Dawson's Creek - General Discussion

[VCRTracking]

That old film noir director giving Dawson a book of Pauline Kael reviews because it would help him be a director is such bullshit. No director would think the best way to learn about making movies is from a critic. 

 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

James Van Der Beek & Krysten Ritter - Don't Trust The B---- In Apartment 23 Instagram Live Reunion

 

[VCRTracking]

 

 

[luckyroll3]

Now airing on Netflix. Who's up for a rewatch?

[Aryanna]

I've actually been rewatching on Netflix but I've been doing it when I go to bed so I fall asleep and don't remember what I watched. I'm about 5 or 6 episodes in and don't remember any of it because I keep falling asleep. I've watched it through about 4 times though. Well...I take that back. I watched all six seasons once and then on rewatch I skip from the end of season 4 to the finale. I don't care much for seasons 5 and 6.

[Scarlett45]

21 hours ago, luckyroll3 said:

Now airing on Netflix. Who's up for a rewatch?

Youve twisted my arm- but YES! Omg I was a huge fan back in the day. 

[luckyroll3]

3 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Youve twisted my arm- but YES! Omg I was a huge fan back in the day. 

Lol! I thought about reaching out to you directly, but I figured you were still in the middle of your One Tree Hill rewatch.

[Scarlett45]

3 minutes ago, luckyroll3 said:

Lol! I thought about reaching out to you directly, but I figured you were still in the middle of your One Tree Hill rewatch.

I AM- but thats not going to stop me. When do you want to start?

[luckyroll3]

I've only watched 2 episodes so far, so you can let me know if you want to jump right in or wait for a bit. I'm fine with either and have no other TV committments currently. 😁

[Scarlett45]

On 12/18/2020 at 3:02 PM, luckyroll3 said:

I've only watched 2 episodes so far, so you can let me know if you want to jump right in or wait for a bit. I'm fine with either and have no other TV committments currently. 😁

I can jump in after New Year's- I want to get my holiday viewing on for the next couple of days.

[luckyroll3]

21 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I can jump in after New Year's- I want to get my holiday viewing on for the next couple of days.

Perfect. We'll start on the 4th.

[Scarlett45]

On 12/21/2020 at 11:26 AM, luckyroll3 said:

Perfect. We'll start on the 4th.

I will be starting tomorrow!!

[Scarlett45]

I totally forgot Mel Silver (90210) was Dawson’s film lab teacher. 
 

30min I still have no love for Pacey. 

Although this teacher/student thing is SO GROSS to me 
It was weird at to me when I was 13. 

Now at 35 this woman is nasty-
Pacey’s in the 10th grade!!!!

They didn’t even make her a college student doing her student teaching. She’s a grown ass woman. GROWN. 
 

Joey’s attitude I swear. 

[SparedTurkey]

2 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

30min I still have no love for Pacey. 

Just in this episode or always?

[Scarlett45]

7 hours ago, SparedTurkey said:

Just in this episode or always?

Just in this episode. Although I’ve never been a huge Pacey fan. I mean Dawson pontificated a lot but he did get things done, if I had to chose between the two of them I’d chose Dawson. However I feel so bad for Pacey that he got punched (I don’t want to see the boy hurt). 

[luckyroll3]

I have to say that I am thoroughly annoyed that they didn't pay the money to get the rights to the Paula Cole theme song. It's so jarring to hear some random folksy song that's not the iconic annoying song. 

I've always loved Pacey. I get that he's a slacker, but his character is very true to life. His family and everyone else treats him like he's shit and he wholeheartedly believes that he's not worth trying to get out of that small town, so why put in any effort for anything. 

10 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Although this teacher/student thing is SO GROSS to me 
It was weird at to me when I was 13. 

Now at 35 this woman is nasty-
Pacey’s in the 10th grade!!!!

This was gross to me when I watched it live in HS, and is equally as cringey now. Particularly because she initiates the flirting and she encourages him on. And then she'll do stuff like make out him on the dock and the next day be shocked he wants to discuss it in the middle of class.  Of course he does.....he's fucking fifteen! And fifteen year olds don't have any goddamn sense! And why is she shocked that he's telling his friends and always discussing it in public places. No wonder they got caught. I remember this romance lasting a very long time, so I was shocked when it got blown up in episode 6.

Joey is really annoying. I wanted to slap her when she started trying to slut shame Jen and embarrass Dawson when they all went to the movies.

But I also hate Jen. She tries to act so mature and above it all. But for an experienced, worldly New Yorker, she has her eyes set on Dawson of all people? She only likes Dawson because she thinks that's what she should like with this new persona.  As much as I find Dawson to be a douche, he doesn't deserve that shit.

I forgot how much I love Dawson's parents. 

[Scarlett45]

2 minutes ago, luckyroll3 said:

Joey is really annoying. I wanted to slap her when she started trying to slut shame Jen and embarrass Dawson when they all went to the movies.

She was! Absolutely awful to Jen who hadn't done anything to her, and Dawson wasn't being rude to her either. He didnt ignore her or exclude her. I understand the jealousy but she was WAY over the top with it.

 

2 minutes ago, luckyroll3 said:

I forgot how much I love Dawson's parents. 

HIs parents are fun, but I remembered his Mom's affair with her co-anchor, and how Dawson picked up on the way she said "Bob" on air and he was damn right. The thing is kids know their parents, AND once people have been intimate they forget where the "line" used to be.

[Scarlett45]

9 hours ago, luckyroll3 said:

This was gross to me when I watched it live in HS, and is equally as cringey now. Particularly because she initiates the flirting and she encourages him on. And then she'll do stuff like make out him on the dock and the next day be shocked he wants to discuss it in the middle of class.  Of course he does.....he's fucking fifteen! And fifteen year olds don't have any goddamn sense! And why is she shocked that he's telling his friends and always discussing it in public places. No wonder they got caught. I remember this romance lasting a very long time, so I was shocked when it got blown up in episode 6.

Of course she was the one who initiated the flirting and led him on, she is an ADULT and he is a CHILD. I know on tv shows kids talk to adults any kinda way (which would never happen in real life) but she could've shut him down with quickness, or just ignored him when he flirted with her in the video store. There are no commercials on Netflix so I should get through episodes pretty quickly on the weekends.

9 hours ago, luckyroll3 said:

But I also hate Jen. She tries to act so mature and above it all. But for an experienced, worldly New Yorker, she has her eyes set on Dawson of all people? She only likes Dawson because she thinks that's what she should like with this new persona.  As much as I find Dawson to be a douche, he doesn't deserve that shit.

As of right now I think Jen does actually like Dawson, because he is nice to her and doesn't expect anything from her, and he's so different than the guys she was into in NYC.

 

I am watching bit by bit as I make soup (I just realized with WFH I dont have to wait until the weekend to make soup!)- I remember the affair Mrs. Leery has with co-anchor and now Joey knows. I dont get Mrs. Leery at all, her husband is pretty hot (as Joey said) and he clearly adores her, shes going to fuck around on him for excitement because her life was "too good". Mr. Leery deserves better. I remember they split up and he takes her back later, but Im Team Mr. Leery. I didn’t think he was hot in 1998, but in 2020 I’d be game.

 

[Scarlett45]

So I have to say, something I appreciate about this show (in 1998 and 2000) is how sharp the dialogue is. I was cracking up when Dawson and Joey were having the exchange and Dawson kept saying "not until you explain the crisco!" 

I was a very verbose teenager who was filled with intellectual angst so I got it in 1998 AND in 2020 I appreciate them, its hard being 15. I would rather have teens like this gang who talk about everything all the time then teens who are dumb as bricks. 

 

[luckyroll3]

I hear that. The other thing I appreciate is that I totally buy each of the leads, and most of the kids in the school, as teens. They all have that level of appropriate awkwardness in how they carry themselves that most 15 years old do, despite all of them being relatively good looking.  Certainly not Degrassi and Degrassi:TNC levels of awkwardness, lol, but believable. I think this was just before WB/CW started only hiring actors with model looks.

[Scarlett45]

28 minutes ago, luckyroll3 said:

I hear that. The other thing I appreciate is that I totally buy each of the leads, and most of the kids in the school, as teens. They all have that level of appropriate awkwardness in how they carry themselves that most 15 years old do, despite all of them being relatively good looking.  Certainly not Degrassi and Degrassi:TNC levels of awkwardness, lol, but believable. I think this was just before WB/CW started only hiring actors with model looks.

It helps that the cast was still young, not actually 15 like in the Degrassi universe but just over the age of majority so I could buy it. Michelle Williams was the youngest (born in 1980) and everyone else was born in 1978- I just googled James Vanderbeek was born in 1977, so hes the oldest but still had the baby face.

I also like that Jen, even the "sophisticated one" from NYC isnt crazy over styled and "done". Yes she picked out an outfit, and did her hair, put on some makeup, but didnt look like she stepped off the cover of Vogue. And Joey, being lower income and a tomboy isnt done at all. Katie Holmes is attractive, with her long long legs and nice skin, but her hair is thrown up in a pony tail and she's wearing old shorts and a t-shirt, or a bathing suit and shorts.

[luckyroll3]

Pretty annoying that the show's only black character, Bodie, just disappears with no mention. I just googled and apparently he's in seasons 3-6? But overall only in 11 episodes for the entire season - pretty pathetic.

[Aryanna]

On 1/5/2021 at 7:40 AM, luckyroll3 said:

I have to say that I am thoroughly annoyed that they didn't pay the money to get the rights to the Paula Cole theme song. It's so jarring to hear some random folksy song that's not the iconic annoying song.

Not only that but a lot of the 90s music that was originally in the show was replaced by generic sound alike music because they couldn't/wouldn't get the rights to all of it. 

Also, I remember not liking the Pacey/Teacher storyline when I was younger but understood it was some kind of male fantasy like in the song Hot For Teacher. But watching it again when I'm older, it's just gross and awkward and I wish they'd never done it. I could always do without that storyline. I'm glad they dropped it early on.

[Scarlett45]

9 hours ago, luckyroll3 said:

Pretty annoying that the show's only black character, Bodie, just disappears with no mention. I just googled and apparently he's in seasons 3-6? But overall only in 11 episodes for the entire season - pretty pathetic.

From what I recall Bodie was just there as a symbol for how the Potters were seen as “low lives” *aka consorting with black people. They never had any intention of giving Bodie and Bessie any character development although as Bessie was Joey’s guardian they really could’ve had some. From the background characters there are only 2-3 black families in this entire little down on the eastern seaboard (where is Capeside again? CN?). 

*of course I don’t think that, but the towns people did. 

[Scarlett45]

I forgot Eion Bailey played Jen’s NYC boyfriend!! Why are they fighting over Jen like an object??

So I’m dissing Dawson for the slut shaming, but I am kinda on his side with wanting Jen to choose, and not kiss other guys when she says she’s his girlfriend. 
 

Wait- Dawson and Jen were only an item for a few episodes? My memory has them as an item for most of season 1. I am not looking things up on wikipedia cause I don’t want to spoil the rewatch experience. Lol. 

[luckyroll3]

I also felt their relationship was linger, similar to Pacey and Tamara. I think its a consequence of how we consume episodes now vs 20 years ago. The 5 episode arc of Pacey's hot for teacher interactions could have been anywhere from 5 to 10 weeks depending on breaks, interruptions from sports state of the unions, breaking news stories, etc. or what not. 

What is going on with Jen's hair in season 2? That cut is awful. And in locking at the dates, I recognize that this was a full year before the Felicity hair rule went I to effect, but maybe it should have been the Dawson's Creek rule. At least Keri Russell still looked amazing with the short do.

[luckyroll3]

I really wish Dawson would stay the hell out of grown folks' business. Gawd!

[Scarlett45]

I’m watching James Van Der Beek’s face mature before my eyes  

He’s the oldest but I think he lost weight and his face got more angular between episode 1 & episode 13 of season 1. 

 

Okay I’m gonna cry- why does Joey feel like no body loves her?? I mean Dawson can be a bone head but yes he loves her!! Bessie loves her! Mr and Mrs Leery love her! Why does this poor girl feel NOBODY loves her? Katie Holmes looks so young and broken. 
 

“is there a new release at the video store I don’t know about?”- Joey 🤪

[Scarlett45]

So I’m doing a One Tree Hill rewatch too, and I do remember that Chad Michael Murry showed up in the last season of Dawson’s Creek and James Van Der Beek did a guest stint on One Tree Hill in season 6. 

[Scarlett45]

Kerr Smith was hot too. This Roman haircut did him no favors but his face was put together nicely. 
 

Tamara is back- and I continue to be grossed out by this entire storyline. Pacey is a child! Watching Abby and Jen fight- why was this grown ass man entertaining obviously teenage girls. 
 

I am glad Joey is developing her art, I can see how her entire life got attached to Dawson and the Leerys after her Mom got sick and her dad was incarcerated. 

[Aryanna]

18 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Kerr Smith was hot too. This Roman haircut did him no favors but his face was put together nicely.

He played the principal on Riverdale recently. 

[Scarlett45]

4 hours ago, Aryanna said:

He played the principal on Riverdale recently. 

He’s also Callie’s bio dad on The Fosters/Good Trouble (although I don’t think he’s made an appearance on Good Trouble yet). 

[Scarlett45]

So I am really hating Father McPhee right now and we haven’t seen him. Where is Mrs McPhee’s caregiver?? Why doesn’t he have someone come in to look after her at least a few days a week. It’s not right to leave it ALL on his teenage children 24/7/365. If she wanders why aren’t there locks on the doors? He’s an awful father and husband. 

[Scarlett45]

On 1/16/2021 at 8:21 PM, luckyroll3 said:

I really wish Dawson would stay the hell out of grown folks' business. Gawd!

In Dawson’s defense- these adults always put him in their business. That often happens with single parents and only children (the “you and me against the world” mentality); and given that the Leery Parents are splitting up and don’t have each other any more they are leaning on Dawson emotionally (not saying it’s right, but it happens). The writers would’ve done well to give the Leery Parents a set of adult friends for these exposition scenes. But the adults never really got their own storylines.  

[SparedTurkey]

11 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

In Dawson’s defense- these adults always put him in their business. That often happens with single parents and only children (the “you and me against the world” mentality);

As an only child I can anecdotally say that does not happen. I am no more involved with my parent's relationship than I am the Leery's relationship. Nor do I know or comment on my parent's sex life with the freedom and overt interest that Dawson does.

Dawson is also a shitty mate to Pacey. I rewatched Detention and just awful.

[Scarlett45]

8 minutes ago, SparedTurkey said:

Dawson is also a shitty mate to Pacey. I rewatched Detention and just awful.

He was!!! 

[Scarlett45]

I hate Father McPhee. His wife is seriously ill and he dumps her on their 16yrs old children and drives them out of town and hides in his work. this woman should’ve had a caregiver so she wouldn’t wander off and the kids could go to school and study in peace. 
 

He comes back and says “oh here are some nursing companies”. No asshole YOU call the nursing companies. There’s nothing wrong with having Andi & Jack sit with him while he did interviews so they know how to do it (my Mom did that with me for my sister’s caregivers so I could learn), but you don’t hand them a piece of paper like you’re telling them to walk the dog. No. 
 

Kerr Smith did a phenomenal job telling him off (he deserved it). 

[luckyroll3]

On 1/30/2021 at 11:31 AM, Scarlett45 said:

In Dawson’s defense- these adults always put him in their business. That often happens with single parents and only children (the “you and me against the world” mentality); and given that the Leery Parents are splitting up and don’t have each other any more they are leaning on Dawson emotionally (not saying it’s right, but it happens). The writers would’ve done well to give the Leery Parents a set of adult friends for these exposition scenes. But the adults never really got their own storylines.  

 

On 1/30/2021 at 11:00 PM, SparedTurkey said:

As an only child I can anecdotally say that does not happen. I am no more involved with my parent's relationship than I am the Leery's relationship. Nor do I know or comment on my parent's sex life with the freedom and overt interest that Dawson does.

Dawson is also a shitty mate to Pacey. I rewatched Detention and just awful.

Dawson's parents do share a lot with him, but he also has too many opinions about things that really have nothing to do with him as it relates to his parent's marriage, like blaming his dad for the demise of the marriage and trying to force his dad to forgive the mom.  But when I wrote my previous comment, is was in response to seeing Dawson insert himself into other adults' business outside of his parents, so his butting in knows no bounds.  

And yes, Dawson is the absolute worse friend to Pacey. Honestly, I'm still fuming about everything regarding the Pacey-Joey-Dawson "triangle" (quotes because at no point was it ever a triangle, only in Dawson's mind), and that it was somehow Pacey's fault, alone (and I don't think anyone was at fault, but if I had to choose, Joey kept flipping back and forth on whether to tell Dawson and Dawson was just an all round dick about everything). But almost everyone on this show was awful to Pacey, with the exception of Jack. The kid couldn't catch a fucking break. And Dawson was only ever cool with Pacey when he was doing better than Pacey. Anytime Pacey attempted to level up in any part of his life, it was a problem for Dawson. Pacey was so much better than the whole lot of them and deserved more. 

[Scarlett45]

1 hour ago, luckyroll3 said:

But almost everyone on this show was awful to Pacey, with the exception of Jack. The kid couldn't catch a fucking break. And Dawson was only ever cool with Pacey when he was doing better than Pacey. Anytime Pacey attempted to level up in any part of his life, it was a problem for Dawson. Pacey was so much better than the whole lot of them and deserved more. 

I am feeling SO BADLY for Pacey. I want to give him a hug and an older male figure to guide him and encourage him in life. When he talked Mrs. McPhee out of the grocery store it took me back. Again, I teenage me wasnt "into Pacey" like every other girl was, but adult woman me has tons of sympathy for him.

1 hour ago, luckyroll3 said:

Dawson's parents do share a lot with him, but he also has too many opinions about things that really have nothing to do with him as it relates to his parent's marriage, like blaming his dad for the demise of the marriage and trying to force his dad to forgive the mom.  But when I wrote my previous comment, is was in response to seeing Dawson insert himself into other adults' business outside of his parents, so his butting in knows no bounds. 

This is too true. Dawson, your opinion isnt relevant to anyone, no one cares, this is what a journal is for.

[Ambrosefolly]

On 4/25/2020 at 6:33 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

James Van Der Beek & Krysten Ritter - Don't Trust The B---- In Apartment 23 Instagram Live Reunion

 

I loved the fake James and Chloe on that show. I feel like that is the relationship that Dawson and Joey should have ended up having. Realizing they were more like family than friends, but feeling they needed to enter a romantic relationship to keep their connection. They kind of addressed it in their last talk by the creek, but wished they got there sooner. There was a movie called "The Pact" that centered around the death of a teenage girl and her boyfriend claiming it was suicide. One of the reason she felt suicidal is because she started feeling the sexual relationship between her and said boyfriend was incestuously because they had grown up together. 

[EarlGreyTea]

I was about 12 during the first go-round of this show (probably too young to be watching), and man, P/J were my absolute JAM. It is hard to overstate how fun it was to watch their relationship develop in real time, before TV binging was a thing. You really had no idea what was going to happen, waiting with bated breath from week to week. It was such a beautiful slow burn; you could tell how much care the writers took with it. I think even they were surprised by the gold mine that was Josh and Katie's chemistry, but they smartly did not ignore it.

I also feel like I read somewhere that they had wanted to pair P/J even earlier, but Joey was occupied with Dawson, hence Andie, who had similar qualities - brainy good girl, family issues, needed saving. That's one reason why she never seemed to be a fully formed character - she was a placeholder (IMO).

I think P/J's season 4 dysfunction was hard to watch but was one of the most realistic things on the show. Pacey himself said it best in the season opener: he never expected to get her, and was just waiting for the other shoe to drop. Combine that with his (rightful) insecurity when it came to Dawson, and it's not surprising that he self-destructed. If you were an insecure person watching this unfold on TV, you understood exactly how Pacey's Promicide speech was the culmination of death by a thousand cuts. Joey constantly undermined their relationship, usually without meaning to, and eventually it got to be too much. NOT that she deserved to be dressed down like that.

 

[absnow54]

15 hours ago, EarlGreyTea said:

I also feel like I read somewhere that they had wanted to pair P/J even earlier, but Joey was occupied with Dawson, hence Andie, who had similar qualities - brainy good girl, family issues, needed saving. That's one reason why she never seemed to be a fully formed character - she was a placeholder (IMO).

I recall Kevin Williamson saying he wanted to pair Pacey and Joey in season 4, but in an All Roads Lead Back to Dawson/Joey (and Pacey/Andie) sort of way. Then KW left after season 2, and the show started to implode through the first half of season 3, and the writers decided to jump on that idea a little earlier, and damn, did they write a good love story! I don't think even they planned on ending the season with Pacey and Joey floating off into the sunset. I think the actor's chemistry and the character's compatibility just took on a life of its own.

I do think they could have realistically ended season 1 with Joey and Pacey. The second half of the season had so many moments where they really understood one another. I mean he stole his dad's car and bribed a guard so she could see her father! But KW felt that putting Dawson and Joey together at the end of the first season was the riskier, less expected storytelling move, which didn't pay off, in my opinion, because the Dawson/Joey will they/won't they thing got old real fast. 

[Scarlett45]

I havent forgotten about you guys- I have had a lot of life going on. I am going to get back into the episodes. I love that Netflix has no commercials!

[Scarlett45]

15 hours ago, EarlGreyTea said:

I also feel like I read somewhere that they had wanted to pair P/J even earlier, but Joey was occupied with Dawson, hence Andie, who had similar qualities - brainy good girl, family issues, needed saving. That's one reason why she never seemed to be a fully formed character - she was a placeholder (IMO).

That makes so much sense. Thank you for sharing. I liked Pacey and Andie as a couple, but after Andie/Pacey were over, Andie just didnt exist. 

[absnow54]

I happened to watch the season 1 finale last night. I admit, I watch season 3 of this show nearly once a year (usually the 4th of July I watch the run of episodes leading to "Joey's Independence Day") but I rarely watch any other episodes with the exception of the series finale, so it's been a LONG time since I've watched the season 1 finale.

I couldn't get over how poorly Jen was treated! First off, Michelle Williams was so underrated back then! Katie Holmes certainly had a spark around her, but MW was just so effortless in her emotional performance. The scene that really stood out to me though, was when she went to Dawson for comfort right after her grandfather died. I have a new appreciation for James van der Beek in recent years, but he was SO bad in these scenes. Jen's pouring her heart out to him, and he plays it like he's grossed out and uncomfortable, like how dare she look for sympathy from me, we broke up and I'm totally into Joey now, so NOT my problem. It's a very bad acting choice.

The season finale also reminds me of the premise in season 3, that because Dawson asked Pacey to look after Joey, Pacey fell in love with her, as if there weren't multiple occasions in season 1, where Pacey -- without any influence from Dawson, was a good friend to Joey and related to her in a way that Dawson never could. I don't think Kevin Williamson ever intended for this, in fact he went into the series finale set on Dawson and Joey, but the foundation to what made Pacey and Joey a great pairing started the moment Joey sat down next to Pacey after his affair with Tamara was revealed and was like "this town, amirite?" Josh and Katie's chemistry was stellar, and impossible to ignore, but I don't think they realized how great they laid the groundwork for the pairing early on either.

[Scarlett45]

On 4/9/2021 at 12:37 PM, absnow54 said:

I happened to watch the season 1 finale last night. I admit, I watch season 3 of this show nearly once a year (usually the 4th of July I watch the run of episodes leading to "Joey's Independence Day") but I rarely watch any other episodes with the exception of the series finale, so it's been a LONG time since I've watched the season 1 finale.

I couldn't get over how poorly Jen was treated! First off, Michelle Williams was so underrated back then! Katie Holmes certainly had a spark around her, but MW was just so effortless in her emotional performance. The scene that really stood out to me though, was when she went to Dawson for comfort right after her grandfather died. I have a new appreciation for James van der Beek in recent years, but he was SO bad in these scenes. Jen's pouring her heart out to him, and he plays it like he's grossed out and uncomfortable, like how dare she look for sympathy from me, we broke up and I'm totally into Joey now, so NOT my problem. It's a very bad acting choice.

The season finale also reminds me of the premise in season 3, that because Dawson asked Pacey to look after Joey, Pacey fell in love with her, as if there weren't multiple occasions in season 1, where Pacey -- without any influence from Dawson, was a good friend to Joey and related to her in a way that Dawson never could. I don't think Kevin Williamson ever intended for this, in fact he went into the series finale set on Dawson and Joey, but the foundation to what made Pacey and Joey a great pairing started the moment Joey sat down next to Pacey after his affair with Tamara was revealed and was like "this town, amirite?" Josh and Katie's chemistry was stellar, and impossible to ignore, but I don't think they realized how great they laid the groundwork for the pairing early on either.

I thought they knew they laid the ground work.

Pacey was always teasing and flirting with Joey and giving her a hard time about Dawson. Even my 13yrs old self was like “why does he care so much?”- ummmmhmmm. But Joey was so into THE IDEA of being with Dawson she wasn’t giving Pacey the time of day. 
 

Yes, it’s no surprise Michelle has had the career she’s had given the talent we saw. She was so underrated then. 

[Scarlett45]

I’m mad at Mr Potter- Bessie was doing a pretty decent job keeping things afloat and parenting her teenage sister. I think the character is supposed to be at most 10yrs older than Joey, but I’m guessing 24/25yrs old. She’s running the business, taking care of Joey, and her father gets out of prison and risks them losing everything by running drugs through their business. What the fuck. And then he sets a fire next door to where his child is studying? (I just realized someone else set the fire)

He has no excuse- if they take the business as a profit from drug trafficking, Bessie and Joey won’t have anything.

Pacey, Pacey I feel so sad for him- with a father like that no wonder he’s so messed up; but you have to write your exams child!

”There’s someone else that doesn’t want to be alone too.”- Jen 

I love that Jen brings Jack to Grams house!!!!!!

 

[Scarlett45]

Working my way through Season 3. 
 

So I can safely say I do still enjoy Dawson’s Creek as an adult. The writing is so sharp and I can relate to a lot of it.

The emotional angst is too much for me though- because they lied to us and told us it would get easier.

 

They were out and out liars.

(They being the “grown-ups”)

[Spartan Girl]

Am I the only one that thought Dawson for once wasn’t an asshole when he turned down Joey’s offer to get back together and sleep with him at the beginning of season three? I mean you can’t just dump someone (for the second time) and ice them out all summer and expect they’ll want to jump right back into a relationship. 

I also I really loathed how even after Joey agreed that it was probably better to go back to just being friends, it didn’t stop her from throwing a snit over Eve and repeatedly playing the victim over Dawson rejecting her. She even went as far as to compare herself to that Capeside witch who was accused of witchcraft and abandoned by her lover. Woooooow.

It really would have gone a long way into improving Dawson’s character if he stuck to his resolve and moved on from Joey instead of getting pissy over her and Pacey.

[Scarlett45]

4 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

Am I the only one that thought Dawson for once wasn’t an asshole when he turned down Joey’s offer to get back together and sleep with him at the beginning of season three? I mean you can’t just dump someone (for the second time) and ice them out all summer and expect they’ll want to jump right back into a relationship. 

I also I really loathed how even after Joey agreed that it was probably better to go back to just being friends, it didn’t stop her from throwing a snit over Eve and repeatedly playing the victim over Dawson rejecting her. She even went as far as to compare herself to that Capeside witch who was accused of witchcraft and abandoned by her lover. Woooooow.

It really would have gone a long way into improving Dawson’s character if he stuck to his resolve and moved on from Joey instead of getting pissy over her and Pacey.

No I didn't think Dawson was an asshole for not wanting to have sex with Joey. Well firstly no one is required to want to have sex with anyone. And Joey DID dump him, TWICE, the second time because she was angry that her father was drug dealing again. He rejected her advances very politely. 

Yes Joey threw a shit fit over Eve because she was jealous, Dawson was Joey's #1 emotional support since her Mom died and her closest friend*, she was going to be jealous over ANYONE else he gave his attention to (besides maybe his parents). As far as Dawson throwing a shit fit over her and Pacey, I haven't gotten there yet, but I am giving him a tiny pass for being mad in the beginning, your two bffs getting together is awkward under the best circumstances, but given one of those BFFs is your ex, who you very much still have feelings for- yeah plenty of grown ass people would be mad, much less a teenager.

And again, Pacey and Joey getting together totally ices Dawson out. At this point Jen has Jack, and Dawson didnt seem to have many other friends (or any other friends it looked like), emotional jealousy (outside of sex) is very much a thing.

 

*Not that Bessie hasn't been doing a good job taking care of her, but Dawson has been her peer and confidant. The girl also has NO other close friends. At this point Jen and Jack have an actual friendship here, but outside of the triangle thats about to happen, thats it.