Watch A Clip From Dr. Phil's Interview With Burke Ramsey

[TattleTeeny]

OK, maybe I am dumb but I just read the two links and found nothing particularly damning, nothing that says once and for all that this was not the underwear JonBenét started out wearing, and nothing that says the underwear was hidden somewhere that no one other than Patsy would know about. But even if Patsy was the only one who knew about the secret stash of underwear, I am unclear on what this is supposed to indicate as far as guilt on Patsy's part or that it was changed by the killer. Did I miss this? I suppose I could have; I've been proofreading all day at work (and that second link is to the ugliest and difficult to read website I may have ever seen).

[Joe Jitsu913]

2 hours ago, TattleTeeny said:

OK, maybe I am dumb but I just read the two links and found nothing particularly damning, nothing that says once and for all that this was not the underwear JonBenét started out wearing, and nothing that says the underwear was hidden somewhere that no one other than Patsy would know about. But even if Patsy was the only one who knew about the secret stash of underwear, I am unclear on what this is supposed to indicate as far as guilt on Patsy's part or that it was changed by the killer. Did I miss this? I suppose I could have; I've been proofreading all day at work (and that second link is to the ugliest and difficult to read website I may have ever seen).

 

It does call into question Patsy's credibility. She can't remember what JBR's normal routine is (how often she bathes and changes her clothes),  she says that a size 12 set of underwear can fit her 6 year old child who takes a size 4-6,  and that JBR was able to open the plastic packaging on her own.  JBR walked around with these huge panties all day at The White's party?  Patsy puts JBR to bed and doesn't notice these huge panties?  Wouldn't they be falling off her 45 lb child?  Patsy even insists that JBR wore a size 8-10 but only sizes 4-6 are found  in the Ramsey home.  

The link below outlines the oversized underwear issue along with a comparison of both sets of underwear. Either Patsy is blind or delusional .

 

http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/showthread.php?7107-The-Huge-(Girls-Size-12-14)-quot-Bloomies-quot-Underwear-on-JonBenet-Modeled-By-Six-Year-Old/page16

[TattleTeeny]

Quote

 

It does call into question Patsy's credibility. She can't remember what JBR's normal routine is (how often she bathes and changes her clothes),  she says that a size 12 set of underwear can fit her 6 year old child who takes a size 4-6,  and that JBR was able to open the plastic packaging on her own.  JBR walked around with these huge panties all day at The White's party?  Patsy puts JBR to bed and doesn't notice these huge panties?  Wouldn't they be falling off her 45 lb child?  Patsy even insists that JBR wore a size 8-10 but only sizes 4-6 are found  in the Ramsey home.  

The link below outlines the oversized underwear issue along with a comparison of both sets of underwear. Either Patsy is blind or delusional .

 

But lots of things strain Patsy's credibility, and she could very well be delusional (that décor for one thing, and the holiday sweaters for another), and she didn't say they fit her. And of course a 6-year-old could open a package of underwear (and I refuse to type the "p" word, and I hated reading it 6,000 times on that website!) All it says to me is that she stuck some too-big underwear in a drawer once upon a time and maybe JonBenét or someone else opened the package. It's weird, OK, but many things are weird about the family, IMO. My family's weird as hell but no one's murdered anyone (yet). None of the above says "killer." 

[Maharincess]

@TattleTeeny, I've read in more than one place about the underwear. I remember it because it was said that Patsy bought them as a gift and I thought underwear is a strange gift to give someone.  I think one of the places I read it was in Steve Thomas's book and I know I've seen multiple links on Websleuths. That place has picked apart every speck of evidence.  I spend a lot of time at that site. 

[TattleTeeny]

Oh, I read Steve Thomas's book too--it feels like forever ago (why am I so old now?!). I guess I just think of the underwear as one more thing for my mental, ever-increasing "weird yet inconclusive" list about this case.

Haha, just now I was flipping channels and one of the Ramsey shows was on and I heard the BF whisper, "no"! 

[MsJamieDornan]

On 9/15/2016 at 8:26 PM, jumper sage said:

I wish someone knew how long it took the police to respond, why can't I find the info?

4 minutes and the first officer arrived.

[Guest]

On September 14, 2016 at 9:18 AM, Lamima said:

2 things that are new to the story: that Burke snuck down to play with toys when everyone was asleep...and...that he and his dad used the flashlight that night.

Has anyone bothered to ask Burke at what time of the night does he think he went downstairs to play with his toys? And for how long? (God knows Phil couldn't be bothered to ask a follow up question.) Surely knowing the timing would help to at least pinpoint the time of death because I would assume he would have heard something going on in the house if there were an intruder present at the time he was up playing? Even if he heard nothing, maybe that means the murder happened after he went back to bed? How long had be been playing for, I wonder? Is this story even true? 

Guilty of anything or not, the guy was straight up weird with the smiling and the darting eyes and the random hand gestures. 

[absolutelyido]

On 9/14/2016 at 8:49 AM, TattleTeeny said:

Again, what's the coincidence? And who is the "they"--police or other investigators (I thought it was Lou Smit who suggested it)? I believe that it was the police who suggested the marks were from a toy (right?), and the police were dead set on it being someone in the family. Those marks also look like stun-gun contact points, complete with one dot larger due to inconsistent contact with the skin (and wasn't it the police who pooh-poohed that theory?). And I am having a tough time putting together how the train track would be used in this injury (granted, I have not gotten a good look at the train track)--was this thing some kind of super-substantial heavy-duty metal? Was Burke, like, holding it like a sword and doing an "engarde!" kind of thing? And if he's bent on conking her with something really damaging, why bother with a train track piece--and twice? 

The A&E JonBenet program debunked the idea that the train tracks would create the marks on JonBenet in a way that was convincing to me. They concluded that the marks were identical to what a stun gun would make, as Tattleteeny noted, down to one dot larger due to incomplete contact with the skin.

[EVS]

I wish Dr. Phil had asked Burke about the feces on Jonbenet's chocolates. I knew he wouldn't, but I'm curious how Burke would have responded. 

[Guest]

Quote

 

I wish Dr. Phil had asked Burke about the feces on Jonbenet's chocolates. I knew he wouldn't, but I'm curious how Burke would have responded.

?!?! I never heard anything about that. Can you elaborate?

ETA:

John Ramsey on today's show:

"You know, the real story here is not that a child was murdered, the real story here is what was done to us by the unjust system." 

Yes, pay no attention to my brutally murdered child - please only pay attention to how I've been inconvenienced. Guilty or not, the man has some fucked up priorities.  

Edited September 19, 2016 by Guest

[EVS]

I read somewhere that there were feces found on a pair of pajama bottoms in JB's room. The bottoms were too big to have been hers. There were also feces in a box of Christmas chocolates that JB had received.

Like a lot of info out there, I don't know how true this is, but I will try to find a link. I'm in the middle of something so it might take a little while.

Eta: apparently it was in Kolar's book, if that helps. 

Edited September 19, 2016 by EVS

[Guest]

Thanks, EVS! I never heard about the poop chocolates before. Bizarre!

[Fable]

1 hour ago, EVS said:

 

I read somewhere that there were feces found on a pair of pajama bottoms in JB's room. The bottoms were too big to have been hers. There were also feces in a box of Christmas chocolates that JB had received.

Like a lot of info out there, I don't know how true this is, but I will try to find a link. I'm in the middle of something so it might take a little while.

Eta: apparently it was in Kolar's book, if that helps. 

 

I had heard this before as well, but what makes me curious is how this became public knowledge.  Surely the parents wouldn't gone around sharing this with other people.  

[EVS]

I found a lot of discussions on the subject but I don't know where to go online to review any official documents.  This excerpt from Kolar's book was in a topix discussion:

From Foreign Faction: Who Really Kidnapped JonBenet? by A. James Kolar; pages 367-70:

"I had reviewed an investigator’s report that documented a 1997 interview with former Ramsey nanny – housekeeper Geraldine Vodicka, who stated that Burke had smeared feces on the walls of a bathroom during his mother’s first bout with cancer. She told investigators that Nedra Paugh, who was visiting the Ramsey home at the time, had directed her to clean up the mess.

There were other police reports in the files that documented what I thought could be viewed as related behavior. CSIs had written about finding a pair of pajama bottoms in JonBenét’s bedroom that contained fecal material. They were too big for her and were thought to belong to Burke.

Additionally, a box of candy located in her bedroom had also been observed to be smeared with feces. Both of these discoveries had been made during the processing of the crime scene during the execution of search warrants following the discovery of JonBenét’s body. "
 

[kat165]

It was completely unneccessary for this interview to be 3 shows long. The info gotten from the interview could have been distilled into 20 minutes tops and that's being generous.

Edited September 20, 2016 by kat165

[WicketyWack]

On 9/16/2016 at 8:51 AM, Christi said:

There is not 1 piece of evidence that 1 thing used had come from outside the house.  Even the garrot was made with Patsys paintbrush.

According to the most recent round of shows, the duct tape put over her mouth and the cord used to bind and choke her were not found anywhere in the house.

[Arynm]

On 9/19/2016 at 6:37 PM, Giant Misfit said:

John Ramsey on today's show:

"You know, the real story here is not that a child was murdered, the real story here is what was done to us by the unjust system." 

Yes, pay no attention to my brutally murdered child - please only pay attention to how I've been inconvenienced. Guilty or not, the man has some fucked up priorities.  

Yes!!! That was jarring. I couldn't believe he said that out loud and meant it!

"My daughter was brutally murdered and sexually assaulted, but what about how that makes ME feel."

Fucked up priorities to say the least!

Edited September 21, 2016 by Arynm
spelling

[AZChristian]

I can just hear Dr. Phil making statements to anyone else who's ever been on his show about their inappropriate smiling, body language and affect.  But not Burke.  And I find it telling that he didn't show the "pineapple" interview.  NO ONE could gloss over that.

[Darknight]

The family is rich. They probably knew who did it or they did it and coveredit up. 

[jameson245]

This show is an ENTERTAINMENT program and was edited to be just that.  I think Phil and his producers and editors should be ashamed of themselves, cutting and pasting things to make the show more "entertaining" for higher ratings.  They should have told the story of what happened, asked Burke the questions more Ramsey-educated people would have asked.  Not left those subjects or dropped the answers because there wasn't any "wow" factor in what he said.

I want to address the "feces" issue.  Kolar put that chit in his book and that is the basis for the CBS show - - and THAT is the subject of a huge lawsuit (which I bet will be settled out of court - a shame.)  But if you go back to the search warrants and returns, the depositions and interviews with all KINDS of witnesses...  there was an unflushed toilet in the basement of the Ramsey house and it would seem there was some feces there.  And the only other mention of feces is  - -  there was a pair of panties in JOnBenet's bathroom that had some "skid marks" (my quote) on them.  Those panties were found still inside the play pants she had taken off to get ready for the Christmas dinner at the Whites'.   My guess is that she was pretty proud of herself when she got dressed for that party and opened the new package of panties and could tell for herself which panties were the right ones, said WEDNESDAY on the waistband.

But that isn't the point.  The point I want to make is that there was no feces found on the walls or on candy or - - - just not there.

I asked about feces on the wall and no one was too sure, no great memories of that.  Certainly no memories of telling the housekeeper to clean it.  But let me suggest that a child with a real mess may get some on their fingers/hand - and that may end up being carried to the toilet roll, the holder or the wall very close to it.  I know I have had to clean such messes before (foster to dozens of kids, parent to three).  Not anything I considered a problem or indication of psychiatric issues.  Chit happens.