S04.E07: The Profit And The Loss

[Shermie]

To say the Vikings didn't produce anything is ludicrous. What about ship-building? Their design was revolutionary.

Also, someone mentioned that Vikings were in Newfoundland, known because of a recent satellite imagery discovery. However, it has been known for many years that they were in Newfoundland, just visit L'Anse aux Meadows.

[formerlyfreedom]

Let's take discussion about the historical significance and accuracy/inaccuracy of the show to the appropriate topic and stick to episode discussion in here, please. Thanks!

 

 

[mirrorrim]

It is not your imagination.  I heard the slipped accent in that line of dialog.  Yes, Fimmel went Australian there for a moment when he was yelling.  I assume it may be difficult to maintain the Swedish accent when you are emoting at that decibel level.

 

I have respect for how well these actors are coached in unfamiliar accents.  It is one thing to sing in a different accent, with different, more pure vowels; in fact, it is EASY compared to what these actors have to do.  Perhaps the director didn't want to re-do this part of the scene on the boat because it was just too much trouble?

 

Yeah, I'm not upset or anything that they aren't fixing this and I understand it's hard. Just surprised and curious about the circumstances because Travis has been so GOOD at maintaining the Viking accent all series, until lately--and he has way less lines nowadays. I hope he's just having an off month and this isn't a sign of something else going on behind the scenes.

[green]

I have no problems with the spin of the drug addiction plot because it's interesting and it has already been established that the Vikings are no strangers to hallucinogenics nor do they think they are taboo.  (Except, the difference is at Uppsala, the drugs were used in accord with religious experiences.  Ragnar's addiction to Yidu's leaves appears, at first, to be recreational and now damn dangerous to everyone around him.)

 

I thought his addiction has grown out of his need for "pain pills" on the day.  That's how/why he started taking the betel nuts; his war wounds from Paris that have continued to plague him with intense chronic pain.  The "fun" part of the the betel nuts is icing on the cake of the primary pain killing need. 

 

Also, what happened to the huge wall surrounding Paris? Did I miss something there?

 

 

They weren't anywhere near Paris in this episode.  The battle took place miles and miles down river from Paris by the two defensive towers that were built per Rollo's recommendations at a strategic point in the Seine to prevent the Viking ships from getting anywhere close to Paris.

Edited April 4, 2016 by green

[Captanne]

I missed the pain connection for the drugs.  I thought it was recreational.  Anyone else remember?  Is Ragnar really just a metaphor for America's problem with opioids?  Is that what we're being shown?  That unintentional (on Ragnar's part; I'm not sure about Yidu's) addiction to pain medication has been a problem for hundreds of years and detrimental to society?

 

That's sort of -- clumsy -- even for this show.

[SingleMaltBlonde]

I'm only noticing it because it's SO different from how they normally speak "Viking." I have no idea if their Viking-speak is accurate, 

I imagine the difference could have been because he was so upset....I thought him talking about "love" was odder.  Loyalty sure...but love?  I now kinda want to see Travis as Stanley in Streetcar....but that might be way off topic.

 

I tend to agree with you there, to the extent that the number of shield maidens in the last battle seemed inordinately large to me.  

After Ragnar going back on his word (about defending her Earldom) and the whole Kalf thing Lagertha might be over trusting men and has built up an all shieldmaiden army....chicks before dicks?

 

I am interested to hear about actual shield maidens...it seems like they and the Berserkers are almost like a religious order...they don't seem to have families in the traditional sense and are dedicated to thier jobs.

[Nukester]

Upon further evaluation of the script, wonder if the Romans will eventually be engaged by the Northmen. Boy would that be a mistake! Would make for a great series finale.

[green]

I missed the pain connection for the drugs.  I thought it was recreational.  Anyone else remember?  Is Ragnar really just a metaphor for America's problem with opioids?  Is that what we're being shown?  That unintentional (on Ragnar's part; I'm not sure about Yidu's) addiction to pain medication has been a problem for hundreds of years and detrimental to society?

 

That's sort of -- clumsy -- even for this show.

 

No, Ragnar was in big time pain and Yidu offered up her herbs to him.  They work but they are addictive.  If that matches modern day America, so what.  America's latest drug problem isn't some new thing that came out of nowhere.  Narcotics have always been with us.  This current wave is only new to TV reporters looking for something to report on I guess.

 

Now if you think the premise is being handled clumsily in it's execution that is another story of course.  I think there have been a few clumsy missteps in this story line myself.  But I think it is good the show didn't have Ragnar healed the very next episode like a lot of TV series would do too.  Remember Thorsten?   His wound caused him to have to have his arm amputated.  There wasn't many choices if you were a wounded warrior back in the day and I'm glad this series is showing that.

 

Upon further evaluation of the script, wonder if the Romans will eventually be engaged by the Northmen. Boy would that be a mistake! Would make for a great series finale.

 

The Roman Empire fell about 400 years before where we are in history's timeline.  Aka mid 400's and we are now in the mid 800's.  And Ecbert pointed out in Season 2 that the people in England had basically lost all memory of the Romans ascribing the ancient ruins even then (and his still amazingly functioning bath house) to mythic giants instead.  One of the reasons the Vikings were so successful was that in the Dark Ages there was no great power in western Europe to unite their various peoples against raiders and invaders of all kinds including our intrepid Vikings.

Edited April 6, 2016 by green

[nowornever]

I was a little surprised that our brave Earl Ingstad left home to go raiding so soon.  In light of Kalf's death, it's unlikely that someone else will usurp her earldom right away, but who did she leave in charge? It looks like most of her shield maidens were with her.  

 

Aslaug and the Pied Piper of Kattegat are going to bring ruin upon themselves when the raiding party comes home to find everyone pregnant.  

[tkmkeely]

Was Habbard one of the human names Odin used when he traveled as a human?????

[FineWashables]

I seem to be alone on this, but I was really impressed -- maybe even for the first time -- by Travis Fimmel's acting skills at the end of the episode when he was speaking with Floki's voice.  Gave me chills.

 

I hope this isn't considered OT.  I found this interesting: There is, in fact, a mausoleum for the Mercian kings, in Repton Abbey, in Derbyshire:  

 

"The abbey's crypt was constructed over a spring in the early 8th century, and is thought to have originally been a baptistery.[5] Later in the 8th century it was converted into a mausoleum for King Æthelbald of Mercia (reign: 716–757). King Wiglaf (died c. 840) and his grandson Saint Wigstan (killed 840) were later also buried in the crypt.[5] It is thought that these royal bodies were first buried in the ground to decompose, before their bones were interred within the crypt.[5]

Following reports of miracles associated with Saint Wigstan, the crypt became a place of pilgrimage.[5] However, following the Viking invasion, Wigstan's bones were removed and taken with the fleeing monks and nuns."

[Lugal]

 

Also, someone mentioned that Vikings were in Newfoundland, known because of a recent satellite imagery discovery. However, it has been known for many years that they were in Newfoundland, just visit L'Anse aux Meadows.

I think they meant the newly discovered site at Point Rosee.

[green]

I seem to be alone on this, but I was really impressed -- maybe even for the first time -- by Travis Fimmel's acting skills at the end of the episode when he was speaking with Floki's voice.  Gave me chills.

 

I hope this isn't considered OT.  I found this interesting: There is, in fact, a mausoleum for the Mercian kings, in Repton Abbey, in Derbyshire:  

 

"The abbey's crypt was constructed over a spring in the early 8th century, and is thought to have originally been a baptistery.[5] Later in the 8th century it was converted into a mausoleum for King Æthelbald of Mercia (reign: 716–757). King Wiglaf (died c. 840) and his grandson Saint Wigstan (killed 840) were later also buried in the crypt.[5] It is thought that these royal bodies were first buried in the ground to decompose, before their bones were interred within the crypt.[5]

Following reports of miracles associated with Saint Wigstan, the crypt became a place of pilgrimage.[5] However, following the Viking invasion, Wigstan's bones were removed and taken with the fleeing monks and nuns."

 

Whoa is that this show's Wigstan since he is going off on pilgrimage to try and save his soul?  Maybe Wigstan will return to the show at a later date.  That would be so cool.

[FineWashables]

Right?? It does seem to be our Wigstan.

[green]

Right?? It does seem to be our Wigstan.

 

Yeah I guess it would make sense.  Why create this whole rather mysterious and intriguing character and give him a big long dramatic speech with Ecbert about the evils of power when you could have Ecbert simply conquering Mercia with his army offscreen in two seconds without help from anyone.

 

Thanks, FineWashables, for finding all this out.  Awesome research.

Edited April 8, 2016 by green

[gwhh]

Actually, because of there diet and lifestyles. Viking woman would have been around the same physical size ( and strength level) of the men of Europe and England during this time period.

 

Plus the woman were taught to use there strengths as woman in battle.  Faster reflexes, more flexible, etc! 

Just like the American Indian during the time of Columbus was much taller and fitter than the average European male.

According to what I have read. It was common to go along on long raiding raids. And to go into combat along side there men.

 

Than again the Viking men may have just done that to get rid of the annoying woman in there life; LOL!!!

 

Regarding the Shieldmaidens, did they really engage in hand to hand combat or was that creative liberty on behalf of Hirst? I'm an average-sized woman and the thought of me trying to fight Rollo or Bjorn is kind of ludicrous.

Edited April 18, 2016 by gwhh

[gwhh]

Love the go complain to your God comment.

So inaccurate. 

 

You putting modern beliefs and modes of behavior on the people that would have had no idea what youre talking about.

Welfare ?  They fought and killed and stole that gold fair and square.   Nobody gave that gold to them. they earned it with thier blood and sweat. If you are too weak to keep it, go complain to your God.

 

 

The Vikings were first and formost farmers. However a change in climate meant that farmland in Scandinavia (always poor) was now unable to sustain the population that had expanded in the warm period.  The excess population had no land to farm and so resorted to piracy and raiding ie  going  viking.

 

 ???

Dude Vikings has better hygiene that your average Saxon or Frank.  The Franks and Saxons used to call the Vikings girly men becuase they combed thier hair regularly. They also bathed more often than other Europeans.  Rollo should have had better hair then any of the Franks from the beginning.  

Minifact. A lot of the Vikings had blonder hair than natural becuase they used soap with lye to kill lice. This had the side effect of bleaching thier hair.

[Kalliste]

On 4/1/2016 at 2:40 PM, magdalene said:

Yes, who was that? Well, Ragnar is no Al Swearengen...

I also thought of Al and his Indian head in a box! I guess sometimes the only one you can trust is a dead guys head.

On 4/1/2016 at 3:30 PM, Knuckles said:

And count me as a confused viewer...Floki and Aslaug and Habard?? That was Floki's imagination, or his vision of goings on back in Kattegut?

And the Chinese drug dealer continues to annoy...so now she is concerned that his habit may be affecting his judgement? A little late for that. On a trivial note, did her hair cut ever get explained...why does she look like a 1920s film star.

Initially I was quite confused with this scene but I believe it's a vision of Floki's about what is going on back home. So that'll be interesting to see if he says anything.

Also, Ragnar cut of Yidu's hair in the bath scene because she commented how her hair was much shorter prior to being a slave.

On 4/2/2016 at 10:44 AM, BitterApple said:

I think people back then were so used to walking ankle deep in filth, a little horse shit coating their hems probably didn't phase them.

Speaking of which, I miss Ecbert holding court in his hot tub. I feel like his bath house is a character in and of itself.

Yes! Why isn't he using the hot tub. It's now quite the same when it's just Judith and Kwenthrith having a gossip about paternity.

On 4/3/2016 at 2:32 PM, Knuckles said:

I  was rewatching the battle scene, and I wondered...what did they catapult onto the Viking ships...clearly it was something highly combustible, but I can't figure out what it was...looked like deflated pumpkins. Anybody know?

They looked to be filled with oil/fat so that the ships became flammable.

I was just looking up imdb because I can never remember how to spell Kwenthrith's name and only just realised that our new King Harald's name is Harald Finehair.. I just thought that was a joke because you all liked his pretty hair :D

[Silly Angel]

Bingeing on the show and just catching up, so I'm sure no one will have interest in comments in an old episode, but I had to pop by to say that Finehair and his brother remind me so much of Liam and Ryan McPoyle I can't watch them without giggling.

Edited February 3, 2017 by Silly Angel