Falling Water - General Discussion

[Meredith Quill]

Discuss Falling Water Here!

[numbnut]

This show is like a sedative. It's slow and weirdly antiseptic. The characters don't seem fully human.

[NeenerNeener]

It reminds me of Sense8. I don't know yet if that's a good thing or a bad thing, though. I had to watch the pilot for Sense8 twice before I thought I knew what the hell was going on (that's what I get for multitasking while watching it the first time) and then I really got into it. I don't know if I'll feel that way about this one. Maybe binge-watching this once the first season is complete will be better for overall comprehension.

Edited October 13, 2016 by NeenerNeener

[azshadowwalker]

I don't watch scripted shows anymore. It's just been too long since I found one worth watching. Part of that is also sort of self-fulfilling, where I don't watch scripted shows so I don't see the marketing for new ones. I ran across an ad for this during an old Star Trek TNG episode, and it grabbed me. Just now trying to watch the pilot. Very hopeful. 

[zxy556575]

9 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

It reminds me of Sense8.

It sure seems like it's trying to be. I already had to force myself to stick with Sense8 and am not convinced I need another one. I also kind of have a grudge against dream sequences, so yeah.

But ... it has to get better, right? Or at least develop a plot?

[Ms Lark]

I think I like it. It's slow moving (plot) and moves slow (action). Like walking underwater, but I suppose that's the dreamlike atmosphere they're trying to convey. Although it seems sometimes they are just being creepy to be creepy.

Since the second episode is up on On Demand, without giving anything away, I will say it does get better. Enough so that I am intrigued and look forward to E3. I like Sense8, too, so I'm in.

Edited October 14, 2016 by Ms Lark

[numbnut]

7 hours ago, lordonia said:

17 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

It reminds me of Sense8.

It sure seems like it's trying to be. I already had to force myself to stick with Sense8 and am not convinced I need another one. I also kind of have a grudge against dream sequences, so yeah.

But ... it has to get better, right? Or at least develop a plot?

Thanks for the heads-up. I watched the first two eps of Sense8 and lost interest, so maybe this show just isn't for me. 

Edited October 14, 2016 by numbnut

[possibilities]

It's like Sense8 meets Twilight Zone meets 2001: A Space Odyssey... police procedural meets sci fi meets hallucinogenic tripping. I am a little worried it will be too much horror, but if they steer clear of that, I could learn to love it for its weirdness.

Sense8 was nowhere near this spooky.

[SunnyBeBe]

I'm a huge fan of dreams, so, this show peaked my interest. I intend to catch up and follow.  I'm not sure I have the characters straight yet. I do think it looks amusing. 

[eurekagirl mOo]

Watched it twice. Don't understand any of it. Writers must be on crack! I'm out.

[zxy556575]

14 hours ago, eurekagirl mOo said:

Watched it twice. Don't understand any of it. Writers must be on crack! I'm out.

I looked at episode 2 on my DVR play list, watched a bunch of other things, looked at it again and deleted. There's only so much artsy pretension I can take.

Edited October 22, 2016 by lordonia

[Wryly]

Lol. I don't even understand enough to know what the questions are.

[officetemp]

I'm mostly watching this series for Will Yun Lee ("Taka") because I liked him in Witchblade. 

This show is fairly interesting, I think.  I like the way the dream imagery is portrayed, because, to me, it does kind of have the randomness that dreams tend to have.  The only thing is that I'm never sure what's a dream and what's not.  I'm still not convinced that the guy shooting himself in the first episode was a "real world" occurrence or not.  Also, wondering what those people who blew up the house are up to.  (Actually, the show kind of puts me in mind of Ursula K. LeGuin's novel, The Lathe of Heaven.)

Will probably stick around for a few more episodes, at least.

[possibilities]

I like it. I found episode 2 much easier to follow than episode 1, so I don't think it's going to be completely unintelligible. I think it's going ot be like a jigsaw puzzle, and as more pieces are put in place, we'll see the picture more clearly.

Sometimes I was confused about what was dream vs waking reality, but I also found that getting clearer. The jolt when it becomes clear each time is kind of like the pieces clicking together.

As you can see, I used to do jigsaw puzzles a lot. Haven't thought about them in a while, but the feelings this show evokes are like those.

I'm glad they don't seem to be going for pure horror, which is what I was worried about after the pilot. Bad stuff happens, but it seems to me that as they solve the case, the dreams may get less nightmarish. It's the confusion that made it feel so spooky last week.

[DrSpaceman73]

I think one of the main points of the show is what is a dream and what is reality.  That is a big part of the mystery.  Clearly the main characters are having a mix of dream and reality and the lines between the two for them are becoming blurred. 

I am enjoying the show as well, it might be just us 3 based on the lack of responses.  Episode two did clear some things up, slowly.

The people who died in the house in episode one appear to have been in a sleep circle and dreaming together, not a suicide.  And obviously the house across the street that blew up was a center for this as well

It seems some of the people are able to use their dream to predict the future, to some degree.  The "Topeka" accounts were doing well it seems because he was having dreams that guided his investments.  Tess as well seems to be using her dreams to predict future hot product lines.  The green and black sneakers were the colors she used for the crown she designed in episode one that she used in her pitch. 

The woman in the nursing home it seems was likely involved in these dream sequences as well and may have been turned catatonic as a result, by some mishap? 

Still very confusing about the kid.  He is being protected by someone, those two guys, question of course is why  ANd how is he related to everyone?  Has to be more than just Tess' son, since their is the picture of him in the record store which would be long before he was born.  Another future prediction? 

Episode two I think opened up many more questions and answers and made it more interesting than the first episode.

[Wryly]

Why was Taka trying to see an ambassador in that one scene? I must have missed something. I vaguely recall them referring to Taka as a liaison, though I don't know what department he actually belongs to. He acts like a local detective, but when he arrives at that first crime scene (dead lady on staircase) the local detectives treat him like he's different. Or was that a dream? Ugh. He hallucinated the kid there. The white lady was really black. Damn it I don't know. These guys need to get some freaking Inception totems. Spin the damn top so I know what's real.

And what exactly is Bill even trying to do? He went on this excited tangent about how wifi would be nothing compared to direct neural communication, yet none of the subjects in his experiments are allowed to communicate. There should be a drinking game where the audience takes a shot every time the words "purity of the data" are spoken on screen. Miss A-Dingo-Ate-My-Baby tells Bill that Beardo was playing a specific piano piece, and Bill is over the moon about it. Why was that significant? Did this mean an experimental message had "gotten through" to Beardo? What did Beardo's tunnel symbolize? Did... did Beardo put himself in a coma or something on purpose? From within his dream? Like, "Suck it, Bill, you'll never get my secrets!"

Why do people have to strip down to their undies to enter dream land?

[officetemp]

So confused!!  With the last episode, I thought that things were finally starting to be explained.  This episode, another trip back to puzzlement land.

Okay, so members of the green sneakers cult were both the people who were found dead and the people who blew up the house across the street.  Was Taka's mom a member of the cult before she went catatonic?  If Mom Taka had been a member, then was the green sneaker girl there in the same facility just to keep an eye on Mom Taka?  Was the musician who made that extremely rare and expensive LP and later died horribly also a member of the cult and maybe that's why Taka's mom was in the album liner photo?

So the green sneakers also are capable of lucid dreaming.  And they combine and scatter the ashes of their dead in some clearing somewhere out in the woods.  And the ashes later find their way to sprinkle themselves on Tess.

Why doesn't Taka have a partner, especially since he's investigating such a high-profile and potentially dangerous case of multiple deaths.  Very strange.

Is chronicling your child's life so extensively in the way that Tess' mom did/is doing a sign of motherly love?  Or is Mom using her own children as study/test subjects for a future publication?  What's going on between Tess and her agent?  It seemed at times that the agent wanted more than a professional relationship with Tess.

Feel bad for Burton having to clean up after everyone's messes.  Nothing seems to rattle him, though.

Okay:  Alien conquest plan?  Sinister Government experimentation and manipulation?  Or control of the human race by more highly evolved, previously unnoticed earth life?  Whatever it is, this show can get really creepy at times.  Those faceless men(?), creatures(?) in the dreams are really scary.

I'm glad that the protagonists have at least become aware of each other so early in the series, even if it's only within the context of the dreams.  I hope that they meet in the waking world soon.

The bar/restaurant seems to be a safe zone between the dream world and the waking world.  (Not for the ambassador, though.)

Of course, everything that happens in the show could just be a dream.

[AlliMo]

I have absolutely no idea whatsoever what's going on in this show, and yet I am 100% in.

[officetemp]

By chance, I happened to see the second half of Episode 3 this morning when USA rebroadcast the episode.  Noticed in Taka's dream that the green sneakers girl exchanged her green sneakers for black booties before she went upstairs to the bar/restaurant.  Also, those faceless creatures were wearing green sneakers, too.  Then, the Belgian Ambassador to the UN got up and put himself between Faceless and Tess when Tess entered the restaurant (pub?).  So, I guess the Belgian Ambassador perceived and/or recognized and/or knew that the green sneakers cult is dangerous or a threat?  And the green sneakers girl changed her shoes so she could get close enough to the ambassador to kill him without him thinking she was a danger?  Also, why is Burton's coworker both a customer and the bartender at Pub Dream?  ("I'm allergic to peanuts!"--that could be another drinking game.)

[possibilities]

Maybe I just wasn't in the mood this week, but I found this episode frustrating and dull. I was so distracted by Burton's sanpaku eyes (the most extreme I've ever seen on anyone) that I couldn't pay as much attention to the rest as I needed to.

Tess's sister is the same woman as Taka was saying had no idea what was going on with her patients, right? I also thought she looked like the woman Burton is seeing in dreamtime, but finally decided that woman is not the same. But the sister/shrink is the same person, right?

[walnutqueen]

Aaaaand - I'm out.
Just can't be bothered trying to pay attention to all this messiness.

[officetemp]

19 hours ago, possibilities said:

. . . Tess's sister is the same woman as Taka was saying had no idea what was going on with her patients, right? I also thought she looked like the woman Burton is seeing in dreamtime, but finally decided that woman is not the same. But the sister/shrink is the same person, right?

I wasn't paying enough attention to see if the sister was the same person or not.  But wasn't Tess's sister in the country with the rest of the family party when Taka visited the psychologist/psychiatrist at her apartment?  (I really disliked the shrink's demeanor toward Taka, by the way.  Hated her superior attitude toward him and the way she kept analyzing him as a means of trying to intimidate him.)

Edited October 31, 2016 by officetemp
Clarity; additional comment.

[possibilities]

I thought her attitude was similar to her attitude toward Tess (obnoxious), but I guess I wasn't sure if the timeline was simultaneous or sequential or shifty or what.

[officetemp]

I'm going to have to rewatch all three episodes to try to make some sense out of things.  I think the episodes are available on the Falling Water website (USA Network).

[kat165]

The commercials for this show never appealed to or intrigued me, but I watched the first 3 eps today out of boredom. I'm finding Tess and her lost boy story interesting. I like Burton but probablly because I'm imagining Idris Elba in his place (does Burton resemble Arsenio Hall a bit or is that just me?). It was confusing, but I like the slo-mo arty quality. I watched on a very old tv w/ a poor picture so much of it was dark and unseeable, which might have added to the dreaminess. Since I wasn't really invested to begin with I just watched without trying to figure anything out. It was interesting enough (or I was bored enough) to continue with eps 2 & 3. I'm looking forward to the 3 main characters meeting in real life.

I didn't catch on that the peanut allergy guy was the bartender until I watched the extras On Demand. I found the extras a bit more illumnating so if you have access to them I recommend checking them out. I probably won't watch this live, truthfully I don't even know when it's on, but will probably stay with it On Demand. So that makes 4 of us, at least for now. :)

[Aca24]

I really find this show to be intellectually stimulating. It's a bit over the top as far as all the loose ends occurring. I feel I take such a strong interest to it because I can lucid dream. When I have tried explaining it to people I get extremely strange and bizarre looks. It's fascinating that a show is being based off of that concept. 

[DrSpaceman73]

Finished episode three this morning.  Slowly coming together. 

I assume the cop is going to be the one that found Tess when she escaped from the mental hospital in 2009. 

I too was wondering if Tess' sister is one of them in the dreams, will have to go back and rewatch. 

The post its the counselor told him to leave alone appears to be a picture or reference to the circles used in the cult. 

The parachute thing they used to spread the ashes took me back to elementary school gym.   We'd play with those things all the time. 

What about the others that died in the house, why did they just have the ashes of the two people?  And which two were they.

Obviously the dreams are predicting the future, or things that are presently going on elsewhere. 

I wasn't clear on how Tess came up with the bottle design at the end based on what happened.  It looked to me a bit like a design you see with baby bottles though.

I am guessing Tess' mom has something to do with this, was studying both her daughters when younger and then at some point realized Tess was the one with the abilities and stopped studying her sister, just focused on Tess. 

[officetemp]

I think Bill was lying when he told Tess that the fellow dreamer she had been interacting with (during that session where she was given an assignment) was "fine,"  especially since there have been at least two deaths now connected with what happened during [all] the dreaming periods.

I'm having difficulty differentiating between Tess' dream experiences and waking experiences.  She does unusual things during her waking moments, so I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out that everything we've see with her so far turns out to have been dreams.  Burton and Taka's dream sequences seem to be more straightforward and more obviously dream experiences.

 

7 hours ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

. . . Obviously the dreams are predicting the future, or things that are presently going on elsewhere. . . .

Agreed.

 

I think "The Woman in Red"--as she's described in various places--is either some invention out of Burton's head or someone that he met while he was traveling and doesn't see from day to day in the waking world.  (From certain angles, her face kind of reminds me of Juliette Lewis, actually.)

Taka and the psychiatrist/psychologist?  Way to end a "get acquainted" day.  Though what does it have to do with his mother?  I really don't like the idea of them pairing up.

 

7 hours ago, Aca24 said:

I really find this show to be intellectually stimulating. It's a bit over the top as far as all the loose ends occurring. I feel I take such a strong interest to it because I can lucid dream. When I have tried explaining it to people I get extremely strange and bizarre looks. It's fascinating that a show is being based off of that concept. 

I've only had one lucid dream that I can recall and that was more than 20 years ago.  It's almost like watching a movie while being in the same movie simultaneously, for me anyway.

With this show, whenever I see more characters appearing, I'm always wondering whether we've seen them in previous episodes.  Hard to keep all the characters straight, especially since they may have spent only a few seconds on screen before.

[By the way, USA Network's Falling Water website:  www.usanetwork.com/falling water .  Contains show info, photos, recaps.  The recaps seem to be as much promotional as informative, however.  One of the recaps does confirm, however, that Tess' sister is the Green Sneakers girl's therapist.]

Edited November 4, 2016 by officetemp
added link

[kat165]

Aca, you're so fortunate to be able to lucid dream. I always remember my dreams and most of the time they are intriguing (at least to me. :) and more like stories or movies than disconnected images.

I find it interesting too.

About Tess's sister and the therapist Taka is involved with. Did the sister wear her hair parted in the middle and the therapist has bangs? Are they the same actress/character but looking slightly different?

Who was the blonde guy at the end or in next wk's previws? He jumped/fell off a roof. Tess got a glimpse of him in that club. Have we seen him before? Is he one of the dreamers?

I don't see what Bill Broad gets out of running these dream studies. He can't make the dreamers do stuff, he doesn't dream/connect himself. He's not giving them any drugs to facilitate their dreams. I'm really not seeing how this works, how these dreamers are different from other/regular dreamers. They (the dreamers) don't seem to be able to control their dreams or use them.

Dr. Space, good point about maybe Taka finding Tess and I too thought of gym parachutes when seeing that scene.

The dreamy quality of the scene where the ashes fall on Tess, if you think about it, it was actually kind of gross and not very dreamy/enjoyable (Tess seemed to enjoy it) as those pretty falling particles were actually the burnt remains of dead people. There might be teeth in there.

I too think Bill is lying about those 2 guys being safe. I think something about the dreams is causing some dreams to terminate, like those people in the circle that Taka found. Or those faceless men are killing them.

I'm not having any problems differentiating between reality and the dreams. I can't specify why, but there does seem to be a difference for the most part. But like you, officetemp, I wouldn't be surprised to see that all we've seen of Tess is one big dream. She's an odd character played by an odd looking actress. I'm into her story the most and I'm never fond of lost kid stories.

The woman in red actress sounds like Juliette Lewis. She also reminds me of this actress that was in that early 90's movie, singles. Sheila Kelley.

I'm also having a hard time keeping some of the characters straight. Like have we seen this person
before?

I'm liking this show more than I expected to. The promotional ads for this show are really doing the show an injustice. The show is much better than it seems from those ads which are almost kind of a turn-off.

Edited November 11, 2016 by kat165

[Lebanna]

Quote

Who was the blonde guy at the end or in next wk's previws? He jumped/fell off a roof. Tess got a glimpse of him in that club. Have we seen him before? Is he one of the dreamers?

Wasn't that the excessively beardy dreamer from Tess' first experiment at the dream monitoring place? The one who was digging a hole but said he was playing the piano? And then everybody said he'd had a stroke? His name was Scott or something. I think he just shaved off the hipster beard.

[DrSpaceman73]

I am assuming Bill Broad is doing all this to find the kid that seems to be Tess' son somehow.  She can find him.  I assume the cult is doing it for the same reason.  I think they are all after him.  Oh and he is totally lying to them about everyone being safe in the dreams, based on everything we have seen.  Multiple people it seems have died in real life that we saw die in the dreams. 

Its interesting there is so much old technology referenced in the dreams.  Like they are going back in time.  There is the old VCR in episode 4, old TVs, the typewriter, nothing modern.  Its like not just a dream but a time shift

Don't know what to make of the counselor and Taka scenes.  And how it relates to his mother. 

I thought the woman in red looked like Cobie Smulders when she was younger. 

I also thought they guy she got a glimpse of at the club and who saw her was the one who she killed later in the dream, they guy in the mask, that ended up in the trash heap.  But I could be wrong, I don't recall if that dream was before or after the club scene. 

Lucid dreaming is fascinating, both personally and from a scientific standpoint.  Many sleep disorders involve overlap of the sleep/wake cycles, an in between state where people are not fully awake and not full asleep.  There are rare cases, though debatable for obvious reasons, of people even committing real crimes in their sleep and claiming they weren't fully aware of it happening, that they aren't full conscious.  Still a poorly understood physiologic of it all. 

[kat165]

Thanks, Lebanna. I thought that guy was heavier, the one with the beard. I also thought he died, but you could be right. If he is the same person I wonder why he'd be shown without the beard, making it harder to recognize him.

Thanks, DrSpace. That makes sense. I wonder why this kid is so in demand. I agree, he is lying to them. So are those green sneaker people.

Interesting point about the old machinery, I only noticed the type writer. Maybe not only can they foresee into the future but maybe they can also get enlightment from the past. Maybe that's where the answers are.

I don't get how the therapist and Taka scenes relate to his mother either. Maybe further eps will give us some clues.

I can see Cobie in Lady in Red, too.

I don't recall Tess killing anyone. When did she do that? Do you remember more details of the scene?

I find dreams fascinating too. Right now my life is pretty dull and I'm amazed every night of the detail and variety of storylines in my dreams when in real life there seems to be very little interesting outside stimulation.

[possibilities]

On 11/4/2016 at 9:46 AM, officetemp said:

One of the recaps does confirm, however, that Tess' sister is the Green Sneakers girl's therapist.]

Thank you!!!!

[sjohnson]

They showed Andy shaving his beard. Later they showed Tess in a dream killing a faceless man with a pick to the chest. Then at the end we see Andy in the dumpster with an apparent wound in the same place. The math for me adds up to Bill Boerg (Icelandic name, presumably,) being wrong about it being a myth that if you die in your dreams, you die in real life. Not for "powerful" dreams at any rate. 

The corporate dreamers, the ones Jones worked for, which include the Belgian and Woody, have the nameless boy. They showed us that, when dream Woody threw Burton out of the pub (Marcello's I think it's called,) where they were playing with the ball with the kid. I think of them as "Topeka" after Jones final words. I think the backwards "Topeka" was on the wall of the cult massacre as a signature. Alice told us they weren't suicidal, so I think Topeka murdered them. And this was part of Topeka stealing the child from the cult. Alice by the way I think is in Sabine's group because Sabine is Tess' sister, the mother of the Special Child. Bill Boerg wants to be the King of Dreamspace but he's way behind and playing serious catch up. 

Taka's mom is in Dreamspace 24/7 I think. And she's freaked out over Taka/Sabine because Sabine is in a fishy relationship with the child. It was Sabine who put Tess into the hospital she worked at. 

The thing of course is not so much what these people are all running about doing, but why we should care? Burton wants love, and Taka wants justice. Personally, I can relate to that.

The thing is, I'm very ambiguous about Tess. There's no such thing as a three day pregnancy! If she was pregnant, her mother and her sister are indeed gaslighting her, huge, and she's not really reacting to that. And if she's not the biological mother, the problem with seeing her as the woman who becomes the Mother of (Dreamspace) God by virtue of her lovingness and self-sacrifice is that she's not a particularly loving person. She's not even very nice. It's not just that she's a corporate hack when everything is said and done. It's that she doesn't even do that. She won't work for Boerg because he's Icelandic? It's certainly not because she has principles about misusing her gifts for crass commerce, is it? Then the first thing she does is cheat her new employer and lie to him about Andy's dream escape from his employ (to work for Topeka I think,) for no visible reason at all. Then she gets Levon fired for having put a picture on his wall! I didn't much care for Levon's reaction, even if it is disgusting when the assholes only see a problem when they get called on their assholery. But Tess' callous indifference to someone she liked really makes it hard to see her as a suitable mother for the Dreamspace God, which is what the Special Child appears to be. That's why his name can't be spoken. Perhaps we should call him Tetragrammaton?

[DrSpaceman73]

Yes Tess stabbed the guy chasing her with the mask on in the chest during one of her dreams.  I assumed that is the one who we see in the dumpster that dies.  Though I did not make the connection of that being Andy from previously. 

[kat165]

Thanks, sjohnson. Good catch. Even if the tv I watched this on had a better picture I wouldn't have caught that the no-face guy was stabbed in the same place.

I don't really remember anyone names. Is Sabine Tess's sister and can she dream too? I don't recall seeing her with the boy.

I like your view of why Taka's mom screamed, interesting.

I wondered the same thing about Tess's pregnancy too. And no, she isn't particularly loving or even likeable. She just comes off as a confused user.

If the guy Tess stabbed is Andy why/how was he faceless in the dream? Is that another ability?

[possibilities]

Burton uses his dreams to solve problems in his job, and chase that woman he was attracted to.

Tess uses her dreams to make money in marketing, to do assignments for the dream "research," and chase the boy she thinks is her son.

Taka uses his dreams to "fight crime" and watch women masturbate. He's also curious about his mother but doesn't seem to really be seeking answers about her in his dreams all that much.

Everyone is creepy to some extent.

[sjohnson]

The dreams are possibly prophetic. But I tend to favor as of now the possibility the contact between the dreamers is effectively rehearsing their real life interactions. For example, Taka's contact with Sabine's dreaming mind gives him a foretaste of how Sabine will interact with him. I'm not sure that all figures in the special dreams are special dreamers. People like Tetragrammaton, Tess, Burton and Taka I think can invade the dreams of ordinary people possibly. Thus Woody may not be a special dreamer, despite being in Burton's dreams so much. His reaction to Burton's references to Dreamworld seemed to me to be a reaction to a perceived coincidence between a half remembered dream and real life Burton. But he didn't seem to me to be a special dreamer coyly discussing encounters in Dreamworld.

[bmacknz]

On 10/28/2016 at 3:33 PM, officetemp said:

Okay, so members of the green sneakers cult were both the people who were found dead and the people who blew up the house across the street. 

Wait... They were ?!?!?

I didn't even notice this.  The people clearing out the house before blowing it up were the same people found dead in the other house?  clones, maybe?

[kat165]

At the end of yesterday's ep (11/10) did anyone see who the woman was who was laying down? We saw her feet and maybe her legs. At least I think it was a she. I think perhaps it was Burton's dream? My tv screen was too dark to make out any more than that.

[officetemp]

2 hours ago, bmacknz said:

Wait... They were ?!?!?

I didn't even notice this.  The people clearing out the house before blowing it up were the same people found dead in the other house?  clones, maybe?

Sorry--I didn't word my original comment correctly.  What I should have said was that "the people found dead in the house and the people who blew up the house across the street all belonged to the Green Sneakers cult."

Who is that mysterious woman who keeps calling Taka?  (Sorry--can't remember the names of the characters.)  She seems to have some type of leadership role with the Green Sneakers; why did she think that it was Taka who made it possible for his mother to show up in the woods when they were scattering the ashes?

I thought that Tess was a little more sympathetic as a character in last night's episode, mostly because she seemed genuinely concerned about keeping Bill safe.  (However, maybe Bill's lack of ability to dream lucidly is some kind of protection against the faceless men?)  Seems strange that neither she nor Taka, when they first meet, would not say anything to each other about experiencing the same dream.

With Tess' mother being revealed as connected to Green Sneakers, it seems as if the whole Special Boy story is part of some huge, over-arching plan (almost like the Bene Gesserit and Paul Atreides in Dune).  (Tess and Sabine must have had really strange childhoods.)  Weird that Burton's company is the one auctioning The Boy off, almost as if he's a commodity.  They must have abducted him and the Greens are trying desperately to get him back, I guess.

Burton continues having to deal with all kinds of bizarre situations.  I kind of like that he quit; however, not sure that The Firm will allow him to leave.

I wish Taka would do more than wander around and/or stand around with a befuddled look on his face.  And I still don't like that he's trying to build some kind of "relationship" with Sabine.  The woman is twisted and proud of it.

Edited November 11, 2016 by officetemp

[sjohnson]

It is unimaginable by me how Sabine and Momster could have wiped Tess' memory of nine months of pregnancy. Or how they knew before the child's "birth" he was Special. 

The appearance and disappearance of people in seemingly waking moments seems to me to be violating the dream premise, turning it into straight up telepathy and prophetic visions. How very, very strange none of them are leaping to conclusions about God.

I think it was ambiguous enough that I could be misreading, but... I think Bill Boerg's encounter with the Faceless Men, where his own face was twitching, was how someone puts on the Faceless Man persona. That is, he's one of them, likely their leader. And that he was lying to Tess about the conclusion of his dream. 

[Lebanna]

Boerg's face was doing the same twitching thing that Taka's mother was doing in his dream in episode 1. Perhaps they have a similar ability? After all, Taka's mother and Boerg's sister both ended up catatonic. 

I loved that scene with the fireworks continually going off behind Burton and the other guy on the couch. In that scene you couldn't keep your eyes on the actors because the explosions were so distracting. That's so quirky and disconcerting - I've never see something like that on a TV series before. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I just binge watched all episodes to date.  I had seen a little here and there and found it confusing, but, at least now, I have a better understanding, though much of it is still a mystery.  In response to a question above by Kat165 about the lady laying down and showing her legs.  It seems that I recall the first time they showed that happening it was Taka's dream and in the dream the woman was Asian.  But, then it really happened when he went on a date with the therapist. Two different women apparently.  

I can buy into a lot of the dream stuff, because I have had dreams in which I honestly think the stuff on this show is actually possible.  Really, I'm not crazy, but anyway, my issue is how would the dreamers be able to connect with people who are not asleep? Like, some of these dream sessions happen in the daytime.  How many people would be sleeping at that time?  Are they interacting with subconscious of other people OR are the other people also asleep at the same time?

Also, if Taka' mom is dreaming, why wouldn't her brain signals show that?  

Even if you have a scar removed, there would still be an indication of a scar underneath the skin.  So, if Tess gave birth, there would be some physical evidence of it.

I can hardly wait for the next episode.  This has become one of my favorite shows!

After binge watching to catch up on this show, I went shopping yesterday. As I turned a corner in the store, I encountered a little boy who looked A LOT like THE BOY!  (Very similar hair and eyes.)  He smiled at me.  Freaked me out! lol  I almost had to pinch myself!

[kat165]

Thanks, Sunny.

I've been thinking that the dreamers have been connecting with people while they're
asleep. If the other person isn't asleep then I don't think the dreamers are connecting
with them.

Good point about Taka's mom's brain signals/waves.  Also about Tess's childbirth scars.
I vaguely recall in the first ep her going to a doctor and gettng examined to see if she
had a child but I don't recall the results. You would think that she'd persue this.

That is creepy about seeing a look a like boy. It would have freaked me out!

I'm enjoying this show. I like pacing and I like waiting to see what happens next, I like
the mystery of it and the feeling of exploration.

[SunnyBeBe]

From what I recall, Tess went to see a doctor (third one in the practice) to ask for examination to tell if she has delivered a baby.  The doctor gave her an explanation and the issue of C-section came up.  Tess said she didn't have a scar, but that it could have been removed. Yeah, but how would they have removed a C-section scar without her memory? Certainly, they would have to have waited months for the scar to heal before doing the revision procedure, yet she only has a short window of time that she has no memory. Plus, the uterus would have a scar.  I think that part of the storyline is weak, but, hey, maybe there is an answer in the end and maybe, I'm too analytical.  lol 

Does anyone know if subsequent seasons will have the same cast or will they start over with a new cast, storyline, etc.  I'm not sure I want the mystery about The Boy to be a continuing thing. ( I grew weary and annoyed with whether RED was Lizzie's father after one season and had to walk from that series.)  I'm not sure I could hang around too much longer to get answers about The Boy.  lol

[DrSpaceman73]

On ‎11‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 4:54 PM, sjohnson said:

It is unimaginable by me how Sabine and Momster could have wiped Tess' memory of nine months of pregnancy. Or how they knew before the child's "birth" he was Special. 

The appearance and disappearance of people in seemingly waking moments seems to me to be violating the dream premise, turning it into straight up telepathy and prophetic visions. How very, very strange none of them are leaping to conclusions about God.

I think it was ambiguous enough that I could be misreading, but... I think Bill Boerg's encounter with the Faceless Men, where his own face was twitching, was how someone puts on the Faceless Man persona. That is, he's one of them, likely their leader. And that he was lying to Tess about the conclusion of his dream. 

But why would he have them chasing Tess is her dreams? 

I am wondering if the woman Burton keeps seeing is Boerg's sister and if Boerg is looking for her.  Not sure why he would need Tess' help with that though if he could connect with her in dreams as a child. 

Tess (her son), Taka (his mom) and Burton (strange woman) are all seeking out someone or searching for clues about someone in their dreams. 

It seems the Momster, Sabine and the cult are all working together though.  And the boy was part of the plan, likely has special powers and was hidden from Tess, somehow, for that reason. 

The boy was younger I believe in the scene we saw with him and the Momster than how he has appeared in other scenes, so I question when that took place.  And also brings up the question if the dreams show future or prior time periods. 

Its all very confusing still

[kat165]

I wonder if there will even be a 2nd season. Any one know how it's doing in the ratings?

[sjohnson]

13 hours ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

But why would he have them chasing Tess is her dreams? 

Good question. One of the faceless men was Andy, who we know was in the cult, went to work for Boerg, then supposedly left Boerg. That presumably would have been to go to work for Topeka, the corporate types who're selling the boy. The thing about that is, why don't the faceless men kill Tess, instead of getting killed themselves? If they're just letting her go, they're letting her hunt for the boy. In which case, maybe they're using her as a kind of stalking horse. Topeka is to think it's just Tess looking for the boy, but the Boerg mean to step in and take him when she leads them to him?

Nor am I clear as to why Boerg was so deceptive to her about his confrontation with the faceless men. What happened to his head wasn't really something that could be described in effect, "And then I woke up..." I think. 

[SunnyBeBe]

Good points.  Also, when Taka showed up at the dumpster with Andy's dead body, did they say what the cause of death was? He appeared to have a fatal injury to his chest, right? And that is where Tess stabbed the masked man in her dream with that tool, right?  So,.......is it coincidental?  Did someone else actually kill Andy? The African American lady showed up at his door, but, I'm wondering if she isn't really bad, since they are leading up to believe that she is.  Why was she so nice to Taka telling him that he was a good son? 

 When Tess had that dream where she stabbed the masked man it was in the day time right?  Was Andy also dreaming in the daytime? So confusing.  

I had to pick holes, but, wouldn't it be smarter for Taka to have followed the green sneaker people when they left the ceremony rather than to have gotten caught up in it. That way, he'd know where they were hiding and could keep tabs on them.   And, why would the funeral home turn the ashes of the deceased people over to total strangers with no proof of kinship?  Just a lot of holes that annoy me a little. 

Edited November 15, 2016 by SunnyBeBe