S05.E10: Map of the Seven Knights

[OtterMommy]

The scene where Trubel talks to Eve was one of my favorites, because it reminded me of the really nice interactions that used to take place between Juliette and Trubel. Everybody else's reactions to Even seem somehow forced -- just incredulously repeating that she's dead, or not dead, or a different person, or whatever. But Trubel reached out to see if there was anything left of the woman who had been kind to her. That struck me as sweet.

 

I liked that scene as well...and the way Trubel handled Juliette vs. Eve was interesting.  It was like she still considers Juliette to be Juliette and she only refers to her as Eve to humor her and/or "in public" (i.e. in front of Meisner).

[TVSpectator]

That translation is not even close. It would be understood to mean something like "always screws up". "Scheiße machen" (or bauen) means colloquially to make a mess of things or screw up, etc.

 

Well, Scheiße is shit, and Dinge erledigen means getting things done

[tpel]

Yea, literal translations often don't work so well for idioms. Of course, there is no reason why the thread title would have to be in German, I was just amused by the idea. And saoirse has helpfully started a thread which references another of Meisner's important qualities ;-)

 

I also agree about the money and Uncle Felix.  In the world of rare books, $100K is a steal for 20 rare books.  Plus, I don't think Felix wanted the money to make a profit--I think that was money he wanted so he could escape whoever was after him.  I really kind of feel that this show has never really painted Nick in a good light.  I mean, the bumbling newbie was fine in season 1, but then he just sort of became a dick.  Well, maybe not a dick--but he definitely has his dickish moments.

 

 

It's not clear that the books were really Felix's to sell, but that didn't seem to be Nick's objection. I wish I liked Nick better than I do.

Edited February 23, 2016 by tpel

[OtterMommy]

It's not clear that the books were really Felix's to sell, but that didn't seem to be Nick's objection. I wish I liked Nick better than I do.

 

Oh, I think the books were Felix's to sell. The proceeds of the sale, however, were not due to Felix, but to the estate of the deceased (less Felix's cut, of course).  Still, I think Felix knew the situation and wanted to be rid of the books.  The $100K was not an attempt to squeeze money out of Nick, but to provide Felix with funds to get to safety.

 

Yeah, Nick is not very likable at the moment.  He's always, how should I put this?, lacked certain social graces.  Now, however, those gaffes are amplified by the fact that Nick is making incredibly bad choices at every turn.

Edited February 23, 2016 by OtterMommy

[iMonrey]

I've lost count of how many keys there are supposed to be and who was supposed to have them. I don't recall any mention of the Royals having any of them but it's possible I've forgotten. However, they did not identify the Grimm - or Grimm descendant - who owned that trunk of books Felix got his hands on. Whoever it was may have stolen the keys from the Royals for all we know.

 

At this point, I think it's probably for the best if the show steers clear of mentioning any Royals beyond Renard and his immediate family. The whole Royals thing never really got fleshed out anyway, in regards to how many there were, where they were, who they were, what they wanted, etc. etc. One good thing about this Black Claw story is that it streamlines the narrative into one group of Wesen terrorists/freedom fighters vs. the "good guys" working with Nick.

[OtterMommy]

However, they did not identify the Grimm - or Grimm descendant - who owned that trunk of books Felix got his hands on. Whoever it was may have stolen the keys from the Royals for all we know.

 

Actually, they did identify him--I mean, they gave him a name (which I can't remember...it was very Eastern European....)  Hadrian's Wall knew that he was Grimm.  But, yeah, we don't know how that person came to have possession of the keys.

[jhlipton]

The only way I can deal withg Adalind is to pretend that nothing happened the way we saw -- i was all just a goofy mix-up.
 

Nick should not be in charge of hiding anything...ever.  The only time he successfully hid anything was when he gave Rosalee the keys to hide and HE didn't know exactly where they were.  Think about it:
The engagement ring...in his sock drawer.  Oh, and his intended is the one who puts the laundry away.

 
Apparently, this is a thing now: if yoiu have a girlfriend, put a engagement ring (intended for her or a previous girlfriend) in a sock drawer.  It worked so well for McGarrett on Hawaii 50!

[tpel]

At this point, I think it's probably for the best if the show steers clear of mentioning any Royals beyond Renard and his immediate family. The whole Royals thing never really got fleshed out anyway, in regards to how many there were, where they were, who they were, what they wanted, etc. etc. One good thing about this Black Claw story is that it streamlines the narrative into one group of Wesen terrorists/freedom fighters vs. the "good guys" working with Nick.

 

 

Those "good guys" in Hadrian's Wall sure do engage in a lot of torture to achieve their ends . . .  But I see your point about the Royals. I'm not sure if we even know for sure whether the Royals are anything different from regular humans. I mean, I don't think they woge, but I vaguely remember Kenneth being kind of super strong. I'm afraid, however, that the gang's heading off to Germany might put them in the range of the Royals once more. 

 

In a way, I wish the Black Claw folks were more nuanced. I mean, the basic idea that Wesen shouldn't have to hide their true nature from humans sounds kind of like a civil rights movement. Not necessarily a bad thing! Some of the Wesen could adopt a non-violent approach to this goal, while others act more like terrorists, and some walk in a gray area in between. Instead, they all seem to go for violent methods that cast them clearly as the "bad guys".

[Prevailing Wind]

 

I hope the continuity person on the writers staff...

Bwaaahahahahahahaha...like they HAVE a continuity person!  If they do, s/he's got to be the most incompetent bumbler since...oh, ever.

 

The Grimm family tree book had the dead guy/owner of the books' name in it, as well as Nick's.  Josef something that began with an N. How might he have acquired only half of the Royals' keys? Perhaps ALL the keys the Royals think they have are, indeed, fakes and there are really two more real keys floating around somewhere.

[tpel]

I want to know why Monroe's mom doesn't have an accent but Uncle Felix does. If they aren't blood-family, who is he to Monroe's mom?

 

 

There might not be much of a mystery here. Perhaps Monroe's mom moved to the USA when she was young, while her brother remained in Germany or returned there as a young adult. If each has spent the last 40 years in a different country, their accents would differ, regardless of blood relations.

 

I kind of hope we don't get bogged down with fake keys, copies of keys, etc. 

[OtterMommy]

There might not be much of a mystery here. Perhaps Monroe's mom moved to the USA when she was young, while her brother remained in Germany or returned there as a young adult. If each has spent the last 40 years in a different country, their accents would differ, regardless of blood relations.

 

I kind of hope we don't get bogged down with fake keys, copies of keys, etc. 

 

Didn't Monroe say Felix was his Great uncle? If that was the case, it would be easy to buy that Monroe's grandparents immigrated to the US while a brother stayed behind.

 

I don't think we'll get too bogged down with extraneous keys.  I have a feeling that the creators want to cross "keys" off their list as quickly as possible and move onto whatever they think we should think is wonderful.

[Prevailing Wind]

If Felix was Monroe's great uncle, he was probably born after his siblings emigrated to America. He's way too young to have a generation in between Monroe and himself. Didn't I hear 1949 for a birth year?  67 vs ±47 is only a one-generation gap.  Felix is either an uncle, or a great uncle with very much older siblings. 

 

I had that in my own family - I had first cousins old enough to be my parents.

[TVSpectator]

If Felix was Monroe's great uncle, he was probably born after his siblings emigrated to America. He's way too young to have a generation in between Monroe and himself. Didn't I hear 1949 for a birth year? 67 vs ±47 is only a one-generation gap. Felix is either an uncle, or a great uncle with very much older siblings.

I had that in my own family - I had first cousins old enough to be my parents.

I also have first cousins whose kids are about 10-15 years younger than me.

[ShadowFacts]

 

The  grand opening of the Fortress of Dull: I may have missed them, but did either Hank or Wu do a double take at Adalind making effing cookies?! I can see Adalind doing so, but seriously intending for either of those men to eat one is a bit rich. As others have stated, if there was any ground-laying that Adalind is back to her hex-y ways, I could even giggle a bit over that as a sly character thing. But, to borrow from Once Upon a Time, this is being played as the scary lasagna bit ( The Evil Queen had made lasagna for a town party, folks didn't trust it, she got sniffly and put out)-- Adalind is playing like Suzy Homemaker and being serious about her food. *sighs*

 

You know, I'm thinking more and more that Adalind is pulling a long con on everybody.  She's got the cover of the postpartum hormones, being a new mom, needing to keep the baby safe.  She acts like she needs protection from Nick from the scary world, he has to sleep in her bed so the baddies can't get her, yadda yadda.  She has got to be bored to pieces (not that I'm denigrating stay at home motherhood--she just has no one or nothing else and Nick must be gone long hours).   I'm beginning to think it's all been an act, she is getting her power back and hiding it, or is working some other angle.  No way is she happy as Suzy Homemaker, and just maybe those cookies we saw her taking out of the oven were anvilicious.  Because there has got to be an explanation for the huge yawn she has become, and the corner they have painted her into.

[OtterMommy]

You know, I'm thinking more and more that Adalind is pulling a long con on everybody.  She's got the cover of the postpartum hormones, being a new mom, needing to keep the baby safe.  She acts like she needs protection from Nick from the scary world, he has to sleep in her bed so the baddies can't get her, yadda yadda.  She has got to be bored to pieces (not that I'm denigrating stay at home motherhood--she just has no one or nothing else and Nick must be gone long hours).   I'm beginning to think it's all been an act, she is getting her power back and hiding it, or is working some other angle.  No way is she happy as Suzy Homemaker, and just maybe those cookies we saw her taking out of the oven were anvilicious.  Because there has got to be an explanation for the huge yawn she has become, and the corner they have painted her into.

 

 

THIS!

 

I've actually thought this from, well, from when she told Nick she was pregnant.  If you watch that scene, the camera pans in on her grabbing Nick's hand--and it was established several times that hexenbiests use mind control through touch (Henriette touched Nick when he went to see her, Adalind touched Renard when she jumped in his car, Juliette touched Nick when she was in the jail cell, Adalind touched Nick's hand when she put it on her baby bump).  Now, I have seen very few of the Nick/Adalind scenes this season because, eeeuuww, but there has been some touching.  And, really, Adalind has cooked herself quite a nice deal.  She has a place to live (it's not the Ritz, but the tech is all tricked out), someone who protects her from the hordes of people who have not come to hurt her, who has given her a car, given her a credit card and now might even be in a position to inflict revenge on Juliette for her.

 

Now, if the show actually does this, I will be mightily impressed.  Heck I may even go back and watch the 4 or so episodes that I deleted!  But, I guess we'll have to wait and see....

[Lii]

If anyone was going to ever comment in-show about Nadalind being gross, let's be real, it was going to be Wu. Now that that chance has come and gone, well, abandon all hope, ye who watch this show...

Edited February 27, 2016 by Lii

[mythoughtis]

Did I incorrectly remember in S1 that Monroe talked about how old he was.... and it was like 150?   I seem to remember him talking about all the changes he had seen over the years, and that he used to be 'rough' in the beginning, but had been mellow for decades?  I must be incorrectly remembering it, because otherwise, why would his uncle have been born in 1949.

[Darklazr]

In episode 1, Nick made the comment about Monroe being in his 40's, single and never been married.

[mythoughtis]

Thank you Darklazr.  I tried to use google to find out Monroe's age, but didn't find it.  Of course, Nick was getting that from his driver's license, which could be faked, I suppose.  Somehow, I got the impression that Monroe himself had lived in the 'old country', and that was where he terrorized the villages in his youth.   I don't know why I extrapolated that to he lived in the 1800s.   

Edited February 29, 2016 by mythoughtis

[Clanstarling]

I agree completely with this--it's like that old kids' book, "Half Magic" or something like that where the magic spells only half work.  It's like the creators only hear the first half of any criticism and act on it.

Half-Magic! Yes, that's the book. I loved that book.

 

Did the lady who was killed say that the dead guy's family wanted everything sold quickly? So does that mean he wasn't a grimm? Or he didn't have any family members who were grimms? Or he was a grimm but no one in his family knew?

I'd forgotten she mentioned a family. I wonder if they'll come into play soon.

Even though I don't get hugely upset about the Nadalind thing, I did find the conversation with Monroe kind of squicky. Besides the fact it seems a hugely inappropriate subject for friends to talk about, it was so clearly the showrunners thinking they've addressed the issue and now we can move on.

I love how his uncle was such a fully fleshed out character in such a short period of time. I was expecting Monroe to chase the bad guys down with his Blutbad super sniffer. But the resolution to that was pretty good, so I won't complain.

I started watching this show for Sascha, I miss the vital character he once was. Not to mention the shirtless character.

I don't mind J'eve. Her character is supposed to be wooden, so it works for me.

Edited March 3, 2016 by clanstarling

[tpel]

Somehow, I got the impression that Monroe himself had lived in the 'old country', and that was where he terrorized the villages in his youth.

 

 

If that were true, I would expect his German would be better than it is.

[OtterMommy]

If that were true, I would expect his German would be better than it is.

 

There were comments waay, waay back in the first season that he grew up in Vermont or Maine or something like that.  Then there were more vague comments that could have been interpreted that he was from the "old country."  

 

I don't speak German, so I don't know how good or bad it is--but I will say that it sounds a little, um, stuttery?  I mean, BT's Spanish comes off a lot smoother than SWM's German (although, Spanish is a smoother language anyway...)

[orza]

It is obvious when Monroe speaks German that SWM learned his lines phonetically. The pronunciation, intonation and cadence of his sentences are all way off. BT speaks Spanish.fluently since childhood.

[Clanstarling]

If that were true, I would expect his German would be better than it is.

I lived in Germany most of my life prior to the age of 15. I went to realschule (I would have been 9th grade in an American school), and was fluent - and did not have an American accent. I returned to the US, and didn't use it except in brief conversations with my Austrian mother. Now that she's gone - my German has devolved to an extent that it's not much better than what Monroe sounded like. My half-brother, whose native language was German, had the same issue after coming to the US as a pre-teen. So I don't find it impossible to believe that Monroe (or the actor) had learned to speak it at a young age but was way rusty. Edited March 3, 2016 by clanstarling

[tpel]

That's interesting. I would expect vocabulary to deteriorate, and probably grammar, but I would have guessed that pronunciation, intonation, and cadence, would be more enduring. I studied Irish Gaelic as a child. Both my parents spoke it (secondarily to English), though I never lived in an area where it was spoken, and I never became anything like fluent. Today I can understand little and express less. But my pronunciation, including sounds that are not in English, is still quite good -- MUCH better than Monroe's German pronunciation. 

 

Eh, this might not be a character point or a clue to Monroe's history. Monroe is clearly supposed to have good German reading comprehension. If Monroe was supposed to have lived in "the old country" until he was old enough to terrorize the countryside, then maybe it's just a case of an otherwise excellent actor not being able to pronounce foreign words as well as perhaps we might hope. But I'm not sure about our evidence that his terrorizing took place in Germany. I always assumed that he raised hell in America in his younger days, then went vegan, started pilates, etc.

 

Tying back into this episode, pronunciation or not, Monroe having to impersonate his recently deceased uncle over the phone was heartbreaking, and beautifully portrayed by SWM.

Edited March 3, 2016 by tpel

[TVSpectator]

That's interesting. I would expect vocabulary to deteriorate, and probably grammar, but I would have guessed that pronunciation, intonation, and cadence, would be more enduring. I studied Irish Gaelic as a child. Both my parents spoke it (secondarily to English), though I never lived in an area where it was spoken, and I never became anything like fluent. Today I can understand little and express less. But my pronunciation, including sounds that are not in English, is still quite good -- MUCH better than Monroe's German pronunciation. 

 

I always thought that it was nice to have Rosalee translate a text for a chance. As for her accent I have no idea if it's good or not (as an American) and I also have a poor ear for German as well. 

 

 

Eh, this might not be a character point or a clue to Monroe's history. Monroe is clearly supposed to have good German reading comprehension. If Monroe was supposed to have lived in "the old country" until he was old enough to terrorize the countryside, then maybe it's just a case of an otherwise excellent actor not being able to pronounce foreign words as well as perhaps we might hope. But I'm not sure about our evidence that his terrorizing took place in Germany. I always assumed that he raised hell in America in his younger days, then went vegan, started pilates, etc.

 

I always thought that Monroe grew up here in America but his family was from Germany. Now, I do know that they have established that Monroe did have a wild past, that he is a reformed Blutbad, doesn't eat meat nor drink, and that his family is so German. I also always thought that Monroe's wild days were in America, since he had a few friends left over from those times (and made an appearance on the show, in the past, and they never hinted that they knew how to speak German. Plus, they are all dead now), that at least one of them was still living in the Portland area, until he died in a fire, in the first Three Little Pigs story.