in Season 1 and how pivotal their relationship was, it makes me realize how badly the story has gone off the rails in terms of this character.

It always cracks me up how nobody on this show ever has to open a door for themselves. Louis stamps his little foot and the guards open the door for him. There was a scene in this episode where he got in a fight with either Philippe or Maintenon and they stormed out of the room, and then Louis slammed his fists down on the desk. I thought it would have been hilarious if the guards had opened the doors, mistaking the sound for his usual foot-stomping, door-opening command. 

That's pretty much the problem with almost every storyline this season. I don't know if they changed things or simply tried to stretch things out. But nothing really went anywhere. I thought the shoemaker would be Philippe's new lover that they came together during the battle. But that really went no where Philippe has been difference since he returned and we never found out why. So many episodes wasted not knowing why Philippe ended things with Chevalier or was changed. With him not ending up Philippe's lover then why are we even seeing the Shoemaker? We don't know him and they haven't bothered to really give us a reason to or reasons to why he cares so much to be at Versailles. I was initially interested the peasants. But as the episodes dragged I lost interested because it too went nowhere. It probably will in the finale. But who cares? The season was wasted on people we don't know nor do we know why we're watching them. The rest of the time we're watching people we do know but again don't know why they are doing what they are doing. Why has Philippe changed? Why has Louis become even worse and horrible to everyone? Why is Chevalier suddenly in love with a woman with zero chemistry?  Why is Louis so in love with a bore? 

[iMonrey]

Quote

I also wonder if the writers were writing this season with a 4th in mind and were told while filming they weren’t coming back and had to change things last minute.  

They might have found out even later than that. I'm not sure how production works on this show but I'm certain the entire season was filmed before any of it ever aired on Ovation. It might air earlier in the UK or Canada for all I know. But if the whole thing is shot before it ever makes it to air it's quite possible we'll end up with a cliffhanger. 

[Conotocarious]

The Man in the Iron Mask was built up so much and then boom, he’s dead. They really had nowhere else to go after the big reveal since historically Louis XIV lived a pretty long life and reigned a long time. They shouldn’t have even done it at all.

[ch1]

It seems like the iron mask story was done mostly to have a mystery since there were ones in the other seasons.  The problem was the ones in the previous seasons were just more interesting and actually involved Versailles and people in Versailles.  The iron mask story was just too isolated.

Also the biggest issue is that it isolated Phillipe and kept him from characters you wanted to see him with.  He’s married to Palatine and how many scenes did they have?  Phillipe comes back a relative stranger and no meaningful scenes about it with her?  

[Raja]

22 hours ago, ch1 said:

It seems like the iron mask story was done mostly to have a mystery since there were ones in the other seasons.  The problem was the ones in the previous seasons were just more interesting and actually involved Versailles and people in Versailles.  The iron mask story was just too isolated.

 

I think that except for the Three Musketeers it, The Man In The Iron Mask, is the best known story from the period and the hope that it may have drawn in a few more viewers to see Versailles treatment of the story. Then they were caught with cancellation notice and tried to jam the greatest hits beats into their story. 

[NutMeg]

The last season is a bum, which is a shame because the series was so good until then. I think the main problem was the acceleration of the time frame. Maintenon was a huge presence on the court in Louis' later years, but here we have all the protagonists in the prime of their life, and introducing her is just a huge dimmer on everything - court life, previous favorite character falling in the background, and acting like they have been defeated by life for no clear reason, story turning to religion wars, so new characters that add nothing to the story to the detriment of old loved characters which are suddenly relegated to the side line. Such a mess overall.

[ch1]

I agree.  Maintenon is just not compelling and that is probably more true to the real Maintenon then her being Clare Underwood.

I also think how they handled the kids of Louis and Phillipe was poorly done.  We saw the king’s heir twice out of 3 seasons and there really was zero point to introducing Phillipe’s kids at all.  I guess there was a point to Mary Louise but honestly season 4 could have focused on these characters and their relationships with their fathers.  Instead it was blink and you miss them.   

[iMonrey]

I don't think the royals had much of a relationship (if any) with their children so their absence from the story doesn't especially bother me. In fact I'm tempted to say that Philippe's disinterest in his daughter was because he believed her to be Louis' child (Louis was sleeping with Henriette, as you will recall). However, the child he had with Palatine is certainly his and he had no interest in that one either. Historically, he had multiple children with both women.

[andromeda331]

Your probably right but when season two ended I really though we'd get to see more interaction with Louis and his heir in season three. They went to the trouble to show his son at the execution in the last episode of season two I thought there was a reason for it.